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 An Actual Englishman wrote:
He also said ALL Buggies are BS4 (or 3 for SJD) for ALL shots. I wonder if he's made a mistake?

Noticed that too. They are not really modeled as such but that would make the points more palatable no doubt

WD preview has a bunch of unit power levels:



MANz are 2PL each, 'nauts are now 15PL

Did he say why he's taking squads of Boyz in 20's, instead of 30's?

Seems like a number that you'd run with Battlewagons - but he doesn't have any?

I had to step away for a moment - perhaps I missed something in the list.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Warbikes at 23 are still garbage unless they've gained something..

Traits and wartrikes?

Sorry what I meant was something other than traits (that every other army got) and Wartrikes that cost 120ppm....

That's nowhere near enough. They are far too expensive.

On the subject of Wartrikes, they're vehicles so can be healed by Meks/Big Meks

so the Loot It! strategem...it doesnt specify Blood Axe unit just ork infantry....

Ok, im loving that one. That technically works on Nobz, theyre infantry. 3+ save nobz anyone? lol
It also doesnt specify ENEMY vehicle - so Trukks have a second purpose! Transport something, blow up, and beef their armor up lol....

oh god im loving that.

Interesting, Gorkanauts went down to 15PL from 19. Wonder if there is a point reduction in there too. Also 10 MANZ would be 20PL as well which means they went down too (and can use teleport). 3PL trukks

 Billagio wrote:
Big mek with PK, MA and KFF is 77 points!

where are you getting this from?

mhalko1 wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
Big mek with PK, MA and KFF is 77 points!

where are you getting this from?

Sorry I was looking at base cost not with wargear. Someone corrected me

Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Regarding nob bikers:
"They're probably not as awesome as you want them to be"

fe40k wrote:
Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Did he say they were 2 wounds or was he looking at nob bikers?

Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

 Billagio wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Did he say they were 2 wounds or was he looking at nob bikers?

Normal bikers are 2wounds.

He was checking if they had 2 DakkaGuns (which they did, "as expected").

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so the Loot It! strategem...it doesnt specify Blood Axe unit just ork infantry....

Ok, im loving that one. That technically works on Nobz, theyre infantry. 3+ save nobz anyone? lol
It also doesnt specify ENEMY vehicle - so Trukks have a second purpose! Transport something, blow up, and beef their armor up lol....

oh god im loving that.

Stream confirmed jumping out and taking advantage of the strat before the trukk is destroyed.

Ha bikes are already 2 wounds...I always assumed they were 1 wound. Shows how much Ive used them

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so the Loot It! strategem...it doesnt specify Blood Axe unit just ork infantry....

Ok, im loving that one. That technically works on Nobz, theyre infantry. 3+ save nobz anyone? lol
It also doesnt specify ENEMY vehicle - so Trukks have a second purpose! Transport something, blow up, and beef their armor up lol....

oh god im loving that.

The reason why Blood axes were mentioned is because they are (supposedly) always in cover.
So that means Blood axe boyz effectively have 5+ saves.
With 'ard boyz that becomes 4+ saves.
With Loot it it becomes 3+ saves.

Blood axe nobz would be 2+ saves, and meganobz become 0+ (only for the purposes of modifiers, obviously)

Non-Blood axe units would be capped at 4+ saves.

"Well, in hyper competitive you won't see Stompas"
"40w, 3+ armor save"
"You're shooting like 18 shots a turn"
"Stompas are WAYYY better, but you have to remember, Orks are better"
"Orks always hitting on 6's, make the Stompa BadMoonz to reroll 1s"
"Blood Axe Stompa, 2+"
"Two meks inside, one hops out each round and heals it before it runs off"

I mean, for 940 points - I'm still not sold.

Stop pulling a Reece and hyping up a bad unit; I get you're a mouthpiece, but you're representing the only really informed individual we have at the moment; as you have the codex in hand.

I'm surprised Painboyz went up in price. Maybe there's a strat or change to Dok Toolz that make them more useful? I'm pretty sure the FNP bubble is still only 6+, so unless they changed how it works, I don't know why you wouldn't just take a Big Mek in most cases besides healing Weirdboy duty.

fe40k wrote:
Regarding warbikers:
"Warbikes are awesome"
"I actually didn't look too closely at the datasheet, let me look again"

Regarding nob bikers:
"They're probably not as awesome as you want them to be"

I lol'd.

Then facepalmed.

He was claiming Bikes are good because they had 2 wounds "not like previous editions".

23 point bikes is really, really poor. Not surprising though. At least Buggies seem OK.

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Couldn't agree more.

I was going to say thank God for obsec all on deffskulls with boys going up in price, until I saw the KFF reading. Yeah, no.

KFF is mandatory with those rules.

Esp with points increases.

Wait, Klaws are 13 points?

What's the cost on a Powerfist?

fe40k wrote:
Wait, Klaws are 13 points?

What's the cost on a Powerfist?

The same IRRC.

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Boyz need to be 7 with all the gak they have coming their way. 30 Boyz just clipping a KFF. 3+/4+ armor saves. Fight twice. Regen unit.

Powerfist is S8 and 12 points. PK is S10. I think it's just fine where it is.

23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

Orks get a stratagem that can resurrect a dead squad.
Necrons, an army with Resurrection as a main theme, don't.
Dammit GW

Imho painboy was just increased to make snakebites more appealing, because they have little else and there's no other reason for the really frankly mediocre painboy to go up in price.

As a force multiplier, KFF will again be king.

Flash gitz are 4+ BS now.
The captain hits on a 3+ because of squig.

 TedNugent wrote:
Imho painboy was just increased to make snakebites more appealing, because they have little else and there's no other reason for the really frankly mediocre painboy to go up in price.

As a force multiplier, KFF will again be king.

That's a real bummer if that's the case. Could at least have made Painboyz made units that have a FNP equivalent just re-roll failed rolls of 1, instead of being useless for them. Hell, even +1 to the FNP save would make Snakebitez a real consideration against the other Klanz.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Boyz need to be 7 with all the gak they have coming their way. 30 Boyz just clipping a KFF. 3+/4+ armor saves. Fight twice. Regen unit.

Powerfist is S8 and 12 points. PK is S10. I think it's just fine where it is.

23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

That's some fantasy wish list you've come up with, got any references?

 TedNugent wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:
Both painboys and boys going up in cost is not good.

13 point klaws is not good.

23 point bikes is meh.

I'm not impressed. Buggy cost is an improvement.

Boyz need to be 7 with all the gak they have coming their way. 30 Boyz just clipping a KFF. 3+/4+ armor saves. Fight twice. Regen unit.

Powerfist is S8 and 12 points. PK is S10. I think it's just fine where it is.

23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

That's some fantasy wish list you've come up with, got any references?

Uhh...everything on the stream...

 Daedalus81 wrote:
23 point bikes is 2 cheaper than CSM with 1 less save and 2 more attacks plus rerolls to charge. There are some other subtle nuances, but the Orks also have access to super solid traits unlike CSM.

And worse BS (on a shooty unit). 4+ save is 16% worse than 3+ save. 2pts is not 16% pts difference. And I don't see armies of CSM bikes at tournaments, in fact, I never see any CSM bikes at tournaments.... sooo probably not the best comparison (particularly when they're better).

Painboy went up? What? Why?

@TedNugent: I think you're probably right, it went up just to make Snakebites look better in comparison.

Regarding Flash Gits; "Gun Crazy Showoffs" is still shoot again if you roll a 6 (on a single d6 for the unit).
"It only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does"