PSA: Please Have A Shower & Wash Your Clothes Before Going To A Public Event

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**Elbows**

EnTyme wrote:
The phenomenon of Nerd Funk is in no way limited to 40k/wargaming. I actually had to ban a player from one of my D&D campaigns because he refused to bathe before coming over to my apartment. I asked him politely on multiple occasions, but he (no joke) said something about not wanting to conform to society's standards of appearance and hygiene.

Gotta love those bizarre excuses...that's up there with someone who mispronounces a word, and when mentioned, responds with "Well that's just how I say it!".

Sure thing guy...

**Grimtuff**

Not true. It's due to my condeeshun.

**BBAP**

Peregrine wrote:
Ah yes, now we come to the point in the thread where people start talking about all the violence they would inflict upon the gross TFGs, because the awkward boasting about how capable they are at basic cleanliness wasn't cringe-worthy enough yet. Can we put this trainwreck of a thread out of its misery yet?

Brah, we're talking about a person who picks their zits at the table and wipes the gak on your models. I've killed for less.

Spoiler:

Also nobody is crowing about their ability to practise basic hygiene, and many people are offering suggestions for dealing with offending individuals without necessarily having to turf them out of an event. Did you miss that bit in your rush to judge everyone else responding to this thread? The bit where I said "he was a nice guy and I wish I hadn't had to chuck him"?

Why am I even asking? Of course you missed it, because you're not interested in engaging with the discussion - all you want to do is bitch and moan and judge because people are talking about something you don't think they should be. What an ass.

Grimtuff wrote:
Perri- champion of the unwashed masses or internet contrarian? You decide...

Champion of the unwashed masses. The alternative is "whiny contrarian narcissist" which is far less interesting.

**XT-1984**

I shower almost every day but I will not wash my Death Guard tshirt.

**Wulfmar**

I wonder if these much maligned individuals with dubious body odor being ranted about have mental, physical or psychological conditions that have led to this condition/behaviour.

Meh, we all come across unpleasantness in life, best to carry on as best we can and leave the judgement behind.

**Lion of Caliban**

XT-1984 wrote:
I shower almost every day but I will not wash my Death Guard tshirt.

I feel so conflicted...

**HuskyWarhammer**

BBAP wrote:
Peregrine wrote:
Ah yes, now we come to the point in the thread where people start talking about all the violence they would inflict upon the gross TFGs, because the awkward boasting about how capable they are at basic cleanliness wasn't cringe-worthy enough yet. Can we put this trainwreck of a thread out of its misery yet?

Brah, we're talking about a person who picks their zits at the table and wipes the gak on your models. I've killed for less.

Spoiler:

DISCLAIMER: At no point has BBAP ever killed anyone for any reason, nor does he plan to start no matter how much sebaceous crap a person may wipe on his models. In the situation previously described, BBAP would not in fact advocate the amputation of an offender's fingers using a cigar cutter, and would instead suggest talking to the person about his wretched behaviour so that he knows it makes you uncomfortable (supposing it does indeed do that). If said individual continued to engage in his foulness BBAP would advocate direct action - not in the form of violence, but rather a swift concession of the game followed by a packing up of models, leaving the table, and never playing the offending entity again. BBAP does not advocate nor practise violence.

Also nobody is crowing about their ability to practise basic hygiene, and many people are offering suggestions for dealing with offending individuals without necessarily having to turf them out of an event. Did you miss that bit in your rush to judge everyone else responding to this thread? The bit where I said "he was a nice guy and I wish I hadn't had to chuck him"?

Why am I even asking? Of course you missed it, because you're not interested in engaging with the discussion - all you want to do is bitch and moan and judge because people are talking about something you don't think they should be. What an ass.

Grimtuff wrote:
Perri- champion of the unwashed masses or internet contrarian? You decide...

Champion of the unwashed masses. The alternative is "whiny contrarian narcissist" which is far less interesting.

Dude, tone down your testosterone like 40%. Nobody likes an internet poster who's ragey, and they like to game with guys like that even less. I'd almost rather pus-boy.

**Stormonu**

XT-1984 wrote:
I shower almost every day but I will not wash my Death Guard tshirt.

At least Frebreeze it every once in a while :p

**Pink Horror**

Do these threads ever help anybody? Is some person who bathes less than once a month going to read this "PSA" and change? Here's a tip: if someone stinks, tell that person to his face, instead of being an Internet Tough Guy.

I don't think anyone should be forced to let someone with a serious odor problem into an event or their home, but I don't see what any of this has to do with 40K.

**Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl**

Dear people that don't like BO and want people to wash constantly despite it being utterly unnatural:
That's our hobby and we won't stop. You have all the other hobbies if you want to.
Love, XOXO.

(Mostly being a contrarian but seeing all that unanimity except for Peregrine was annoying

)

**Mmmpi**

Spoiler:

Talizvar wrote:
Okay, some observations or notes, especially from a dad that showers every day and has two young teenage boys:

- Young men will smell, no matter what deodorant used and showering twice a day. It is the nature of the beast. (http://www.momjunction.com/articles/body-odor-problems-in-teens_00353333/#gref)
- Many of these games are held during the evening and there would be little or no time to clean-up after work, the dude could be a welder so you also have sweaty leather stink (much like hockey gear stink).
- Usually you have to fit in grabbing some food on the way, some may not think to hold off on onion or garlic.
- Most places we game in are rather small... not much volume of air or air-flow so it only gets worse. They may have smelt fine when they got in... not so much later.
- Speaking of that, poor climate control, how many times have those areas seemed too hot?
- Between family I have and people I know, there are a fair number of people who fall in the spectrum of Autism who play the hobby. When the physical act of cleaning the body can be uncomfortable (high skin sensitivity): these folk may need a higher dose of empathy in that regard. It does not come easy. Something to keep in mind.

- My own personal "problem", when I get into a good painting session for a few hours, you keep your arms down and possibly clamped shut the whole time. My wife calls them "the hobby pits of doom", there is nothing to save those armpits other than a shower and scrubbing.

As a side note, we just recently had a new MTG release and gaming started at midnight on Fri/Sat, I had the "pleasant" experience of walking into a room in the morning of some 40 people who have been up all night drinking energy drinks, coffee, spicy food and had smoke breaks.
It was like hitting a wall and I am a guy who grew up on a farm. The washroom needed to be burned to the ground.

I guess I can say as the original OP said, the majority of people are good, there is typically a horde of mitigating circumstances I think at work for the remainder.

The smell of sweat, especially if it's 'fresh' isn't an issue. Same thing if you've been stuck under the office heater for several hours, or you have a musk. You can tell the difference between someone who bathes, but is sweaty now, and someone who treats soap as a warcrime. The issue is the few who don't bathe, who pick their noses and try to pick up your figures, or like the zit popper.

**Dai**

Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
Dear people that don't like BO and want people to wash constantly despite it being utterly unnatural:
That's our hobby and we won't stop. You have all the other hobbies if you want to.
Love, XOXO.

(Mostly being a contrarian but seeing all that unanimity except for Peregrine was annoying )

Not looking after personal hygiene is a major red flag for clinical depression. Maybe 40k gaming is what is getting some of these people out of bed, maybe not but a little empathy and kindness goes a long way. Not saying one can't say anything to people but if you're a dick about it then you're actually likely worse than the person you're attacking. And many people will judge appropriately.

**tneva82**

Pink Horror wrote:
Do these threads ever help anybody? Is some person who bathes less than once a month going to read this "PSA" and change? Here's a tip: if someone stinks, tell that person to his face, instead of being an Internet Tough Guy.

I don't think anyone should be forced to let someone with a serious odor problem into an event or their home, but I don't see what any of this has to do with 40K.

Well here's one who had 2nd thoughts about how I might smell. Nobody has said flat out anything so not sure but then again I do have habit of sweating so...And having to walk ~3km with big bag full of models and books isn't likely helping situation so...

Somebody mentioned bringing in extra t-shirt along which is doable plan. One extra t-shirt for the ~3-4h before it gets changed(gym will obviously make me sweaty enough that I'll be taking shower and fresh change right away obviously

) isn't unreasonable.

So who knows? Not sure was I issue but if I was I'll be taking more precautions that are reasonable(shower&wash before is flat out not possible).

**Kiarn**

Have you ever been to Warhammer world, they know its a problem the air conditioning is set to hurricane to make sure that the place doesn't smell!!

Additionally the best way I heard someone get told between to people that they had a BO issue was "Someone smells around here and its not me"

**whispered_war**

Just a heads up: If anyone is struggling to find a deodorant that they can use/is effective, LUSH sell solid deodorant bars that mainly consist of natural ingredients. They have some in powder forms too, and both seem very useful for if you have any skin irritations that normal deodorants can cause to flare up

**Forrix**

Suggested Edit :

Please Have A Shower & Wash Your Clothes Before Going outside,*Daily* !!

**topaxygouroun i**

Forrix wrote:
Suggested Edit :

Please Have A Shower & Wash Your Clothes Before Going outside,*Daily* !!

Do you wash your clothes daily? You could,like, get more than one pair?

Just joking

**techsoldaten**

Dai wrote:
Not looking after personal hygiene is a major red flag for clinical depression. Maybe 40k gaming is what is getting some of these people out of bed, maybe not but a little empathy and kindness goes a long way. Not saying one can't say anything to people but if you're a dick about it then you're actually likely worse than the person you're attacking. And many people will judge appropriately.

That's an interesting point. There's a way to talk to someone about their hygiene that doesn't result in them feeling like a leper.

My gaming bag contains hygiene products, which are not really there for me. I've pulled up next to someone and said, hey, thought you could use this. Take care of yourself, the game will still be here.

As long as someone knows you care, they're not going to take it as an accusation. There are a lot of factors behind bad hygiene, I've run into people who are between homes, work in sanitation / butcher shops, just stepped in something on the way to the FLGS.

**Talizvar**

Peregrine wrote:
Can we put this trainwreck of a thread out of its misery yet?

But this is another kick at the can for dispelling the myth that gamers are funky smelling people who scoff at social norms of cleanliness!
Pretty sure you notice this to happen pretty much anywhere, all you have to do is spend a couple hours in a poorly ventilated room with enough people.
I find it hard enough to enforce game rules nevermind someone's hygiene.

Spending some time in a pig farm and coming for a visit to the FLGS would set a new standard for many (the stink gets right into your hair... it is incredible how it permeates).

Well, I suppose it is not quite like going to a play but some cleaning up is warranted no matter what arguments we choose to make.

**AaronWilson**

I'm all good with people after 8 hours of gaming in a hot room might not smell 100%. Those people who turn smelling like "that" boggle my mind.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Anecdote.

When I worked as a GW Till Monkey, I had to have words with a handful of customers on different occasions.

And do you know, it's a difficult subject to approach. You need to be firm with them. Sadly, some smells are genuinely completely unacceptable, especially in a shop that's trying to make a buck. But you also need to be polite about it. And it's rare you can have said quiet word in a one man store without some form of audience.

Some genuinely don't realise they're a bit whiffy. Consider the young teenager. Hormones are raging, and they're possibly properly sweating for the first time in their lives. Kids don't tend to be that smelly. It's quite possible it hasn't occurred to their parents to suggest deodorant.

Some get it, and genuinely improve. Some just don't.

**Rune Stonegrinder**

Tournaments are starting to become worse than Trekkie conventions.

**OrkaMorka**

Everyone keeps bringing up ASD and how the hobby might attract people who are in it, but I find it hard to believe that there are so many that you'd have to second guess.

I've played two people who actually are on the ASD, and they were probably the cleanest amongst the group.

In general the people I find that bring in a funk are those that hit that 'socially off' spectrum. They didn't clean up before hitting town because they generally don't think about it. Not because they forgot, only because it's a habit they formed. Sort of 'shut in' to the point they live in a way that there's no one aroumd them to remind them to shower this week.

I've had my moments. Once during a tourney in a hot room I hit up a dollar store across the street and nabbed a shirt because I was sweating. My service has made me almost nervous about my general appearence or smell. Plus with three kids I've become very aware of odours.

I had a friend like this. He smoked, drank constantly, and usually forgot to shower before work. We were going to drive out to a tourney and i said 'bro hit the showers you reek like a dive bar'. He didnt think of it sinply because theres in general no one else around him to tell him he stinks.

I think the introvert who hasn't interacted with society in a couple weeks is far more likely than someone who is in the ASD.

**liquidjoshi**

Talizvar wrote:
Peregrine wrote:
Can we put this trainwreck of a thread out of its misery yet?
But this is another kick at the can for dispelling the myth that gamers are funky smelling people who scoff at social norms of cleanliness!
Pretty sure you notice this to happen pretty much anywhere, all you have to do is spend a couple hours in a poorly ventilated room with enough people.
I find it hard enough to enforce game rules nevermind someone's hygiene.

Spending some time in a pig farm and coming for a visit to the FLGS would set a new standard for many (the stink gets right into your hair... it is incredible how it permeates).

Well, I suppose it is not quite like going to a play but some cleaning up is warranted no matter what arguments we choose to make.

What? No, only nerds stiink. Oh, except me. All the other nerds need to go take a shower

In a less sarcastic tone, I don't think I've ever met anyone in the context of a game store that fits the hyperbole either. Daytime games, evenings, as a teen or adult man-thing. Seen far more incidents with hobbyists and sharp tools than any overwhelming cases of Nurgle's Rot. Had to endure more people like that in uni seminars.

**ProwlerPC**

OK while I do shower and wear clean clothes on a regular basis for all my day to day activities (except in the bush, I'm a hunter/trapper/fisher/tree burner) I do try to let the hair on my neck grow before going to any event. For good luck. And because I giggle at the neckbeard comments. Not saying that I'd now intentionally show up funky because I get a kick out of toying with shallow inconsequential concerns. I'm just saying.

**Tannhauser42**

OrkaMorka wrote:
Everyone keeps bringing up ASD and how the hobby might attract people who are in it, but I find it hard to believe that there are so many that you'd have to second guess.

I've played two people who actually are on the ASD, and they were probably the cleanest amongst the group.

Nobody brought up ASD in relation to bad smells, it was brought up as a possible explanation for people who are bad/awkward in their social interactions.

**Dr. Mills**

The current gaming club I'm a part of has literally zero people along the usual "smelly" spectrum. From the mum and daughter who play to the oldest beardy man, it's generally very pleasant in our small room!

Now, I used to go to a FLGS in a nearby city (but stopped due to time/distance constraints) that had their fair share of... Funky smells. From my observation, it was 100% the card players, as everyone else was pretty good.

**CragHack**

Oh yes! Add some alcohol vapors and microwaved food stench for a full package

**Talizvar**

Tannhauser42 wrote:
OrkaMorka wrote:
Everyone keeps bringing up ASD and how the hobby might attract people who are in it, but I find it hard to believe that there are so many that you'd have to second guess.
I've played two people who actually are on the ASD, and they were probably the cleanest amongst the group.

Nobody brought up ASD in relation to bad smells, it was brought up as a possible explanation for people who are bad/awkward in their social interactions.

Actually I did on page 2:
"- Between family I have and people I know, there are a fair number of people who fall in the spectrum of Autism who play the hobby. When the physical act of cleaning the body can be uncomfortable (high skin sensitivity): these folk may need a higher dose of empathy in that regard. It does not come easy. Something to keep in mind. "
It is a subject I keep coming across on the autism boards.
Once the cleanliness functions are established as a routine, they can be the cleanest kids around... the trick is getting them there.
Now for prevalence in population, for someone would fall under the spectrum at about 1% (http://www.autism-society.org/what-is/facts-and-statistics/ 2014 stats).
The attraction is the rules.
They are written down and people are supposed to follow them.
No strange social unwritten rules to figure out.
You will see a disproportionate number of these folk who love gaming.
My son plays MTG and D&D and loves it and has ADHD as well as "High Functioning Autism" however they like to say it.
I would say being a teenager is more challenging than anything else.
I have to remind on occasion of the "rules" when spending extended time with people needs.

There are many people who are also undiagnosed so again, something to keep in mind for tolerance.

**Backspacehacker**

I can appreciate that, but tolerence ends when you begin to interfear with my pleasure and enjoyment of a hobby, everyone gets one.

Call me cold hearted and intolerant, but if you infringe on my free time, and my hobby and enjoyment, and begin to crap up my very limited time I have to relax and enjoy myself, I will kindly tell you there is an issue once, after that piss off. Someone has autism or what ever and end up having some nervous tick, or send weird quark that's annoying but not interfering with my fine. If you smell like hot garbage leave.