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I’ve been guessing this was coming for a while, but it looks like Boyz are moving to 32mm bases based on this photo. Check the upper right-hand corner.

Yes nerf to new players. Old players meanwhile keep using 25mm

Makes sense to me, given how stocky the models are.

And what about warbikers? It appears they'll be rebased, though they aren't even in the web store anymore.

 Stux wrote:
Makes sense to me, given how stocky the models are.

Yeah, orks are the one where i was more surprised this hasn't happened sooner. They always got one foot almost off the base on 25mm

I think we can call this one confirmed - I was going through today's new pre-orders (Yay, the Mekboy workshop comes with the scrap terrain from Speed Freakz!) and I see every infantry box for Orks have been repackaged, and, well, to copy and paste from the Ork Boyz description:

"This boxed set contains 11 multi-part plastic Ork Boyz, and includes options for sluggas, choppas, shootas, heavy weapons and stikk bombz. Models supplied with 32 mm round bases"

So, there it is, a brave new big-base world...

God bless 3rd party base makers.

yeah.....again, not rebasing my 300+ infantry models NOR my 35ish Warbikes.

OT: Personally I hate the bases on vehicles.... but that does look like a great, Mad-max style horde.

 Hivefleet Oblivion wrote:
OT: Personally I hate the bases on vehicles.... but that does look like a great, Mad-max style horde.

GW have very much decided all models are going to be on bases now and they only have rules for non-based models as legacy code (or special rules for skimmers).

SemperMortis wrote:
yeah.....again, not rebasing my 300+ infantry models NOR my 35ish Warbikes.

If anyone takes issue with it, they probably aren't worth playing with to begin with. I don't play orks & I'm well aware that 25mm is advantageous over 32mm but I would never ask an ork player to rebase hundreds of infantry. That is just absurd.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Hivefleet Oblivion wrote:
OT: Personally I hate the bases on vehicles.... but that does look like a great, Mad-max style horde.

GW have very much decided all models are going to be on bases now and they only have rules for non-based models as legacy code (or special rules for skimmers).

FW clearly didn't get that memo based on the new Necrons super heavy!

Have you seen the imaginary base rule on that thing?

 Commissar Benny wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:
yeah.....again, not rebasing my 300+ infantry models NOR my 35ish Warbikes.

If anyone takes issue with it, they probably aren't worth playing with to begin with. I don't play orks & I'm well aware that 25mm is advantageous over 32mm but I would never ask an ork player to rebase hundreds of infantry. That is just absurd.

I can honestly see GW allowing that untill 9th edition then the base size for models will be specified. Look at whats happening with bike, buggies etc, the future seems to be everything on a base and it will have to be of the specified size.

This is less about players it's about GW and the need for parity in a competitive setting. They can't allow people to have an advantage over people playing with current models.

Ice_can wrote:

 Commissar Benny wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:
yeah.....again, not rebasing my 300+ infantry models NOR my 35ish Warbikes.

If anyone takes issue with it, they probably aren't worth playing with to begin with. I don't play orks & I'm well aware that 25mm is advantageous over 32mm but I would never ask an ork player to rebase hundreds of infantry. That is just absurd.

I can honestly see GW allowing that untill 9th edition then the base size for models will be specified. Look at whats happening with bike, buggies etc, the future seems to be everything on a base and it will have to be of the specified size.

This is less about players it's about GW and the need for parity in a competitive setting. They can't allow people to have an advantage over people playing with current models.

Yes, it's a genuine concern for the competitive scene. 25mm gives you an extra rank in melee compared to 32. For a horde that's huge.

In the competitive scene the various orgniser packs will often define things like base size requirements. GW plays it easy with use whatever you want almost - whilst the competitive major events will specify and normally stick to the newest.

So yeah if you're casual gaming its fine, sort of, but competitive get out the rebasing tools (though to be fair considering this has happened for a lot of armies thus far it was sort of expected to happen )

 Overread wrote:
In the competitive scene the various orgniser packs will often define things like base size requirements. GW plays it easy with use whatever you want almost - whilst the competitive major events will specify and normally stick to the newest.

So yeah if you're casual gaming its fine, sort of, but competitive get out the rebasing tools (though to be fair considering this has happened for a lot of armies thus far it was sort of expected to happen )

So far only 1 event I've been to has had a base size requirement. They were mostly doing it because of how many daemons players there were. But I almost got hit with a penalty for my Berserkers, I made them in 4th edition so they're on 25's. Most people don't care because I space them out pretty good, but one dude was being salty about it.

Aye I can wager it will get stricter as time goes on - even if you're trying to play fair its hard when you've not got the right base size. Step-up bases are out there on the market so you don't have to rebase you can extend the base.

 Overread wrote:
Aye I can wager it will get stricter as time goes on - even if you're trying to play fair its hard when you've not got the right base size. Step-up bases are out there on the market so you don't have to rebase you can extend the base.

You won't be allowed to use them in the Warhammer Citadel though probably

 Stux wrote:

Ice_can wrote:

 Commissar Benny wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:
yeah.....again, not rebasing my 300+ infantry models NOR my 35ish Warbikes.

If anyone takes issue with it, they probably aren't worth playing with to begin with. I don't play orks & I'm well aware that 25mm is advantageous over 32mm but I would never ask an ork player to rebase hundreds of infantry. That is just absurd.

I can honestly see GW allowing that untill 9th edition then the base size for models will be specified. Look at whats happening with bike, buggies etc, the future seems to be everything on a base and it will have to be of the specified size.

This is less about players it's about GW and the need for parity in a competitive setting. They can't allow people to have an advantage over people playing with current models.

Yes, it's a genuine concern for the competitive scene. 25mm gives you an extra rank in melee compared to 32. For a horde that's huge.

I can already see the dakka posts and vocal minority outrage - "Modelling for advantage"

I don't get why anyone is getting angry about it. The rules don't specify what base you have to use (although I really wish it did!) so you can mount grots on 200mm bases for all the rules care.

In clubs people will work out what they want to do on their own, and tournaments will house rule as they always have. If you're a "serious" tournament player you would already be willing to deal with inconvenience to do so.

It's not even that difficult if you're willing to accept having taller models, just stick the base on top of a 32mm base. If you want to take more time and effort, you can easily cut a hole in the top of a 32mm base and slide the old 25mm base in, then patch up the hole with basing. And if you're REALLY lazy you can shell out for pre-made base converters.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
I don't get why anyone is getting angry about it. The rules don't specify what base you have to use (although I really wish it did!) so you can mount grots on 200mm bases for all the rules care.

In clubs people will work out what they want to do on their own, and tournaments will house rule as they always have. If you're a "serious" tournament player you would already be willing to deal with inconvenience to do so.

It's not even that difficult if you're willing to accept having taller models, just stick the base on top of a 32mm base. If you want to take more time and effort, you can easily cut a hole in the top of a 32mm base and slide the old 25mm base in, then patch up the hole with basing. And if you're REALLY lazy you can shell out for pre-made base converters.

I'm not doing either because existing models I bought, built and painted/flocked should require periodic maintenance because GW decided 10 to 20 years later certain models look better on a bigger base. You will have a lot of older players be turned off if you try to go with anything other than base it with what we sold it on at the time.

In a 25mm boy blob, 4 rows can fight.

With 32, 3 can.

Each of those rows has 78% the number of boyz in it, limited by charge distance in the wrap around.

Net result is 58.6% as many attacks as before.

It is a 40% nerf to the unit.

 JimOnMars wrote:
In a 25mm boy blob, 4 rows can fight.

With 32, 3 can.

Each of those rows has 78% the number of boyz in it, limited by charge distance in the wrap around.

Net result is 58.6% as many attacks as before.

It is a 40% nerf to the unit.

Assuming you always get them all in before and whatever you were fighting could survive that many attacks. Otherwise that's just a misleading statistic. Anything that needed that many attacks has a bigger area to surround anyway.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 JimOnMars wrote:
In a 25mm boy blob, 4 rows can fight.

With 32, 3 can.

Each of those rows has 78% the number of boyz in it, limited by charge distance in the wrap around.

Net result is 58.6% as many attacks as before.

It is a 40% nerf to the unit.

Assuming you always get them all in before and whatever you were fighting could survive that many attacks. Otherwise that's just a misleading statistic. Anything that needed that many attacks has a bigger area to surround anyway.

It isn't always 40%, but that is more common that you think. Dajump 40 boyz near a knight. The magical 9 inch charge, with 3 inch pile in, puts up a nice neat 10-boy front row, with 25mm bases. The back rows fill in for your sweet 40 in combat.

Unless the knight is on a very bare table and has nobody around it, it is very hard to get more than 10 or 11 in the front row. The jump/charge rules are almost magically designed to pack in 40 25mm models.

32s just get shafted. The 9th and 10th boyz simply cannot charge that far. In any event, losing the 4th row is a certainty.

Note: against other 25s and 32s, the fourth row CAN fight, because the 2nd row is within an inch. Only against extremely wide bases, where there are no small circles poking out, is the 2nd row farther than 1 inch away. This kills the 4th row.

HoundsofDemos wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
I don't get why anyone is getting angry about it. The rules don't specify what base you have to use (although I really wish it did!) so you can mount grots on 200mm bases for all the rules care.

In clubs people will work out what they want to do on their own, and tournaments will house rule as they always have. If you're a "serious" tournament player you would already be willing to deal with inconvenience to do so.

It's not even that difficult if you're willing to accept having taller models, just stick the base on top of a 32mm base. If you want to take more time and effort, you can easily cut a hole in the top of a 32mm base and slide the old 25mm base in, then patch up the hole with basing. And if you're REALLY lazy you can shell out for pre-made base converters.

I'm not doing either because existing models I bought, built and painted/flocked should require periodic maintenance because GW decided 10 to 20 years later certain models look better on a bigger base. You will have a lot of older players be turned off if you try to go with anything other than base it with what we sold it on at the time.

You can tell someone has been in the hobby for a while when they refer to basing as "flocked" - have an exalt my veteran brother

Outside of the super serious e-sport "all my sponsors are watching this match" mentality, I seriously doubt anyone will have an issue with what base size your orks are on. Hell, both of the LGS I visit, several of the players still have their marines on 25's and no one has said a thing.

Thank you haha, Most of my marines are still on 25mms, since my chapter was completed a while ago, though I did a few characters on a bigger base to add detail and importance.

My death watch are on bigger bases since that's what they came with and I don't mind the extra room to give them some more detail/bitz trophies. (My group will usually trade bitz to what ever model killed the most in a given match and if possible we try to incorporate part of that into that model if possible. ). But the idea of taking hobby money and effort to rebase dozens or hundreds of models doesn't interest me

Definitely not rebasing anything I've finished.

That being said the larger bases for Orks definitely make sense aesthetically.

I wonder where we'll be in the next 20 years of scale creep. Terminator bases for Boyz?

HoundsofDemos wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
I don't get why anyone is getting angry about it. The rules don't specify what base you have to use (although I really wish it did!) so you can mount grots on 200mm bases for all the rules care.

In clubs people will work out what they want to do on their own, and tournaments will house rule as they always have. If you're a "serious" tournament player you would already be willing to deal with inconvenience to do so.

It's not even that difficult if you're willing to accept having taller models, just stick the base on top of a 32mm base. If you want to take more time and effort, you can easily cut a hole in the top of a 32mm base and slide the old 25mm base in, then patch up the hole with basing. And if you're REALLY lazy you can shell out for pre-made base converters.

I'm not doing either because existing models I bought, built and painted/flocked should require periodic maintenance because GW decided 10 to 20 years later certain models look better on a bigger base. You will have a lot of older players be turned off if you try to go with anything other than base it with what we sold it on at the time.

The issue that GW has with that is that they make no money from people using 10-20 year old mini's.
They make their money on selling models, and accessories.
I'm not saying that it should be a must do for casual players, just giving people an opinion on what I see coming.
You might not like it but GW doesn't see old model support as profitable, atleast nothing like as profitable as selling new models or bases.

Though nothing beats the look of shock when people pick up my old-school metal mini's on new bases and are shocked at the wieght

Ice_can wrote:

HoundsofDemos wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
I don't get why anyone is getting angry about it. The rules don't specify what base you have to use (although I really wish it did!) so you can mount grots on 200mm bases for all the rules care.

In clubs people will work out what they want to do on their own, and tournaments will house rule as they always have. If you're a "serious" tournament player you would already be willing to deal with inconvenience to do so.

It's not even that difficult if you're willing to accept having taller models, just stick the base on top of a 32mm base. If you want to take more time and effort, you can easily cut a hole in the top of a 32mm base and slide the old 25mm base in, then patch up the hole with basing. And if you're REALLY lazy you can shell out for pre-made base converters.

I'm not doing either because existing models I bought, built and painted/flocked should require periodic maintenance because GW decided 10 to 20 years later certain models look better on a bigger base. You will have a lot of older players be turned off if you try to go with anything other than base it with what we sold it on at the time.

The issue that GW has with that is that they make no money from people using 10-20 year old mini's.
They make their money on selling models, and accessories.
I'm not saying that it should be a must do for casual players, just giving people an opinion on what I see coming.
You might not like it but GW doesn't see old model support as profitable, atleast nothing like as profitable as selling new models or bases.

Though nothing beats the look of shock when people pick up my old-school metal mini's on new bases and are shocked at the wieght

While all that is true, I don't believe they have upped the base size in order to increase sales. They will know it will piss some older players off, and that many will go to third party solutions if they do decide to upsize their bases.

They will have done it simply because the models look better on a larger base. And that being the case they aren't going to be constrained by a 20 year old decision.

As BCB says, if you don't like it you are free to ignore it in the current rules. If you're chasing the tournament meta then tournaments have always had their own rules that might force you to change your models anyway. It's always been extra expensive to play 40k competitively.

It's this kind of thing that is part the reason we get Primaris and other completely new units when a faction is updated - because the history of the game has way too much baggage and it's so much easier just to start with a clean slate than to update units from the 80s and enter this minefield.

I would have used 30mm MDF bases anyway so...