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 Kap'n Krump wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
To absolutely no one's surprise a Buggy dies instantly on stream to the Knight player awarding first blood.

Someone was stupid enough to bring buggies v. knights?

Let me know how that game goes!

He's got a SJD and Wartrike left.

A Stompa(!)

A Gorkanaut.

A KFF Big Mek.

A bunch of boys.

Not sure what else (if anything).

More Dakka does indeed allow Dakka Dakka Dakka to be procced on a 5+.

More I reflect the more those dragstas seem busted. I was thinking about how good defskull dragsters were and forgot they also have a rocket launcha lol, and also they have DDD.

Very quick math has 9 of them averaging something like ~20 shock rifle hits after you factor the rerolls and DDD PLUS the 4 rocket hits. then remember you get to reroll ~9 wound rolls. Then ~9 damage rolls. I'm using lazy math because obviously the rerolls get allocated but they are wounding T7 vehicles ~18 times with the shock rifle and 15 times vs T8.... again not including the rockets.

The rokkit buggy gets +1 to hit vs shooting vehicles. Sounds like it has 2d3 rokkits +2 rokkits.

The megatrakk skrapjet get +1 to hit vehicles (maybe just in shooting). The wing missiles are another rokkit in stats it seems

Edit: Beaten to the krump


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 greggles wrote:
The rokkit buggy gets +1 to hit vs shooting vehicles. Sounds like it has 2d3 rokkits +2 rokkits.

Did they say it had 2 wing missiles?

Zachectomy wrote:

fe40k wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

fe40k wrote:
They were just mentioning that from a competitive standpoint, his plan is to get into melee; the shooting is just a bonus.

I hope a decent (albeit if not the most competitive) list can be made from shooting units.

Your joking right? You can take 9 shock jump buggies for under 1K and make them def skulls. They hit on a 3 with a free reroll to hit, wound and damage roll EACH. This book is not difficult to power game at all from the leaked cultures and strats alone.

All that crying over imaginary spilled milk with boys being 7ppm, and now what the few were telling you, wait and see, turns out to be true and worse. Turns out you can easily start the game with a full battalion of blood axes with 4+ saves and maxed defskull buggies between them form an outrider, oh whats that? They will shoot the buggies? Right, so you not only have a 6++ but when it does finally go down, without degrading, for only 1cp one of those bricks of 30 blood ax boys becomes 3+ save...

This books traits are easily the most broken the game has seen. Some of these klans are getting 2-3 other factions traits all rolled into one and some even better.

Congrats - you have what amounts to 50 point lascannons, and 1 squad of boyz with some extra saves.

2000 points
1000 - 10 Shokkjump Dragsta
210, 2cp - 30 Boyz
210, 2cp - 30 Boyz
210, 2cp - 30 Boyz
1cp, "Lootin'"

That leaves 370 points for HQs and grots (cp farms).

So, for 7cp (which is a lot itself), you get 90 boyz that are 4-5+ save, and one that might be a 3+; I forsee the meta potentially quickly shifting to units that counter cover saves (Imperial Fists, etc); since it not only counters Blood Axes, it also counters the 2cp 2nd turn cover strategem.

The thing is, this list is about 50/50 in terms of Infantry/Vehicles - when the meta is based on skew lists; and since it doesn't skew, I imagine it'll have an interesting time. It gives all of your opponents guns (anti-tank and anti-infantry) optimal targets all around.

Nevermind you ALSO want 3cp (I imagine that's what it is) to teleport 20pl of units.

10cp for that whole list, for three squads of boyz and some double price lascannons.

Don't bother arguing. I took a look at Red Corsair's other posts, and he's clearly got a thing against orks, "complainers" or both. The dragster is a nice model and situationally strong but not worth maxing out on. The reliable BS is a nice gimmick. Bikers I actually am excited about. Strong? Maybe. But the kultures open up options

I definitely have a thing against people that complain before they have all the facts. I actually love orks.

If you think BS 3+ is somehow a gimmick, that's revealing all on its own Especially when you ignore the 3 free rerolls they get each simply by painting the model blue.

Not watching atm....can you repeat shooting forever if you don't roll a 1?

Did they say it had 2 wing missiles?

Said "wing missiles" so I assumed two, but could just be 1 shot. The +1 to hit vehicles was the main thing I was looking for, for why you would want to take one.

 JimOnMars wrote:
Not watching atm....can you repeat shooting forever if you don't roll a 1?

I believe they mentioned it maxes out at shooting 3 times. Maybe I'm making that up. Don't know if that would be shooitng 3 times in total or three extra times


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 greggles wrote:

Did they say it had 2 wing missiles?

Said "wing missiles" so I assumed two, but could just be 1 shot. The +1 to hit vehicles was the main thing I was looking for, for why you would want to take one.

In Speed Freeks the wings missiles are basically just a rokkit launcha, not two

 greggles wrote:
The rokkit buggy gets +1 to hit vs shooting vehicles. Sounds like it has 2d3 rokkits +2 rokkits.

Man that thing will average 3.5 hits after DDD not counting any klan traits. Plus is has an emulsion blender on the nose SO good.

Ramming speed 2CP, 3D6 charge D3 MWs on a 2+ (?)

 JimOnMars wrote:
Not watching atm....can you repeat shooting forever if you don't roll a 1?

I think it's one extra round of shooting per turn.

Can someone post a link to the stream please?

 TedNugent wrote:
Can someone post a link to the stream please?

https://www.twitch.tv/warhammer

 Billagio wrote:
Ramming speed 2CP, 3D6 charge D3 MWs on a 2+ (?)

Do you know if the "selectable fleet" reroll applies to any of those three dice?

On stream a half beat Warglaive almost one shot the Wartrike. He survived because of 5+++ Warlord Trait (Cybork Body?).

 JimOnMars wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
Ramming speed 2CP, 3D6 charge D3 MWs on a 2+ (?)

Do you know if the "selectable fleet" reroll applies to any of those three dice?

Well since it is a charge roll yes it can be rerolled with ere we go. However I'm not 100% how it will work with 3d6. GW said we can reroll one or both of the dice now so I don't see why you couldn't cherry pick with 3 dice.

Skrapjet sounds bloody awesome. amazing vehicle hunting unit, and if all of them are under 100 points - sweet.

If the size is at all comparable, that's what my grot megatank is going to be run as for sure.

the_scotsman wrote:
Skrapjet sounds bloody awesome. amazing vehicle hunting unit, and if all of them are under 100 points - sweet.

If the size is at all comparable, that's what my grot megatank is going to be run as for sure.

I think they said it was 9 wounds as well, so a little bit hardier then

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
On stream a half beat Warglaive almost one shot the Wartrike. He survived because of 5+++ Warlord Trait (Cybork Body?).

After they were talking for 15 minutes how the Wartrike will one-shot the Warglaive, and then it did 4 wounds.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
On stream a half beat Warglaive almost one shot the Wartrike. He survived because of 5+++ Warlord Trait (Cybork Body?).

Yeah, the warlord has the supa-cybork body..
Can't see the orks winning this one

Or maybe on points by hiding some boyz in a corner, but I doubt any other way

Regarding 9 Shokkjump Dragstas:
DEATHSKULLS Dragstas
vs
T8, Sv3+

18*(0.666)=11.998hits
6.002*(0.666)=3.997 missed converted to hits

15.995 initial hits

15.995*(0.25)=3.998 6's on initial attack, DDD
3.998*(0.666)=2.663 hits
1.335*(0.666)=0.889 misses converted to hits

TOTAL HITS: 15.995+2.663+0.889= 19.547 final hits

If they advance, the total hits goes down quite a bit; not including rokkits and other weapons.

19.547*(0.5)=9.774 wounds
9.773*(0.5)=4.8865 misses converted to wounds
14.661*(0.833)=12.212 failed armor saves
12.212*(3.5)=42 average damage

Quite strong; and can spike high if you roll well on the d6.

The biggest problem is that they can't split fire very effectively, since it's one gun per model. Additionally, the math gets a little weird because in reality, it's possible for one vehicle to hit/wound twice, and another to miss/fail to wound twice - meaning the Deathskull re-roll has lessened benefit.

If Dragstas aren't Deathskull, their effectiveness goes down significantly.

PiñaColada wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:
Skrapjet sounds bloody awesome. amazing vehicle hunting unit, and if all of them are under 100 points - sweet.

If the size is at all comparable, that's what my grot megatank is going to be run as for sure.

I think they said it was 9 wounds as well, so a little bit hardier then

The scrap jet is really nice, I think the dragsta out shoots it but the ram of the scrap jet with that strat makes it super useful verse certain targets like custode shield captains.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

fe40k wrote:
Regarding 9 Shokkjump Dragstas:
DEATHSKULLS Dragstas
vs
T8, Sv3+

18*(0.666)=11.998hits
6.002*(0.666)=3.997 missed converted to hits

15.995 initial hits

15.995*(0.25)=3.998 6's on initial attack, DDD
3.998*(0.666)=2.663 hits
1.335*(0.666)=0.889 misses converted to hits

TOTAL HITS: 15.995+2.663+0.889= 19.547 final hits

If they advance, the total hits goes down quite a bit; not including rokkits and other weapons.

19.547*(0.5)=9.774 wounds
9.773*(0.5)=4.8865 misses converted to wounds
14.661*(0.833)=12.212 failed armor saves
12.212*(3.5)=42 average damage

Quite strong; and can spike high if you roll well on the d6.

The biggest problem is that they can't split fire very effectively, since it's one gun per model. Additionally, the math gets a little weird because in reality, it's possible for one vehicle to hit/wound twice, and another to miss/fail to wound twice - meaning the Deathskull re-roll has lessened benefit.

Yea thats the same maths I was running, I am far to lazy to break down each reroll per car. That is insanely efficient though, all on a platform that doesn't degrade. I think splitfire is much less an issue when your looking at 9 individual units. Also the rerolls come in handy on the rockets too. For fun I was rolling dice at my desk and you get a lot of hits sometimes but overall you basically at least get 2 shock rifle hits per buggy.

Also I forgtot initially to factor in the additional mortal wounds on 6's to wound with the rifle which actually add up. The buggies average ~9 dmage each vs t7 so that mortal wound can be the finishing touch on 10 wound targets.

Wow, the knight just 1 turn killed a Gorkanaut. He better have gone down in points massively!

BTW this thing out performs a DL ravager for 30 points less. Same speed, lacks fly, doesn't degrade has a 6++ rather the 5++ but with the saved points you can get a KFF that covers several. Whats crazy is this is an ork unit not an eldar unit. In the right list it is very hard to focus on these with a mob barreling down your throat ready to beat you.

According to the army lists posted earlier;

Boys up to 7ppm, as we know.
MA Big Mek same cost with KFF. Kustom Shoota down to 2 pts.
Painboy up 8 pts.
Wazbomb Blastajet up 13 pts.
Weirdboy same cost.
Bikes down 4ppm.

 lolman1c wrote:
Wow, the knight just 1 turn killed a Gorkanaut. He better have gone down in points massively!

Pretty sure the Naut was already down 8 wounds from last turn?

So, the knight just killed half their army and it's only turn 2.

The stompa "should" kill two knights this turn. "Should"

 lolman1c wrote:
So, the knight just killed half their army and it's only turn 2.

The streams always have lopsided poor games. I think the new army has lost almost every game on stream so far. They try to highlight lots of units rather then look for specific synergy.