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countbenignito wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Do other armies lose out on traits because "it's thematic"? No. But Orks do... [and yes, I understand that some factions (marines) don't even get traits on everything; but that's an entirely separate issue].

The Triarch Praetorians, Triarch Stalker and C'tans don't access to theirs for thematic reasons.

This seems like a pretty intense victim complex tbh

No faction traits on Triarch units is a total mistake, and has made those models unplayable. We can both agree to that, right?

In that case perhaps its a less of "Boohoo no *sniff* faction traits on muh dudes" and more of a sigh as it could kill them competitively

 Eonfuzz wrote:


No faction traits on Triarch units is a total mistake, and has made those models unplayable. We can both agree to that, right?

In that case perhaps its a less of "Boohoo no *sniff* faction traits on muh dudes" and more of a sigh as it could kill them competitively

I'd debate that it's a mistake. It perfectly fits the way their role is described in the background. Is it GW's intention to make sure every single unit in their books are able to stand the heat of ultra-competitive matched play, or to give rules that best reflect the armies that inhabit the universe they've created.

countbenignito wrote:

 Eonfuzz wrote:


No faction traits on Triarch units is a total mistake, and has made those models unplayable. We can both agree to that, right?

In that case perhaps its a less of "Boohoo no *sniff* faction traits on muh dudes" and more of a sigh as it could kill them competitively

I'd debate that it's a mistake. It perfectly fits the way their role is described in the background. Is it GW's intention to make sure every single unit in their books are able to stand the heat of ultra-competitive matched play, or to give rules that best reflect the armies that inhabit the universe they've created.

They could EASILY do both. If a unit has a big but fluffy drawback, all they need to do is drop its points and keep the rules the same.

Sometimes that may not be the best thing for the game, as it might be more fun to allow the combo (or whatever) and require the high point costs.

But it is a simple fix and could be done in 5 minutes if GW gave a damn.

 JimOnMars wrote:

countbenignito wrote:

 Eonfuzz wrote:


No faction traits on Triarch units is a total mistake, and has made those models unplayable. We can both agree to that, right?

In that case perhaps its a less of "Boohoo no *sniff* faction traits on muh dudes" and more of a sigh as it could kill them competitively

I'd debate that it's a mistake. It perfectly fits the way their role is described in the background. Is it GW's intention to make sure every single unit in their books are able to stand the heat of ultra-competitive matched play, or to give rules that best reflect the armies that inhabit the universe they've created.

They could EASILY do both. If a unit has a big but fluffy drawback, all they need to do is drop its points and keep the rules the same.

Sometimes that may not be the best thing for the game, as it might be more fun to allow the combo (or whatever) and require the high point costs.

But it is a simple fix and could be done in 5 minutes if GW gave a damn.

Not as long as a part of the hobby is to find every single broken combo or loophole in the rules with no regard to the background.

I wonder if theres a looted baneblade in the chapter approved..

I would really hope they would include the one looted fits all type rules where you just take another vehicle and modify it in an orky way. If they release something only available to leman russ tanks it would be stupid...but VERY like GW to do so.

I am not sure it was brought up yet and if it says anything about GW and Orks, but the buggies sprues in Speed Freeks are from 2018 ...
Does it often happen that GW releases sprues the same year they are made?

fe40k wrote:


Do other armies lose out on traits because "it's thematic"? No. But Orks do... [and yes, I understand that some factions (marines) don't even get traits on everything; but that's an entirely separate issue].

Yes they do, don't get a persecution complex just because you do not know the other factions well enough.

You may need to wait for a Gretchin Revolutionary Committee for the grots to get their own traits (just as Kroot are waiting for a Kroot Mercs release that they may or may not ever get).

A nice compromise might have been a Stratagem called "Mascots", where you could select a unit with the GRETCHIN keyword and for the duration of the battle they could benefit from Klan Kultur. You could easily incorporate such Stratagems to all factions.

 nflagey wrote:
I am not sure it was brought up yet and if it says anything about GW and Orks, but the buggies sprues in Speed Freeks are from 2018 ...
Does it often happen that GW releases sprues the same year they are made?

Very unusual but could be just that the final mould was cast this year. Design could be years old.

 nflagey wrote:
I am not sure it was brought up yet and if it says anything about GW and Orks, but the buggies sprues in Speed Freeks are from 2018 ...
Does it often happen that GW releases sprues the same year they are made?

Custodes sprues from the start of this year have 2018 on them, but they would have been made much sooner. The year they stamp is the planned release date when production is being done. Occasionally that's subject to change.

 xttz wrote:

 nflagey wrote:
I am not sure it was brought up yet and if it says anything about GW and Orks, but the buggies sprues in Speed Freeks are from 2018 ...
Does it often happen that GW releases sprues the same year they are made?

Custodes sprues from the start of this year have 2018 on them, but they would have been made much sooner. The year they stamp is the planned release date when production is being done. Occasionally that's subject to change.

In that case they must have changed it as at one point you could have even 2 year difference and I doubt anything would really change THAT much.

 Spreelock wrote:
I wonder if theres a looted baneblade in the chapter approved..

There used to be a skullhamma battlefortress available from FW, which was just a looted baneblade.

 Eonfuzz wrote:

countbenignito wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Do other armies lose out on traits because "it's thematic"? No. But Orks do... [and yes, I understand that some factions (marines) don't even get traits on everything; but that's an entirely separate issue].

The Triarch Praetorians, Triarch Stalker and C'tans don't access to theirs for thematic reasons.

This seems like a pretty intense victim complex tbh

No faction traits on Triarch units is a total mistake, and has made those models unplayable. We can both agree to that, right?

In that case perhaps its a less of "Boohoo no *sniff* faction traits on muh dudes" and more of a sigh as it could kill them competitively

In IG codex, a lot of units (like ratlings, ogryns, and a lot of other auxilia) doesn't get Regiments for fluff reasons either, and yet, somehow you see them on lots of competitive tables.

Yeah, looks like victim complex, sadly. Especially seeing none of the ork units even saw table testing yet...

 Irbis wrote:

 Eonfuzz wrote:

countbenignito wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Do other armies lose out on traits because "it's thematic"? No. But Orks do... [and yes, I understand that some factions (marines) don't even get traits on everything; but that's an entirely separate issue].

The Triarch Praetorians, Triarch Stalker and C'tans don't access to theirs for thematic reasons.

This seems like a pretty intense victim complex tbh

No faction traits on Triarch units is a total mistake, and has made those models unplayable. We can both agree to that, right?

In that case perhaps its a less of "Boohoo no *sniff* faction traits on muh dudes" and more of a sigh as it could kill them competitively

In IG codex, a lot of units (like ratlings, ogryns, and a lot of other auxilia) doesn't get Regiments for fluff reasons either, and yet, somehow you see them on lots of competitive tables.

Yeah, looks like victim complex, sadly. Especially seeing none of the ork units even saw table testing yet...

Eldar pheonix lords
Space marine vehicles
Dark Eldar mercenaries
IG regimental advisors+tempestus
Tau axuiliaries
Necron triarchs

definitely just orks guys pack it up gw hates us and only us.

So, here's a question for Speedfreeks, I figure I'm gonna a playback game at least once...
Shoukd I assemble a Power Klaw or Big Choppa Nob, and should I paint them Death Skulls or Evil Suns?

I think the klaw may be the better choice for death skulls for the reroll to damage and hits. The reroll slightly increases the potential for the weapon and it becomes an obvious choice for spending your unit's free rerolls due it's higher potential damage output.

That said, I think the big Choppa is outstanding for 5 points. At 8 points savings compared to the klaw and with flat 2 damage, it really is a great choice for either, but especially for evil suns.

According to Bob at War of Sigmar (their review is up) the gunwagon is unfortunately indeed BS5+ not BS4+ as rumoured early. He clarifies that in the comment section

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/3391

Maybe a little late, but Lady Atia has posted her Codex Orks Review on War of Sigmar.

Right that does it. Time for a #Mektoo movement.

 Rinkydink wrote:
Right that does it. Time for a #Mektoo movement.

Spoiler:

I already wrote about it on GW's FB.
I know I said wait until the codex is released, but right now the word is out there, and if we mention it before it gets released it might impact their sales enough for them not to pull gak like this.

There is legitimately a lot of annoying stuff in this codex, even if it's alright or even exciting overall.

Having to pick a clan is exciting, eye opening and also annoying in that it shuts out certain named characters, strategems, and pigeonholes you into certain builds while impacting your build flexibility. Once painted you're kind of stuck with it. I guess this is supposed to be super awesome and kewl or something, but in practical terms it is incredibly annoying, even if it is a convention at this point. Clan soups will be impacted by Waaagh, transport restrictions, Speedwaaagh, etc.

Removal of numerous utility characters like big mek with KFF, bikerboss, painbiker, is continually frustrating when theorycrafting builds. Having to buy an index just to support them is annoying. Possibility of losing support is annoying. No points adjustments ever are annoying. It's like legacy support that is soon to be on life support before the inevitable cut, probably never to be seen again.

Points increases on warboss, painboy, and boys are frustrating.

Over all it's an exciting book that carries serious restrictions that will result in more confined, structured builds based around min maxing clan rules.

I'm finding myself grumbling each time I think about a certain list build and how clan rules and omissions have affected certain things.

I don't think you guys are looking hard enough.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Rinkydink wrote:
Right that does it. Time for a #Mektoo movement.

Spoiler:

I already wrote about it on GW's FB.
I know I said wait until the codex is released, but right now the word is out there, and if we mention it before it gets released it might impact their sales enough for them not to pull gak like this.

You wanted to affect this, you are waaaaay too late. It should have been done like year ago when it became apparent this reality is very high chance. But nope. People here too said "Oh GW wouldn't drop that many characters and you can build MA warboss out of box etc etc". But GW has been straight honest all the time what kits are dropping out yet people ignore it. (wonder if GW people have ever considered poker as a life career? Since they seem to have apt on having people not believe them when they are 100% honest they could utilize that in poker to deadly effect)

Actually 1 year ago would have been too late. Would have to be more like 2-3+ years ago when GW came up with their no model, no rule policy.

 TedNugent wrote:
Once painted you're kind of stuck with it.

Or you just ignore the paint scheme and do what you want.
Think about it this way - if you have to use a paint scheme to use a klan, how are you going to make your own klan?
I want to do my own thing, not copy what's in the book.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Rinkydink wrote:
Right that does it. Time for a #Mektoo movement.

Spoiler:

I already wrote about it on GW's FB.
I know I said wait until the codex is released, but right now the word is out there, and if we mention it before it gets released it might impact their sales enough for them not to pull gak like this.

You wanted to affect this, you are waaaaay too late. It should have been done like year ago when it became apparent this reality is very high chance. But nope. People here too said "Oh GW wouldn't drop that many characters and you can build MA warboss out of box etc etc". But GW has been straight honest all the time what kits are dropping out yet people ignore it. (wonder if GW people have ever considered poker as a life career? Since they seem to have apt on having people not believe them when they are 100% honest they could utilize that in poker to deadly effect)

Actually 1 year ago would have been too late. Would have to be more like 2-3+ years ago when GW came up with their no model, no rule policy.

Perhaps, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't receive an earful. If we put our foot down now maybe they won't be so stupid in the future.

I'm having a tough choises between Evil sunz and goffs. I'm probably building a Green tide, with multiple blobs (3-5) of 30 boyz, either tellyporting or jumping at early game.

tneva82 wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Rinkydink wrote:
Right that does it. Time for a #Mektoo movement.

Spoiler:

I already wrote about it on GW's FB.
I know I said wait until the codex is released, but right now the word is out there, and if we mention it before it gets released it might impact their sales enough for them not to pull gak like this.

You wanted to affect this, you are waaaaay too late. It should have been done like year ago when it became apparent this reality is very high chance. But nope. People here too said "Oh GW wouldn't drop that many characters and you can build MA warboss out of box etc etc". But GW has been straight honest all the time what kits are dropping out yet people ignore it. (wonder if GW people have ever considered poker as a life career? Since they seem to have apt on having people not believe them when they are 100% honest they could utilize that in poker to deadly effect)

Actually 1 year ago would have been too late. Would have to be more like 2-3+ years ago when GW came up with their no model, no rule policy.

Well yes. (Although there was a GK character without a model, so not unprecedented.) But feedback is feedback. I prefer to look forward and hope that new things happen in campaign box. My Mek above will have a custom deflekor, powered axe etc. etc. So will remain in my army regardless of when, not if, (as it's going to happen...) the index is no longer supported.

I'm having a tough choises between Evil sunz and goffs. I'm probably building a Green tide, with multiple blobs (3-5) of 30 boyz, either tellyporting or jumping at early game.

Goff trait is useless if you fail your charge rolls. Evil sunz

 Spreelock wrote:
I'm having a tough choises between Evil sunz and goffs. I'm probably building a Green tide, with multiple blobs (3-5) of 30 boyz, either tellyporting or jumping at early game.

If teleporting, command points are at a premium.

That may restrict the number of skarboys.

Evil Suns are faster, and they more reliably charge. Goffs really must utilize skarboys strategem. It's too good not to, and is probably the only thing that makes them a legitimate steal at 7 ppm

That said, you are going to need lots of command points to get them where they need to be, and they are just as squishy as normal boys. So start thinking about what your budget is as far as fitting in weirdboys for da jump, and building your army with enough CPs for tellyporting plus enough for the skarboys upgrade.

Or, just make mass shoota boys and make them all evil sunz.


Either way, survivability relative to points cost is going to be an issue. People were already seeing mobs of 90 getting blown off the board at 6 points per model by static gunlines. So getting your deepstrikes in and reliable charges will be important.

Personally, I considered and I am not going this route. I decided on MSUs and transports. Nobs saw significant price drops, and they do better in transports. I want to exploit this to the fullest. I don't like boys at 7 points per model. Not at all. I'm going to be experimenting with grots+nob lists with death skulls for objective secured.

Even baseline nobs are 1-1 on wounds per point with Ork boys, with the benefit of having a 4+ armor save. Go check out the codex reviews. Nobs can now get a free dual Choppa for 5 attacks on a 14 ppm model.

That said, skarboys are murder and death. It is hard to overstate how scary a 30 man mob is. I would recommend seeing how many you can fit in a list that can deepstrike those mobs reliably. The math for how much damage they can do in a single round of combat is stunning.

 greggles wrote:

I'm having a tough choises between Evil sunz and goffs. I'm probably building a Green tide, with multiple blobs (3-5) of 30 boyz, either tellyporting or jumping at early game.

Goff trait is useless if you fail your charge rolls. Evil sunz

Goff trait is useless regardless. Goff strategem skarboys is incredible. It gives crucial strength 5 on a unit that can be throwing out literally buckets of dice.

For one thing, it doubles their damage output against toughnesa 8 models like imperial knights.

Provided that you can get a slow as molasses 5" movement speed 30 man blob into combat, they are so far beyond any of the other clans in sheer damage output.

Considering most people will have multiple clans which most should require some type of troop choice...
There is no need to pigeon hole yourself with all your Boyz with 1 clan. Feel free to use 30-40 Goff skar boys that you da jump.
Followed by 30-60 evil sun shoota boys with a 10-20 model Gretchin screen.
Or whateva your heart fancies...
Remember to save 3cp so you can green tide your Boyz back to full strength after your oppponent wastes a turn or 2 shooting them.