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So I'm looking for a centrepiece model for my upcoming chaos army build, and I've been having some trouble finding a good balance, as unfortunately (and as per usual) Chaos does not have the variety of options that the Imperials do :(

Originally I had considered a Leviathan or Deredeo conversion using a Thanatar (which is probably still something I would do), but I currently have the bits and base model for a large walking tank model that I think would be very suitable for a chaos list.

The problem though, is what tank to create from it. (Most of my examples below are using Death Guard units as the filler, but I only own fairly standard models so far and none of the DG specific ones, so I might alter my list to being Alpha Legion instead. Would basically change very little, just different terminators and probably still keep plague marines... would be short on troops then though. Not really necessary for this topic though!)

Rhino - Easiest option, wont even take much conversion, and also the cheapest option in points. Fill it with Plague Marines and maybe a Blightspawn or two. Problem being, a Rhino as a centrepiece seems a little odd haha, as it may well not survive long.

Land Raider / Proteus / Achilles - The FW variants seem a better option over the default one, mainly for the improved melee ability and ability to self heal. Achilles seems to be by far the most survivable tank (even more so than Spartan) due to the 4++, but with only carrying 6 models it'll be limited. Proteus and the Vanilla LR would both be pretty decent metal bawkses, but very very expensive and so easily tarpitted by a few conscripts. Might be interesting to put 3x Deathshroud in the Achilles... otherwise it would probably still be Plague Marines plus a couple characters in a Proteus.

Spartan - So, not a huge amount more than a land raider, and about the same survivability, but way more guns and can carry basically most of my army. Also can't be tarpitted, as it can both shoot while in melee, but also fall back shoot and charge, which is something land raiders would really wish they could do. Basically 500 points in one model though. I have no idea what I would put in one... 2x Plague Marine squads plus some characters for just some obscene burst, but the tank will be focus fired upon from turn 1 unless I figure out a distraction.


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And then there's the 'other' column. Considered a drop pod / kharybdis, would be a bit of a conversion but might work. Maybe a predator, but a single predator wouldn't seem to be all that much use. Might see if there's any FW battle tanks worth getting, but then I'd still have to figure out what to do with my slow moving units!

As it’s chaos and they only have heresy wargear, a proteus would suit the army

When ever someone mentions leviathan, I think of the mahoosive tank bus thing that rivals titans

Rybrook wrote:
As it’s chaos and they only have heresy wargear, a proteus would suit the army

When ever someone mentions leviathan, I think of the mahoosive tank bus thing that rivals titans

Haha, I didn't know there was another Leviathan, but then anything titan sized has never been something I'd looked into in this game

Another possible idea I have had though (and with magnets, I could make the final model modifiable into several different tanks) is... well, a Predator. But instead of the normal "sit on back lines and fire shots" boring predator, I was thinking of:

- Infernal Flamestorm Cannon
- 2x Heavy Flamer
- Havoc Launcher
- 4 attacks (+D3 attacks on charge) at S6 AP-3, with the weaponskill getting better as the tank takes damage.

Could be interesting.

I ran a Spartan proxy today against guliman gunline. I got turn 1 split shots on two predators. Killed one halved the other. His turn one, everything with big guns shot the Spartan, killed it. Three squads of Berserkers and Kharn then get shot to pieces with everything else. Not very tempting to get one. Then again it was against Bobby G and co. I still managed to win, because he entrenched his whole army in his quarter and I was playing objectives. This was my attempt to justify getting one myself.

 chimeara wrote:
I ran a Spartan proxy today against guliman gunline. I got turn 1 split shots on two predators. Killed one halved the other. His turn one, everything with big guns shot the Spartan, killed it. Three squads of Berserkers and Kharn then get shot to pieces with everything else. Not very tempting to get one. Then again it was against Bobby G and co. I still managed to win, because he entrenched his whole army in his quarter and I was playing objectives. This was my attempt to justify getting one myself.

BobbyG sitting in a corner and doing nothing but a big gunline is pretty much going to kill off anything that travels across the board though. None of my opponents would ever play something like this fortunately, mostly because it's got to be among the most boring tactic/game to play.

Niiru wrote:

 chimeara wrote:
I ran a Spartan proxy today against guliman gunline. I got turn 1 split shots on two predators. Killed one halved the other. His turn one, everything with big guns shot the Spartan, killed it. Three squads of Berserkers and Kharn then get shot to pieces with everything else. Not very tempting to get one. Then again it was against Bobby G and co. I still managed to win, because he entrenched his whole army in his quarter and I was playing objectives. This was my attempt to justify getting one myself.

BobbyG sitting in a corner and doing nothing but a big gunline is pretty much going to kill off anything that travels across the board though. None of my opponents would ever play something like this fortunately, mostly because it's got to be among the most boring tactic/game to play.

Yeah, I might have to give it another shot against someone else. Although, basically everyone at my LGS plays shooting armies. I'm the only assault army. So I think any way I slice this pie, spartan is gonna be bad for me.

What you need is one of these,

Rybrook wrote:
What you need is one of these,

Haha, considered that but it's too big of a model unfortunately

Have you seen this

https://www.thediceabide.com/blog/2015/07/chaos-renegades-lord-of-war-analysis

Rybrook wrote:
Have you seen this

https://www.thediceabide.com/blog/2015/07/chaos-renegades-lord-of-war-analysis

No, it's interesting but it's all woefully out of date now.

The spartan is what the land raider should be and the spartan should be slightly better than that baseline.

The spartan can be worth it, Land raiders rarely are.

I will say, I do like that the LR doors fit the Spartan. It's a small thing, but it's nice to be able to have Legion doors on that thing.

Current front runners are:

Spartan Assault Tank
- Two Quad Lascannons
- Twin Heavy Flamer
- Havoc Launcher
505 Points


Predator Flame-Tank
- Infernal Flamestorm Cannon
- 2xLascannon
- Havoc Launcher
201 Points


The Predator is loads cheaper, but also more fragile and with less firepower.

The spartan is a lot of eggs in one basket... but on the other hand, it can get buffed with rerolls of all 1's to hit, and get protected with either a -1 to hit (-2 to hit if it pops smoke) or a 5+ FnP. Can also ram it's way into combat to protect itself, and still fire all its lascannons and heavy flamers. Kinda appropriately brutal for chaos.

Those both seem tastey. I've been tempted on more than one occasion to build a flamey pred.

 chimeara wrote:
Those both seem tastey. I've been tempted on more than one occasion to build a flamey pred.

My problem with the flamey pred, is that you have to be within 8". It doesn't get the same cannon as say... the Inferno Cannon, which is 16" I think on the Hellhound. So you can't shoot much until you get into 8" range, at which point you pretty much have to charge (4 attacks +D3 attacks isn't bad). But then that's it, you're stuck in combat with just 4 attacks a turn. Easily tarpitted. And no more flamers. So if the opponent plays well, you might only get 1 round of flamer damage out of it (and if they play very well, they may even avoid that).

The Spartan just can't be stopped. In combat it does it's 4 attacks, and still fires 8 lascannon shots and 2 heavy flamers and a havoc launcher. Put it near a Daemon Prince or Chaos Lord and I mean... ouch. But of course, you pay a LOT of points for this damage output, and if the opponent manages to punch through the armour and kills it then that's 1/4 of your army gone in one big boom.

Tough decision.

I'd say if you intend on using the predator. Plan on Warptime to get it where you need it. Basically, your gonna be paying a sorcerer tax. Unless you want to try to out tactics your opponent. I'd say see if you can proxy one and try it out. See how it plays out.