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Made in hk
Steadfast Ultramarine Sergeant




Not knowing if this has been discussed, the question might seem likes a joke, Can the Linebreaker Bombardment be used even at the moment those Vindicator cannot fire normally?

I once thought that this stratagem is garbage, but when I looked into the codex a second time, I find that there is no wording implies that the stratagem can only be used on Vindicator(s) that can be choose to shoot. It just say you must have 3 vindicators located close together, and "the Vindicators cannot fire their demolisher cannons this phase", but nowhere stating the cannon must be able to function normally when using this stratagem, and nowhere say the result will be rely on the tank hits something, just "choose a visible point within 24 inches, then everyone within 3 inches suffer 3D3 MW on a roll of 4+". So, as RAW the Linebreaker Bombardment can be used at situation such as the vindicators just falling back from combat, or the vindicators have just advanced or even used smoke launcher?

What do you guys think?
   
Made in de
Spawn of Chaos




"the vindicators cannot fire their demolisher cannons this phase - instead, select a visible point on the battlefierld"

I think you are right. But i dont know for sure, with this wording no one could say what they clearly mean with instead.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/24 22:53:39


12000p
 
   
Made in de
Drop Trooper with Demo Charge






It is in the Rulebook FAQ 1.1

Q: Can abilities that are used ‘instead of shooting’, such as Smoke Launchers, be used if the model using them has Fallen Back, Advanced or has enemy models within 1" of it?
A: Yes. A model can use such an ability so long as it does not shoot – it does not matter whether this is because the model cannot shoot or it chooses not to.


So yeah, it would work.

If Khorne needs blood, will drown him in his own blood!
If Slaanesh wants pleasure, then we´ll give him DEATH, the greatest pleasure known to man!
If Tzeentch asks for forbidden knowledge, then we will enlighten him with fear of The God Machine!
If Nurgle wants us to embrace rebirth, then to hell with that, the Guard embrace Death, we live to DIE! 
   
Made in nz
Scarred Ultramarine Tyrannic War Veteran




Ankh Morpork

You still have to take and pay for three Vindicators though, so I don't think it makes it a good stratagem
   
Made in us
Ragin' Ork Dreadnought




Why not be a total cheesemonger and bring three Vindicator Laser Destroyers? They still have the 'Vindicator' keyword, but lack Demolisher Cannons - Their main gun is something else entirely. So you can use the strategem, and then fire their totally-not-demolisher-cannons.
Abuse that RAW! Abuse it 'till the cows come home!

(Note: Don't actually do this.)
   
Made in nz
Scarred Ultramarine Tyrannic War Veteran




Ankh Morpork

Waaaghpower wrote:
Why not be a total cheesemonger and bring three Vindicator Laser Destroyers? They still have the 'Vindicator' keyword, but lack Demolisher Cannons - Their main gun is something else entirely. So you can use the strategem, and then fire their totally-not-demolisher-cannons.
Abuse that RAW! Abuse it 'till the cows come home!

(Note: Don't actually do this.)


Mostly don't do this because the stratagem doesn't reference the VINDICATOR keyword, and instead simple references the Vindicator unit, per the regular datasheet.
   
Made in us
Ragin' Ork Dreadnought




 Mr. Shine wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:
Why not be a total cheesemonger and bring three Vindicator Laser Destroyers? They still have the 'Vindicator' keyword, but lack Demolisher Cannons - Their main gun is something else entirely. So you can use the strategem, and then fire their totally-not-demolisher-cannons.
Abuse that RAW! Abuse it 'till the cows come home!

(Note: Don't actually do this.)


Mostly don't do this because the stratagem doesn't reference the VINDICATOR keyword, and instead simple references the Vindicator unit, per the regular datasheet.

A Vindicator Laser Destroyer is still a Vindicator, no?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/25 09:08:04


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




It's a VINDICATOR. Not a Vindicator.

DFTT 
   
Made in us
Chaplain with Hate to Spare





Sioux Falls, SD

 Mr. Shine wrote:
You still have to take and pay for three Vindicators though, so I don't think it makes it a good stratagem
Thankfully their price went down 30 pts. 3 Vindicators run about 400 pts. Definitely expensive as hell, but if you get that Strategem off more than once, it is pretty damn good.

5250 pts
3850 pts
Deathwatch: 1500 pts
Imperial Knights: 375 pts
30K 2500 pts 
   
Made in hk
Steadfast Ultramarine Sergeant




Thanks for sharing the view guys, very helpful

 Mr. Shine wrote:
You still have to take and pay for three Vindicators though, so I don't think it makes it a good stratagem


Many of other Space Marine generic stratagem are garbage, with the decesion that the Vindicator that can use this stratagem as long as there are 3 of them together. This stratagem at least becomes quite decent actually.
For example, As long as I go first, I can 1st turn, drive up and advance in movement phase, so in most cases the enemy portion of army you want to target could be in range now. Come the shooting phase, play this stratagem and at the same time, pop smoke. Now good luck killing T8 Sv3+ 11 wounds model with a -1 to hit within a single turn, unless the opponent have extensive anti-tank weapon or is very good luck . 2nd turn, if they were not charged by enemy, they can choose to stay stationary and shoot normal shells, if they are charged previous turn or have to move due to threatening enemies draw close, then move-advance and use this stratagem again
   
Made in gb
Lord of the Fleet






London

Waaaghpower wrote:
Why not be a total cheesemonger and bring three Vindicator Laser Destroyers? They still have the 'Vindicator' keyword, but lack Demolisher Cannons - Their main gun is something else entirely. So you can use the strategem, and then fire their totally-not-demolisher-cannons.
Abuse that RAW! Abuse it 'till the cows come home!

(Note: Don't actually do this.)


Would it though? The rule states that "The Vindicators cannot fire their Demolisher Cannons", but if they don't have any to fire how can they fulfil the requirements for the strategem? I'm not really looking for a full discussion of this rule however, as it's probably an oversight, one which doesn't need a 10+ page YMDC thread arguing the exact definitions of the rule.

   
Made in us
Ragin' Ork Dreadnought




 Valkyrie wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:
Why not be a total cheesemonger and bring three Vindicator Laser Destroyers? They still have the 'Vindicator' keyword, but lack Demolisher Cannons - Their main gun is something else entirely. So you can use the strategem, and then fire their totally-not-demolisher-cannons.
Abuse that RAW! Abuse it 'till the cows come home!

(Note: Don't actually do this.)


Would it though? The rule states that "The Vindicators cannot fire their Demolisher Cannons", but if they don't have any to fire how can they fulfil the requirements for the strategem? I'm not really looking for a full discussion of this rule however, as it's probably an oversight, one which doesn't need a 10+ page YMDC thread arguing the exact definitions of the rule.


You can use the strategem after falling back from combat, so actually being able to fire a demolisher cannon isn't necessarily relevant.
   
Made in de
Drop Trooper with Demo Charge






See post #3.

If Khorne needs blood, will drown him in his own blood!
If Slaanesh wants pleasure, then we´ll give him DEATH, the greatest pleasure known to man!
If Tzeentch asks for forbidden knowledge, then we will enlighten him with fear of The God Machine!
If Nurgle wants us to embrace rebirth, then to hell with that, the Guard embrace Death, we live to DIE! 
   
 
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