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I think Ravenwing can be a fairly competitive Marine build considering they have very cost-effective and simple stratagems. Speed of the Ravenwing and Masters of the Dark Age are just simply efficient and good in almost all situations. Yes I'll take more damage dealing and more reach on my attacks for 1 CP each!. This is in contrast with general SM stratagems which are much more toolbox in nature and situationally good. Just a different approach I guess for a huge faction versus a smaller faction.

Dark Angels Battalion +3 CP:
Ravenwing Talonmaster - 188 (Warlord) and gets Heavenfall Blade Relic
Samael on Saberclaw - 216
5 Scouts w/Bolters - 55
5 Scouts w/Bolters - 55
5 Scouts w/Bolters - 55
3 Plasma Inceptors - 177
6 Black Knights - 276
Darkshroud - 138

Flyer Wing +1 CP:
Dark Talon - 160
Dark Talon - 160
Dark Talon - 160

Imperial Vanguard+1 CP:
Regular Marine Librarian w/Jump Pack, Bolt Pistol, and Force Sword - 120
Culexus Assassin - 85
Eversor Assassin - 70
Eversor Assassin - 70

Total: 1985

What should I do with last 15 points?

Option A: Take a Combi-Plasma on the Librarian. Useful on the drop for 2 more plasma shots. If this was the case, I would swap him to Dark Angels so he could drop near Samael and re-roll his 1's.
Option B: Upgrade the Darkshroud to have an assault cannon and upgrade force sword to force axe. Seems kind of situational gear since DarkShroud with be Jinking most of the time and I doubt the librarian is getting in combat that much
Option C: Upgrade Librarian to Ezekiel. However, I don't have a place to really put him since he is a solo footslogger.
Option D: Something I haven't thought of?

I think you have more than enough fire power to deal with armour and hordes. As you said, you may have to get a little close for a lot of the anti-tank, with the rift cannons and knights, but I think you'll be okay. You usually want the Dark Talons close anyways so you can get double tap range and the -1 is huge, especially if you get aversion off or have it in range of the darkshrouds. I usually have mine go in ahead of everything in order to soften up key targets or thin hordes and they always make back at least their cost.

@Mysticbucket

What do you think of the Xiphon and the Culexus? I think typically those points would be spent on 2 additional Dark Talons. However, I figured I wanted one source of long range anti-tank in the list and not just getting in 18 inch range. The Culexus is for anti-Smite which I read about being a big threat to a low army count army like Ravenwing even with the Spite nerf.

What is your experience with the Rift Cannons? Hitting on 4+ if moved seems to be induce a lot of variability. However, if they do hit, they hit like bricks I would think with 3 standard damage and potential to do 3 more.

hoya4life3381 wrote:
@Mysticbucket

What do you think of the Xiphon and the Culexus? I think typically those points would be spent on 2 additional Dark Talons. However, I figured I wanted one source of long range anti-tank in the list and not just getting in 18 inch range. The Culexus is for anti-Smite which I read about being a big threat to a low army count army like Ravenwing even with the Spite nerf.

What is your experience with the Rift Cannons? Hitting on 4+ if moved seems to be induce a lot of variability. However, if they do hit, they hit like bricks I would think with 3 standard damage and potential to do 3 more.

From my experience, drop the Xiphon. The models great and I had to get one, but it’s not very good. In the rain under I’ve used it in, it zipped around doing nothing until it got shot down. Assassins are good, but maybe take a few more for a screen?

lliu wrote:

hoya4life3381 wrote:
@Mysticbucket

What do you think of the Xiphon and the Culexus? I think typically those points would be spent on 2 additional Dark Talons. However, I figured I wanted one source of long range anti-tank in the list and not just getting in 18 inch range. The Culexus is for anti-Smite which I read about being a big threat to a low army count army like Ravenwing even with the Spite nerf.

What is your experience with the Rift Cannons? Hitting on 4+ if moved seems to be induce a lot of variability. However, if they do hit, they hit like bricks I would think with 3 standard damage and potential to do 3 more.

From my experience, drop the Xiphon. The models great and I had to get one, but it’s not very good. In the rain under I’ve used it in, it zipped around doing nothing until it got shot down. Assassins are good, but maybe take a few more for a screen?

Really surprised to hear this. I guess 4 lascannons for 240 is a bit expensive but then again 4 lascannon Devs still cost 165/170 points. It just felt like a natural felt into the list to provide longer range firepower and not have to rely on getting in 18" Rift Cannon.

hoya4life3381 wrote:
@Mysticbucket

What do you think of the Xiphon and the Culexus? I think typically those points would be spent on 2 additional Dark Talons. However, I figured I wanted one source of long range anti-tank in the list and not just getting in 18 inch range. The Culexus is for anti-Smite which I read about being a big threat to a low army count army like Ravenwing even with the Spite nerf.

What is your experience with the Rift Cannons? Hitting on 4+ if moved seems to be induce a lot of variability. However, if they do hit, they hit like bricks I would think with 3 standard damage and potential to do 3 more.

Technically the Rift Cannon will still hit ground targets on a 3+ due to Strafing Run, which gives it +1 to hit when shooting, which is great with the hurricanes which then hit on 2+. From my experience, they will melt most things if you get enough shots in, but that's the trick as Dark Talons are something of a glass cannon. The Xiphon I'm unsure of. I have no experience with them, but they seem fairly solid in a vacuum. However, their cost seems a bit steep when you could get a full las pred for 50 pts cheaper that does the same thing or better yet some devs. The Culexus is great, they are a serious pain to deal with and are well worth their salt. I agree getting more would always be worthwhile, however I think their efficacy in a highly mobile list such as Ravenwing is questionable. I've only ever had experience with them in much more static lists, so I'm not sure.

Also side note, if you have 3 flyers in your list, just toss them in an airwing. You don't need an HQ for it and you get a nice extra CP.

 Mysticbucket wrote:

hoya4life3381 wrote:
@Mysticbucket

What do you think of the Xiphon and the Culexus? I think typically those points would be spent on 2 additional Dark Talons. However, I figured I wanted one source of long range anti-tank in the list and not just getting in 18 inch range. The Culexus is for anti-Smite which I read about being a big threat to a low army count army like Ravenwing even with the Spite nerf.

What is your experience with the Rift Cannons? Hitting on 4+ if moved seems to be induce a lot of variability. However, if they do hit, they hit like bricks I would think with 3 standard damage and potential to do 3 more.

Technically the Rift Cannon will still hit ground targets on a 3+ due to Strafing Run, which gives it +1 to hit when shooting, which is great with the hurricanes which then hit on 2+. From my experience, they will melt most things if you get enough shots in, but that's the trick as Dark Talons are something of a glass cannon. The Xiphon I'm unsure of. I have no experience with them, but they seem fairly solid in a vacuum. However, their cost seems a bit steep when you could get a full las pred for 50 pts cheaper that does the same thing or better yet some devs. The Culexus is great, they are a serious pain to deal with and are well worth their salt. I agree getting more would always be worthwhile, however I think their efficacy in a highly mobile list such as Ravenwing is questionable. I've only ever had experience with them in much more static lists, so I'm not sure.

Also side note, if you have 3 flyers in your list, just toss them in an airwing. You don't need an HQ for it and you get a nice extra CP.

I didn't add another detachment for flyers because I am already at the 3 detachment limit. The Culexus counts a an Auxiliary detachment. You bring up a good point and this is a good reason to get rid of it.

The Culexus is held in reserve and should be able to deploy semi-near your opponents psycher so mobility is not a key issue.

I edited my army quite a bit. Could you guys help me with the last 15 points?

I'd stick an assault cannon on the Darkshroud. The extra shots are well worth it I think and the extra strength can help with GEQ units as you're then wounding on 2's.

lliu wrote:

From my experience, drop the Xiphon. The models great and I had to get one, but it’s not very good. In the rain under I’ve used it in, it zipped around doing nothing until it got shot down. Assassins are good, but maybe take a few more for a screen?

The xiphon is the best anti air fighter of the imperium, and its good against all else. It hits other hard to hit flyers on 3+. It hits other non hard to hit FLY units on 2+. And there is a lot of those. Daemons with wings, tyranids with wings, eldar jetbikes, eldar tanks, infantry with JP. It hits anything else on 3+.

 p5freak wrote:

lliu wrote:

From my experience, drop the Xiphon. The models great and I had to get one, but it’s not very good. In the rain under I’ve used it in, it zipped around doing nothing until it got shot down. Assassins are good, but maybe take a few more for a screen?

The xiphon is the best anti air fighter of the imperium, and its good against all else. It hits other hard to hit flyers on 3+. It hits other non hard to hit FLY units on 2+. And there is a lot of those. Daemons with wings, tyranids with wings, eldar jetbikes, eldar tanks, infantry with JP. It hits anything else on 3+.

Yes, but on the table it isn’t as good as it sounds. I’ve played five games, and in sac it’s failed to do anything. I played against Nurgle so that may affect what I think, but even up against Morty and Magnus my other units did a lot more damage than the Xiphon. Also it’s flimsy, and a few well-aimed lascannon shots can bring it down.

lliu wrote:

 p5freak wrote:

lliu wrote:

From my experience, drop the Xiphon. The models great and I had to get one, but it’s not very good. In the rain under I’ve used it in, it zipped around doing nothing until it got shot down. Assassins are good, but maybe take a few more for a screen?

The xiphon is the best anti air fighter of the imperium, and its good against all else. It hits other hard to hit flyers on 3+. It hits other non hard to hit FLY units on 2+. And there is a lot of those. Daemons with wings, tyranids with wings, eldar jetbikes, eldar tanks, infantry with JP. It hits anything else on 3+.

Yes, but on the table it isn’t as good as it sounds. I’ve played five games, and in sac it’s failed to do anything. I played against Nurgle so that may affect what I think, but even up against Morty and Magnus my other units did a lot more damage than the Xiphon. Also it’s flimsy, and a few well-aimed lascannon shots can bring it down.

I think I see your point. As long as the Xiphon is undamaged, he is quite good. However, his damage chart is quite punishing and his performance deteriorates after taking the 4th wound. It's damage chart is quite a bit more brittle than say a predator and costs about 50 points more (granted to gain all those flyer and anti-flyer benefits).

Mysticbucket wrote:I'd stick an assault cannon on the Darkshroud. The extra shots are well worth it I think and the extra strength can help with GEQ units as you're then wounding on 2's.

How often are you actually shooting with the Darkshroud? I would imagine it's Jinking and Advancing always to get the 4+ save no?

lliu wrote:

Yes, but on the table it isn’t as good as it sounds. I’ve played five games, and in sac it’s failed to do anything. I played against Nurgle so that may affect what I think, but even up against Morty and Magnus my other units did a lot more damage than the Xiphon. Also it’s flimsy, and a few well-aimed lascannon shots can bring it down.

Just because you were unlucky with the interceptor doesnt mean its a bad unit. If it did less damage to morty and magnus than your other units it only means you rolled bad, and/or your opponent rolled good. Its not flimsy. Its as tough as a predator, and -1 to hit enemy rolls.

 p5freak wrote:

lliu wrote:

Yes, but on the table it isn’t as good as it sounds. I’ve played five games, and in sac it’s failed to do anything. I played against Nurgle so that may affect what I think, but even up against Morty and Magnus my other units did a lot more damage than the Xiphon. Also it’s flimsy, and a few well-aimed lascannon shots can bring it down.

Just because you were unlucky with the interceptor doesnt mean its a bad unit. If it did less damage to morty and magnus than your other units it only means you rolled bad, and/or your opponent rolled good. Its not flimsy. Its as tough as a predator, and -1 to hit enemy rolls.

I suppose a five game test period isn’t enough? If it failed in every one of them, maybe there’s something wrong? Seriously, try it out a few times, it’s going to disappoint.

Mysticbucket wrote:I'd stick an assault cannon on the Darkshroud. The extra shots are well worth it I think and the extra strength can help with GEQ units as you're then wounding on 2's.

How often are you actually shooting with the Darkshroud? I would imagine it's Jinking and Advancing always to get the 4+ save no?