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2018/01/30 16:03:26
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
I was at a tournament this weekend and I saw several list featuring Mortarion and Magnus. All those lists got in the top 10 and were basically the same list.
My question is; Who is more dangerous out of the 2? I have not face Mortarion yet and only played against Magnus a few times. So, I only know limited information about them stats wise.
if I was to face them together in a game which one should I try deal with 1st?
It really depends on the list and on the situation during the game.
I'll go with Magnus as he has very strong psychic powers and +2 to cast them (while being a demigod in CC). But Mortarion is a huge deal to... Target prioritizing would probably depend on every game.
Motarion, hands down. Main reason? He takes part in almost every phase of the game, unlike Magnus, whom only takes part in 3. Mortarion can move a giant 12 inches, can cast and deny psychic powers, can shoot very well (pistol for big stuff, bombs for little stuff, meaning he even has variation and choices in his firepower), and in assault... well... almost no need to explain as he just murders EVERYTHING.
Magnus, on the other hand, moves an even bigger 14 inches. His psychic phase is obviously the best, as he has three powers plus 2 to casting them plus an amazing super-duper-Smite. In shooting, however, he has NO shooting attacks, so he can't overwatch and he can't participate. Lastly, in close combat, he's very deadly to big things with his very strong attacks that will almost always wound on a 2+, and does lots of damage, but he has no extra options against little guys, meaning that he can be bogged down with killing hordes that are not worthwhile, and if he flies away, without a gun or Retreat+Charge abilities, he can be somewhat neutralized for a turn.
This makes Magnus a better support character than a front-line unit (though he's obviously still good at that too), while Mortarion is a cyclone of devastation unto himself. I've had games with my Mortarion where he has killed off the entire enemy army PRACTICALLY UNSUPPORTED, while the rest of my army just stood in the back and waved. If you couldn't harm him, he would deal an average of 1 mortal wound per player turn to everything within 7 inches, so an army near him will be DEAD just if they stood next to him for 5 turns, without factoring in ANY of him AMAZING close combat and shooting abilities.
Galef wrote: If you refuse to use rock, you will never beat scissors.
2018/01/30 19:00:12
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Obviously both are highly dangerous but Mortarian edges it. When Magnus approaches, it's possible to tie him up for a turn or three at some cost. Whereas when Mortarion approaches, you get the hell outa the way before everything within 7 inches dies.
Suggest both be met with Cobra D-Impaler fire!
2018/01/30 19:15:56
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Yarium wrote: Motarion, hands down. Main reason? He takes part in almost every phase of the game, unlike Magnus, whom only takes part in 3. Mortarion can move a giant 12 inches, can cast and deny psychic powers, can shoot very well (pistol for big stuff, bombs for little stuff, meaning he even has variation and choices in his firepower), and in assault... well... almost no need to explain as he just murders EVERYTHING.
Magnus, on the other hand, moves an even bigger 14 inches. His psychic phase is obviously the best, as he has three powers plus 2 to casting them plus an amazing super-duper-Smite. In shooting, however, he has NO shooting attacks, so he can't overwatch and he can't participate. Lastly, in close combat, he's very deadly to big things with his very strong attacks that will almost always wound on a 2+, and does lots of damage, but he has no extra options against little guys, meaning that he can be bogged down with killing hordes that are not worthwhile, and if he flies away, without a gun or Retreat+Charge abilities, he can be somewhat neutralized for a turn.
This makes Magnus a better support character than a front-line unit (though he's obviously still good at that too), while Mortarion is a cyclone of devastation unto himself. I've had games with my Mortarion where he has killed off the entire enemy army PRACTICALLY UNSUPPORTED, while the rest of my army just stood in the back and waved. If you couldn't harm him, he would deal an average of 1 mortal wound per player turn to everything within 7 inches, so an army near him will be DEAD just if they stood next to him for 5 turns, without factoring in ANY of him AMAZING close combat and shooting abilities.
I've never once used Magnus as a Support unit, I move him into CC as fast as I can get him there, I bounce him around the table as needed and he kills everything he comes across. I leave him completely unsupported and deep in enemy territory. I've only ever lost him once in a game, and that was to a Tau player who brought a butt load of seeker missels, even then it was turn 2 and Magnus already had 3 turns to wreck absolute havoc. So much of her force was spent on killing Magnus, it only took 3 more turns to table her.
2018/01/30 19:34:51
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Ravingbantha wrote: I've never once used Magnus as a Support unit, I move him into CC as fast as I can get him there, I bounce him around the table as needed and he kills everything he comes across. I leave him completely unsupported and deep in enemy territory. I've only ever lost him once in a game, and that was to a Tau player who brought a butt load of seeker missels, even then it was turn 2 and Magnus already had 3 turns to wreck absolute havoc. So much of her force was spent on killing Magnus, it only took 3 more turns to table her.
You and I must have very different luck , but yes, that is why I qualified that Magnus is still good at bashing things, but compared to Mortarion, Mortarion is better at it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/30 19:35:01
Galef wrote: If you refuse to use rock, you will never beat scissors.
2018/01/30 19:43:49
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Mortarion with a couple of abilities on him (I forget which) deleted a buffed Magnus in one round of CC, and it was when magnus charged him.
The two powers were "Plague weapons get +1 to wound and do mortal wounds on a 7+" and "locus of contagion" or something that gave him +1 damage on all his attacks.
Of course he re-rolls To-Hit and To-Wound rolls because mortarion, lol.
2018/01/30 21:23:07
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
They're both strong, but now that Magnus doesn't have in effect a rerollable 3++, he's much more killable. Mortarian is brutal.
Galas wrote: I remember when Marmatag was a nooby, all shiney and full of joy. How playing the unbalanced mess of Warhammer40k in a ultra-competitive meta has changed you
Bharring wrote: He'll actually *change his mind* in the presence of sufficient/sufficiently defended information. Heretic.
2018/01/30 21:32:41
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Mortarion is overall more resilient as well. He can get a -1 to hit buff and has FnP. The rerollable 3++ on Magnus is good but is not 100% reliable, especially when the enemy has denials. Without the buff, he's not that difficult to wound. Mortarion still gets his FnP and works against mortal wounds, something Magnus struggles against if it's not deniable.
2018/01/30 21:42:48
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Mortarian is the better one man army; being stupidly tough and able to delete pretty much anything.
Magnus is the better utility unit; access to far more and far more useful psychic powers (watch how hard a Daemon player cries if Magnus turbo boosts 36" in to the centre of their deployment, drops a death hex bomb and proceeds to wipe out everything in that bubble, including the 3++ turkey) as well as being able to delete most big models.
I'm betting Ahriman + Magnus are going to dominate the meta once codex TS hits being able to cast 6 psychic powers (3 with a +2 and 3 with a +1) from Dark hereticus and 2 other disciplines: Weaver of fates + Warptime on Magnus, Magnus can Death Hex bomb or smite the front line if needed, then Ahriman can prescience a massive unit of rubrics who just deep struck in and then you have space for 2 more powers. Being able to hammer the enemy in to the dust is important but the utility units that can give your entire army that utility are just as important.
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
2018/01/30 23:59:00
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Taking into account the nerfs in the codex, Magnus has fallen far behind Mortarion just because Mortarion is actually capable of staying alive. Magnus already had a pretty decent chance of dying turn one, now he's even more fragile AND more expensive...
2018/01/31 00:23:26
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Arachnofiend wrote: Taking into account the nerfs in the codex, Magnus has fallen far behind Mortarion just because Mortarion is actually capable of staying alive. Magnus already had a pretty decent chance of dying turn one, now he's even more fragile AND more expensive...
Besides losing his re-rolls of 1s, what else has made him more fragile?
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
2018/01/31 00:31:25
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Arachnofiend wrote: Taking into account the nerfs in the codex, Magnus has fallen far behind Mortarion just because Mortarion is actually capable of staying alive. Magnus already had a pretty decent chance of dying turn one, now he's even more fragile AND more expensive...
Besides losing his re-rolls of 1s, what else has made him more fragile?
He lost the Changeling in exchange for a psychic power that does the same thing, which is a problem because the whole point of running the Changeling was to give Magnus some protection on the enemy's first turn before Magnus could beef up.
2018/01/31 00:37:35
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Arachnofiend wrote: Taking into account the nerfs in the codex, Magnus has fallen far behind Mortarion just because Mortarion is actually capable of staying alive. Magnus already had a pretty decent chance of dying turn one, now he's even more fragile AND more expensive...
Besides losing his re-rolls of 1s, what else has made him more fragile?
He lost the Changeling in exchange for a psychic power that does the same thing, which is a problem because the whole point of running the Changeling was to give Magnus some protection on the enemy's first turn before Magnus could beef up.
Oh, I thought you were talking about changes in the TS codex. To be truthful, I've never run the changeling with Magnus and I've had reasonable success with him.
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
2018/01/31 02:23:59
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Arachnofiend wrote: Taking into account the nerfs in the codex, Magnus has fallen far behind Mortarion just because Mortarion is actually capable of staying alive. Magnus already had a pretty decent chance of dying turn one, now he's even more fragile AND more expensive...
Besides losing his re-rolls of 1s, what else has made him more fragile?
He lost the Changeling in exchange for a psychic power that does the same thing, which is a problem because the whole point of running the Changeling was to give Magnus some protection on the enemy's first turn before Magnus could beef up.
I mean the Changeling DOES still offer protection. It just isn't as good protection.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
2018/01/31 07:40:20
Subject: Who is more dangerous. Mortarion or Magnus?
Mainly because I have horrible luck rolling for first turn, and then he takes ALL the lascannons for the team...
The Viletide: Daemons of Nurgle/Deathguard: 7400 pts
Disclples of the Dragon - Ad Mech - about 2000 pts GSC - about 2000 Pts
Rhulic Mercs - um...many...
Circle Oroboros - 300 Pts or so
Menoth - 300+ pts
, but yes, that is why I qualified that Magnus is still good at bashing things, but compared to Mortarion, Mortarion is better at it.
