Kill Guiliman or kill everything around him?

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**Dakka Wolf**

The Ultramarines Primarch is a monster in about every way that matters, he's a monster himself and he can make base infantry better than elites.
So, to everyone who doesn't have easy access to mortal wounds, do you kill Papa Smurf or his followers first?

**Insectum7**

I'd be curious to know how you kill him first before killing everything around him.

**mmimzie**

Shining spears can get in on girlyman and kill him atleast once, as they fly, and ahve the shooting to clear out what ever units want to try to bubble wrap him.

**Dawnstrider**

If you were to kill his cronies first, you need to start with the banner. If you can’t get to the banner, I would start with Bobby.
I think that circumstances of the two lists and deployment will dictate which choice is best. If his heavy weapon cronies will have to move to get good targets, that diminishes their capacity, for instance and changes things.

**Amishprn86**

Kill what you need to kill, he is an Aura buff until he gets into melee, if you kill everything else that Aura is pointless.

The 5-6x i fought against him i just killed everything else and isolated him.

**Fafnir**

It's not worth committing any resources to killing Guilliman unless you can confidently take him from 9 to 0 in one turn. Games are mostly decided by turn 2, and he'll be getting back up 75% of the time, which means you're likely going to need both to get the job done.

**Odrankt**

If I see Gulliman I usually shoot what is around him to bring those units down and then I try to charge him in CC so I can hold him for a turn, move my stuff around him (advancing if necessary), fall back with the unit I charged with and then have 2-4 units surrounding him just shooting and hacking him to death. I have beaten him 4 out of 4 times facing him.

I played Necrons for all those games.

**Neophyte2012**

No need to kill everything around him, just kill those Devastators / Hellblasters, and tie up the Razorbacks / Predators in combat. Then you win.

**Blackie**

Kill and tie up the units around him, on his own guilliman isn't scary. With assault oriented armies this tactic is the most effective way to deal with the UM gunline.

**KingLetterman**

Dakka Wolf wrote:
The Ultramarines Primarch is a monster in about every way that matters, he's a monster himself and he can make base infantry better than elites.
So, to everyone who doesn't have easy access to mortal wounds, do you kill Papa Smurf or his followers first?

Hey, I am a Ultramarines player.
Kill all of our other units, avoid Guilliman. Most of our other units arent "that" great. Hellblasters, Agressors, Razorbacks, Vanguard Vets, Dreadnoughts are our best versitile units. So take those out as quicjly as possible. The armies with the best ability to beat us are Tyranids with genestealer swarms and Aliatoic Eldar Cheese. You play Necrons, I have been "having my way" with Necron players as they dont have a codex, but your C'tan seems good and Ghostarks are amazing with that sheese shield. Take up a ton of fire. Also the stalker (i think?) with the 5++ field seems good. Otherwise wait for codex! They will likley make you guys very strong.

**Dakka Wolf**

Insectum7 wrote:
I'd be curious to know how you kill him first before killing everything around him.

I run Space Wolves.
3+ Invulnerable saves are as common to me as Bolters are to most other Space Marine Armies. I know their strengths and weaknesses, massed fire from Lasguns scares me more than a Lascanon, the logic you guys lay down will determine if I fill out my army with AssaultCanons, LasCanons or Grey Hunters.

**Xenomancers**

Well - you don't really stand a chance against guilliman playing space wolves. Ask him not to play Guilliman.

**Dakka Wolf**

Xenomancers wrote:
Well - you don't really stand a chance against guilliman playing space wolves. Ask him not to play Guilliman.

I'm playing competition, that really isn't going to work.
I'm also playing for the first time in months - watched a tournament last month and just about every Imperial list had that guy. Not just the Smurfs, even Guard had him.
The three options that seem to do well at bringing Papa Smurf down are absolutely spamming him with Boltgun fire, peppering him with Bolt Rifle fire or hounding him with a flyer that I rarely use carrying a quarter of an army worth of Assault Canons.

**argonak**

Xenomancers wrote:
Well - you don't really stand a chance against guilliman playing space wolves. Ask him not to play Guilliman.

Playing an index anything against codex is starting from down hill. In my group codex armies don't get to use their chapter tactics or relics (strategems and warlord traits we decided were ok) against an opponent playing an index army. It makes things at least a little less one sided.

**Insectum7**

Now I'm thinking that if you can null the invuln a Thunder Hammer Captain can knock him right out in a single go.

**Dynas**

argonak wrote:
Xenomancers wrote:
Well - you don't really stand a chance against guilliman playing space wolves. Ask him not to play Guilliman.

Playing an index anything against codex is starting from down hill. In my group codex armies don't get to use their chapter tactics or relics (strategems and warlord traits we decided were ok) against an opponent playing an index army. It makes things at least a little less one sided.

We go the other way. Index armies have no limit on the number of CP they can use in a single phase. SO if you want to reroll 4 seperate charges you can.