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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/22 21:32:56
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Horrific Hive Tyrant
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They wouldn't ditch the poorly selling moulds they already have, because they've already paid the biggest cost. At that point they might as well keep selling it to try and recoup as much of their costs as possible.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/22 21:46:54
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Frenzied Berserker Terminator
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Stux wrote:They wouldn't ditch the poorly selling moulds they already have, because they've already paid the biggest cost. At that point they might as well keep selling it to try and recoup as much of their costs as possible.
Exactly they have recouped the cost, just like they will do with less popular models. GW is game with so many flavours, every army, every model etc. cannot all be extremely popular, there business does well because they have created such a rich game, If they stop producing less popular models they'd have to cut so much and it wouldn't be so rich, plus if they are going to release a new lysander, they are going to market it, they'll find away to make it a good seller like they are doing now, with saint Celestine and inquisitor greyfax etc. Plus everyone will buy their new released character, it will sell as good as it did when it first came out unless there is a massive drop in imperial guard etc. I just find that they are going to get rid of anything that is not popular will ruin the game, I don't see them doing it, especially since they aren't just releasing generic characters, they are releasing speacial characters from factions that aren't that popular and they are making gak loads of new special character, just look at the DG range. Automatically Appended Next Post: Delvarus Centurion wrote:Stux wrote:They wouldn't ditch the poorly selling moulds they already have, because they've already paid the biggest cost. At that point they might as well keep selling it to try and recoup as much of their costs as possible.
Exactly they have recouped the cost, just like they will do with less popular models. They recouped the cost on these models a decade ago even more probably. GW is game with so many flavours, every army, every model etc. cannot all be extremely popular, there business does well because they have created such a rich game, If they stop producing less popular models they'd have to cut so much and it wouldn't be so rich, plus if they are going to release a new lysander, they are going to market it, they'll find away to make it a good seller like they are doing now, with saint Celestine and inquisitor greyfax etc. Plus everyone will buy their new released character, it will sell as good as it did when it first came out unless there is a massive drop in imperial guard etc. I just find that they are going to get rid of anything that is not popular will ruin the game, I don't see them doing it, especially since they aren't just releasing generic characters, they are releasing speacial characters from factions that aren't that popular and they are making gak loads of new special character, just look at the DG range.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/22 21:47:53
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 02:03:14
Subject: Re:Legions that need more love.
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Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion
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Well GW's proven a willingness to release resin models of characters with Eisenhorn. But I can't think of any big name characters associated with novels who are on par with Eisenhorn that wat.
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Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 02:20:24
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Stalwart Space Marine
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Word Bearers. I dislike almost anything Chaos related, but I found it odd that they didn't get more attention considering how important they were in the Horus Heresy.
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Praying to get a game of 9th edition in before Summer. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 03:11:44
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Archmagos Veneratus Extremis
On the Internet
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GW has been back and forth on models. On one hand we've gotten models like Eisenhorn who are resin and pretty frikkin sweet (I liked the special Canoness as well but the 2nd ed codex is pretty iconic to me since it's where Sisters truly started as we know them today).
That said, they've also retired metal models as the molds wore out (Sisters are an example of this as well sadly) and we've seen limited run plastic stuff (the Dark Angels chaplain who was only in some Dark Vengence boxes for example, or the plastic Intercessor Sergeant that was released as a special 30 year anniversary model) so using these things as a kind of loss leader to get people into something is a thing too, especially since modelling is done digitally and they can use existing stuff as a base to make different things, or take existing elements from to make other things.
I feel like the current lack of support of new plastics to update old models is tied to a few things: first we have this Sigmar stuff that was being worked on that was likely higher in the list than the 40k stuff we were looking at. The second is that the push is more towards getting armies on the table with their own codexes first, and with new stuff somewhere after that. Yes, we have seen some new stuff drop (like Custodes or Knights) but plenty got updated with either nothing or close to it.
So basically, if it isn't updated yet we don't need to stress about it and assume we'll likely see more coming in the future.
Backing up a bit though to the CSM, I'm starting to feel like we should see the Chaos breakdown to something like this:
Codex: Thousand Sons
Codex: World Eaters
Codex: Emperor's Children
Codex: Plague Marines
Codex: Heretic Astartes Legions
Codex: Heretic Astartes Renegades
Codex: Chaos Daemons
I'd also want a Codex: Dark Mechanicum and Codex: Traitor Guard but I'm sure the Xenos players would shed bitter tears about how the setting built around the core of Imperium vs Chaos isn't focusing on the aliens again. The point is that we could probably give Chaos a much wider diversity in play styles, even amongst the power armour armies, by breaking them into more focuses on specific flavors. Legions could be the undivided Legions and how they work with less powerful boons of the Chaos gods, but more god diversity (or completely ignoring the gods) while Renegades could focus on mixing smatterings of both Imperial and Chaos wargear while given less focused bonuses from either side (so no ATSKNF and no DttFE, but a new bonus that fits their status as the new kids with spikes on the block and a Raider Tactics trait that breaks down the Renegades down into different personalities on the table).
Basically I'm saying that since Chaos is supposed to be heavily diversified it should feel like it on the table with a wider variety of list styles and options in every flavor.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 04:23:36
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Savage Khorne Berserker Biker
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Kelligula wrote:Word Bearers. I dislike almost anything Chaos related, but I found it odd that they didn't get more attention considering how important they were in the Horus Heresy.
I came here to say WB as well. Such an awesome legion with a rich culture of chaos, yet so woefully represented in the rules. Pathetic, really.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 04:30:34
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
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WB are my favorite legion in the fluff. But my body just isn't ready for summoning to be good (hi, AoS!).
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 04:31:10
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Archmagos Veneratus Extremis
On the Internet
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Wolf_in_Human_Shape wrote: Kelligula wrote:Word Bearers. I dislike almost anything Chaos related, but I found it odd that they didn't get more attention considering how important they were in the Horus Heresy.
I came here to say WB as well. Such an awesome legion with a rich culture of chaos, yet so woefully represented in the rules. Pathetic, really.
Pretty true really. They should synergize with cultists more (since they like to start cults to Chaos), and need something more than ATSKNF and a daemon summoning gimmick that only really works well in open play.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 04:32:39
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Ancient Ultramarine Venerable Dreadnought
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I'd like to see every FW Space Marine chapter that had tactics in 6th/7th get those before we get anything else for the other, bigger marine chapters. EDIT: Or, total pipe dream, Codex: Iron Warriors. Just because.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/23 04:34:15
Iron Warriors 442nd Grand Battalion: 10k points |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 04:35:24
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Archmagos Veneratus Extremis
On the Internet
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Coolyo294 wrote:I'd like to see every FW Space Marine chapter that had tactics in 6th/7th get those before we get anything else for the other, bigger marine chapters.
EDIT:
Or, total pipe dream, Codex: Iron Warriors. Just because.
The problem on those chapter tactics is that we need FW to update them, but they're too busy with HH again.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 04:39:27
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
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Fires of Cyraxus is coming out soon, right after Trump's complete tax returns.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 04:52:54
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Archmagos Veneratus Extremis
On the Internet
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meleti wrote:Fires of Cyraxus is coming out soon, right after Trump's complete tax returns.
So it's in one of those boxes that we see at the end of Indiana Jones Ark of the Covenant?
I didn't know FW could pull those kind of strings.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 06:37:37
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Lord of the Fleet
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Alan Bligh's absence seems to have FW in complete turmoil. Who knows how that's going to work out at this point.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/23 06:41:16
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 06:42:28
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion
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Scott-S6 wrote:That also isn't true - we only see mould replacement for the few most popular items, there are lots of models with moulds that are 10+ years old.
And they don't "use" a factory. Mould production and model production is all in house except for a subset of the scenery and accessory products (Wall of martyrs, 40K objectives, etc.) which are made in China.
Case in point, Eldar are still stuck with finecast for a lot of their aspect warriors.
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Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 07:28:04
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'
Kapuskasing, ON
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Angry Marines bitz box
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 09:49:39
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Loyal Necron Lychguard
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meleti wrote:WB are my favorite legion in the fluff. But my body just isn't ready for summoning to be good (hi, AoS!).
The new summoning rules in AoS 2nd edition seem really interesting from an outsider's perspective, I hope they work out so that they can be ported into 40k.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 10:40:50
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought
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Legions that need more love:
Night Lords (name a Night Lords special ability from Codex??)
Emperor's Children (Sonic Marines and...........Lucius. Need more!!)
Alpha Legion (Never been anything for them!)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 10:45:56
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion
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Corennus wrote:Legions that need more love:
Night Lords (name a Night Lords special ability from Codex??)
Emperor's Children (Sonic Marines and...........Lucius. Need more!!)
Alpha Legion (Never been anything for them!)
The Nigfht Lord's stratigum (in midnight clad) is IMHO an under rated gem, situationally stronger then the Alpha Legion's chapter tactic. and the Alpha legion has the best tactic and stratigium in the codex.
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Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 10:57:46
Subject: Re:Legions that need more love.
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Mighty Vampire Count
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So basically, if it isn't updated yet we don't need to stress about it and assume we'll likely see more coming in the future.
Backing up a bit though to the CSM, I'm starting to feel like we should see the Chaos breakdown to something like this:
Codex: Thousand Sons
Codex: World Eaters
Codex: Emperor's Children
Codex: Plague Marines
Codex: Heretic Astartes Legions
Codex: Heretic Astartes Renegades
Codex: Chaos Daemons
I'd also want a Codex: Dark Mechanicum and Codex: Traitor Guard but I'm sure the Xenos players would shed bitter tears about how the setting built around the core of Imperium vs Chaos isn't focusing on the aliens again. The point is that we could probably give Chaos a much wider diversity in play styles, even amongst the power armour armies, by breaking them into more focuses on specific flavors. Legions could be the undivided Legions and how they work with less powerful boons of the Chaos gods, but more god diversity (or completely ignoring the gods) while Renegades could focus on mixing smatterings of both Imperial and Chaos wargear while given less focused bonuses from either side (so no ATSKNF and no DttFE, but a new bonus that fits their status as the new kids with spikes on the block and a Raider Tactics trait that breaks down the Renegades down into different personalities on the table).
Basically I'm saying that since Chaos is supposed to be heavily diversified it should feel like it on the table with a wider variety of list styles and options in every flavor.
Problem with that is its not just Xenos players that will feel a bit irritated - but non marine players - we are currently drowned in marine releases and Codexes and focussing all this attention on yet more of them seems - lets say unnecessary.
I would have much preferred them to have Codexes focussing on one Chaos Power including Legions, Renegades(both Astartes and Guard) and Daemons - so we would have had 4 big dexes - Khrone, Tzeentch, Nurgle, Slaanesh
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I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page
A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 11:05:50
Subject: Re:Legions that need more love.
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Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion
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My ideal is CSMs, 1K sons, World waters, death guard, Emperor's children, and "Renegades and Heretics" which focuses on Traitor guard.
with world eaters and emperor's children in their own codex, we can get a liiitle more attention to renegade chapters. although not a whole lot. Another idea would be for Codex CSMs to double down on the unaffliated legions, and to release a "fallen chapters Index" that provides a ruleset for a "more recently fallen space marine chapter"
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Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 17:01:50
Subject: Re:Legions that need more love.
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Archmagos Veneratus Extremis
On the Internet
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Mr Morden wrote:So basically, if it isn't updated yet we don't need to stress about it and assume we'll likely see more coming in the future.
Backing up a bit though to the CSM, I'm starting to feel like we should see the Chaos breakdown to something like this:
Codex: Thousand Sons
Codex: World Eaters
Codex: Emperor's Children
Codex: Plague Marines
Codex: Heretic Astartes Legions
Codex: Heretic Astartes Renegades
Codex: Chaos Daemons
I'd also want a Codex: Dark Mechanicum and Codex: Traitor Guard but I'm sure the Xenos players would shed bitter tears about how the setting built around the core of Imperium vs Chaos isn't focusing on the aliens again. The point is that we could probably give Chaos a much wider diversity in play styles, even amongst the power armour armies, by breaking them into more focuses on specific flavors. Legions could be the undivided Legions and how they work with less powerful boons of the Chaos gods, but more god diversity (or completely ignoring the gods) while Renegades could focus on mixing smatterings of both Imperial and Chaos wargear while given less focused bonuses from either side (so no ATSKNF and no DttFE, but a new bonus that fits their status as the new kids with spikes on the block and a Raider Tactics trait that breaks down the Renegades down into different personalities on the table).
Basically I'm saying that since Chaos is supposed to be heavily diversified it should feel like it on the table with a wider variety of list styles and options in every flavor.
Problem with that is its not just Xenos players that will feel a bit irritated - but non marine players - we are currently drowned in marine releases and Codexes and focussing all this attention on yet more of them seems - lets say unnecessary.
I would have much preferred them to have Codexes focussing on one Chaos Power including Legions, Renegades(both Astartes and Guard) and Daemons - so we would have had 4 big dexes - Khrone, Tzeentch, Nurgle, Slaanesh
Save for Inquisition, Sisters of Silence and Sisters of Battle how many non-marine players (who aren't playing Xenos) still need codex releases right now?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 17:51:43
Subject: Re:Legions that need more love.
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Fixture of Dakka
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ClockworkZion wrote: Mr Morden wrote:So basically, if it isn't updated yet we don't need to stress about it and assume we'll likely see more coming in the future.
Backing up a bit though to the CSM, I'm starting to feel like we should see the Chaos breakdown to something like this:
Codex: Thousand Sons
Codex: World Eaters
Codex: Emperor's Children
Codex: Plague Marines
Codex: Heretic Astartes Legions
Codex: Heretic Astartes Renegades
Codex: Chaos Daemons
I'd also want a Codex: Dark Mechanicum and Codex: Traitor Guard but I'm sure the Xenos players would shed bitter tears about how the setting built around the core of Imperium vs Chaos isn't focusing on the aliens again. The point is that we could probably give Chaos a much wider diversity in play styles, even amongst the power armour armies, by breaking them into more focuses on specific flavors. Legions could be the undivided Legions and how they work with less powerful boons of the Chaos gods, but more god diversity (or completely ignoring the gods) while Renegades could focus on mixing smatterings of both Imperial and Chaos wargear while given less focused bonuses from either side (so no ATSKNF and no DttFE, but a new bonus that fits their status as the new kids with spikes on the block and a Raider Tactics trait that breaks down the Renegades down into different personalities on the table).
Basically I'm saying that since Chaos is supposed to be heavily diversified it should feel like it on the table with a wider variety of list styles and options in every flavor.
Problem with that is its not just Xenos players that will feel a bit irritated - but non marine players - we are currently drowned in marine releases and Codexes and focussing all this attention on yet more of them seems - lets say unnecessary.
I would have much preferred them to have Codexes focussing on one Chaos Power including Legions, Renegades(both Astartes and Guard) and Daemons - so we would have had 4 big dexes - Khrone, Tzeentch, Nurgle, Slaanesh
Save for Inquisition, Sisters of Silence and Sisters of Battle how many non-marine players (who aren't playing Xenos) still need codex releases right now?
It's more than codex releases. SM got two plastic assault marine kits. Most of my army is still in Crapcast.
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tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/23 18:12:50
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Stubborn Prosecutor
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Would love to see Iron Hands finally make it to a independent codex. They are clearly not a codex compliant chapter and it's wierd to see them in the standard codex
Plus - more angry cyber marines.
Why the hell isn't there a Codex: Night Lords? How can you not have a codex for the most metal of the metal marines.
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Bender wrote:* Realise that despite the way people talk, this is not a professional sport played by demi gods, but rather a game of toy soldiers played by tired, inebriated human beings.
https://www.victorwardbooks.com/ Home of Dark Days series |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/24 03:33:05
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Archmagos Veneratus Extremis
On the Internet
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ChargerIIC wrote:Would love to see Iron Hands finally make it to a independent codex. They are clearly not a codex compliant chapter and it's wierd to see them in the standard codex
Plus - more angry cyber marines.
Why the hell isn't there a Codex: Night Lords? How can you not have a codex for the most metal of the metal marines.
Black Templars are in the Vanilla Codex despite being founded out of all of Dorn's sons who spat on the codex when it was released and chose to instead crusade so hard that even Guilliman had to approve of them turning down being codex compliant.
I feel like the Vanilla book is less about who follows the codex, but rather who uses the same basic wargear and organizes it similarly, regardless of special one off units (Crusader Squads). Anyone not in the core codex varies so heavily that multiple parts of their army are different than the codex in terms of organization (Black Company, Space Wolves having veterans as scouts, Dark Angels running only Terminator first company and an all bike second company, everything Grey Knights...) to wargear (Baal Predators, Space Wolf frost weapons, Dark Angels having a jetbike, Grey Knight Dreadknights).
Don't get me wrong, I feel like there is room for more diversity since many chapters do have one off stuff that could be used to provide more flavor, but they don't need a whole codex to really do it.
As for the Night Lords, I almost feel like, based on the few stories I've read of theirs, that if they had a codex it'd have less stuff than they currently have access to rather than more. Automatically Appended Next Post: pm713 wrote:It's more than codex releases. SM got two plastic assault marine kits. Most of my army is still in Crapcast.
Sisters are all metal until next year (and then who knows what we're actually going to get for kits), Sisters of Silence have a single box and were screwed out of a proper Talons of the Emperor release, Inquisition is missing model support all over the place (would an Inquisitorial Alcolyte upgrade kit be too much to ask for at least?), and you're crying about one of the most solid codexes that has gotten a lot of proper support having some Finecast kits while everything else is in plastic?
Yeah, that sums it up for me. Sorry, but Eldar are hardly the red headed step children here, especially since save for some new cult troops (who have plastics that rival the ages of the original Aspect Warrior models for Berserkers, or are a Finecast upgrade kit for Noise Marines (which I'd say is a worse position over being an actual model kit) most of the changes could be done soley through rules and putting a Razorback into a box with the CSM vehicle upgrade sprue. I mean, sure, new models would be nice for everyone, but they don't need to do more than update stuff that is just as old as the stuff you're complaining about.
So yeah, I'm not really seeing a complaint I'd call "valid" all things considered. This isn't even a "I got mine" sort of wishlisting since the bare bones of the want is for the main antagonists of 40k to have the proper level of diversity to really show it's threat off. Because let's be honest, for the most part Chaos doesn't feel like it has the level of diversity the player is told they have. We're supposed to be able to see Chaos as a diverse threat that invades every aspect of Imperial life, corrupting it and turning it agains the Imperium. On the table we don't see that diversity. Where are the Renegade chapters taking the latest technology of the Imperium, corrupting it and turning it on their former brothers? Where are the Dark Mechanicum who Heretek ways pervert the tenants of the Mechanicus? You could have argued that we have Traitor Guard through Heretics and Renegades but the book was more the PDF and common populace revolting than a true Guard regiment falling to Chaos and marching on their former home to claim it in the name of the Dark Gods.
Basically, I'm arguing for a diversification of flavor that would bring different styles of army to the table under the banner of Chaos rather than just CSM (who outside of the Thousand Sons and Death Guard) who run the same basic gear with no real differences outside of some relics and the daemons (because let's be honest, there weren't many Renegade and Heretic armies after FW's update of them in 8th). It's something that doesn't really need a lot of model support as much as it needs better rules support.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/24 03:33:40
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/24 04:13:02
Subject: Re:Legions that need more love.
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Legendary Master of the Chapter
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Iron Hands, White Scars nuff said.
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From whom are unforgiven we bring the mercy of war. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/27 09:31:44
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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ye, iron hands needs both fluff and a new official chapter rule, as their dreads was hit hard by the invul nerf.
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darkswordminiatures.com
gamersgrass.com
Collects: Wild West Exodus, SW Armada/Legion. Adeptus Titanicus, Dust1947. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/07/27 09:37:09
Subject: Legions that need more love.
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Stalwart Tribune
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Fallens, definetely
Maybe they should put renegade cahpter keyword to them
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/27 09:39:50
If you wish to grow wise, learn why brothers betray brothers. |
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