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Coldstars take 4 weapon points; even I know that, and I'm a T'au'noob. The semantics are permissive (because the sentence is poorly constructed) but the pragmatics aren't.

"Ben shot the elephant from Africa" means I shot the elephant that originated from the continent of Africa, not that I loaded an elephant into a mega cannon in Johannesbeg and launched it into the ocean. The sentence permits both interpretations, but it would be wrong to suggest that both are equally likely.

So while you can currently abuse the ambiguity, hopefully it'll be FAQ'd asap.

A similar topic seems to have caused a bit of a stir on B&C.

Speaking of odd Tau rules, have FW fixed the rules for the AX-1-0 I think it is? The one with the wazzing great rail guns which is patently missing the 'Titanic' key word, due the the RGs being 'Macro' so it can't actually fire them.

I thought they fixed that ages ago in a faq.

Jorim wrote:
I thought they fixed that ages ago in a faq.

They did.

According to RAW in the new codex, no unit, including Longstrike, can benefit from Longstrike's +1 to hit aura, due to GW messing up with keywords. So 6 weapon coldstar players should also not add +1 to the shooting of their hammerhead formations.

liverscrew wrote:
According to RAW in the new codex, no unit, including Longstrike, can benefit from Longstrike's +1 to hit aura, due to GW messing up with keywords. So 6 weapon coldstar players should also not add +1 to the shooting of their hammerhead formations.

What?
Longstrike gives the bonus to tau sept hammerheads.

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:

liverscrew wrote:
According to RAW in the new codex, no unit, including Longstrike, can benefit from Longstrike's +1 to hit aura, due to GW messing up with keywords. So 6 weapon coldstar players should also not add +1 to the shooting of their hammerhead formations.

What?
Longstrike gives the bonus to tau sept hammerheads.

Read the rule closely, pay attention to the Keywords in particular. Longstrike buffs " T’AU SEPT HAMMERHEAD GUNSHIPS" but they keyword hammerheads use is "TX7 HAMMERHEAD GUNSHIP".

They are not the same thing.

You know my position and what I'd say in response, so we can just take the whole argument as read.

 CREEEEEEEEED wrote:
You know my position and what I'd say in response, so we can just take the whole argument as read.

I don't, because if you're honestly saying partial keywords work then you're opening a massive can of worms right there.

Spelling it out, I'd say in this particular case, it's clear that the hammerhead is for all intents and purposes the same as the tx7 hammerhead gunship, for the purposes of Longstrike's buff.

I have to go with Creeeeeeed on this. As the ability references Hammerheads in the plural this logically to me means:

1) more than one; and

2) all Hammerhead variants irrespective of designation.

 NoiseMarine with Tinnitus wrote:
I have to go with Creeeeeeed on this. As the ability references Hammerheads in the plural this logically to me means:

1) more than one; and

2) all Hammerhead variants irrespective of designation.

Well a similar issue existed in the index, the keywords didn't match between the index and forgeworld hammerheads for the Longstrike buff and GW fixed it in the index FAQ (not the forgeworld, the regular index) by adding the HAMMERHEAD keyword to the hammerheads and changing the Longstrike rule to affect HAMMERHEAD instead of TX7 HAMMERHEAD to equalize the keywords between the forgeworld codex and the index. So there is precedent of a sort for that.

notredameguy10 wrote:

Pottsey wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

Pottsey wrote:

The rules says replace the Burst or Missile pod for 2 extra weapons and then take a further 2 giving you a total of 5 weapons not up to 4. Coldstar cannot take 2+ Iridium but can still take Stimulant due to a rarely used rule that says any missing wargear from the codex my be brought from the index.

I see why you might read it like that, but no. He will get four weapons. It will be FAQ'd otherwise.

And if there is anything I think GW should never have done it's that stupid index carry over sheet.

While it might get a FAQ later, right now it is very clearly allowed 5 weapons. Coldstar is worded differently from the other 2 commanders.

You keep saying this and you are 100% wrong. Every commander in every codex edition has 4 hard points. You can have 4 weapons. Stop trying to cheat.

I am not trying to cheat but you clearly are by refusing to let players use what is a very clear rule. The rule is very clear there is no ambiguous in reading it. GW clearly intended to increase the amount of weapons it can take and they clearly changed the rule wording so it’s not the same as the other commanders. Plus there is a picture in the codex of what looks like a Coldstar with 5 hard points in use. Also you are wrong every commander has not always had 4 hard points. The number has changed between versions and there are more than 5+ hard points on the model.

So until a FAQ changes the wording its fine to fit 5 hard points. Creating restriction rules that are not in the codex and trying to force them onto players is cheating. It’s not clearly intended to be 4 and the rule is not ambiguous so it’s not rules lawing. So the only cheaters are those that do not allow it.

Pottsey wrote:
there is a picture in the codex of what looks like a Coldstar with 5 hard points in use.

Pray tell, where is this pic? I could find no such thing.

The only possible rational 5 weapon loadout would be if one of the weapons was either the burst cannon or missile pod.

 carldooley wrote:

Pottsey wrote:
there is a picture in the codex of what looks like a Coldstar with 5 hard points in use.

Pray tell, where is this pic? I could find no such thing.

The only possible rational 5 weapon loadout would be if one of the weapons was either the burst cannon or missile pod.

The armies of expansion page looks like it has 2 guns and 3 subsystems for 5 hard points and there are at least 6 physical hard points on the model. I agree one of the weapons has to be a burst cannon or missile pod. You cannot take 5 fusion.

The one with the Fusion blaster and CIB?

Does anyone purchase drones to go with Coldstars? I had not been because they couldn't keep up.

Also, I usually do shield generators for my commander suits - does anyone else?

 Stormonu wrote:
Does anyone purchase drones to go with Coldstars? I had not been because they couldn't keep up.

Also, I usually do shield generators for my commander suits - does anyone else?

Shield generators are good but its hard to make up the value of a weapon on a BS2+ platform with a 40” move, especially if you can hide it with the character rule shenanigans.

My thinking is if the opponent wants to kill your commander he'll probably manage eventually and a 4++ is nice but positioning will count for more. Better to use positioning and maybe the JSJ relic to have deepstriking drones, stealth teams and Ghostkeels soak some fire (all of which can also equip a shield gen).

Of course if you believe in the 6 hard-point thing (seems extremely questionable) you can go ahead and grab that shield gen and another gun or TL and be on your merry way.

 Stormonu wrote:
Does anyone purchase drones to go with Coldstars? I had not been because they couldn't keep up.

Also, I usually do shield generators for my commander suits - does anyone else?

I thought that drones bought with a unit became their own discrete unit?

 Sleep Spell wrote:

 Stormonu wrote:
Does anyone purchase drones to go with Coldstars? I had not been because they couldn't keep up.

Also, I usually do shield generators for my commander suits - does anyone else?

Shield generators are good but its hard to make up the value of a weapon on a BS2+ platform with a 40” move, especially if you can hide it with the character rule shenanigans.

My thinking is if the opponent wants to kill your commander he'll probably manage eventually and a 4++ is nice but positioning will count for more. Better to use positioning and maybe the JSJ relic to have deepstriking drones, stealth teams and Ghostkeels soak some fire (all of which can also equip a shield gen).

Of course if you believe in the 6 hard-point thing (seems extremely questionable) you can go ahead and grab that shield gen and another gun or TL and be on your merry way.

I do have a shieldgen because I have the fusion blades and like to charge stuff

 carldooley wrote:

 Stormonu wrote:
Does anyone purchase drones to go with Coldstars? I had not been because they couldn't keep up.

Also, I usually do shield generators for my commander suits - does anyone else?

I thought that drones bought with a unit became their own discrete unit?

They do, which means they get left behind when the Coldstar advances to Narnia and back.

 carldooley wrote:
Besides, there is so much more gank that can be pulled with this garbage pile. Excuse me while I make Longstrike my Warlord so he can gain Strength of Belief and a PEN chip. For the volume of shots they can put out, why use anything other than pathfinders for markerlights. And why would I not put pulse pistols on anything that could take them? And why shake your head at my monat broadside with vectored retro thrusters?

You are aware that you can't give Longstrike the PEN Chip?

 AndrewC wrote:

 carldooley wrote:
Besides, there is so much more gank that can be pulled with this garbage pile. Excuse me while I make Longstrike my Warlord so he can gain Strength of Belief and a PEN chip. For the volume of shots they can put out, why use anything other than pathfinders for markerlights. And why would I not put pulse pistols on anything that could take them? And why shake your head at my monat broadside with vectored retro thrusters?

You are aware that you can't give Longstrike the PEN Chip?

People always forget you can't give Relics to a named character.

I'm a big fan of Coldstars now and will have to pick up another commander to make one. I think the best way to run them will be T'au sept with the exemplar of Mont'ka warlord trait, that way you can advance and shoot as normal and also take the T'au Relic for that sweet old school JSJ which will keep him safe, either behind cover or preferably jump him behind a conveniently placed stealth or crisis suit squad

 carldooley wrote:

 Stormonu wrote:
Does anyone purchase drones to go with Coldstars? I had not been because they couldn't keep up.

Also, I usually do shield generators for my commander suits - does anyone else?

I thought that drones bought with a unit became their own discrete unit?

They can, but it defeats the purpose of protecting the Coldstar if they don't stay near (savior protocols & shield drones). I've also had my Coldstar shot out from under me by the likes of Necron Deathmarks, who can target characters, even if they aren't the closest.

I have been experimenting with two Vior'la Coldstar's with two squads Shield Drones in Manta Strike.

Deploy the Coldstars behind LOS terrain and put 2x Squads of 5 Shield drones in Manta Strike. Move the Coldstars 40" to wherever they need to be, then manta strike the shield drones next to them. Remember the shield drones need the 9" bubble.
Extra points if you somehow get the Coldstars within 8" of an enemy and get the drones in 9" away.

Vior'la means you're still hitting on 2's. Alternatively you could use Sa'cea (if you're taking the Vanguard Markerlight strategy) for a re-roll to hit but it's sub-optimal.