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I'm running a mostly pure Nurgle Daemon list with a unit of Myphitic Blight-Haulers. They have the Faction keyword Nurgle and the Keyword Daemon. The FAQ stated that they would not benefit from stratagems, but would they benefit from other abilities in the Codex that target friendly Nurgle Daemons? For example, Epidemius. His tally targets Friendly Nurgle Daemons but doesn't say they need the faction keyword Daemons. Same with Fleshy Abundance, Miasma of Pestilence, Daemon Prince of Chaos, and so on and so forth with friendly Nurgle Daemons. I haven't bought any yet and was waiting until after this FAQ to see if that'd change before I bought a unit of 3 of them to add to my army. My assumption would they'd still benefit from things like Epidemius's tally because they are considered Nurgle Daemons with Nurgle Faction and Daemon Keyword but I wanted to make sure I had this straight.

 Tyno2025 wrote:
I'm running a mostly pure Nurgle Daemon list with a unit of Myphitic Blight-Haulers. They have the Faction keyword Nurgle and the Keyword Daemon. The FAQ stated that they would not benefit from stratagems, but would they benefit from other abilities in the Codex that target friendly Nurgle Daemons? For example, Epidemius. His tally targets Friendly Nurgle Daemons but doesn't say they need the faction keyword Daemons. Same with Fleshy Abundance, Miasma of Pestilence, Daemon Prince of Chaos, and so on and so forth with friendly Nurgle Daemons. I haven't bought any yet and was waiting until after this FAQ to see if that'd change before I bought a unit of 3 of them to add to my army. My assumption would they'd still benefit from things like Epidemius's tally because they are considered Nurgle Daemons with Nurgle Faction and Daemon Keyword but I wanted to make sure I had this straight.

You are correct. The Special Snowflake FAQ only applies to stratagems. Any auras that affect Keywords affect them regardless of being faction keywords or not.

GW: The only company where their FAQ document needs FAQ documents.

 Tyno2025 wrote:
I'm running a mostly pure Nurgle Daemon list with a unit of Myphitic Blight-Haulers. They have the Faction keyword Nurgle and the Keyword Daemon. The FAQ stated that they would not benefit from stratagems, but would they benefit from other abilities in the Codex that target friendly Nurgle Daemons? For example, Epidemius. His tally targets Friendly Nurgle Daemons but doesn't say they need the faction keyword Daemons. Same with Fleshy Abundance, Miasma of Pestilence, Daemon Prince of Chaos, and so on and so forth with friendly Nurgle Daemons. I haven't bought any yet and was waiting until after this FAQ to see if that'd change before I bought a unit of 3 of them to add to my army. My assumption would they'd still benefit from things like Epidemius's tally because they are considered Nurgle Daemons with Nurgle Faction and Daemon Keyword but I wanted to make sure I had this straight.

You might wanna write into the community site because that's a very good question.

It seems fairly obvious to me based on the wording and subsequent changing of keywords that when something affects "nurgle daemon" then it is referring to the nurgle daemon faction. People are mixing faction and unit keywords to get what they want which would clearly result in unbalanced play that was not intended, such as 4+ reanimation of bloat drones. So dumb of them when choosing keywords to use the word daemon in different ways.

Ike42 wrote:
It seems fairly obvious to me based on the wording and subsequent changing of keywords that when something affects "nurgle daemon" then it is referring to the nurgle daemon faction. People are mixing faction and unit keywords to get what they want which would clearly result in unbalanced play that was not intended, such as 4+ reanimation of bloat drones. So dumb of them when choosing keywords to use the word daemon in different ways.

Except that contradicts the Designers Commentary FAQ which says faction keywords and normal keywords are no different during the game.

They are no different, except when they are. For Strategums, they are different says the FAQ.

 alextroy wrote:
They are no different, except when they are. For Strategums, they are different says the FAQ.

ONLY for stratagems, not for Auras. And even then that's only because of a special snowflake "ignore the rules" FAQ.

Gotcha. So general consensus would be that they benefit each other with the exception of stratagems which was spelled out in the FAQ right?

so would that now imply that all stratagems can only be used by units with the faction keywords since it was clarrified in this FAQ?

mchammadad wrote:
so would that now imply that all stratagems can only be used by units with the faction keywords since it was clarrified in this FAQ?

It would, but that directly contradicts the Death Guard faq (which was also updated). So for now, this ruling only applies to daemons.
It's literally a knee jerk reaction to deep striking primarchs. Completely not thought through or consistent.

Umm... dont death guard still have the "heretic astartes' faction keyword? and CSM stratagems call out that specific keyword?

I think the death guard FAQ just clarified that they were still 'heretic astartes' so you can use those stratagems cause they call out that faction keyword

Just had a look at death guard and CSM, and sure enough it calls out 'heretic astartes'

Ok. But nowhere is is said that stratagems at only intended to affect faction keywords. And I'm sure here are plenty of examples of stratagems which call out non faction keywords.

I guess this is easier than errating each strat to say faction daemon. Lazy way of doing it tho.

Actually..... i looked throught all the different codexes and found something very interesting.

All of the codex stratagems, with the exception of certain units that are called out. Only specify faction keywords for their stratagems. (Space marines it refers to <CHAPTER> or SPACE MARINE (Which is specifically ADEPTUS ASTARTES and <CHAPTER&gt

This applies to Adeptus mechanicum (even differentiating Skiitari and normal mechanicum) Chaos Space marines (Heretic astartes or <LEGION> faction keywords) and i have a pretty good hunch that it would apply to other factions aswell.

I think that GW intentionally made it this way that faction units are effected by their factions stratagems. It only started to be confusing when Chaos daemons came out, because most CHAOS units have DAEMON either as a faction keyword or a normal.

This is just clarifying that it was only supposed to be faction keywords all along that were effected, and no other keyword works for those.

So...... yeaa..... turns out GW actually kept track of this, and that we all just didn't see it

I think they missed a trick by not having two separate keywords, e.g. one for the DAEMON faction and one for anything DAEMONIC.

Other FAQ fridge logic:

1. Death Guard - why do Plague Drones no longer have the DAEMON faction keyword. when Nurglings, Plaguebearers and Beasts of Nurgle still do?

2. Daemons - why do Daemonettes still lack the DAEMONETTE keyword, even when Seekers and Hellflayers now have that keyword? (applicable for e.g. the Masque).

3. Should Plague Drones have the PLAGUEBEARER keyword, and Bloodcrushers have the BLOODLETTER keyword? This would be consistent with e.g. Skull Cannon having BLOODLETTER, Seekers/Chariots having DAEMONETTE, Burning Chariot having EXHALTED FLAMER, and all the heralds having one of the appropriate keywords. Cavalry should have the rider's keywords, no?

2, I know what people are going to say, but the s at the end of a keyword comes and goes. Daemonettes are still daemonettes and benefit from daemonette.

1 and 3 are to me a clear indicator that this one was rushed, and base purely on what people were complaining about and not independent thought.
Morale of the story is to always send problems you notice to the faq email.

AutocannonSidearm wrote:
I think they missed a trick by not having two separate keywords, e.g. one for the DAEMON faction and one for anything DAEMONIC.

Or have rules referring to faction keyword as "target model faction:daemon" or some such. Don't pretend they are separate.

They should have just gone oldschool and use "Neverborn" for the faction daemon keyword. it's been around in the lore forever and makes a nice clear distinction between them and daemon engines/possessed.

Oh well.

 WindstormSCR wrote:
They should have just gone oldschool and use "Neverborn" for the faction daemon keyword. it's been around in the lore forever and makes a nice clear distinction between them and daemon engines/possessed.

Oh well.

Codex Neverborn would sound pretty awesome if they did that.

 Tyno2025 wrote:

 WindstormSCR wrote:
They should have just gone oldschool and use "Neverborn" for the faction daemon keyword. it's been around in the lore forever and makes a nice clear distinction between them and daemon engines/possessed.

Oh well.

Codex Neverborn would sound pretty awesome if they did that.

I assume Wyrd have the rights to the name Neverborn for miniature games:

https://www.wyrd-games.net/malifaux-neverborn/

Either that, or it's not copyrightable in which case GW are unlikely to touch it anyway.

Primordial Annihilators would be cool but maybe a little too much even for 40k.