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Now this might just be me, however does anyone else prefer the look, lore and feel of Marines from Rogue Trader/Early 40k?

I'm not talking just about the look of the models but the art work and general mid 80's to early 90's punky feel and look as opposed to this Warrior Monk order that marines are currently? 7

What does everyone else think?

Nop. I love the monastic/Monks in Space/Knights feel of the Space Marines (Thats the reason I play Dark Angels)

The generic pseudopunk cyberhumans that the space marines where in their early days aren't as interesting.

Might be the rose-tinted glasses you have on?

Duh obviously.

They are much more frightening, they require much less planet-of-hats caricature. They seem like someone who could come to my house tomorrow and beat me up, rather than something abstracted and caricatured.

The political situation and material condition were different at the time they were made and that can't really be recreated now.

I dig the old RT era stuff in its own way. In many ways it seems like a fresher setting, with lots of that 80's "Heavy Metal" influence and a lot less...corporate copypasta to the visual. Marines were more "Sardaukar" and less "Crusader".

The stuff especially of the last decade or so has really been mostly snooze inducing or facepalm worthy when it comes to Space Marine visuals and fluff.

Don't get me wrong, I like the current plastic and metal range however there's just something about the "Old School" look that draws me to them.

Certainly they look less human and as previously stated a 'Caricature'.

Maybe its the undertones of religious zeal or Grim-Dark nature of the fluff, personally I feel like there was more personality with the punky look and feel of those earlier marines.

Absolutely. I've always been a huge fan of 80s grimdark/pulp science fiction, and the aspect of the marines that appeals to me is the techno-barbarian part of it, the "I don't really understand how this works or how it was built but I am going to hit you over the head with it and you are going to explode" attitude.

Warrior monks are OK, but they go out of their way too often to make sure that they're relatable to the reader and take away the flaws that would come with a warrior monk type lifestyle (rigidity, ignorance, etc).

I'm fine with current space marines when they're done correctly ("An open mind is a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded") and much less so when they turn up the Marty Stu factor ("Silly Leandros, the Codex Astartes isn't some religious doctrine we follow like a bible, we have to use cool awesome tactics that show that I, Video Game Protagonist Ultrasmurf, am a cool smart dude that someone in the distant past playing a video game of me could feel cool smart and awesome imagining themself as.")

I do miss the old Ork robots that they made that was basically mocking each race.

But not much else honestly.

("Silly Leandros, the Codex Astartes isn't some religious doctrine we follow like a bible, we have to use cool awesome tactics that show that I, Video Game Protagonist Ultrasmurf, am a cool smart dude that someone in the distant past playing a video game of me could feel cool smart and awesome imagining themself as.

You managed to pick one of the things that game actually got correct, given that even in the past codex's before 5th the Ultramarines did and were often forced to change tactics after meeting new species that the Codex Astartes did not cover.. Which is why they added to it over time.

Heck, there's a reason why there are anti-tyranid tactics in it after the entire 1st company got eaten. Tyrannic War Veterans were basically a codifier of "Learn and Adapt"!

Yeah I think part of the problem with the modern fluff is they tell us how it is, then don't really double down on it.

"These Space Marines are the Emperor's divine angels and an embodiment of his wrath. They meditate on His nature daily, when they are not rigorously training for a fight. Even if they do not hold the Emperor to be a god, they recognize his greatness and solemnly act as His ambassadors wherever they walk. The weight of their defense of humanity weighs on their shoulders more heavily than any other burden, but stoically and with conviction, they bear it."

also

"The Space Wolves have the best parties ever. They wolf party so hard that the wolves pass out before they do! And they shoot at the Ecclesiarchy and Inquisition too, because those guys were jerks anyways. Oh, and did we mention Ragnar Blackmane's a real womanizer? Yeah he totally slapped her ass with his Oath of Moment purity seal. It was rad, bro. So when are we stealing the Thunderhawk for a joyride again, brother Lupus Lycanwulf?"

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Yeah I think part of the problem with the modern fluff is they tell us how it is, then don't really double down on it.

"These Space Marines are the Emperor's divine angels and an embodiment of his wrath. They meditate on His nature daily, when they are not rigorously training for a fight. Even if they do not hold the Emperor to be a god, they recognize his greatness and solemnly act as His ambassadors wherever they walk. The weight of their defense of humanity weighs on their shoulders more heavily than any other burden, but stoically and with conviction, they bear it."

also

"The Space Wolves have the best parties ever. They wolf party so hard that the wolves pass out before they do! And they shoot at the Ecclesiarchy and Inquisition too, because those guys were jerks anyways. Oh, and did we mention Ragnar Blackmane's a real womanizer? Yeah he totally slapped her ass with his Oath of Moment purity seal. It was rad, bro. So when are we stealing the Thunderhawk for a joyride again, brother Lupus Lycanwulf?"

No idea why, but I read the second part in John Cleese's frantic tone from this sketch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8R2zvE615dM

As i wasnt around for the older kits and art im not particularly blinded by the nostalgia.

i think the older kits are really off.

sure the newer ones are a bit more sterile and digital but the models look far far far better.

at least i think primarus are spot on for what a marine should look like.

if they redid the space marine line to be a head taller then it currently is or just stop posing them in poopy pants poses then i think they would also look pretty good. so long as they dont increase the size of normal cadians type things.

I started playing in 7th so i didnt grow up on 40k. The old stuff has grown on me a lot since i started playing. The old artwork is imo is so raw and lovingly made. It is hard to compare that to the polished and almost formula followed scenes of the current edition. The new stuff from images to models is technically "better" but there is so much personality in the old that i gravitate to. As for models the newer stuff is a blast to paint. This said, in art a simple well done origional design can often outshine a more decorated one.

Its just about taste and no one is wrong.

I will take rogue trader era art and tongue-n-cheekyness over the current hyper real art direction. Now don't get me wrong, I love the new stuff on soooooo many levels (amazing illustrations, etc) but still want to, I guess reminisce about back in the day 40k.

the current crop of stuff feels more like 2k (all digital) rather than 40k (dot matrix and pen/ink).

Models, I like the newer look. Art, I like the older.

 Galas wrote:
Nop. I love the monastic/Monks in Space/Knights feel of the Space Marines.

Hasn't that been there, to an extent, right from the first Rogue Trader book? It shows the Space Wolves living in a "Fortress Monastery" and calls them "Warrior Monks". It was, I recall, vague about the nature of their religion but said that all Space Marines followed a variant of an "Imperial Cult".

Personally I'm a bit two faced about this...

I love the creativity and freedom that seems to have gone into much of the original book, and I love the humour, I do miss the humour. But it could also be a bit too silly, "Space Elves" just felt daft and like the creativity had been spent elsewhere.

As to the models... I bought the original box of 30 beaky Marines on Games Day in '87 and a metal dreadnought either then or very soon after. 30 Marines for a tenner was fantastic value (that was just over a weeks paper round back then). I've now got back into it and built the models in Dark Imperium and a box of Plague Marines. The quality of both is so much higher than either the plastic or the metal miniatures that I remember. Especially with the Plague Marines I really appreciate the variety of the models. Though when painting I sometimes have found myself cursing the level of details.

So, in a way, I like and dislike both Rogue Trader and the current Dark Imperium. They feel like quite separate games in a way that share some mechanics and slight fluff. The "tone" of both seem really rather different.

 Gordon Shumway wrote:
Models, I like the newer look. Art, I like the older.

this

I liked the marines and artwork from 3rd edition.
Wayne England, Karl Kopinski, Adrian Smith, ect.

As far as models... Same. Newer is better than older. Those old Rogue Trader marines remind of Bill Paxton and co. In The Terminator. Stupid, silly and childish.

To me, give me mid-late 90's all day. Better/crisper and more finalized than the RT era silliness, but not as over-done "crank it to 11!" as a lot of the current sculpts. I mean...Jes Goodwin is about all you have to say.

It was also the era where a handful of character sculpts informed you what chapter you were playing. You didn't need hundreds of overflowing bits of detail to make your marines a special snowflake. Is your armour painted as a Space Wolf? Do you have a tooth necklace or a wolf pelt hanging from a bolt pistol? Cool.

Only the actual chapter characters of the Dark Angels were swathed in robes. Models looked far more purposeful for going into combat. Also, to me, vastly prefer more solid/less agile looking Terminators. It makes them actually look like the nuke-hazmat safety suits they originated from.

I don't need this:


When I can have this: (pardon my crap paintjob)


I just feel a lot of the newer models are just trying way too hard...and bedazzled to hell and gone. Never, once, in GW has the phrase "well, less is more" been uttered. Details are always something the consumer can add if desired.

Personal preference of course.

I dunno. I cant really say Primarus are all that Bejazzled

i was honestly surprised considering the previous editions starter Chaos space marines and there excessive bling though i really like those models.

I agree with the Primaris simply because they've been released as blank-do-anything marines so GW is "almost" forced to restrain themselves. You can bet as time goes on and we get proper new Primaris models attached to Chapters the mayhem will return.

 Elbows wrote:
I agree with the Primaris simply because they've been released as blank-do-anything marines so GW is "almost" forced to restrain themselves. You can bet as time goes on and we get proper new Primaris models attached to Chapters the mayhem will return.

Waiting to see how big of a nipple they give blood angel specific primarus kits

Those abs tho'!

I still love the RT era models, especially terminators. I do like the newer models, but the RT termies will always be awesome to me.