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What do you guys think about Omnispex and Datatether, when is it useful/ a must to bring them.
I typically either field just 2x 5 rangers with snipers, 1 ranger squad stocked as screen, and vanguards go with 5-6 models with maybe 1 plasma in each squad.

Also: do you think taking freeblade for a single knight is worth?

 0XFallen wrote:
What do you guys think about Omnispex and Datatether, when is it useful/ a must to bring them.
I typically either field just 2x 5 rangers with snipers, 1 ranger squad stocked as screen, and vanguards go with 5-6 models with maybe 1 plasma in each squad.

Also: do you think taking freeblade for a single knight is worth?

I am generally not running Omnispex & datatether at the moment, but they have some merits in certain situations:
Omnispex on some sniper rangers to maximise their arquebus damage is ok
Or datatethers on a 10man unit to keep moral from affecting them as much.

Regarding the free blade - depends on the knight. E.g a single gallant in a super heavy aux detachment will not gain any benefits for house traits, and a lot of the freeblade buffs mostly affect melee, so you might decide to roll for them rather than picking to gain more buffs.

 0XFallen wrote:
What do you guys think about Omnispex and Datatether, when is it useful/ a must to bring them.
I typically either field just 2x 5 rangers with snipers, 1 ranger squad stocked as screen, and vanguards go with 5-6 models with maybe 1 plasma in each squad.

Also: do you think taking freeblade for a single knight is worth?

With Metalica I run a lot of data tethers on my plasma vanguard. Let's me fall back and still hit on 2's with a unit in an emergency and helps keeps my squads around. I run a lot of Skittles though and in fairly large units so I'm a niche case. Also almost half my group has some sort of -1 to hit ability so I tend to use protector doctrina every single turn to get my plasma more reliable. The main draw is if you want to use something other than MSU skitarii and want larger squads, our leadership is garbage and we have very few ways to buff it. Rather than waste a canticle to keep my guys in line I just pay the extra 5pts per squad and call it a day. They always seem to pay for themselves since they protect my plasma from running but if you're running naked squads more dudes would be the smarter option for the points.

I've tried omnispex every now and then but rarely felt like I needed it. Id maybe use it on arquebus rangers but even there a lot of my targets for them aren't in cover but charging up the table so it's unnecessary. If you play against people who use a lot of cover abilities like enemy admech I could see them being worthwhile though. My meta just doesn't call for them.

There are only two situations when I would consider the data tether

1) 10 man vanguard squads using the lucius strat for a beta strike

2) 10 man + hoplite squads always

mostly this is for the extra +1 WS/BS with the strat other than that MSU almost always works better

Omnispex - never worth it its just too situational

 kastelen wrote:
Why are you taking a Valient, from memory they're really, really bad.

They aren't bad in an absolute sense. It's just that you can invest roughly the same number of points and get a Castellan. So they're basically relatively bad in the same vein of a Shadowsword.

 0XFallen wrote:
What do you guys think about Omnispex and Datatether, when is it useful/ a must to bring them.
I typically either field just 2x 5 rangers with snipers, 1 ranger squad stocked as screen, and vanguards go with 5-6 models with maybe 1 plasma in each squad.

Also: do you think taking freeblade for a single knight is worth?

At 1500+ points, Skitarii want to run in MSUs with minimal investment. Only situation where I'd take Omnispex is with Arquebus teams. If you want to improve morale, stand next to a Ballistarii or a Crawler.

Take Raven or Krast instead of Freeblade almost always. For Raven, you are going for the stratagem. For Krast, the tradition is redundant, but the WLT and relic are both amazing; stratagem is also good in a scrap. Krast works best on a Styrix or Magaera (but the Magaera is not that good, to be honest).

I've wrote a 2000 pts list to try some Armigers for the first time, I'll borrow them from friends. After having faced 2 Helverins that promptly slew my 6 Kataphrons in one go I'm seriously thinking about adding some D3 to my army to counter heavy infantry and I've always loved the look of these guys. I don't want to play bigger Knights than those, too, so I'll keep it at the Armigers if I ever buy some.

1st Battalion, Stygies, Cohort Cybernetica:

- Dominus, Volkite & Macrostubber, WL Necromechanic with Arkhan's Caduceus
- Enginseer

- 8 Rangers, 2 Arquebuses & Omnispex
- 8 Rangers, 2 Arquebuses & Omnispex
- 5 Rangers

- Datasmith
- 2 Dakkastelans
- 4 Fistelans, Cremators
- 3 Dragoons, Tasers

2nd Battalion, Stygies:
- Dominus, Volkite & Macrostubber
- Enginseer

- 6 Vanguards
- 6 Vanguards
- 6 Vanguards

Super-Heavy Detachment, Taranis:
- Helverin, Stubber
- Helverin, Stubber
- Warglaive, Stubber

The idea is to use my 15 CPs to Infiltrate whatever I need, mostly the Fistelans and their Datasmith, the Dragoons and perhaps some Vanguards in a nice spot. Meanwhile I have a firebase in the back with the Helverins, the Dakkabots and Arquebuses. The Warglaive will join the fray first turn with Full Tilt if needed.

It's a variation of my Distraction Fistelans list I use with Lucius, here there's even more CC vehicles in the face of my opponent T1 provided I have first turn. Seeing as I mainly play CA2018 missions it's much more likely as there's no +1 to roll shenanigans.

I chose Taranis for the 6+++ but Vulker catches my eye too for the Stratagem that procs 2 hits on 6s. The Trait is more random though, I can't control their closest target each turn.

 Aaranis wrote:
I've wrote a 2000 pts list to try some Armigers for the first time, I'll borrow them from friends. After having faced 2 Helverins that promptly slew my 6 Kataphrons in one go I'm seriously thinking about adding some D3 to my army to counter heavy infantry and I've always loved the look of these guys. I don't want to play bigger Knights than those, too, so I'll keep it at the Armigers if I ever buy some.

1st Battalion, Stygies, Cohort Cybernetica:

- Dominus, Volkite & Macrostubber, WL Necromechanic with Arkhan's Caduceus
- Enginseer

- 8 Rangers, 2 Arquebuses & Omnispex
- 8 Rangers, 2 Arquebuses & Omnispex
- 5 Rangers

- Datasmith
- 2 Dakkastelans
- 4 Fistelans, Cremators
- 3 Dragoons, Tasers

2nd Battalion, Stygies:
- Dominus, Volkite & Macrostubber
- Enginseer

- 6 Vanguards
- 6 Vanguards
- 6 Vanguards

Super-Heavy Detachment, Taranis:
- Helverin, Stubber
- Helverin, Stubber
- Warglaive, Stubber

The idea is to use my 15 CPs to Infiltrate whatever I need, mostly the Fistelans and their Datasmith, the Dragoons and perhaps some Vanguards in a nice spot. Meanwhile I have a firebase in the back with the Helverins, the Dakkabots and Arquebuses. The Warglaive will join the fray first turn with Full Tilt if needed.

It's a variation of my Distraction Fistelans list I use with Lucius, here there's even more CC vehicles in the face of my opponent T1 provided I have first turn. Seeing as I mainly play CA2018 missions it's much more likely as there's no +1 to roll shenanigans.

I chose Taranis for the 6+++ but Vulker catches my eye too for the Stratagem that procs 2 hits on 6s. The Trait is more random though, I can't control their closest target each turn.

i wouldnt take the pimp-cane on your dominus if youre planning on deepstriking fistellans, its gonna be a wasted relic slot, i'd give the datasmith the solar flare so you can teleport him to your fistellans after the deepstrike to give them +3 to their charge.

i wouldnt run big squads of rangers, i'd do all minimum size squad, so your 10 + 10 + 5 would become a 5+ 5+ 5+ 5+5, which covers a lot more ground and caps a lot more objectives, especially since you wouldntb e able to move the squads with snipers in them. 3 dragoons feels underwhelming, they really shine the more you have. maybe try them as ballistarii autocannons to deal with hordes from a distance (to clear a path for your kastellans).

Octovol wrote:

 The Forgemaster wrote:

 Ideasweasel wrote:
Can anyone who’s run Graia help me out with the following Refusal to yield scenarios. I think I’m playing it wrong, how many refusal to yield rolls would I need to make for the below if my model is a 1W model like a Ranger

1. I fail my armour save versus a damage 3 weapon.
2. I fail all my armour saves against a volley of 10 bolter shots


Cheers

1. One roll
2. 10 rolls

https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/warhammer_40000_adeptus_mechanicus_en.pdf

If the unit only has one model in it, and of those 10 shots you fail your save on the first one and that kills it, the remaining 9 shots are gone because there are no other models to allocate them to. The shots all happen at the same time, as do the deaths. So after all shots have been resolved saved/failed and models have been killed, then you roll for your refusal to yield. That applies to mortal wounds as well. It's not a FnP style roll that applies to damage of an attack, it's why you still get your refusal to yield after your fanatical devotion on priests.

Shots do not happen at the same time. You are meant to roll them one by one, and only roll them multiple at the same time if they all share a profile and there’d be no difference rolling them together or separately. This is in the main rulebook.

So with one guy against 10 shots, you (as tedious as it sounds) roll one save, if it passes then roll another save, and when you fail it is slain and the Refusal to Yield kicks in immediately upon the model being slain - if it survives the death due to the RtY roll, you resume rolling saves one by one until it either passes all the shots and/or deaths, or fails a RtY roll.

Correct.

The order of operations is:
1) Shots
2) Hits
3) Wounds
3.5) Tally mortal wounds (most occur here)
4) Saves
5) Damage
6) Assign all of the damage to one model
6.5) FNP
7) Determine if model dies
7.5) RTY

For FNP, you roll a die for each point of damage. For RTY, you allocate all of the damage to a model; if it dies, you roll a die; if you succeed, your unit has 1 wound remaining.

Honestly, next edition they need to rename Wounds to HP. It's too semantically confusing to share the same word with the "wound roll."

Evening all.

Rules question for those of you that mix detachments to take Graia rangers for deny - if you also take stygies dragoons in the same detachment do they revert to just the native -1 to hit?

Thanks

 Ideasweasel wrote:
Evening all.

Rules question for those of you that mix detachments to take Graia rangers for deny - if you also take stygies dragoons in the same detachment do they revert to just the native -1 to hit?

Thanks

Yep, unfortunatly mixed forgeworlds means no forgeworld bonuses including stygies -1 to hit...

K I thought so. I saw some guy won a tournament a while back doing that and thought hmm, I wonder if he missed the -2 much

Thanks

Any of you ITC chaps familiar with Michael Sarapta? He seems to be doing well with Admech at the moment which is good to see

Like I said, the most value in AdMech comes from the stratagems, so the Forge Worlds aren't important. The only one that seriously would like to be pure is Stygies. But even that FW can be brought in mixed detachments for the infiltration.

Upcoming 1k Tournament once again.
Last time I used 3 dakkabots, Cawl and lots of screening, which worked fine but was unlucky as one explosion killed almost all of my troops.

This time I have two lists that I consider, I want them to be fun but dont want to auto lose, so if its at least 80% competetiv im fine.
Restrictions: 2 detachments 1000points, not ITC or anything just plain missions.

First Knight list:


I will play aggressiv with the knight if possible, so shooting and then charging some stuff to finish them off.
______________________________________________________________________________________

2nd Skitarii List



I really like both lists as they look fun to play, any glaring weaknesses or things I should change not to auto lose?

So my Styrix had it’s first run out today, i won one lost one playing some of the new CA2018 missions as a test run for throne of skulls doubles. I’m not attending but my friends wanted some practice runs to try stuff out, so i played two teams of 900 admech, as if i were two people, against a 900 DE and 900 Harlequins, lost on points to that team, they just have too much mobility for missions that focus on objectives.

Second game was against 900 thousand sons and 900 Khorne, where the Styrix basically won the game on it’s own. It was sat on an objective in the middle of the table on turn two, having been reduced from 24 to 6 wounds in the previous psychic and shooting phases (they went first, this was their turn 2) they wanted it off that objective as it would be worth 2VP at the end of my turn so they proceded to charge it with a chaos lord, 2 x daemon princes and Ahriman.

All of them died. In overwatch. All 27 wounds or so of auto-hitting rad-cleansed death. 25 extra points well spent lol

 0XFallen wrote:


I really like both lists as they look fun to play, any glaring weaknesses or things I should change not to auto lose?

The ruststalkers...

Personally would go for the first list with the knight, but maybe exchange the hoplites for infiltrators - you then have the option for backfield deep strike and Hoplites do not gain stygies bonuses anyway.

 The Forgemaster wrote:

 0XFallen wrote:


I really like both lists as they look fun to play, any glaring weaknesses or things I should change not to auto lose?

The ruststalkers...

Personally would go for the first list with the knight, but maybe exchange the hoplites for infiltrators - you then have the option for backfield deep strike and Hoplites do not gain stygies bonuses anyway.

I cry everytime, but I love them =(

Octovol wrote:
So my Styrix had it’s first run out today, i won one lost one playing some of the new CA2018 missions as a test run for throne of skulls doubles. I’m not attending but my friends wanted some practice runs to try stuff out, so i played two teams of 900 admech, as if i were two people, against a 900 DE and 900 Harlequins, lost on points to that team, they just have too much mobility for missions that focus on objectives.

Second game was against 900 thousand sons and 900 Khorne, where the Styrix basically won the game on it’s own. It was sat on an objective in the middle of the table on turn two, having been reduced from 24 to 6 wounds in the previous psychic and shooting phases (they went first, this was their turn 2) they wanted it off that objective as it would be worth 2VP at the end of my turn so they proceded to charge it with a chaos lord, 2 x daemon princes and Ahriman.

All of them died. In overwatch. All 27 wounds or so of auto-hitting rad-cleansed death. 25 extra points well spent lol

Styrix with the Rad-cleanser is an anti-elite murder machine. That being said, I have crunched the numbers, and while Krast Feet are best for both infantry and Titans, the Reaper is ideal for T6-7 enemies due to the better to hit with reroll.

Hey folks,
haven´t had much time playing lately and wanna catch up with AdMech´s place in the meta.

So with more than 2 month testing time how are our specialist detachments fairing? I am thinking pretty heavily about including a Servitor maniple for a unit of Ryzaphrons for my soup.
How do they do? I´ve read about the trick with infiltrating them with the Guard dagger. Is this necessary or can they be started on the table, since I´m not keen on losing a round of shooting with them.
I was thinking about infiltrating a large dragoon squad first turn to attract the enemies firepower.

 lash92 wrote:
Hey folks,
haven´t had much time playing lately and wanna catch up with AdMech´s place in the meta.

So with more than 2 month testing time how are our specialist detachments fairing? I am thinking pretty heavily about including a Servitor maniple for a unit of Ryzaphrons for my soup.
How do they do? I´ve read about the trick with infiltrating them with the Guard dagger. Is this necessary or can they be started on the table, since I´m not keen on losing a round of shooting with them.
I was thinking about infiltrating a large dragoon squad first turn to attract the enemies firepower.

Servitor Maniple - it depends if you can hide them out of LoS just incase your opponent can sieze on you/ goes first then you probably do not need the dagger. the general consensus is max 6 Ryzaphrons otherwise they look like a really large threat. if they are agrippina instead they can be more survivable with the Agrip. strat to bring them back (which is again max 6). once people start noticing the ryzaphrons it will probably be the first target of many large tanks/long range firepower which is why you need to keep them safe if you do not go first. they are infantry so can walk through ruins walls turn 1 though.
In addition it may be worth it to take a Tech-Priest Manipulus near them (from a kill team box - he also has 40k rules but is not in the codex) to bolster their weapons for that additional 6" range on the plasma (so 42") and 11" flamers (for overwatch)...

I am personally not such a fan of the Kastellan Robot specialist detachment, but I can see some upsides, if you end up taking some robots but no Kataphrons then it may be worth it to use this one.
you could take Lucius combat Kastellans and a datasmith with the teleporting relic, drop the robots in 9" away, teleport the datasmith nearby, and pop the +3 to advance and charge rolls for a 6" charge with kastellans and change protocols in combat with the stratagem to fight twice.
alternatively if you tend not to switch to the shooty protocol with phosphor GRAIA bots (keeping them in Ageis) and someone charges you near your warlord you sould pop the change heavy to assault weapons and shoot them in combat which might make for a surprise to the enemny.

I'm surprised noone seems to be using the vigilus robots with graia. They can shoot in melee with the stratagem so if you break their legs they're still an incredible threat.

 laam999 wrote:
I'm surprised noone seems to be using the vigilus robots with graia. They can shoot in melee with the stratagem so if you break their legs they're still an incredible threat.

Played it and its really bad for several reasons, its only really good against alpha charges.

1. You cant use the stratagem to instantly switch and deal damage
2. You dont use cawl, neither stygies which is way better for them in team of damage and survivability.
3. It costs way too much CP

 lash92 wrote:
Hey folks,
haven´t had much time playing lately and wanna catch up with AdMech´s place in the meta.

So with more than 2 month testing time how are our specialist detachments fairing? I am thinking pretty heavily about including a Servitor maniple for a unit of Ryzaphrons for my soup.
How do they do? I´ve read about the trick with infiltrating them with the Guard dagger. Is this necessary or can they be started on the table, since I´m not keen on losing a round of shooting with them.
I was thinking about infiltrating a large dragoon squad first turn to attract the enemies firepower.

Servitor Maniple is a must. Ryza Plasma Destroyers hidden with Officer of the Fleet carrying the Dagger of Tu'Sakh is an incredibly powerful beta strike.

Meanwhile, some people have had success with Mars, Agripinaa, or Stygies Breachers. They are essentially bigger Terminators that can shoot and fight decently well; they have ObSec and can get 4++ with the formation buff and Acquisition stratagem. I personally cannot attest to their effectiveness though. I own no Breachers and play toolbox-style, with every unit having a specific purpose.

Doesn't the dagger require the same <Regiment> to use on infantry? How would you use it on something thats admech?

 Rex2490 wrote:
Doesn't the dagger require the same <Regiment> to use on infantry? How would you use it on something thats admech?

because 40k doesnt have ultra-specific rules (obvious RAW/rules as intended tension) you can take an Officer of the fleet (which doesnt have a regiment keyword) and give him the dagger, which means that he can use it on kataphrons since kataphrons AND officer have no regiment keyword, since the dagger specifies "if they have one" its a legal play.

Nah, you can't not name your faction. Every codex has this same wording under its <FACTION> rules section at the beginning of the rules page

"When you include such a unit in your army, you must nominate which regiment that
unit is from. You then simply replace the <REGIMENT> keyword in every instance on
that unit’s datasheet with the name of your chosen regiment."

Emphasis on the MUST wording. The daggers description on "The infantry unit must have the same<REGIMENT> keyword as the bearer if the bearer has one." is referencing some characters that do not get a <REGIMENT> like the psykers and ogryn bodyguards as they get the character tag, which were able to get the relic at the time the codex was made (Now Erratad to Officers only).

Even If you played RAW, most TOs with knowledge of the game, wouldn't allow this. The Dagger still looks for a <REGIMENT> for infantry, even though the bearer doesn't have one.

 Rex2490 wrote:
Nah, you can't not name your faction. Every codex has this same wording under its <FACTION> rules section at the beginning of the rules page

"When you include such a unit in your army, you must nominate which regiment that
unit is from. You then simply replace the <REGIMENT> keyword in every instance on
that unit’s datasheet with the name of your chosen regiment."

Emphasis on the MUST wording. The daggers description on "The infantry unit must have the same<REGIMENT> keyword as the bearer if the bearer has one." is referencing some characters that do not get a <REGIMENT> like the psykers and ogryn bodyguards as they get the character tag, which were able to get the relic at the time the codex was made (Now Erratad to Officers only).

Even If you played RAW, most TOs with knowledge of the game, wouldn't allow this.

No, it specifies that it needs the same <regiment> keyword, but theres no such thing on the officier of the fleet datasheet. so he doesnt have a <regiment> keyword to replace. You basically compare datasheets when you check for the dagger. since theyre no mention of a regiment on the officer fo the fleet datasheet, the "if the bearer has one" part of the dagger says that you can use it with any infantry in your army. otherwise that wording would be unnecessary.

Where's BaconCatBug? He's the best with RAW.

It's so obviously against RAI I can't imagine a TO who would allow it...

unless that TO respects the RAW