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Hello fellow commanders. My question refers to our best resources fighting fly-keyword armies such as the eldar factions and tau. I keep getting my imperial gak kicked in by a couple of eldar players because they have dozens of fast movement, dark lance toting (or other high caliber weapons) units that are mobile and hard hitting. I wouldn't call their lists tournament competitive, more like kitchen table competitive since we all play to win but don't spam the most efficient option to win. However I digress, my armies are usually Guard allied with SM and I was wondering what are the options we have to counter these armies, specifically 'Fly' units as it seems like the thing to exploit.

So far I have seen the AdMech Onager as a solid unit to try with their Icarus array as mobile Fly hunters. Have yall encountered any other good units like this? I own a SM Sicaran that I have yet to build that has a nasty anti-fly ability but I haven't seen much tactica on it. Any suggestions?

You have some of the most powerful factions in the game currently so this should be easy. Best bet is to just chuck Gulliman into the mix if you don't have him. Super op.

That and conscript spam. He probably won't be your friend after this though.

I agree with gamgee, one of the if not the best army in the game, you have loads of options. If you are mainly IG, then use some Hydra anti air tanks.

Eldar are mid-tier and unless a Tau player is spamming Commanders they tend to be low tier.

 Gamgee wrote:
You have some of the most powerful factions in the game currently so this should be easy. Best bet is to just chuck Gulliman into the mix if you don't have him. Super op.

That and conscript spam. He probably won't be your friend after this though.

This is explicitly what I'm trying to avoid. I don't want Gulliman at all, and I typically only bring 1 full size conscript squad. I'm not trying to cheese my way out, just decide on what efficient anti Fly units I need to invest in

As guard seems to be in a great place I would think it's not hard to do. However I'll leave the nitty gritty details to the experts.

CrimsonApostle wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:
You have some of the most powerful factions in the game currently so this should be easy. Best bet is to just chuck Gulliman into the mix if you don't have him. Super op.

That and conscript spam. He probably won't be your friend after this though.

This is explicitly what I'm trying to avoid. I don't want Gulliman at all, and I typically only bring 1 full size conscript squad. I'm not trying to cheese my way out, just decide on what efficient anti Fly units I need to invest in

The Imperial Guard Hydra is your dedicated anti-aircraft tank. Eight autocannon shots with +1 to hit against anything with Fly. You can also magnetise it to make it into a Wyvern if the mood strikes you too (such as if they decide to avoid ever bringing fliers again).

Happy hunting!

Honestly like you said, you can't go wrong with onager dune crawlers from the Admech, equipped with the Icarus array.

-It's hitting on 3+ with +1 vs fly.
-3 guns in the array 10 shots ranging from auto cannons to heavier rockets.
-has a 5+ invuln
- can move and shoot with no penalty

Yep, go with the Icarus Array. No further comments needed.

 backlash13 wrote:
Honestly like you said, you can't go wrong with onager dune crawlers from the Admech, equipped with the Icarus array.

-It's hitting on 3+ with +1 vs fly.
-3 guns in the array 10 shots ranging from auto cannons to heavier rockets.
-has a 5+ invuln
- can move and shoot with no penalty

Yeah as soon as I looked up the stats/cost when posting I realized it was very strong for this purpose but I never used it in practice. I think this and hydras will serve the cause

1: deep strike assault marines
2: charge
3: ????
4: profit!

Anti Aircraft Flamethrowers.

A bunch of things work.

As guard: Try a Hydra or two. Cheap, cheerful, and if you played guard last edition you *probably* have an extra wyvern lying around now that their price got hiked up. It puts the autocannons in the mortars or else it gets the flyers again!

Alternatively, There are a number of other units that are quite good at tackling flying units:

Knight Commander Pask Punisher: BS2+ is no joke, and most flyers have to come fairly close to you to get their job done. Pask with multi-meltas and a punisher cannon is great for smacking them around when they get into his 12" range.

Hellhound (or Trogdor Pattern Leman Russ Punisher+3HF): Same concept as the pask option, letting the flyer get within 18" or so and then popping it with close ranged weaponry, this time with nice auto-hitting flame weaponry.

I'm not sure I understand your problem.
The main benefit of the fly keyword is to prevent shooty units from getting locked in combat. But you don't seem to try and kill them in melee.
Many flying units also have a high movement value (but Tau suits are only M8"), which is what you seem to be referring to. But SJS doesn't exist anymore, so if they can shoot you, you can shoot them back, since AM usually have pretty decent range.

Staying in-codex, Space Marine Stalkers are pretty good now.

6 x S7 shots, AP-1, 2 damage

+1 to hit against FLY, so hits proper "hard to hit" flyers on a 3, and semi-flyers like Eldar stuff on a 2.

114 points.

They do get -1 to hit against non-fly... so hitting other stuff on 4's... but that isn't what youre looking for really.