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One of the new armiger configurations is dual auto-cannons LOL. Thats a friggin joke, though i guess not everyone has access to balistarii-levels of cheap fast auto-cannons. On the plus side i could probably get a cheap forgebane set and use my magnetised ironstrider auto-cannons without having to buy whatever standalone kit they release is. It does look like the kit will be in pairs, which is odd, given minimum unit size is one.
Sneggy wrote: For those talking about removing sniper squad and arquebuses. You’re not getting how he used them.
2x19 electropriests is presumably because he plays a lot more itc than etc so will transfer the army across.
The techpriest on bike was a very points efficient and safe way to carry the vitae.
There’s a lot more to his list than who hit hardest turn one. He still had priests and dragoon’s going at the end of the game.
I can understand the Elysian Sniper Squads. He probably dropped them on objectives to crowd the opponent off them. They also can contribute toward wounding pretty much anything. I don't get the Arquebuses though. They have to foot slog, and they're quite pricey.
In any case, Elysian Mortars seem to make more sense. The list does not have very good anti-horde shooting.
I don't see why 2x19 is more transferrable compared to 2x20.
I agree about the Techmarine. I don't think you should be putting Vitae on Captains. Those guys are bullet magnets, and losing your Relic early is devastating given how much you need every turn. No need to put it on a Bike though. Again, price concerns; 29 points for durability and 2 Heavy Bolters is a bit hard to swallow.
I disagree about the first turn bit though. The only reason why this army works is because it hits harder on turn one. Hell, it's why the faction works at all; none of AdMech's models aside from Dragoons and maybe Kastelans have a second strike to write home about. In fact, the survival of Electro-Priests and Dragoons depends on removing a lot of the significant threats to them immediately; offense is the best defense.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/27 23:55:19
A small rules question for the more knowledgeable tech priests of this thread:
My friend wants to take 3 Armiger Knights as a detatchment add-on to his mechanicus battalion ready for a charity tournament day. So, my questions are this:
1. Since the Knights and mechanicus are in separate detatchments, they don't lose any bonuses as each detatchment is "pure", correct?
2. Separate detatchments cannot use stratagems from others, only their own, and so the Knights cannot use mechanicus stratagems and vice versa, correct?
3. My friend will have to take codex mechanicus, codex Knights and the 40k core rulebook as his books for this set up, correct?
40k: Thousand Sons World Eaters
30k: Imperial Fists 405th Company
Dr. Mills wrote: A small rules question for the more knowledgeable tech priests of this thread:
My friend wants to take 3 Armiger Knights as a detatchment add-on to his mechanicus battalion ready for a charity tournament day. So, my questions are this:
1. Since the Knights and mechanicus are in separate detatchments, they don't lose any bonuses as each detatchment is "pure", correct?
2. Separate detatchments cannot use stratagems from others, only their own, and so the Knights cannot use mechanicus stratagems and vice versa, correct?
3. My friend will have to take codex mechanicus, codex Knights and the 40k core rulebook as his books for this set up, correct?
1. Correct.
2. Any ARMY can use any of its DETACHMENT'S stratagems. However, each stratagem specifies what keywords it affects. In the case of AdMech, you can use the stratagems for the Questor Mechanicus on Armigers.
3. Just the Codex Mechanicus and data pamphlet for Armigers from the Forgebane set, actually. I don't think everyone needs to bring a rule book. In fact, the last I heard, GW stated that you only needed their core rules PDF. (https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/40k/warhammer_40000_en.pdf)
Oh, and highly recommended you print the BRBFAQ and all codex/index FAQs.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/05/28 08:31:57
Ideasweasel wrote: Anyone thinking a Crusader might worm it’s way back into your army if the rumoured points reductions are true?
Anything from 40-60 points depending on sources
A point cost reduction is very much needed and will help Knights a lot. I don´t know if a Crusader will get super competitive but I think I´ll include one, since we are pretty good at supporting a single Knight imo.
I really want to include a Valiant or Castellan but rumors they, that they are over 600 points and just have a few wounds more than a regular knight.
Ideasweasel wrote: Anyone thinking a Crusader might worm it’s way back into your army if the rumoured points reductions are true?
Anything from 40-60 points depending on sources
A point cost reduction is very much needed and will help Knights a lot. I don´t know if a Crusader will get super competitive but I think I´ll include one, since we are pretty good at supporting a single Knight imo.
I really want to include a Valiant or Castellan but rumors they, that they are over 600 points and just have a few wounds more than a regular knight.
Yeah I’m putting one back in my list would love a new knight but finances are tight. Will have to persuade the missus it’s an investment
Raven apparently cancels out the hit penalty for advancing too. This makes it pretty strong for an Errant or Crusader. The big problem with Knights was always for foot slogging then into CC. It's the only way they would make their points back, but hard to do without advancing at least once.
So turn one advance and shoot. Turn two shoot and charge.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/05/28 16:36:43
*************** 3 Heavy ***************
2 Kastelan Robots, 2 x 2 Heavy Phosphor blasters, 2 x Heavy Phosphor blaster
2 Kastelan Robots, 2 x 2 Heavy Phosphor blasters, 2 x Heavy Phosphor blaster
2 Kastelan Robots, 2 x 2 Heavy Phosphor blasters, 2 x Heavy Phosphor blaster
Adeptus Custodes: Supreme Command Detachment
*************** 3 HQ ***************
Shield Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike, Interceptor lance, Hurricane bolter – Open the Vaults (Auric Aquilis)
Shield Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike, Interceptor lance, Hurricane bolter
Shield Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike, Interceptor lance, Hurricane bolter
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/28 17:30:44
Ideasweasel wrote: Interesting. Talk me through the robots. Would you not have preferred one big blob of 6 for WOM?
no. I think a 6 Pack is too easy to get charged either round 1 or 2. There are so many shining spears and blood angel captains that it will happen in a five game tournament. This will be an Auto loss pretty much. A six Pack is always very vulnerable to dark reaper and Tau. They dont have to think on how to split their shooting. They just put everything into them. Small packages deliver enough punch while being flexible. Also, you are just boned if you play Aeldari and they got a Drikhari detachment and deny your Stratagems.
They hold objectives really good and the thread range is bigger. They 4++ makes them so much more durable than the 5++. I am more than satisfied with this decision :-)
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/05/29 08:38:36
Even if you decide to use split robots you must go at least 2*3 robot groups. Icarus onager 2* seems an extremely good choise !!
You can't have a competitive list no anti air no anti phych no transports no options to assault beyond Dragoons.
And now that we cleared that out if you consider Robots in split groups then Dragoons need to be in teams maxed 3-4. Or get them priests / infiltrators to support. Having zero options just 3*2 Robots is not a competitive list. Stratagems like wrath of Mars in a group of 4-6 robots is a weapon vs high invu targets like big bad robots primarchs etc. Your list rmoves all options. No plan to use stratsgems for mortals no plan for a good assault army . No plan for a good gun line. What is this list doing? Don't get me wrong it's just how I see it. Usually when we make a list we try to have a plan not sum up points and consider one option working.
Get an assault force. Groups of Dragoons 2*3 or 1*4 infiltrate. Get a group or priests 15+ with them . Make 2*3 5 man vang with plasma and advance them. Or take infiltrators to use wom and support assault with dual canticels. All valid and make a plan . Not far from points and your list but still a plan. Get two onager to increase survivibikitay in your list use of healing from you hq. So make your gun line closer to 2*3 robots 2*1 onagers Icarus. That's a solid defence back line !
Just suggesting to try and give you a hint on how to work your lists IF we talking tour play !!!
Suggestions dont start with the word "must". The list worked pretty well so its not as bad as you see it. It is not a list to kill the enemy round one. This is a list that plays the Mission. It functions even after loosing several units.
Priests are crap. They dont work if you dont get turn one since everyone and their mother kills them with indirect damage but admech. Infiltrators are pure Garbage as it is. Small groups of dragoons Lack damage and are a waste of CP. If we talk to "play" as you stated, you would not suggest a 4 Pack of dragoons. That is exactly the number you dont want to use.
I played versus Magnus and morti teamed up, won 20:0. I played vs fireraptor and two relic Leviathan. Won 16:4. I played a cerastus, 5 custodes bikers and 3 onager. Won 20:0. Played nids with a crap Ton of psychic. 10:10.
As you See you can have a list without anti Air shooting if you know how to use your captains.
Critique is fine but dude: stay classy.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/28 22:05:11
-Iago40k, who do you spend your CP on? WRATH OF MARS? Or the captains? 9CP makes for 3CP on the robots. 3CP to have a captain fight again. 2CP to infiltrate and increase the swing damage on the dragoons.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Octovol wrote: One of the new armiger configurations is dual auto-cannons LOL. Thats a friggin joke, though i guess not everyone has access to balistarii-levels of cheap fast auto-cannons. On the plus side i could probably get a cheap forgebane set and use my magnetised ironstrider auto-cannons without having to buy whatever standalone kit they release is. It does look like the kit will be in pairs, which is odd, given minimum unit size is one.
Going out on a limb here, I think those are 3 shot autocannons on each arm. There is no way that thing has 1/3 the firepower of a taurox prime.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/29 02:14:26
Wulfey wrote: -Iago40k, who do you spend your CP on? WRATH OF MARS? Or the captains? 9CP makes for 3CP on the robots. 3CP to have a captain fight again. 2CP to infiltrate and increase the swing damage on the dragoons.
Well usually you can go for 12 cp thanks to the WL trait. It really depends on the opponent what i use but most of the time its infiltrating dragoons and +2 to Hit stratagem. One pair of dakkastelans sit down and use WoM if needed. From time to time i drop in the captain with the aquila.
We dont play ITC so I reccomend testing this before you take it to a GT :-)
*************** 3 Heavy ***************
2 Kastelan Robots, 2 x 2 Heavy Phosphor blasters, 2 x Heavy Phosphor blaster
2 Kastelan Robots, 2 x 2 Heavy Phosphor blasters, 2 x Heavy Phosphor blaster
2 Kastelan Robots, 2 x 2 Heavy Phosphor blasters, 2 x Heavy Phosphor blaster
Adeptus Custodes: Supreme Command Detachment
*************** 3 HQ ***************
Shield Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike, Interceptor lance, Hurricane bolter – Open the Vaults (Auric Aquilis)
Shield Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike, Interceptor lance, Hurricane bolter
Shield Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike, Interceptor lance, Hurricane bolter
Do you override the Kastelans or switch them on and off?
The old lists used to run 1x4 Kastelans and 2x1 Crawlers. Kastelan without Wrath of Mars or Protocols is comparable to an Icarus Crawler against ground infantry, actually.
Why take Custodes over Blood Angels? You can get Bolter Scouts to play the map or Melee Scouts to form an assault screen.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/29 10:00:54
Do you override the Kastelans or switch them on and off?
The old lists used to run 1x4 Kastelans and 2x1 Crawlers. Kastelan without Wrath of Mars or Protocols is comparable to an Icarus Crawler against ground infantry, actually.
Why take Custodes over Blood Angels? You can get Bolter Scouts to play the map or Melee Scouts to form an assault screen.
I think one big pack of Dakkastelans at this point is out of the question. You are very likely to face Aeldari/Drukhari in a tournament and they can deny you the protocol switch Stratagem and Wrath of Mars. Yes, its 6 CP but worth a ton. So we need to go with at least 2 packs of Kastelans. 2 times 3 are great but I didnt have the points to put in an additional Dunecrawler. Not getting first means loosing one unit of them which is a heavy hit if you only have 2 of them. And as you stated against ground targets they are comparable in damage but more durable while in Aegis and potentially threatening all game since I can sit them down.
Usually I tend to sit down one unit down with Stratagem while the Datasmith takes care of the other 2 units and switches them on and off, just as it is needed. Its just so damn flexible this way.
Why custodes and not Blood Angels? Good Question. Durability, Hurricane Bolters, deny the witch and Stooping Dive. They are a counter charge unit that can strike first which makes them awesome. I feel like Scouts arent an auto take anymore, since a lot of lists lost the ability to first turn charge and those that dont have fly unitsfor the job. I switched them out after the Big FAQ and I havent missed them since.
Anyone know if the new knight chassis is going to be cross compatible with both variants(magnetising) or if your going to have to purchase two separate ones?
I realise I’m probably fishing in empty waters here but you never know
Ideasweasel wrote: Anyone know if the new knight chassis is going to be cross compatible with both variants(magnetising) or if your going to have to purchase two separate ones?
I realise I’m probably fishing in empty waters here but you never know
Warhammer Community is saying they are 2 separate kits. Not just two different pictures on the same box of sprues. I am waiting until I see the fortification rules. The shooty one really needs some way to get max shots for it to beat a shadowsword. Also, boy, shadowswords suddendly got more useful didn't they.
Can forgeworld knights apply to super heavy detachments. Ie. If I threw an Imperial Knight styrix in with say two armigers does that count as a 3 knight detachment for my 3 command points. Or do they have to be the plastic variety?
I’ve never bought forgeworld so no idea how they conform to formations other than an inkling that they come with seperate rules
Ideasweasel wrote: Anyone know if the new knight chassis is going to be cross compatible with both variants(magnetising) or if your going to have to purchase two separate ones?
I realise I’m probably fishing in empty waters here but you never know
Warhammer Community is saying they are 2 separate kits. Not just two different pictures on the same box of sprues. I am waiting until I see the fortification rules. The shooty one really needs some way to get max shots for it to beat a shadowsword. Also, boy, shadowswords suddendly got more useful didn't they.
Expensive if you have to buy two to magnetise to make a super knight
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/29 18:47:01
Do you override the Kastelans or switch them on and off?
The old lists used to run 1x4 Kastelans and 2x1 Crawlers. Kastelan without Wrath of Mars or Protocols is comparable to an Icarus Crawler against ground infantry, actually.
Why take Custodes over Blood Angels? You can get Bolter Scouts to play the map or Melee Scouts to form an assault screen.
I think one big pack of Dakkastelans at this point is out of the question. You are very likely to face Aeldari/Drukhari in a tournament and they can deny you the protocol switch Stratagem and Wrath of Mars. Yes, its 6 CP but worth a ton. So we need to go with at least 2 packs of Kastelans. 2 times 3 are great but I didnt have the points to put in an additional Dunecrawler. Not getting first means loosing one unit of them which is a heavy hit if you only have 2 of them. And as you stated against ground targets they are comparable in damage but more durable while in Aegis and potentially threatening all game since I can sit them down.
Usually I tend to sit down one unit down with Stratagem while the Datasmith takes care of the other 2 units and switches them on and off, just as it is needed. Its just so damn flexible this way.
Why custodes and not Blood Angels? Good Question. Durability, Hurricane Bolters, deny the witch and Stooping Dive. They are a counter charge unit that can strike first which makes them awesome. I feel like Scouts arent an auto take anymore, since a lot of lists lost the ability to first turn charge and those that dont have fly unitsfor the job. I switched them out after the Big FAQ and I havent missed them since.
I see. So it's a survivalist strategy. Durability + redundancy. Probably the right way to go if you're doing Stygies Robots. Do you feel like you struggle against things like Magnus without the easy access to mortal wounds?
I agree with you about the Scouts, though if you're doing artillery, having that extra space is still helpful. Even still, Slamguinius+Mephiston+Techmarine with Vitae is also a nice option.
Can forgeworld knights apply to super heavy detachments. Ie. If I threw an Imperial Knight styrix in with say two armigers does that count as a 3 knight detachment for my 3 command points. Or do they have to be the plastic variety?
I’ve never bought forgeworld so no idea how they conform to formations other than an inkling that they come with seperate rules
Ideasweasel wrote: Anyone know if the new knight chassis is going to be cross compatible with both variants(magnetising) or if your going to have to purchase two separate ones?
I realise I’m probably fishing in empty waters here but you never know
Warhammer Community is saying they are 2 separate kits. Not just two different pictures on the same box of sprues. I am waiting until I see the fortification rules. The shooty one really needs some way to get max shots for it to beat a shadowsword. Also, boy, shadowswords suddendly got more useful didn't they.
Expensive if you have to buy two to magnetise to make a super knight
Do you mean Questoris Knight Styrix? First, I'm not sure they have Imperium FW Knight rules, only Renegades. Correct me if I am wrong on this. Second, the chierovile gun is now pretty bad. It's like an anti-elite RFBC, but Terminators are relatively uncommon these days, and most other viable elites fly and thus can be taken down with Icarus Crawlers.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/05/29 23:23:26
I see. So it's a survivalist strategy. Durability + redundancy. Probably the right way to go if you're doing Stygies Robots. Do you feel like you struggle against things like Magnus without the easy access to mortal wounds?
I agree with you about the Scouts, though if you're doing artillery, having that extra space is still helpful. Even still, Slamguinius+Mephiston+Techmarine with Vitae is also a nice option.
I played versus Morti and Magnus last tournament and no, its not really a struggle. a unit of 2 Dakkastelans wit WoM and sitting down are a good enough base for the Dragoons and/or shield captains to finish him off. Killed him first turn in my game at the GT. Would it be possible without the 4 to 5 Mortal wounds? I sure think so, yes, even if I dont have turn 1.
The number of Dakkastelan units makes it not so easy for your opponent to criple you effectively. Its not really a hard task to charge into a unit of 6 Dakkastelans and mute or even kill them before they did anything significant. With several smaller units their impact is less extreme and my list has got enough counter charge support to mop him up.
mhhh what are your plans with the Techmarine? I mean Captain Smashface and Mephiston sure, but the TM?
Iago40k wrote: I played versus Morti and Magnus last tournament and no, its not really a struggle. a unit of 2 Dakkastelans wit WoM and sitting down are a good enough base for the Dragoons and/or shield captains to finish him off. Killed him first turn in my game at the GT. Would it be possible without the 4 to 5 Mortal wounds? I sure think so, yes, even if I dont have turn 1.
The number of Dakkastelan units makes it not so easy for your opponent to criple you effectively. Its not really a hard task to charge into a unit of 6 Dakkastelans and mute or even kill them before they did anything significant. With several smaller units their impact is less extreme and my list has got enough counter charge support to mop him up.
mhhh what are your plans with the Techmarine? I mean Captain Smashface and Mephiston sure, but the TM?
Interesting. I realize now that we have become so used to CP scarcity that we've been building our lists with the assumption that we won't be able to WoM every turn for multiple turns. That is not true anymore. I will consider this...
Techmarine carrying Vitae is 5+/5+/5+ CP recycling. Give him the Beam to let him shoot from afar.
I see. So it's a survivalist strategy. Durability + redundancy. Probably the right way to go if you're doing Stygies Robots. Do you feel like you struggle against things like Magnus without the easy access to mortal wounds?
I agree with you about the Scouts, though if you're doing artillery, having that extra space is still helpful. Even still, Slamguinius+Mephiston+Techmarine with Vitae is also a nice option.
I played versus Morti and Magnus last tournament and no, its not really a struggle. a unit of 2 Dakkastelans wit WoM and sitting down are a good enough base for the Dragoons and/or shield captains to finish him off. Killed him first turn in my game at the GT. Would it be possible without the 4 to 5 Mortal wounds? I sure think so, yes, even if I dont have turn 1.
The number of Dakkastelan units makes it not so easy for your opponent to criple you effectively. Its not really a hard task to charge into a unit of 6 Dakkastelans and mute or even kill them before they did anything significant. With several smaller units their impact is less extreme and my list has got enough counter charge support to mop him up.
mhhh what are your plans with the Techmarine? I mean Captain Smashface and Mephiston sure, but the TM?
And how do you deploy your Dakkastelans? All within Cawl bubble? Or do you spread them more to evade charge/piling in on everyone (by a large unit for instance)?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/30 09:57:59
Iago40k wrote: Suggestions dont start with the word "must". The list worked pretty well so its not as bad as you see it. It is not a list to kill the enemy round one. This is a list that plays the Mission. It functions even after loosing several units.
Priests are crap. They dont work if you dont get turn one since everyone and their mother kills them with indirect damage but admech. Infiltrators are pure Garbage as it is. Small groups of dragoons Lack damage and are a waste of CP. If we talk to "play" as you stated, you would not suggest a 4 Pack of dragoons. That is exactly the number you dont want to use.
I played versus Magnus and morti teamed up, won 20:0. I played vs fireraptor and two relic Leviathan. Won 16:4. I played a cerastus, 5 custodes bikers and 3 onager. Won 20:0. Played nids with a crap Ton of psychic. 10:10.
As you See you can have a list without anti Air shooting if you know how to use your captains.
Critique is fine but dude: stay classy.
I said my opinion. Your unable to have a conversation. Your list is not good nor optimal. Priests are crap? When they draw all firepower and you waste cheap points? While if you go first they rock? No your list works fine the non ad mech part rest are your assumptions only. We participate and many have played tour including the latest 10th place with priest you call crap!
Mneuver 4+ Dragoons optimal ? Ok if you don't like my suggestions ignore them but talking like you know it all just add you to my ignore list !
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/30 12:33:36
I said my opinion. Your unable to have a conversation. Your list is not good nor optimal. Priests are crap? When they draw all firepower and you waste cheap points? While if you go first they rock? No your list works fine the non ad mech part rest are your assumptions only. We participate and many have played tour including the latest 10th place with priest you call crap!
Mneuver 4+ Dragoons optimal ? Ok if you don't like my suggestions ignore them but talking like you know it all just add you to my ignore list !
Ah so you can talk like that but if others do that is not okay? Dude srsly. Maybe cut down on those allegations for some time and act like a grown man.
You said your opinion, thats fine. And I tell you that I think your suggestions doesnt help at all since you are not helping to improve the list but to rewrite it. those are very different thinks.
So someone gets 10th place means priest rock, I get 16th in a GT without them and its all assumptions? but i give you that, they are not crap but suboptimal.
You are telling me my list is not competitive while talking about groups of 3 dragoons, adding infiltrators to the list and using Plasma Vanguard. I cant even...-.-
Why would I ignore your "suggestions"? because I dont like them? I didnt ask you to comment on my list, which you did, so why cant I do what you did? That btw is called "having a conversation".
And how do you deploy your Dakkastelans? All within Cawl bubble? Or do you spread them more to evade charge/piling in on everyone (by a large unit for instance)?
The later. I usually go for having 2 of the units save in the Cawl bubble while one unit has to move into the bubble if I go first. But this really depends on the opponent and how he deployed up to the point where I have to place the bots.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2018/05/30 14:56:04
Do you mean Questoris Knight Styrix? First, I'm not sure they have Imperium FW Knight rules, only Renegades. Correct me if I am wrong on this. Second, the chierovile gun is now pretty bad. It's like an anti-elite RFBC, but Terminators are relatively uncommon these days, and most other viable elites fly and thus can be taken down with Icarus Crawlers.
All the FW knights have rules for 8th in the astra militarum imperial armour book. Including the styrix.
I said my opinion. Your unable to have a conversation. Your list is not good nor optimal. Priests are crap? When they draw all firepower and you waste cheap points? While if you go first they rock? No your list works fine the non ad mech part rest are your assumptions only. We participate and many have played tour including the latest 10th place with priest you call crap!
Mneuver 4+ Dragoons optimal ? Ok if you don't like my suggestions ignore them but talking like you know it all just add you to my ignore list !
Ah so you can talk like that but if others do that is not okay? Dude srsly. Maybe cut down on those allegations for some time and act like a grown man.
You said your opinion, thats fine. And I tell you that I think your suggestions doesnt help at all since you are not helping to improve the list but to rewrite it. those are very different thinks.
So someone gets 10th place means priest rock, I get 16th in a GT without them and its all assumptions? but i give you that, they are not crap but suboptimal.
You are telling me my list is not competitive while talking about groups of 3 dragoons, adding infiltrators to the list and using Plasma Vanguard. I cant even...-.-
Why would I ignore your "suggestions"? because I dont like them? I didnt ask you to comment on my list, which you did, so why cant I do what you did? That btw is called "having a conversation".
And how do you deploy your Dakkastelans? All within Cawl bubble? Or do you spread them more to evade charge/piling in on everyone (by a large unit for instance)?
The later. I usually go for having 2 of the units save in the Cawl bubble while one unit has to move into the bubble if I go first. But this really depends on the opponent and how he deployed up to the point where I have to place the bots.
I don care I said my opinion only one picking fights and talking about crap bla bla bla is you. You posted I said many things you need to consider you taking words from a post to make your case. Sorry not interested to pew pew with you nor to figth. Said my opinion that's why forums exists don't like to I'd be more than happy to get you vs my list in a tour. Rest I don't answer nor try to pick fights like you. I used a word must and you off me. Well I care not wanna fight good for you not with me. Go read my first post and if you make any conclusions from all things I wrote good. Else no hard feelings play what you like. I m not here to convince you and you won't tell me what I wanna consider valid. If you don't like what I say ignore I will ignore you either way! Dragoons groups or 3+ is bad while 3*2 robot it's tactical. Go see I'm I coming from the corner boy!
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/05/30 22:00:29
I'm starting Admech up as my second army. I'm planning on doing a predominantly Stygies force for the infiltration + -1 to it + I liked their lore the most. Also planning to dabble with Mars for artillery/gun line. So currently the plan was Stygies Vanguard + Dragoons and Mars Rangers + Dunecrawlers. Dakkastelans and Infiltrators are on the table, but that was going to be my initial build.
Got a few specific questions. First of all, vanguard look really good to me, I'm coming from orks and from a mathhammer perspective they're like shoota boyz with an extra shot and crits. There's a lot of FNP in my meta to make the 2 damage even more enticing.
What's the state of plasma weapons? They excite me but they look costly and paint a bigger target on the vanguard.
Similarly, I have the same question for Rangers but with the transuranic arquebus.
The other question is, how do you end up playing the vanguard and rangers? I'm so used to playing a horde army so playing MSU is very alien to me. This is more of an actual tactics question.
What are peoples thoughts on infiltrators? I like the idea of deepstriking + wrath of mars with them. I'm mainly interested in them fluff + flavour wise, but was hoping they'd be viable enough to run in an escalation league I wish to attend.
Thousand Sons 
World Eaters
Imperial Fists 405th Company 
but i give you that, they are not crap but suboptimal.
