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I'm building a list for an upcoming ITC tournament in my area. The last list I played was a Bor'kan / Vior'la Brigade / Vanguard list that went 1-2, so I wanted to shake things up a bit. I'm torn between two potential lists, the basic differences being one has a substantial Kroot screen and an ethereal whereas the other has three more MSU fire warrior squads and a third cadre fireblade for more markerlights, and 4 more shield drones.

2000/2000 Triple Battalion, T'au / Sa'cea, 18 Command Points

**BATTALION (T'AU)**

HQ - Coldstar Commander: 174 Points
4x Fusion Blasters.

HQ - Cadre Fireblade: 45 Points

ELITES - XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: 280 Points
Heavy Burst Cannon, 2x Smart Missile Systems, Target Lock, Advanced Targeting System.

ELITES - XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: 280 Points
Heavy Burst Cannon, 2x Smart Missile Systems, Target Lock, Advanced Targeting System.

ELITES - XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: 278 Points
Heavy Burst Cannon, 2x Smart Missile Systems, Velocity Tracker, Advanced Targeting System.

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

**BATTALION (T'AU)**

HQ - Coldstar Commander: 174 Points
4x Fusion Blasters.

HQ - Cadre Fireblade: 45 Points

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

FAST ATTACK - Tactical Drone Squad: 50 Points
5x Shield Drones.

FAST ATTACK - Tactical Drone Squad: 40 Points
4x Shield Drones.

**BATTALION (SA'CEA)**

HQ - Commander: 142 Points
3x Cyclic Ion Blasters, 1x Advanced Targeting System.

HQ - Ethereal: 42 Points

ELITES - Firesight Marksman: 25 Points

ELITES - Firesight Marksman: 25 Points

ELITES - Firesight Marksman: 25 Points

TROOPS - Kroot Squad: 50 Points
10x Kroot Carnivores.

TROOPS - Kroot Squad: 50 Points
10x Kroot Carnivores.

TROOPS - Kroot Squad: 50 Points
10x Kroot Carnivores.

Notes:

This was the original list I came up, before the FAQ dropped. Now that turn 1 deep strike is gone and 1st turn charges are generally going to be a thing of the past, I am considering modifying it as follows:

2000/2000 Triple Battalion, T'au / Sa'cea, 18 Command Points

**BATTALION (T'AU)**

HQ - Coldstar Commander: 174 Points
4x Fusion Blasters.

HQ - Cadre Fireblade: 45 Points

ELITES - XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: 280 Points
Heavy Burst Cannon, 2x Smart Missile Systems, Target Lock, Advanced Targeting System.

ELITES - XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: 280 Points
Heavy Burst Cannon, 2x Smart Missile Systems, Target Lock, Advanced Targeting System.

ELITES - XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: 278 Points
Heavy Burst Cannon, 2x Smart Missile Systems, Velocity Tracker, Advanced Targeting System.

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

**BATTALION (T'AU)**

HQ - Coldstar Commander: 174 Points
4x Fusion Blasters.

HQ - Cadre Fireblade: 45 Points

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

FAST ATTACK - Tactical Drone Squad: 40 Points
4x Shield Drones.

FAST ATTACK - Tactical Drone Squad: 40 Points
4x Shield Drones.

FAST ATTACK - Tactical Drone Squad: 40 Points
4x Shield Drones.

**BATTALION (SA'CEA)**

HQ - Commander: 138 Points
3x Cyclic Ion Blasters, 1x Advanced Targeting System.

HQ - Cadre Fireblade: 45 Points

ELITES - Firesight Marksman: 25 Points

ELITES - Firesight Marksman: 25 Points

ELITES - Firesight Marksman: 25 Points

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

TROOPS - Fire Warrior Strike Team: 38 Points
4x Pulse Rifles, 1x Pulse Rifle/Markerlight

The second list has 4 more markerlights and 3 more shield drones, but 15 fewer bodies and no deep strike / melee screen.

With the first list, the idea would be to deploy the Kroot at the front line and use their pre-combat move to secure the chunk of real estate 7" ahead of the gun line. The fire warriors and firesight marksman would deploy towards the rear and secure the backfield to prevent deeps striking behind my lines. The drones deploy to the manta (or behind the riptides depending on my opponent's list) with the coldstar commanders just behind them. The Sa'cea commander deploys to the manta to await a deep strike target of opportunity.

Turn 1, if the kroot are alive, they will push towards objectives and engage targets of opportunity and otherwise try to keep up with the Riptides. The Riptides will move into position and attack targets of opportunity. The Coldstars will stay behind the Riptides, with one Coldstar using the command and control node to give wound re-rolls to one Riptide. In any event, the Riptides stay close to the Kroot to fire overwatch, hitting on 5+. On turn two I can be more aggressive with the Riptides and push them towards mid-field or towards objectives and deep strike shield drones on their positions along with the CIB suit to attack targets of opportunity.

With the non-kroot list, I would likely deploy the shield drones with the riptides and play in a similar way, just more cautiously given the lack of Kroot screen.

I'd love the community's thoughts, especially as they relate to the comparative strengths of the Kroot screen vs. more markerlights and shield drones.

Thanks!

My opinion is that the kroot version is better, having counter melee asset and better deep strike denial. Having less markerlight is not a problem, as there are plenty of them already.

Yeah, my only concern is 11 markerlights v. 15. I've never run a list with less than 15.

Additionally, do you think 9 is enough shield drone coverage for the riptides?

Riptides are bullet magnets, so it depends about your opponents firepower..

This is my problem with triple riptide lists: Usually there will be no way to protect all three equally, and your opponent will just shoot the one that is not protected. We can double nova-charge one of them for 3++ and improved shooting, but what about the rest? Shield drones are fine, but don't you also need those for your coldstars? Or are you going to offer the coldstars up after turn 1?

Plus I look at their 280 pts and I feel empty inside :(

My plan had been to run the Coldstars behind the Riptides and the Riptides behind the Kroot (for however long the Kroot screen lasts) and have the shield drones hang out within range of Saviour Protocols for the Riptides. That way the Coldstars would at least have some protection from the Character rule. Then I'd use C&C Node on whichever Riptide targets a vehicle (since they'll usually be wounding on 5+) while the others look for other targets of opportunity (T6 units like bikes, light vehicles, etc.). Then basically keep the Coldstars waiting behind the Riptides until time comes for a major push then have them advance, pop whoever they need to pop, and go from there.

I know alternatively I could keep the Riptides and everyone still and pop Kauyon turn 1, then start advancing on turn two (I likely go 2nd since I have 23 drops). But I figured I'd see how I'd play the game depending on my opponent's list. If they're playing gun line then I go Mont'ka and advance into their face as fast as possible while laying down as much firepower as possible. If they're coming at me (which will probably more often be the case) then I can sit back on turn 1 and Kauyon, then start moving up the board once I weather the initial turn or two of assaults.

And bottom line for the Riptides - I get they're bullet magnets, but it's all a question of how many bullets it takes to bring one down. I think if all 3 survive turn one then I have a good chance of hitting back hard enough to knock my opponent back and generate breathing room for the army to move and shoot. And with the Stim Injector Strategem, I only need a Riptide to survive with at least 1 wound to be fully effective the next turn.

Unfortunately 5++ does not mean much any more. There's a reason they gave it to everyone. 3++ is a good thing, and potentially you could keep nova charging your shield in all of them instead of the cannon, but 50% extra shots is 50% extra shots.

A decent well rounded list will definitely kill a riptide with 5++ on turn 1. Probably not more than that though. If you are lucky and survive at 1-2 wounds, then toss the stim and d3 heals and go full damage, then you might catch them by surprise. But I think it's only going to be so many games before people realize Stim Injector exists, and then they will be focusing down our stuff like no tomorrow.

Hm. I see your point. I'm gonna run the the Kroot screen list at a local tournament, but what would you recommend as far as changing the list?

Off the top of my head, one of my Riptides is the same points as two naked missile sides, so I anticipate that's a start.

 Knute wrote:
Hm. I see your point. I'm gonna run the the Kroot screen list at a local tournament, but what would you recommend as far as changing the list?

Off the top of my head, one of my Riptides is the same points as two naked missile sides, so I anticipate that's a start.

I think your math is wrong-ish. Broadside + 2x missiles = 110. Two naked of those are still 60 points cheaper than your Riptide. Add two twin SMS and you are equal. Plus the missilesides can take 4++ for like 8 points. The math gives you 12 wounds at 4++, with no degrading stats and more shots than the riptide, albeit only on T5. Of course you would probably want to add ATS instead of the shield generator.

HRR broadsides on the other hand, are already 15 pts cheaper AND they have no need of the ATS, so you can get your shield and be happy about it. Plus you get 2+ armor and easier cover.

For "missile sides" I was referring to broadsides with HYMP/SMS, which comes in at 140 points. I'm not sold on the HRR broadside because of their low volume of fire, but I can see HYMP/SMS missile sides being a replacement for Riptides. But my issue with broadsides is how stationary they are, whereas the Riptide can zip around the board.

I keep hearing about Ionheads are good replacements for Riptides. What about those?

I feel like a unit of three missile Broadsides with ATS for 456 points, then have a low cost commander giving them command and control every turn is easier to protect and will perform very well. You could drop 2 riptides and pick a unit of broadsides, change your cyclic commander to a low cost XV8 commander with a weapon/system or two systems, and you would have a decent amount of points left over. Or pick up Shadowsun instead to use Kauyon twice in a battle.

24 Str 7 and 24 Str 5 shots reroll hits and wounds is very powerful. Minus a landraider or a LoW vehicle, there isn't much that unit can't just point at and delete.

Of course the riptide has some great fire power, but you can't make all three riptides reroll wounds at the same as they are not in the same unit.