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I've played SW from the mid 90's and outside of The Sled, which is horrible I give you that, nothing has changed so much as to put me off playing them.
If you hate the wolf theme, you would never have started playing/collecting them. So those who have stopped playing them are just some FOTM jerks from around 5th edition that have joined a common bandwagon to flame the wolves for not being super competitive anymore. That's my theory at least.
I mean they were kinda OTT wolfy already in 2nd/3rd edition. They have not "become a farce", they have been what they are pretty much for decades now.
Also one thing about The Sled: given that there is precedent in Norse mythology where gods actually rode chariots pulled by animals (and what animals would you want pulling a SW sled, sheep??), as a concept it's not as far fetched as you might think.
I prefer space wolves to bangels myself. Outside of the sanguinary guard and their special characters the blood angels models don't really have an identity. They're just red space marines. The wolves on the other hand have a lot more variety to their models. I get that some people think the space wolves look silly but at least they have an identity that's represented in their models. Who cares if they want to ride wolves and have a floating chariot pulled by wolves? Not everything has to be all grimdark and edgy.
The bangels do have the best jump packs in the game with their winged jump packs, IMO.
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
Anti grav is a common sci fi thing, Ork technology looks roughly functional most of the time, most psychic kills happen via telekinesis or lightning or whatever but a box does not fly because it has engines on the back. A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam
pm713 wrote: A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
The Stormwolf have engines under the "box" as well as the same "anti-grav" plates or whatever as a LandSpeeder. As far as I am concerned, that is plenty enough to suspend my disbelief.
I'm more peeved that Imperials in general got so many anti-grav/flying things in recent years. Eldar/Necrons/Tau have previously been the masters of this kind of tech and Mankind had supposedly lost the know-how to manufacture such vehicles.
But no. Storm-things and Storm-that for everyone. Oh, and Samael having the "last Imperial jetbike in existence"? Here's some flying golden Terminator jetbikes that have conveniently been hidden for 10K years.
/rant
But I have since come to terms with these new additions to 40K as it deepens the Sci-fi feel of the game which is so steeped in fantasy origins.
pm713 wrote: A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
The Stormwolf have engines under the "box" as well as the same "anti-grav" plates or whatever as a LandSpeeder. As far as I am concerned, that is plenty enough to suspend my disbelief.
I'm more peeved that Imperials in general got so many anti-grav/flying things in recent years. Eldar/Necrons/Tau have previously been the masters of this kind of tech and Mankind had supposedly lost the know-how to manufacture such vehicles.
But no. Storm-things and Storm-that for everyone. Oh, and Samael having the "last Imperial jetbike in existence"? Here's some flying golden Terminator jetbikes that have conveniently been hidden for 10K years.
/rant
But I have since come to terms with these new additions to 40K as it deepens the Sci-fi feel of the game which is so steeped in fantasy origins.
-
That's because the new writers probably realized know-how is rarely lost. If nothing else, there is reverse engineering of Xeno gak.
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
Anti grav is a common sci fi thing, Ork technology looks roughly functional most of the time, most psychic kills happen via telekinesis or lightning or whatever but a box does not fly because it has engines on the back. A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
You can't really say something can't fly when both anti grav and telekinesis are established though. Also, we have no idea what the atmosphere on these planets is like so we can't apply real world aerodynamics to anything. They have power supplies that we could only dream of so they could even just brute force their way past aerodynamics problems if they do apply.
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
Anti grav is a common sci fi thing, Ork technology looks roughly functional most of the time, most psychic kills happen via telekinesis or lightning or whatever but a box does not fly because it has engines on the back. A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
You can't really say something can't fly when both anti grav and telekinesis are established though. Also, we have no idea what the atmosphere on these planets is like so we can't apply real world aerodynamics to anything. They have power supplies that we could only dream of so they could even just brute force their way past aerodynamics problems if they do apply.
I never ever thought disliking the Space Wolf flyers would be a debated thing. I can't really defend the opinion beyond what I've already stuff. They're the straw that broke the camels back in terms of 40k flying for me.
tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
Anti grav is a common sci fi thing, Ork technology looks roughly functional most of the time, most psychic kills happen via telekinesis or lightning or whatever but a box does not fly because it has engines on the back. A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
You can't really say something can't fly when both anti grav and telekinesis are established though. Also, we have no idea what the atmosphere on these planets is like so we can't apply real world aerodynamics to anything. They have power supplies that we could only dream of so they could even just brute force their way past aerodynamics problems if they do apply.
I never ever thought disliking the Space Wolf flyers would be a debated thing. I can't really defend the opinion beyond what I've already stuff. They're the straw that broke the camels back in terms of 40k flying for me.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with not liking a model I just though it weird that the reason you gave for not liking a model in what is essentially a fantasy game was aerodynamics.
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
Anti grav is a common sci fi thing, Ork technology looks roughly functional most of the time, most psychic kills happen via telekinesis or lightning or whatever but a box does not fly because it has engines on the back. A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
You can't really say something can't fly when both anti grav and telekinesis are established though. Also, we have no idea what the atmosphere on these planets is like so we can't apply real world aerodynamics to anything. They have power supplies that we could only dream of so they could even just brute force their way past aerodynamics problems if they do apply.
I never ever thought disliking the Space Wolf flyers would be a debated thing. I can't really defend the opinion beyond what I've already stuff. They're the straw that broke the camels back in terms of 40k flying for me.
The Caestus Assault Ram didn't do it. It had to be a Space Wolf flyer to be able to burst your immersion bubble? You can hate SW as much as you like but your reasoning is a bit weak.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/08/17 09:15:01
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
Anti grav is a common sci fi thing, Ork technology looks roughly functional most of the time, most psychic kills happen via telekinesis or lightning or whatever but a box does not fly because it has engines on the back. A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
You can't really say something can't fly when both anti grav and telekinesis are established though. Also, we have no idea what the atmosphere on these planets is like so we can't apply real world aerodynamics to anything. They have power supplies that we could only dream of so they could even just brute force their way past aerodynamics problems if they do apply.
I never ever thought disliking the Space Wolf flyers would be a debated thing. I can't really defend the opinion beyond what I've already stuff. They're the straw that broke the camels back in terms of 40k flying for me.
The Caestus Assault Ram didn't do it. It had to be a Space Wolf flyer to be able to burst your immersion bubble? You can hate SW as much as you like but your explanation is a bit weak.
Spoiler:
even the thunderhawk is VERY VERY boxy, I mean you can't tell me this is any less a container.
It's clear, at least to me that the reason why so many Imperial ships aren't partiuclarly aerodynamic is because they're NOT airplanes. They're space ships. The Apollo Lunar Lander wasn't exactly aerodynamic eaither.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
pm713 wrote: Blood Angels I have absolutely no feelings towards one way or another except for the model with nipples on his armour which is plain silly.
Now Space Wolves are a different story. They were the army I started with because I loved their lore and models and play style. But since then its just been stupid release after stupid release between Murderfang, Stormrider, the flying containers and the awful Wulfen to the point I've quit them now because I don't want to play an army where I sigh every other page at something dumb
The few cool things they add don't hold back the dumbtide sadly.
This sucks, and I admit I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. If I'd been a long-time Space Wolves player I'd be damn near heartbroken at how obnoxious they've become. I suppose you could model your way around a lot of it, but I do fully understand. That sucks.
I find his inclusion of the gunships in that list a bit odd given they're no worse then any other space marine flier (all of which take basic principals of aerodynamics around behind the woodshed) but yeah sucks for him to see your army become something you dislike.
I can see the other Marine flyers working. They seem to be capable of bad flight whereas I just can't see a container flying. Basically after a certain point you can't suspend anymore disbelief.
So we have a game with machines that ignore gravity, ork technology that works because they believe it does, people who can kill you with a thought and beings made of thought that can kill you. All of which you're fine with but when you see a stormwolf your suspension of disbelief is ruined because it doesn't look aerodynamic enough?
Anti grav is a common sci fi thing, Ork technology looks roughly functional most of the time, most psychic kills happen via telekinesis or lightning or whatever but a box does not fly because it has engines on the back. A Stormraven isn't aerodynamic but looks roughly like it COULD fly. A stormwolf doesn't.
You can't really say something can't fly when both anti grav and telekinesis are established though. Also, we have no idea what the atmosphere on these planets is like so we can't apply real world aerodynamics to anything. They have power supplies that we could only dream of so they could even just brute force their way past aerodynamics problems if they do apply.
I never ever thought disliking the Space Wolf flyers would be a debated thing. I can't really defend the opinion beyond what I've already stuff. They're the straw that broke the camels back in terms of 40k flying for me.
The Caestus Assault Ram didn't do it. It had to be a Space Wolf flyer to be able to burst your immersion bubble? You can hate SW as much as you like but your reasoning is a bit weak.
I think you missed my point a little as I very much do NOT hate SW. As for not hating the Caestus Ram that's because I never see or hear of it on the tabletop so that's just a space boarding ship were aerodynamics aren't a thing. Make the Stormfang/wolf a space ship and I'd have nothing to complain about with them.
tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam
Blood Angels for me. I got started with GW stuff because of Space Hulk. I've loved every release's BA models from 1st to 4th edition SH, and I have always enjoyed their lore.
There are some Space Wolf missions from WD for Space Hulk, but the SWs just never captured my attention the same.
7000+
3500
2000 
2200pts/1750 painted
2800pts/1200 painted
2200pts/650 painted
217pts/151 painted 
" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever." 
is any less a container.