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TedNugent wrote: Or better yet they could increase the points cost with no update like they did with Ghazghkull.
Lol lootas are 17 points
Wut
Lootas are going to be one of the most popular units. Take of that what you will.
I think bad moons lootas are looking pretty strong if you invest enough poiints and CP into them. A squad of 10 and another of 15 mob up, put More Dakka strat on them and fire away. Then use the Showin' Off strat to fire again. You might have to CP the amount of shots you get. That's potentially 75 shots, rerolling 1's generating extra shots on 5's & 6's. Shooting twice. And you can move them beforehand if you wish since More Dakka just cancels that out anyways. Put a 30 man grot unit in front of them to give their squishy statline some protection and that's suddenly a real scary thing on the table.
TedNugent wrote: Or better yet they could increase the points cost with no update like they did with Ghazghkull.
Lol lootas are 17 points
Wut
Lootas are going to be one of the most popular units. Take of that what you will.
I think bad moons lootas are looking pretty strong if you invest enough poiints and CP into them. A squad of 10 and another of 15 mob up, put More Dakka strat on them and fire away. Then use the Showin' Off strat to fire again. You might have to CP the amount of shots you get. That's potentially 75 shots, rerolling 1's generating extra shots on 5's & 6's. Shooting twice. And you can move them beforehand if you wish since More Dakka just cancels that out anyways. Put a 30 man grot unit in front of them to give their squishy statline some protection and that's suddenly a real scary thing on the table.
And put those grots in a snakebite detachment for fearless.
PiñaColada wrote: I think bad moons lootas are looking pretty strong if you invest enough poiints and CP into them. A squad of 10 and another of 15 mob up, put More Dakka strat on them and fire away. Then use the Showin' Off strat to fire again. You might have to CP the amount of shots you get. That's potentially 75 shots, rerolling 1's generating extra shots on 5's & 6's. Shooting twice. And you can move them beforehand if you wish since More Dakka just cancels that out anyways. Put a 30 man grot unit in front of them to give their squishy statline some protection and that's suddenly a real scary thing on the table.
Yeah, spend all that CP to try to make it a good unit. Often when I look at these discussions I wonder where people are getting all these CPs from to be able to afford to spend it on every little thing. For my own part, I'll be getting probably all of 6 CP from detachments in most cases.
Lootas just are too damn random (at least I seem to recall seeing that they're still 1-3 shots), and too pricey for that reason since they don't have survivability either. Even grot shield requires CP in addition to the points cost of the grots themselves. And from what I've seen of the wording of grot shield, it seems to be unit-specific. So use it on the lootas, and the enemy can just choose to wreck other things instead with the rest of his units, unless you spend even more CP. Sure, you protected that one unit, but that's about it. Overall in your example it is a lot of points and CP. A lot of units can be "scary" if you pump them up with all that.
Oh, and as for the mob up? You can't just mob up two units together like that, they have the be under half strength - and I imagine that being the case you can't end up with a unit with more models than the unit entry allows (which has been 15 for lootas).
I have 3 or 4 boxes of lootas myself - although only a few finished - and would love to use them as the models are quite nice... but the fact they didn't drop the points cost nor get much in the way of buffs to justify the old cost, I suppose they won't necessarily be all that often used.
Armies:
Primary: Black Templars Crimson Fists Orks
Allied: Sisters of Battle Imperial Guard
Yeah, spend all that CP to try to make it a good unit. Often when I look at these discussions I wonder where people are getting all these CPs from to be able to afford to spend it on every little thing. For my own part, I'll be getting probably all of 6 CP from detachments in most cases.
Lootas just are too damn random (at least I seem to recall seeing that they're still 1-3 shots), and too pricey for that reason since they don't have survivability either. Even grot shield requires CP in addition to the points cost of the grots themselves. And from what I've seen of the wording of grot shield, it seems to be unit-specific. So use it on the lootas, and the enemy can just choose to wreck other things instead with the rest of his units, unless you spend even more CP. Sure, you protected that one unit, but that's about it. Overall in your example it is a lot of points and CP. A lot of units can be "scary" if you pump them up with all that.
Oh, and as for the mob up? You can't just mob up two units together like that, they have the be under half strength - and I imagine that being the case you can't end up with a unit with more models than the unit entry allows (which has been 15 for lootas).
I have 3 or 4 boxes of lootas myself - although only a few finished - and would love to use them as the models are quite nice... but the fact they didn't drop the points cost nor get much in the way of buffs to justify the old cost, I suppose they won't necessarily be all that often used.
Lots wrong here.
Mob up is 10 or more plus 10 or fewer.
You need to rethink your lists then. 5 CP can be had for 250 points. The lists with Lootas have 16 to 18 CP.
Loota survivability is easily addressed by grot shield. Yes I protected that "one" high powered unit that benefits from force multipliers more. I'm sure you'll get tons of mileage shooting grots and boyz.
I think if and only if you used the showing off on 3 shots Lootas could be a centerpiece unit in a bad moons detachment.
That said, their damage output isn't that amazing even under ideal circumstances, and they now have three liabilities instead of just 2:
A) cost
B) random shot count
C) survivability
Grot shield cost CP, showing off costs CP, mob rule costs CP, more Dakka costs CP. So if you roll a 1 on shot count, you're SOL.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
TedNugent wrote: I think if and only if you used the showing off on 3 shots Lootas could be a centerpiece unit in a bad moons detachment.
That said, their damage output isn't that amazing even under ideal circumstances, and they now have three liabilities instead of just 2:
A) cost
B) random shot count
C) survivability
Grot shield cost CP, showing off costs CP, mob rule costs CP, more Dakka costs CP. So if you roll a 1 on shot count, you're SOL.
Depends on timings.
Grot shield only costs when needed. Showing off only gets used when advantageous. Mob up is only 1 CP once. More Dakka could occur before the shots roll.
In an army revolving around this unit you'll want 3 to 4 CP for Grot Shield (by turn 5 it's mop up time and they have 48" guns), 1 for Mob Up, 2-3 for reroll shot count, 2 to 4 for Showing Off, 2 to 4 for MD. So, 10 to 16, which is easy enough to achieve.
The only other CP I'd use is for a 3D6 charge from a Blood Axe Gorkanaut.
tneva82 wrote: Problem with clan rules is same as it's always been with chapters etc. Go against fluff, stiffle creativity
I don't know if you noticed, but we have (gasp!) 8th edition now. 7th ed nonsense pigeonholing you into whatever rigid mix your special snowflake decurion demanded is over, now you can bring whatever units you want that synergize with (quite broad and fluffy) faction tactics. The fact you choose to spam that one 0.00002% more efficient unit to the exclusion of all else while calling the rest of the book 'trash' or whatever, is your problem, and the resulting lack of fluff and fun is 100% on you, not on the game, or the writers, who did far better job this edition...
Decurions etc might be over but it's still unfluffy. The traits are invariably unfluffy as hell. Evil suns that are all about slow stuff? Blood axe trait that is biggest help for gunlines? Raven guard that turned assault infiltrating specialists into gunlines? White scars that encourage avoiding tactical marines(core of white scars)? The chapter/etc rules are NOT fluffy and they pigeonhole armies into rigid mixes. That is not good. Decurions not good(wasn't btw fan of those ever so why you even bring them up? MASSIVE reading comprehension failure but maybe I'm talking with kindergarden kid so failure of english reading is acceptable. Or maybe not native english speaker with poor grasp of english?)
The chapter/regiment/etc rules are PIGEONHOLING THINGS AND STIFLING CREATIVY! If you can't grasp that simple concept problem is on you.
If you want codex that encourages fluffy and varied lists chapter/etc traits have to go. Simple fact. Pigeonholing leads to non variety and the traits are never balanced as they are all same cost. Already it's easy to see which ork clans are king and which will be ignored. Just like all other factions. And you can see how they pigeonhole armies into forces that don't follow ork fluff at all.
No I think you will find you are wrong here. The way you play the klan rules is unfluffy and Uncreative. How are evil suns about slow stuff? Their trait works better on vehicles. It’s all about making things go faster. It doesn’t stop you from picking what ever units you want. None of them restrict unit choices. You need to stop worrying so much about winning and focus on enjoying the game. None of the rules you quote force you into doing anything at all. Therefore there is no PIGEONHOLING AND STIFLING.
TedNugent wrote: I think if and only if you used the showing off on 3 shots Lootas could be a centerpiece unit in a bad moons detachment.
That said, their damage output isn't that amazing even under ideal circumstances, and they now have three liabilities instead of just 2:
A) cost
B) random shot count
C) survivability
Grot shield cost CP, showing off costs CP, mob rule costs CP, more Dakka costs CP. So if you roll a 1 on shot count, you're SOL.
Depends on timings.
Grot shield only costs when needed. Showing off only gets used when advantageous. Mob up is only 1 CP once. More Dakka could occur before the shots roll.
In an army revolving around this unit you'll want 3 to 4 CP for Grot Shield (by turn 5 it's mop up time and they have 48" guns), 1 for Mob Up, 2-3 for reroll shot count, 2 to 4 for Showing Off, 2 to 4 for MD. So, 10 to 16, which is easy enough to achieve.
The only other CP I'd use is for a 3D6 charge from a Blood Axe Gorkanaut.
Is it worth that CP cost? There are powerful strategems in the 'dex.
For one thing, you would want another viable target for showing off.
Second, if you have to go 2-3 turns without rolling a 3 on shot count, you're holding on to CPs, allowing the enemy to dictate the pace, while this massive points invested unit craters your list.
Assuming the stars align, and you get the shots out, you're getting 25x3 shots. 5's to hit. If you popped more dakka, you'd get another 1/3 of those recycled. Show off gets you a second round.
So if we're assuming - perfection - , that's 25x3x2 = 150 shots, 25 rerolls, which generate approx 8 additional hits. 50 base hits, which generate additional shots, for a total of 58. Those 58 new shots would generate 9 rerolls, for a total of 19 hits plus 3 hits from the rerolls for a total of 22 hits. So overall you would get 80 hits.
From those 80 hits, if you were shooting at, let's say a juicy target like an Imperial Knight. You'd be wounding on 5's since it's toughness 8, and then you'd get an ion shield at a 4++. So *.33*.5 or 13.2 unsaved wounds at 2 damage apiece or 26.2 damage.
So you could conceivably oneshot a knight. For 425 points, plus grot shields, for however many CPs it takes to pop both more dakka and showing off after a mob up on 25 lootas.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
so i have the november whitedwarf. and there is an battle report between tau and codex orks. this post is for those who haven't read it yet or those who want to discus it.
here are the lists (was done in PL, no wargear was listed)
Spoiler:
orks,batalion detach,badmoons,5cp =wartrike,super cybork body,warlord trait-the best armor teeth can buy =bigmek in megarmor,kff =boyz,3 groups of 10 =3 trucks =meganobz x5 =meganobz x4 =1 boosta blasta,1 shockdragsta,1 snazzwagon =1 battlewagon =1morkanaut kff,1 gorkanaut =dakajet =wazbomblastajet witj smasha gun and tellyport blastas auxilary detachments,-3 cp =1scrapjet,1squigbuggy,1bonebreaker 145 PL total, said the he had 5cp total but because he brought 3 aux detachments he should've only had 2cp
tau,battalion detach,viorla sept,5cp (i wont bother with all the details of tau list) =commander in crisis suit (warlord) =etherial on hover drone =2x firewarrior breacher teams of 10 =firewarrior strike team of 10 =devilfish =x3 crisis suits =x3 crisis bodyguards =riptide with the high output burst rifle =x2 ghostkeels =firesuit marksman =x2 boradsides with rail guns =hammerhead gunship with railgun =3 sniper drones superhvy aux detachment =stormsurge 143 PL, 9cps (had a warlord thing that gave 1 extra cp, not sure where the others came from)
its a kustom scenario. there is a mekshop on the board and the orks only have to get 1 of 2 secret ork vehicles to use the mekshop and then make it to the tau's board edge and they would win (the 2 secret vehicles were the battlewagon and the squigbuggy).
so, the ork player has his flyers in reserves, everything else deploys in transports on the line...and his wartrike is the closest model as far as i can tell. luckily the orks had 1st turn. all ork units rush forward. despite being badmoons the ork player focuses on speed...im not kidding.
the article said this "the orks gave little thought to shooting the tau, preferring instead to drive straight at them." this is not going to go well.
tau 1st turn was spent mostly shooting at the warttrike since the the ork player charged it as far as possible towards the tau gunline.with the combo of a 4up invul and a 5up fnp the wartrike suffered a whole round of shooting from half the tau army. very survivable but only had 1 wound left. ended up killing himself from overwatch in the charge in the next turn.
the next few turns go like this. tau shoot, things die, ork player does little to keep his units within the range of the 2 kffs he has. he gets a few units in combat and or course he wrecks because hes fighting tau. alot of the orks shooting is focused toward the worst units to try to shoot at...all the stealth suits/ghostkeels.
ork player is able to get one of his surviviing secret vehicles in contact with the mekshop (squigbuggy) but since the objective is to use the mekshop then the squigbuggy had to spend a turn doing nothing and thus got shot up when the tau player could deduce that was the secret ork vehicle.
end of round 5. well, no surprise the ork player is almost tabled. tau win.
some thoughts. ork player obviosly wanted to play evilsunzs but badmons was the only things availabe at the studio that also had all the new buggies to test out.
tau players most valuable model was the stormsurge.
orks players mvp was the wazbom blastajet.....no surprise the only thing that performed well was a shooting focused unit in a badmoons list...and the tau never shot at it. (it killed a ghostkeel after its drones were destroyed, and it chipped off the last wounds on a riptide).
i dont remember any mention of any ork stratagems used in the whole battle report, not surprising since technically he barely had any cp. all the while they talked about the tau player using cool tau strats.
so yet again a battle report that utterly fails at hyping me up for the orks. without utilizing any stratagems and barely using the clan trait it was like index orks with some new models and some pts decreases vrs codex tau played by an obviously more competent player.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/02 07:39:28
"dont put all yer boyz in one trukk" "umless its dredds, then take as much uf those as possible"
geargutz interpretation of the 'umies "eggs in one basket"
It's incredible there are as many Ork players as there are, given GW seemingly loves to take every opportunity to remind people how bad they can be with poor play.
Its as if they enjoy making our army look like garbage.
Ugh that battle report is epic fail on so many levels starting from the scenario. Okay GW is not good at making scenarios as the rulebook shows but really? Have to use mek shop and then get out? with flimsy ork vehicles? When it will be obvious which to shoot out the second somebody tries to use mekshop? Lol.
Okay WD BR's are never good but making custom scenario that was designed from the get-go for orks to lose is pretty funny!
Well there goes the idea that BR's are rigged in new army's favour ;-) This was rigged for orks to automatically lose...
And not just scenario but then lists...Orks are rigged for using multiple detachments with cheap core so 13 CP should be standard yet the guy runs up what 5CP total....Bejezus.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/02 07:54:18
tneva82 wrote: Ugh that battle report is epic fail on so many levels starting from the scenario. Okay GW is not good at making scenarios as the rulebook shows but really? Have to use mek shop and then get out? with flimsy ork vehicles? When it will be obvious which to shoot out the second somebody tries to use mekshop? Lol.
Okay WD BR's are never good but making custom scenario that was designed from the get-go for orks to lose is pretty funny!
Well there goes the idea that BR's are rigged in new army's favour ;-) This was rigged for orks to automatically lose...
also the mekshop was right infront of the tau gun line. it was a long drive through enemy fire just to get to it.
"dont put all yer boyz in one trukk" "umless its dredds, then take as much uf those as possible"
geargutz interpretation of the 'umies "eggs in one basket"
tneva82 wrote: Ugh that battle report is epic fail on so many levels starting from the scenario. Okay GW is not good at making scenarios as the rulebook shows but really? Have to use mek shop and then get out? with flimsy ork vehicles? When it will be obvious which to shoot out the second somebody tries to use mekshop? Lol.
Okay WD BR's are never good but making custom scenario that was designed from the get-go for orks to lose is pretty funny!
Well there goes the idea that BR's are rigged in new army's favour ;-) This was rigged for orks to automatically lose...
also the mekshop was right infront of the tau gun line. it was a long drive through enemy fire just to get to it.
Lol. Even better.
Well I know I won't even bother to read that one. It's so lopsided scenario that you would need top-level tournament list to have serious shot at winning it. And I dont' talk about ork tournament list but the ones that can actually win tournaments. The scenario is so ridiculously lopsided in favour of the tau it's unbelievable.
I love custom scenarios and for me best way to play 40k but sheesh this was epic fail on so many levels.
I like stratagems giving back "new tactics" and all, but some things should've stayed special rules, IMO. That existed years ago already. Bilowing Smoke for bikes at least. Maybe Grot Shield.
And why have batreps without players commenting on their tactics, movement diagrams etc.. Even a full-on narrative based on the game would be better than the current setup of a few sentences of incomplete narrative and a few snippets of "highlights".
The Armageddon mega batrep is a great example of a narrative one, the ones where they had tourney players usually were good examples of "why do X at Y time".
PS: Only one more day until WAAAGH! Still excited, I mean, it's still probably better than the last few editions
Looking for a Skaven Doomwheel banner to repair my Nurgle knights.
Binabik15 wrote: I like stratagems giving back "new tactics" and all, but some things should've stayed special rules, IMO. That existed years ago already. Bilowing Smoke for bikes at least. Maybe Grot Shield.
Agreed. Especially as the strategems are 100% unscalable which makes their value change differently. That's the biggest issue with strategems. They don't scale at all. And encourages deathstar style of building of buffing one unit to max rather than multiples. Which alas is opposite of target saturation orks do.
All units get Dakkadakkadakka, and can use weapon profiles from the codex. Squiggoth can benefit from embarked KFF. Zhadsnark nerfed, only affects Evil Suns Infantry, not bikers it seems.
All units get Dakkadakkadakka, and can use weapon profiles from the codex. Squiggoth can benefit from embarked KFF. Zhadsnark nerfed, only affects Evil Suns Infantry, not bikers it seems.
so instead of fixing zhadsnark to benefit bikers they now pigionholed him for evilsunz?
admittedly evilsunz is a good trait for him and the infantry,he will buf and most named characters have a specific clan now, but still, no bikers?
FW never ceases to amaze me with their incompetence.
"dont put all yer boyz in one trukk" "umless its dredds, then take as much uf those as possible"
geargutz interpretation of the 'umies "eggs in one basket"
Aye, but if they were going to limit Zhadsnark, they should have limited his ability to bikes, not infantry. I do still find him useful though, just use him like a controllable missile.
They still forgot to give him the ability to have bikes Waaagh!, which the regular biker warboss from the index has.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
Well, in that case, they could just add "other" to the rule.
I really doubt they have given it any thought at all.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
on the loota frnt i'm thinking of just using mine as tank bustas in truks. The new strats seem to suit them better, more dakka on 5+ and shoot again.... yes pls.
PiñaColada wrote: I think bad moons lootas are looking pretty strong if you invest enough poiints and CP into them. A squad of 10 and another of 15 mob up, put More Dakka strat on them and fire away. Then use the Showin' Off strat to fire again. You might have to CP the amount of shots you get. That's potentially 75 shots, rerolling 1's generating extra shots on 5's & 6's. Shooting twice. And you can move them beforehand if you wish since More Dakka just cancels that out anyways. Put a 30 man grot unit in front of them to give their squishy statline some protection and that's suddenly a real scary thing on the table.
Yeah, spend all that CP to try to make it a good unit. Often when I look at these discussions I wonder where people are getting all these CPs from to be able to afford to spend it on every little thing. For my own part, I'll be getting probably all of 6 CP from detachments in most cases.
Lootas just are too damn random (at least I seem to recall seeing that they're still 1-3 shots), and too pricey for that reason since they don't have survivability either. Even grot shield requires CP in addition to the points cost of the grots themselves. And from what I've seen of the wording of grot shield, it seems to be unit-specific. So use it on the lootas, and the enemy can just choose to wreck other things instead with the rest of his units, unless you spend even more CP. Sure, you protected that one unit, but that's about it. Overall in your example it is a lot of points and CP. A lot of units can be "scary" if you pump them up with all that.
Oh, and as for the mob up? You can't just mob up two units together like that, they have the be under half strength - and I imagine that being the case you can't end up with a unit with more models than the unit entry allows (which has been 15 for lootas).
I have 3 or 4 boxes of lootas myself - although only a few finished - and would love to use them as the models are quite nice... but the fact they didn't drop the points cost nor get much in the way of buffs to justify the old cost, I suppose they won't necessarily be all that often used.
Stick them next to a Mek Gun and a unit of grots in your backline and they might as well be a character.
How are you physically getting to 6CP with an ork army? 3 non-battalion detachments? no troops at all?
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
Stick them next to a Mek Gun and a unit of grots in your backline and they might as well be a character.
How are you physically getting to 6CP with an ork army? 3 non-battalion detachments? no troops at all?
Well more like 2 units of 30 grots.
If you want ork army with 6CP to start with look at the WD battlereport. 5!
why would you ever take 2 units of 30 grots?
6 units of 10 grots, now you're talking. those puppies are 5/3 or 2cp for 30 points. I own 120 and I don't know if I'm going to be making any lists with less than 60 from here on out, our main book stratagems are so goddamn good.
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
Stick them next to a Mek Gun and a unit of grots in your backline and they might as well be a character.
How are you physically getting to 6CP with an ork army? 3 non-battalion detachments? no troops at all?
Well more like 2 units of 30 grots.
If you want ork army with 6CP to start with look at the WD battlereport. 5!
why would you ever take 2 units of 30 grots?
6 units of 10 grots, now you're talking. those puppies are 5/3 or 2cp for 30 points. I own 120 and I don't know if I'm going to be making any lists with less than 60 from here on out, our main book stratagems are so goddamn good.
Simple. They are tougher. 10 gets wiped out when somebody looks at them with evil eye. 2 units of 30 with runtherd making morale non-issue? That actually starts to be tough one to remove without it feeling like waste of points for enemy to remove S2 T2 no real damage output buggers.
Now albeit you can have 10 block units as well. 2x30 and as many 10 strong as I can fit(up to max 120 I own) is common feature in my lists.
(oh and for added flexibility 30 creates one hell of a long wall to set up with da jump if you feel like creating 62" long "you shall not pass!" area(well not pass without killing them anyway)
Looks like the sources I've been looking at (several of them) have been talking out of their rear ends. Typical, I guess. Still, as my luck usually goes 25 lootas in one mob would simply end up rolling one shot per turn for the entire game (and yes, I'm aware that's a subjective and not objective thing).
You need to rethink your lists then. 5 CP can be had for 250 points. The lists with Lootas have 16 to 18 CP.
I don't have enough troops to spam. Or then I'd be spamming squads of 10 boyz which get shot off the table in a hurry (can't even mob them up if the enemy goes first and whacks them, plus then I'd be using up those CP already).
At any rate some actually like using a variety of units and don't even want to paint 200 models for a 2000p list, or buy a million more troop boxes just to get more CP. I was really hoping this codex would make other means than spamming troops viable, but I guess not. don't really play competitively for that and other reasons. Not really specific to this codex but they in general went too over the top with this CP stuff. What started out as an interesting minor gameplay mechanism has turned out into an all out CP-farming fest. Reminiscent of the formation fiasco. Chasing the ever-changing perfect meta lists is far too much for my wallet.
Armies:
Primary: Black Templars Crimson Fists Orks
Allied: Sisters of Battle Imperial Guard
I don't have enough troops to spam. Or then I'd be spamming squads of 10 boyz which get shot off the table in a hurry (can't even mob them up if the enemy goes first and whacks them, plus then I'd be using up those CP already).
.
How little troops you have? 3 troop choices alone gives you 8CP. I would at least go to shop and get 3 boxes of grots. Not THAT expensive and they give you them 13CP to begin with while being good at objective grabbing etc. Sure they die easily but at least enemy has to spend firepower clearing 90 pts total. 6 CP is super thin(I'm still struggling to see how you come with that many. Battallion+1 extra relic comes to 7 CP. Aux detachment? What you need that for?)
(and where we have gone if 30 grots is considered spamming)
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/11/02 12:38:22
Black Templars 
Crimson Fists 
Orks
Sisters of Battle 
Imperial Guard 
