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 Galas wrote:

Kinda the contrary, they are the ones gatekeeping people out for not doing things their way. Of course is their event and they have that right. But I'm free to say that I disagree with them.

It's not really "their way". It is the fair way. You don't need to be at a tournament to want to play fairly.

In 7th it didn't matter so much. In 8th it matters a whole ton on how big your base is to be within an aura.

Like I said above - blue tack. Keep your painted bases and remove the unpainted blue tacked base for display.

Glue a base on another base. Done.

Just wait until you play a guy with 30 devastators on 25mm bases all within a custodes 5+invun bubble hahaha. These WAAC players are dicks.

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Galas wrote:

Kinda the contrary, they are the ones gatekeeping people out for not doing things their way. Of course is their event and they have that right. But I'm free to say that I disagree with them.

It's not really "their way". It is the fair way. You don't need to be at a tournament to want to play fairly.

In 7th it didn't matter so much. In 8th it matters a whole ton on how big your base is to be within an aura.

Like I said above - blue tack. Keep your painted bases and remove the unpainted blue tacked base for display.

I can understand the "fair way". Thats why, if they allowed gluing (Or using bluetac) the apropiate base to your base, or using those base adaptators, then I'll be ok with that. But it appears they don't allow that. You need to rebase and paint your new base.

 koooaei wrote:
Glue a base on another base. Done.

Actually you could argue that this wouldn't be okay because this raises the models height when it was normally shorter.

The real issue with this to me is that there are still kits of models with older bases flying around. It's entirely possible to go to a FLGS today and buy marines with 25mm bases - because the kits are old.

I don't think people would get models pulled for 25mm bases instead of 32mm bases. It's when you put a model on a pie plate that people get upset.

Bluetack them onto clear bases. Simple as that, no need to paint or anything

Couldn't you either
1. Simply put a magnet under your done up base and a magnet/metal on the new bases and simply click them on and off
2. Blue tack them onto blank or clear bases just for this tournament.

Both options really wouldn't take more than a day and wouldn't be very expensive

Edit: Some people have said this could affect the height on a model but considering you are free to model guys standing on rocks/ other stuff on a base I doubt adding another lip edge would really make a difference. Also if you magnetized them you could always quickly place them down to measure "true hight" if someone complained (highly doubt this would come up

 Galas wrote:


I can understand the "fair way". Thats why, if they allowed gluing (Or using bluetac) the apropiate base to your base, or using those base adaptators, then I'll be ok with that. But it appears they don't allow that. You need to rebase and paint your new base.

Well, if they're not willing to bend a little that's pretty dumb.

These rules with base sizes etc do indeed leak into casual play. At campaign events that I run, I specifically state that you use the base that the model came with, so if you have legacy models you're fine.

There are some that get very angry that enforcing the current bases "like they do at tournaments" is not something that I enforce at casual narrative events.

Hmmmm rebase two entire Marine armies?

No. No go feth yourself.

Leaving the EU was just the first indicator that the brits have lost their minds.
Love your humor but sorry not gonna redo 200+ bases.

 combatcotton wrote:
Leaving the EU was just the first indicator that the brits have lost their minds.
Love your humor but sorry not gonna redo 200+ bases.

AoS players already went through it and 40K players are for the most part in a much gentler position then they were.

It's coming for you whether you like it or not.

Glad I decided to not go to this event, and now i know that I wont be going to any future ones. There's competitive, and then there is taking a game of little toy soldiers wayyyyy to seriously.

secretForge wrote:
Glad I decided to not go to this event, and now i know that I wont be going to any future ones. There's competitive, and then there is taking a game of little toy soldiers wayyyyy to seriously.

Say what you will, it's a real thing. I've seen it first hand - a friend who intentionally based every assault unit in his army on the smallest possible base so he can get as many into melee combat as possible.

Daedalus81 wrote:

AoS players already went through it and 40K players are for the most part in a much gentler position then they were.

It's coming for you whether you like it or not.

AoS is unplayable garbage. True WHFB is dead.

 auticus wrote:
These rules with base sizes etc do indeed leak into casual play. At campaign events that I run, I specifically state that you use the base that the model came with, so if you have legacy models you're fine.

There are some that get very angry that enforcing the current bases "like they do at tournaments" is not something that I enforce at casual narrative events.

I wouldnt play with you, my Harlequins Shadowseer, Solitaire, Troupe Masters and Deathjesters are "sold on 25mm" but i put them on 32mm b.c they look better and are characters, especailly the TM since he is just a normal looking Troupe (he is suppose to have a different mask.. but who other than Quin players know that?) its easier to see them that way and just looks better, makes them look like characters now.

Then there is the Biovores problem they once came on 40mm bases a long time ago, now they are the same model but are on 60mm bases. Biovores look terrible on 60mm bases... i mean they are tiny. They are about the Size of a terminator. place one of your terminators on a 60mm base and tell me that looks right?

I'm going to converse with them about unpainted base adaptors and see what the feedback is.

FYI, i did the math for my House (3 bedroom tri-level)

If i had to replace my 40 models with 40mm to 60mm bases, it would cost 70$.

The average time to cut (they are suger glued and sand based, they are actually really hard to cut off) rebase, paint, glue, sand etc.. I could have bought enough and spend the same amount of time to re-paint my house with 1 coat (painting over the dirt, sun fade etc..)

So your telling me, they want you to re-paint your house to play in this tournament if you have bought your models before the base changes?

 Amishprn86 wrote:

 auticus wrote:
These rules with base sizes etc do indeed leak into casual play. At campaign events that I run, I specifically state that you use the base that the model came with, so if you have legacy models you're fine.

There are some that get very angry that enforcing the current bases "like they do at tournaments" is not something that I enforce at casual narrative events.

I wouldnt play with you, my Harlequins Shadowseer, Solitaire, Troupe Masters and Deathjesters are "sold on 25mm" but i put them on 32mm b.c they look better and are characters, especailly the TM since he is just a normal looking Troupe (he is suppose to have a different mask.. but who other than Quin players know that?) its easier to see them that way and just looks better, makes them look like characters now.

Then there is the Biovores problem they once came on 40mm bases a long time ago, now they are the same model but are on 60mm bases. Biovores look terrible on 60mm bases... i mean they are tiny. They are about the Size of a terminator. place one of your terminators on a 60mm base and tell me that looks right?

There has to be a line drawn somewhere I suppose. If someone rebased their models to upsize them to the current size, that wouldn't be a big deal. Beyond that it would be player discretion. But that's a pandora's box. Personal private games I'd have zero problem with it though. Public games there are always rules benders and waacists that would say "you let Amishprn86 rebase his guys because they look better to him, well I think my chaos terminators look better on 20mm rounds wink wink" so for public events there has to be a boundary.

AoS players already went through it

Heh I still haven't rebased a single miniature. I'm fine running on squares. My new models of course are on the rounds but I put a lot of time into my armies and rebasing them just isn't something I would ever consider doing.

AdmiralHalsey wrote:

 Silentz wrote:
My slight concern here is that it seems this is a ruling you have gained in a one on one email discussion with the TO, right?

So presumably you have sought clarification that your weirdly-based units are OK and disappointingly been told no, they're not.

If that's true thenI would say that unless they publish this as a rules change somewhere, then it doesn't apply to anyone else. You discovering this ruling doesn't necessarily mean that others showing up with unusual base sizes will be turned away or asked to remove models.

This is where the saying "it's better to ask for forgiveness than permission" arises

I saught general rules clarification with open ended questions about models based on the bases they were sold with vs the bases they are sold with now. I included several generic examples, [Such as old marines vs new marines] but I hardly made the question specific to me.

None of my models are based 'Weirdly' they're based as they came, with the exception of two or three characters that are based on GW's now out of print Forgeworld 'Senic bases', which I think are 32mm, and thus larger than the bases those models were originally sold with.

Given the events attitude is, 'If your model isn't permissable, we'll ask you to remove it from the table' I sure wouldn't want this to be sprung on someone else at the event by suprise. But you're all welcome to email them yourselves for clarification if you like.

So, just to make sure I have this clear. You emailed a TO for this event to clarify a question that you had regarding base sizes, and they told you in this private exchange that all models at the event must be on the current base sizes, no custom or legacy base sizes will be permitted. However, the official tournament packet that they put out does not clearly state this ruling (hence why you asked them the question in the first place). Is this correct?

If this is the case, then the TOs messed up and can't really enforce this ruling at the event. They did not make this clear that this was going to be a rule for the event in the official event document. The players participating in this event paid money to attend the event and participate in the tournament, and did so based on the official rules document. If these players show up and are told they are unable to play in the tournament they paid to be in due to a rule that was not in the official document, the TOs either are gonna have to offer full refunds on the spot or offer free rebasing/base extenders so they players can be compliant with the new rule. Otherwise, this could potentially be a lawsuit for them.

I am not a lawyer, I am not well versed in British law, if my read of the situation is incorrect, please let me know.

At the very least, even if it is not possible for a lawsuit to take place, once this gets out that a major tournament is attempting to enforce a rule they did not include in their tournament packet that prevents players who paid to be there from competing, there's gonna be a show online and this tournament is gonna get a fair bit of bad press within the community.

 auticus wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:

 auticus wrote:
These rules with base sizes etc do indeed leak into casual play. At campaign events that I run, I specifically state that you use the base that the model came with, so if you have legacy models you're fine.

There are some that get very angry that enforcing the current bases "like they do at tournaments" is not something that I enforce at casual narrative events.

I wouldnt play with you, my Harlequins Shadowseer, Solitaire, Troupe Masters and Deathjesters are "sold on 25mm" but i put them on 32mm b.c they look better and are characters, especailly the TM since he is just a normal looking Troupe (he is suppose to have a different mask.. but who other than Quin players know that?) its easier to see them that way and just looks better, makes them look like characters now.

Then there is the Biovores problem they once came on 40mm bases a long time ago, now they are the same model but are on 60mm bases. Biovores look terrible on 60mm bases... i mean they are tiny. They are about the Size of a terminator. place one of your terminators on a 60mm base and tell me that looks right?

There has to be a line drawn somewhere I suppose. If someone rebased their models to upsize them to the current size, that wouldn't be a big deal. Beyond that it would be player discretion. But that's a pandora's box. Personal private games I'd have zero problem with it though. Public games there are always rules benders and waacists that would say "you let Amishprn86 rebase his guys because they look better to him, well I think my chaos terminators look better on 20mm rounds wink wink" so for public events there has to be a boundary.

AoS players already went through it

Heh I still haven't rebased a single miniature. I'm fine running on squares. My new models of course are on the rounds but I put a lot of time into my armies and rebasing them just isn't something I would ever consider doing.

Yes GW has drawn a line saying its "You can use what you had or new bases"

Edit: Re-worded.

I like how half of this thread is people offering reasonable, sound advice, while other half is entitled whiners using curses instead of arguments

 Marmatag wrote:
Actually you could argue that this wouldn't be okay because this raises the models height when it was normally shorter.

Not really, these models were usually much smaller than modern ones. In fact, that would pretty much make them the size of modern BA/DW marine.

 Amishprn86 wrote:
If i had to replace my 40 models with 40mm to 60mm bases, it would cost 70$.

The average time to cut (they are suger glued and sand based, they are actually really hard to cut off) rebase, paint, glue, sand etc.. I could have bought enough and spend the same amount of time to re-paint my house with 1 coat (painting over the dirt, sun fade etc..)

So your telling me, they want you to re-paint your house to play in this tournament if you have bought your models before the base changes?

I like that strawman, inflated "count" that pretty much shows the issue in more biased way than most one-sided arguments I've ever seen.

First, it's maybe 70$ if you order bases directly from GW, shipping and all. In reality, ebay is full of offers of bits sellers giving you 10 bases for 1$ deals. Yes, even big bases, if you know where to look. Wow, 4$, what a massive amount! Second, you also don't need to cut off the mini, simply trim the rim off base, glue on top of new one, smack some glue on bald spots on new, bigger base, re-sand, done, takes a minute per model. And cents worth of glue. Wow, 40 minutes, who has that much time? I know, I actually did it myself. It also creates cool little uneven sand hill for your model to stand on, looking better than flat surface. If you're too lazy to spend 5-10$ and a hour of time to get your army tournament legal, fine, but at least be honest and don't try to warp it in some really weird ways pretending it's somehow a massive investment...

And that's if you won't take reasonable advice above and don't simply glue transparent 60 mm disc under your bases, which would take 5 min and maybe 5$ for the whole army, at best. Wow, what impossible, unbelievably expensive, daunting task!

It was a fun way to look at it, and you took it very seriously lol. Calm down dude.

I would rather boycott the even than even pay 5$ for a temp basing issue.

 Irbis wrote:
I like how half of this thread is people offering reasonable, sound advice, while other half is entitled whiners using curses instead of arguments

What exactly is entitled about telling a self-important tournament organiser jobsworth to shove their non-existent ruling up their arse?

Go on, I'll wait...

 Amishprn86 wrote:

Yes GW has drawn a line saying its "You can use what you had or new bases"

Edit: Re-worded.

Yes, but you'll be hard pressed to find a tournament allowing it.

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:

Yes GW has drawn a line saying its "You can use what you had or new bases"

Edit: Re-worded.

Yes, but you'll be hard pressed to find a tournament allowing it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't most, if not all, major US tournaments follow GW's ruling of use the base the model was packaged with or use the new current base size? I know several rather high ranking tournament players and have played with them, both in and out of tournaments, in the past, and I have never heard of any tournament in the US rule that you had to use the current base size for a model. As long as the base is the size they came with out of the box, you're good.

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:

Yes GW has drawn a line saying its "You can use what you had or new bases"

Edit: Re-worded.

Yes, but you'll be hard pressed to find a tournament allowing it.

I havent seen one that hasnt yet... I even talked to the long war guys about my Hive guard (tho now im doing SOB b.c a friend wants to do doubles) and they were like "Gw doesnt care we dont care, just as long as they all are on the same bases and dont have some large and some small with the same units"

And the local ones around me dont care... So what ones are making everyone have Space Marines on 32mm? (well other than this one)

 Irbis wrote:
First, it's maybe 70$ if you order bases directly from GW, shipping and all. In reality, ebay is full of offers of bits sellers giving you 10 bases for 1$ deals. Yes, even big bases, if you know where to look. Wow, 4$, what a massive amount! Second, you also don't need to cut off the mini, simply trim the rim off base, glue on top of new one, smack some glue on bald spots on new, bigger base, re-sand, done, takes a minute per model. And cents worth of glue. Wow, 40 minutes, who has that much time? I know, I actually did it myself. It also creates cool little uneven sand hill for your model to stand on, looking better than flat surface. If you're too lazy to spend 5-10$ and a hour of time to get your army tournament legal, fine, but at least be honest and don't try to warp it in some really weird ways pretending it's somehow a massive investment...

And that's if you won't take reasonable advice above and don't simply glue transparent 60 mm disc under your bases, which would take 5 min and maybe 5$ for the whole army, at best. Wow, what impossible, unbelievably expensive, daunting task!

You realize that creates taller model? Which then in return could also claimed to be modeling for advantage and even worse ruins several transport options. I know if I had to do that with my 30k armies I would have to basically throw all the foams to garbage because they wouldn't anymore FIT. The slots are barely tall enough as it is. Even 2mm and bye bye. We are now talking about over hundred euro's AND I would need another box(since suddenly all models wouldn't fit to box as taller slots=less slots per foam) so add another 70e or so.

Just to appeal some TFG's insists that I need to rebase. Yeah right. Sure. When that TFG can first pay. Oh and it's not as simple with resin bases where that addition needs to blend in with original base or replace base completely.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:

Yes GW has drawn a line saying its "You can use what you had or new bases"

Edit: Re-worded.

Yes, but you'll be hard pressed to find a tournament allowing it.

Yeah like all the tournaments here.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Amishprn86 wrote:

I havent seen one that hasnt yet... I even talked to the long war guys about my Hive guard (tho now im doing SOB b.c a friend wants to do doubles) and they were like "Gw doesnt care we dont care, just as long as they all are on the same bases and dont have some large and some small with the same units"

And the local ones around me dont care... So what ones are making everyone have Space Marines on 32mm? (well other than this one)

That's lot stricter than here actually.

We had a discussion like this in our FLGS not long ago. It almost tore apart our playerbase, as one half was telling us to rebase everything to make it more fair, while the other half was telling us to go feth off because their minis were on the bases they came with (some of us use minis from way back to 2nd ed.).

Actually I think it wouldnt really matter if you get 5 or maybe 7 guys into melee, while your playing a game in which your landraider usually gets popped in turn 1 (maybe even before you've got your turn).

BUT i do think it would be a good idea for GW to have a clear rule for base sizes.

If they would tell us to rebase everything to the new standard, I would be looking at about 100-200 models that i needed to rebase. But then again, at least we had a clear rule and noone would have to argue about this.

If they would tell us to go with whatever size you want as long as the model doesnt look to awkard on the base, that would be fine, too. If someone would put assault squads on 25mm bases, while the rest of his army goes on 32mm, that player maybe would be "basing for advantage" but he would be clearly backed by the rules, so no arguing there either.

Like I said, that discussion did really hurt the playerbase in my FLGS. Some players even refuse to play there anymore.

I think this will also be the case in the LVO. They talked about Bloodletters on 25 mm bases vs 32 mm bases and that the 25 mm weren't allowed.