CODEX ORKS -strategies and tactics in 8th.

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**Blackie**

About Tankbustas I think a good way to make them efficient is to bring two separate units embarked in their own trukk. This because we should avoid to put all the eggs in the same basket and because rokkits have a short range, so an appropriate target could be too far from one squad but in range for the other one. For the same reason one trukk can be focussed down by some firepower but the second one could manage to stay out of range from the enemy anti tank. Not to mention that a single source of anti tank can kill a BW and overkill a single trukk sparing the seocond if it doesn't split fire, but if it does maybe both trukks could even survive.

Two units of 8 bustas and 2 squigs between my 3 bonebreakas is what I'm trying in my list. Not the full 10 because it's 68 points that I need elsewhere, but it wouldn't be impossible to add those 4 bustas if I feel that I really need them. All five vehicles compete to soak the anti tank, all scary but none of them is a priority target.

Alternatively a single unit of 10+2 bustas in a trukk and 15 lootas in my backfield (which are exactly the same cost that 10 bustas + 2 squigs in a trukk), shielded by 2x10 grots.

**tneva82**

Anti tank ranges are so high odds of one trukk being in range and other not...well if that happens get lottery tickets. You just beat odds of that. In terms of survivability 2 trukks is worse than battlewagon. Short range is better reason but then you also lose punch

**davou**

tneva82 wrote:
Reason: plenty of groups/tournaments don't allow it

Plenty of groups play warmachine isntead of 40k. that has no bearing on warhammer

**Vineheart01**

Meltas are about all they'd be avoiding and personally i dont see a lot of meltas right now. its all the plasma crap or just battlecannon level stuff.

**lord_blackfang**

davou wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Reason: plenty of groups/tournaments don't allow it

Plenty of groups play warmachine isntead of 40k. that has no bearing on warhammer

You can just stop trolling with this crap. The ETC forbids index units, that has a real and tangible effect on the competitive scene in Europe.

**the_scotsman**

Spoiler:

gungo wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
gungo wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
I guess that's true. I think from an evil sunz perspective I'm putting the index bikerboss behind Zhardsnark and the Deffkilla, and by that point in my list building I'm generally going "eeeeeh, do I want the third warboss, or do I want to just close it out with a da jump weirdboy and call HQs done?"

Most of my lists bring the Deffkilla with supa-cybork over the index bikerboss. Plus, the bikerboss' turn 1 threat is a bit more in question as he moves 16" and advances D6 vs Zhard who moves 17" and advances 6".

Looking at it though maybe I'm just being overly attached to my one evil sunz character. Killa Klaw does score quite a bit more damage vs T7/T8 (9 wounds vs 6.5) and he is cheaper.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
Jidmah wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
I'm curious, why are people still so stuck on the index bikerboss? Just because he can rock the Killa Klaw? That's fine by me, but our transports are so good at this point I don't know why I wouldn't just take a regular, cheaper boss and pop the killa klaw on him.

He also has +1T +1W and doesn't have to take a kustom shoota, making him only a few points more than the foot warboss. Also, free dakka guns.

Neither does warboss on foot though if index is allowed.

Jidmah wrote:
I think trukks are the perfect vehicles for anything that wants to shoot out of its transport. Anything that doesn't can and should go inside a bonebreaka. Due to the point drop on trukks, I don't think there is a reason to take open topped battlewagons anymore, you could just take two trukks for the same price.

15 strong unit you want to transport and shoot out. 15 benefits from strategems more than 12. Battlewagon is often also going to be tougher.

Battlewagons transport 20 don't they?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
I don't know if I'm totally sold on the bonebreaka.

I think I like most people are going to be dropping their wagon out of the sky and then charging it, then the turn after whatever's inside is going to get out and start breaking heads.

If I bring a bonebreaka, I pay 20 points more for 3.5 extra deffrolla attacks, and I bring 12 models.

If I bring a battlewagon, I can stuff it with 20 of whatever I want, which then gets to shoot when I arrive because it has open topped. 16 tankbustas and 4 bomb squigs? 20 shoota boyz?

I don't know how much I love the prospect of those 12 models in the bonebreaka that don't get to do anything until turn 3. I'd rather bring a shooting focused or semi shooting focused unit and give them a nice clean shot turn 2, then a shot and melee turn 3.

In most situations out of deep strike I'd rather have 15 S4 AP- hits from 20 shoota boyz than 3.5 S9 hits from the bonebreaka.

A warboss on bike is significantly more Killy than the Wartrike. Even before he gets the Killa Klaw that a trike cannot take.
Zhardsnark is number 1 though.

The real question Is what do you need the trike for? If you don’t have a vehicle you want to advance and charge there really isn’t any point..
Furthermore you can give your trike a relic supercybork but the warboss has no need since it benefits from painboyz.
I’m running all 4 it was good precodex it is better now.
The worst part pre 8th was they were targeted first because they hit hard and we didn’t have the first turn options we have now.
Now I can threat overload them and get my support units in range of my da jumped/deepstrike units.

Looking at standard T7 3+ vehicles, assuming dakkagunz = boomsticks = big shootas roughly (boomsticks do do slightly more tbf because of the +1 to hit but, meh.)

Bikeboss with Klaw: 4A @ -1 to hit S12 Ap-3 Dd3 = 2.95 and 2A @ S4 Ap-1 D1 = .28, 3.23 total wounds.

Bikeboss with Killa Klaw: 4A @ S12 Ap-3 D3 reoll wounds = 7.406 plus .28 from the squig = 7.69 total wounds.

Zhardsnark with the Pain Klaw: 5A @ S12 AP-4 Dd3 with the extra mortals on a 6 = 6.38 total wounds.

Trikeboss with the Snagga Klaw and Kill Jet melta profile: 5A @ S7 Ap-2 Dd3 reroll wounds = 4.16 + 2 shots at BS5+ S8 AP-4 Dd6 with melta = 1.99, 6.15 total wounds.

So, Killa Klawboss does outdamage both Zhard and Trike, but I think he has his drawbacks. His move (assuming evil sunz) is 16"+ (D6+1) + (2D6+1) versus 16"+7"+2d6+1 and 17+7+2d+1. 28" average charge threat vs 31"/32", probably won't make a big difference but it does exist. And the trike with the supa-cybork does win out significantly in durability with the extra wound and the 5+ FNP giving him 4 extra wounds on average than the bikeboss.

I think I'll probably run my Zhardsnark proxy as a killa klaw bikeboss and run both him and the trike. But I'm definitely not going for regular klaw bikebosses.

Zhardsnarks mortal wounds ability is more useful then mathhammer suggest
I agree don’t take basic klaw it’s better (and cheaper) to take the relic killchoppa.
The 4 bikers in using are
Warboss on bike w killchoppa
Trike (warboss with brutal but kunnin)
Zhardsnark
And painboy on bike w Killa Klaw since it makes the painboy Killy and gives everyone including my dajumped Boyz (except trike) 5+ fnp.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
Reason: plenty of groups/tournaments don't allow it

No etc and it’s area of influence don’t allow it...(they don’t allow forgeworld either)
Warhammer world and most of England and all the ITC, adepticon and nova all allow it.
The index isn’t overpowered either it’s been nerfed several times and is very vanilla.

Oh, I'm sorry - when you said I'm using 4 bikers, I assumed you meant biker boss with Killa Klaw, then just three regular bikerbosses with regular Klaws. Yeah, I definitely agree that Trike, Zhard and regular Bikeboss/Painbike with KK are all worth using.

FYI the painboy only gives a 6+ FNP. The only 5+ FNPs in the book are the supa-cybork and Zagstruk IIRC.

**PiñaColada**

tneva82 wrote:
Anti tank ranges are so high odds of one trukk being in range and other not...well if that happens get lottery tickets. You just beat odds of that. In terms of survivability 2 trukks is worse than battlewagon. Short range is better reason but then you also lose punch

Surely that depends a lot on what fire on them right? Like I face a lot of Eldar, so those fire prisms melt through them just as easily, but then the can't link fire if it's 2 different trukks.
A hemlock wounds trukk's on 2's and battlewagons on 3's but neither get a save and you have a chance to ramshackle the trukk.
Fire dragons if you were ever to face them, (or melta in general) makes no distinction between the two. Again ramshackle could help but nothing you can count on. Shining spears have a similar weapon in this sense
Dark reapers are the same.

A battlewagon with an 'ardcase is much more durable against so many weapons but I feel like there aren't that many weapons with S6 that want to fire at vehicles. S7 certainly exists but autocannons and non-overcharged plasma aren't that common imo. Maybe that's mostly what I face though.

**Frontline989**

What are some decent units to focus on for a 1250 pt list for a new ork army? I only have a unit of flash gits currently and wanted to know what would be some units that would compliment them.

**davou**

lord_blackfang wrote:

You can just stop trolling with this crap. The ETC forbids index units, that has a real and tangible effect on the competitive scene in Europe.

Then get them to change; the etc has room for how many teams of four? a hundred people tops actually goto that event? Why should they have a negative effect on how the population of Europe plays Warhammer? When gw takes away our toys it will be a sad day, but following the etc like a puppy because some group of 100 players will be obliged to follow that ruleset is dumb.

If a competitive player wants to get ready to the etc, they can restrict their list and play against mine just fine. Having to deal with a bike mek/boss that you might be unfamiliar with is no different than having to be ready to deal with some unit that got 40k ready rules in kill team suddenly and out of the blue.

Not wanting to take a bike mek because it won't fit into your etc plans is NOT the same thing as saying it effectively no longer exists because it cant be run at ETC.

**Jidmah**

tneva82 wrote:
In terms of survivability 2 trukks is worse than battlewagon.

That's flat out wrong.

Do the math.

**tneva82**

davou wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Reason: plenty of groups/tournaments don't allow it

Plenty of groups play warmachine isntead of 40k. that has no bearing on warhammer

Now that's relevant counter arqument to the FACT index is not universally accepted. Denying that is so pointless that for your reputation i hope you don't try to deny.

Oh and here's another funny fact. There is no universal 40k. As it is it's impossible as playing 40k requires house rules to even work and house rules invariably vary

**Vineheart01**

i fail to see how 2 trukks are squishier than a wagon.

20hp vs 18hp, with the caveat that excessive damage cant spill to the other 10w on trukks but can spill into all 18 on the BW.
Same armor save.
T6 vs T7 is very, very minor when the bulk of anti tank is S8+ anyway.
Also Trukk can sometimes dodge multidamage.

Wagon with 'Ard Case would be noticably durable, but except the Bonebreaka nobody uses 'Ardcase because you cant shoot now with the passengers. And if were comparing BW to Trukk, were talking transporting dakkateams not melee teams.

**Jidmah**

Vineheart01 wrote:
Meltas are about all they'd be avoiding and personally i dont see a lot of meltas right now. its all the plasma crap or just battlecannon level stuff.

Plasma is just 24" though, with the efficient range only being 12". Anti-tank also involves knights or daemons punching things, psychic powers (18"-24") and multi-wound flamers like foul blightspawns or hemlocks.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Frontline989 wrote:
What are some decent units to focus on for a 1250 pt list for a new ork army? I only have a unit of flash gits currently and wanted to know what would be some units that would compliment them.

Depends on what route you want to go. Do you want to have a freeboota army, or should the flash gits just be an auxiliary in your army?

**Frontline989**

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Frontline989 wrote:
What are some decent units to focus on for a 1250 pt list for a new ork army? I only have a unit of flash gits currently and wanted to know what would be some units that would compliment them.

Depends on what route you want to go. Do you want to have a freeboota army, or should the flash gits just be an auxiliary in your army?

I just bought the models because I wanted to paint them but now I want to do a whole army but not ready for 2000 pts. Id like to start with 1250 and then add to it from there. I wouldn't be opposed to a freeboota army but Id prefer something that I can experiment with different tactics and kulturs. I want to use the flash gits so I figure some other units that work well with them or at least just some units that would perform well in a small point all comer's list.

Thanks

**Jidmah**

Frontline989 wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Frontline989 wrote:
What are some decent units to focus on for a 1250 pt list for a new ork army? I only have a unit of flash gits currently and wanted to know what would be some units that would compliment them.

Depends on what route you want to go. Do you want to have a freeboota army, or should the flash gits just be an auxiliary in your army?

I just bought the models because I wanted to paint them but now I want to do a whole army but not ready for 2000 pts. Id like to start with 1250 and then add to it from there. I wouldn't be opposed to a freeboota army but Id prefer something that I can experiment with different tactics and kulturs. I want to use the flash gits so I figure some other units that work well with them or at least just some units that would perform well in a small point all comer's list.

Thanks

Ok, keep in mind that the codex is still new, so take any advice with a grain of salt.

First of all, you will need a battalion worth of models - two HQs and three troops.
Possible good HQs would be a warboss, Kaptin Badrukk, the new warkilla defftrike or a weird boy. For the weird boyz and badrukk, I heavily suggest hunting down metal models or using alternative models instead of buying the resin ones from GW, the are flawed more often than not.
For troops I suggest getting two units of 30 boyz and then add one of 10 gretchin. Make sure to build the rokkits boyz from your boxes and use them as tank bustas.

From that you can pretty much go any direction. Maybe get a transport for your flash gits, mek guns for fire support, walkers for stomping around the field or some of the new buggies and bikes to race down the field.

**the_scotsman**

Frontline989 wrote:
What are some decent units to focus on for a 1250 pt list for a new ork army? I only have a unit of flash gits currently and wanted to know what would be some units that would compliment them.

Oh my goodness a post not complaining about index v codex rules garbage.

Flash Gitz are hard-locked into the Freebootas Kultur, which is slightly worse at shooting than Deff Skullz or Bad Moonz, but nicely works with both shooting and melee pretty well. Now, you can include your Flash Gitz into any clan, if you're really not big on Freebootas, but if you like Flash Gitz, you probably want to at least consider running your

It's got a terrible Relic and Stratagem - meaning that, as a Freeboota player you're pretty likely to not be quite as Command Point hungry as other ork armies might be - but a fairly solid warlord trait and basic Kultur rule.

I'd structure your army around having one big punch for melee - say, a biker painboy with the Killa Klaw relic and the Freeboota warlord trait, paired up with a large unit of jumping boyz or Stormboyz ready to pile in, boost their WS up to 2+ with the freeboota Kultur, and then get the rerolls of 1 from the warlord trait. That's your real "put the hurt on" condition.

Then for the shooting components of your army I would build extremely MSU-based - small, min sized squads designed to be able to take down or finish off a unit in the shooting phase with the minimum number of units expended.

**Frontline989**

Jidmah wrote:
Frontline989 wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Frontline989 wrote:
What are some decent units to focus on for a 1250 pt list for a new ork army? I only have a unit of flash gits currently and wanted to know what would be some units that would compliment them.

Depends on what route you want to go. Do you want to have a freeboota army, or should the flash gits just be an auxiliary in your army?

I just bought the models because I wanted to paint them but now I want to do a whole army but not ready for 2000 pts. Id like to start with 1250 and then add to it from there. I wouldn't be opposed to a freeboota army but Id prefer something that I can experiment with different tactics and kulturs. I want to use the flash gits so I figure some other units that work well with them or at least just some units that would perform well in a small point all comer's list.

Thanks

Ok, keep in mind that the codex is still new, so take any advice with a grain of salt.

First of all, you will need a battalion worth of models - two HQs and three troops.
Possible good HQs would be a warboss, Kaptin Badrukk, the new warkilla defftrike or a weird boy. For the weird boyz and badrukk, I heavily suggest hunting down metal models or using alternative models instead of buying the resin ones from GW, the are flawed more often than not.
For troops I suggest getting two units of 30 boyz and then add one of 10 gretchin. Make sure to build the rokkits boyz from your boxes and use them as tank bustas.

From that you can pretty much go any direction. Maybe get a transport for your flash gits, mek guns for fire support, walkers for stomping around the field or some of the new buggies and bikes to race down the field.

I'll get my codex tomorrow so I'll see which of the HQs look interesting. Badrukk is an obvious choice and I've always liked weird boyz. That warkilla model is amazing though so I might not be able to resist.

Is the Big Mek with Shock Attack Gun any good? With the Freeboota kultur it might be a good combo to up the BS and then let loose with the SAG?

**skyfi**

Thinking more about freebooters..

+1 save for 30 boys, hope to bring them back to full strength later in game..

Deepstrike 10 manz and jump 30 boys
While bonebreaka pushes up with banner boss kff and nob squad inside
2 x10 grots camp obj
2 trukks, one with flash gits and badrukk + runt and other 10 tank bustas + 2 squigs shoot stuff

Only 3 tanks for target saturation but 10 manz and 30 boys in your face early.

Have been looking at lists with more tanks for tart saturation and double tank busta trukks, but this above was just intended to bring my manz out

Also trying to think how to best use my Dakkajet as a feeebooter, have made some lists using it as ant infantry/light vehicle killer hoping to hit on 4s or 3s with freebooter buff up.

Really think lots of klaws will be good with freebooters? Especially if you have the +1 waaagh banner nearby for +2 to hit? Pretty reliable.

Also the flash gits don’t seem so bad in melee after shooting really, 30 attacks hitting on 3+ or 2+ with buff up?

Really think traktor kannons would be great for freebooters to generate kills in shooting phase for TB/gits/jet etc to benefit from +1 to hit ... maybe worth dropping some manz and add some Mek guns for that purpose.

**Frontline989**

the_scotsman wrote:
Frontline989 wrote:
What are some decent units to focus on for a 1250 pt list for a new ork army? I only have a unit of flash gits currently and wanted to know what would be some units that would compliment them.

Oh my goodness a post not complaining about index v codex rules garbage.

Flash Gitz are hard-locked into the Freebootas Kultur, which is slightly worse at shooting than Deff Skullz or Bad Moonz, but nicely works with both shooting and melee pretty well. Now, you can include your Flash Gitz into any clan, if you're really not big on Freebootas, but if you like Flash Gitz, you probably want to at least consider running your

It's got a terrible Relic and Stratagem - meaning that, as a Freeboota player you're pretty likely to not be quite as Command Point hungry as other ork armies might be - but a fairly solid warlord trait and basic Kultur rule.

I'd structure your army around having one big punch for melee - say, a biker painboy with the Killa Klaw relic and the Freeboota warlord trait, paired up with a large unit of jumping boyz or Stormboyz ready to pile in, boost their WS up to 2+ with the freeboota Kultur, and then get the rerolls of 1 from the warlord trait. That's your real "put the hurt on" condition.

Then for the shooting components of your army I would build extremely MSU-based - small, min sized squads designed to be able to take down or finish off a unit in the shooting phase with the minimum number of units expended.

I quite like the idea of a Stormboy unit bringing the pain.

**PiñaColada**

Frontline989 wrote:

I'll get my codex tomorrow so I'll see which of the HQs look interesting. Badrukk is an obvious choice and I've always liked weird boyz. That warkilla model is amazing though so I might not be able to resist.

Is the Big Mek with Shock Attack Gun any good? With the Freeboota kultur it might be a good combo to up the BS and then let loose with the SAG?

He's not bad. I like him but he's a hell of a gamble, the damage potential is insane though. If you get that 1 in a billion roll he could do 108 damage in a single round of shooting! But the range makes him a pretty decent objective camper. You might not get to utilise the repair ability all that often though.

The model is amazing, as is the deffkilla wartrike. If you want a weirdboy, plenty of us are using the Orruk Weirdnob. That model is leaps and bounds better than the weirdboy IMO

**gungo**

the_scotsman wrote:

Spoiler:

gungo wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
gungo wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
I guess that's true. I think from an evil sunz perspective I'm putting the index bikerboss behind Zhardsnark and the Deffkilla, and by that point in my list building I'm generally going "eeeeeh, do I want the third warboss, or do I want to just close it out with a da jump weirdboy and call HQs done?"

Most of my lists bring the Deffkilla with supa-cybork over the index bikerboss. Plus, the bikerboss' turn 1 threat is a bit more in question as he moves 16" and advances D6 vs Zhard who moves 17" and advances 6".

Looking at it though maybe I'm just being overly attached to my one evil sunz character. Killa Klaw does score quite a bit more damage vs T7/T8 (9 wounds vs 6.5) and he is cheaper.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
Jidmah wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
I'm curious, why are people still so stuck on the index bikerboss? Just because he can rock the Killa Klaw? That's fine by me, but our transports are so good at this point I don't know why I wouldn't just take a regular, cheaper boss and pop the killa klaw on him.

He also has +1T +1W and doesn't have to take a kustom shoota, making him only a few points more than the foot warboss. Also, free dakka guns.

Neither does warboss on foot though if index is allowed.

Jidmah wrote:
I think trukks are the perfect vehicles for anything that wants to shoot out of its transport. Anything that doesn't can and should go inside a bonebreaka. Due to the point drop on trukks, I don't think there is a reason to take open topped battlewagons anymore, you could just take two trukks for the same price.

15 strong unit you want to transport and shoot out. 15 benefits from strategems more than 12. Battlewagon is often also going to be tougher.

Battlewagons transport 20 don't they?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
I don't know if I'm totally sold on the bonebreaka.

I think I like most people are going to be dropping their wagon out of the sky and then charging it, then the turn after whatever's inside is going to get out and start breaking heads.

If I bring a bonebreaka, I pay 20 points more for 3.5 extra deffrolla attacks, and I bring 12 models.

If I bring a battlewagon, I can stuff it with 20 of whatever I want, which then gets to shoot when I arrive because it has open topped. 16 tankbustas and 4 bomb squigs? 20 shoota boyz?

I don't know how much I love the prospect of those 12 models in the bonebreaka that don't get to do anything until turn 3. I'd rather bring a shooting focused or semi shooting focused unit and give them a nice clean shot turn 2, then a shot and melee turn 3.

In most situations out of deep strike I'd rather have 15 S4 AP- hits from 20 shoota boyz than 3.5 S9 hits from the bonebreaka.

A warboss on bike is significantly more Killy than the Wartrike. Even before he gets the Killa Klaw that a trike cannot take.
Zhardsnark is number 1 though.

The real question Is what do you need the trike for? If you don’t have a vehicle you want to advance and charge there really isn’t any point..
Furthermore you can give your trike a relic supercybork but the warboss has no need since it benefits from painboyz.
I’m running all 4 it was good precodex it is better now.
The worst part pre 8th was they were targeted first because they hit hard and we didn’t have the first turn options we have now.
Now I can threat overload them and get my support units in range of my da jumped/deepstrike units.

Looking at standard T7 3+ vehicles, assuming dakkagunz = boomsticks = big shootas roughly (boomsticks do do slightly more tbf because of the +1 to hit but, meh.)

Bikeboss with Klaw: 4A @ -1 to hit S12 Ap-3 Dd3 = 2.95 and 2A @ S4 Ap-1 D1 = .28, 3.23 total wounds.

Bikeboss with Killa Klaw: 4A @ S12 Ap-3 D3 reoll wounds = 7.406 plus .28 from the squig = 7.69 total wounds.

Zhardsnark with the Pain Klaw: 5A @ S12 AP-4 Dd3 with the extra mortals on a 6 = 6.38 total wounds.

Trikeboss with the Snagga Klaw and Kill Jet melta profile: 5A @ S7 Ap-2 Dd3 reroll wounds = 4.16 + 2 shots at BS5+ S8 AP-4 Dd6 with melta = 1.99, 6.15 total wounds.

So, Killa Klawboss does outdamage both Zhard and Trike, but I think he has his drawbacks. His move (assuming evil sunz) is 16"+ (D6+1) + (2D6+1) versus 16"+7"+2d6+1 and 17+7+2d+1. 28" average charge threat vs 31"/32", probably won't make a big difference but it does exist. And the trike with the supa-cybork does win out significantly in durability with the extra wound and the 5+ FNP giving him 4 extra wounds on average than the bikeboss.

I think I'll probably run my Zhardsnark proxy as a killa klaw bikeboss and run both him and the trike. But I'm definitely not going for regular klaw bikebosses.

Zhardsnarks mortal wounds ability is more useful then mathhammer suggest
I agree don’t take basic klaw it’s better (and cheaper) to take the relic killchoppa.
The 4 bikers in using are
Warboss on bike w killchoppa
Trike (warboss with brutal but kunnin)
Zhardsnark
And painboy on bike w Killa Klaw since it makes the painboy Killy and gives everyone including my dajumped Boyz (except trike) 5+ fnp.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
Reason: plenty of groups/tournaments don't allow it

No etc and it’s area of influence don’t allow it...(they don’t allow forgeworld either)
Warhammer world and most of England and all the ITC, adepticon and nova all allow it.
The index isn’t overpowered either it’s been nerfed several times and is very vanilla.

Oh, I'm sorry - when you said I'm using 4 bikers, I assumed you meant biker boss with Killa Klaw, then just three regular bikerbosses with regular Klaws. Yeah, I definitely agree that Trike, Zhard and regular Bikeboss/Painbike with KK are all worth using.

FYI the painboy only gives a 6+ FNP. The only 5+ FNPs in the book are the supa-cybork and Zagstruk IIRC.

Doh :/ that puts a damper on my list.
The main goal was to set up my deployment with 3 min units of grots on the line as a screen. With 3 units of Boyz behind them with a meka dread covering all the Boyz w kff and a painboy on bike within range. Giving me enough turn 1 protection 5++, 6+++, 2+ grot screen
Turn 1
mob up, warpath, dajump a unit within 9in
Move, advance warboss on bike, painboss on bike, zhardsnark, trike in range of boy blob... also 3x scrapjets in range
Move grots, last unit of Boyz and meka dread w kff up (I doubt even w 18in kff strat I can keep everyone in range)
Shoot w everyone (including Mek guns)
Trike/bikeboss waagh
Charge boy blob into whatever screen eat overwatch and hope at least 1 survives the charge...
Then charge 4x biker blob/3xscrapjets into biggest threats
Turn 2
Drop 2x klaw/saw dreads and 12x burna kommandos
Warpath and da jump last boy blob (if it’s depleted greentide it back to full)
Any Grots still alive take objectives
Everyone shoots again
Waaagh with whatever waagh is left
Charge boy blob into whatever I need to eat overwatch or tie up
Charge remaining bikers into what needs to die
Charge 2x klaw/saw dreads and meka dread into what they can
Have kommandos charge what they can
Turn 3
Clean up with whatever units are left

My main concern is castellan knights... I think I have enough klaws to take it down in 2 turns but once it blows up it hurts a lot of my army.

**akaean**

Don't expect to have a plan that lasts longer than the first turn's opening moves. Plans don't typically survive contact with the enemy, and dice rolls being what they are means some parts of your plan my fail, and some parts of your opponents plan may fail, and you need to be able to adjust on the fly to those changing conditions! Almost every game of 40K starts out with both armies following the "plan" on turn 1, and by turn two the game has devolved into complete chaos with both players scrambling, you want an opening plan that puts you at an advantage when everything goes topside. But I wouldn't expect anymore than that.

**redboi**

How does Loot It work with Deathskulls trait? Is the 6++ considered part of the units save characteristic?

**gungo**

akaean wrote:
Don't expect to have a plan that lasts longer than the first turn's opening moves. Plans don't typically survive contact with the enemy, and dice rolls being what they are means some parts of your plan my fail, and some parts of your opponents plan may fail, and you need to be able to adjust on the fly to those changing conditions! Almost every game of 40K starts out with both armies following the "plan" on turn 1, and by turn two the game has devolved into complete chaos with both players scrambling, you want an opening plan that puts you at an advantage when everything goes topside. But I wouldn't expect anymore than that.

Ya my plan was to have enough threats and backups that if something doesn’t survive or make the charge there is enough backups to keep rolling.
There isn’t much of an opening plan other then get into charge range and provide as much protection as I can to my deployment zone. Kff and painboy and grot screen is pretty much the best orks got minus the kommandos and dreads put into deepstrike reserve.
I guess the most debilitating hit on this list would be to take out the warphead turn one before I can take my turn. In which case I have 2 evil sun boy blobs, hoofing it across the board w kff and maybe fnp... worse case scenario I can use the backup deepstrike using the greentide strategem to get within 9in but that’s 3 more CP then I want to spend from the 10 I have left after deployment.

**PiñaColada**

Has anyone had a chance to try out the Boomdakka Snazzwagon yet? I'm not sure how much I like that datasheet. The model is basically perfect IMO but it feels like you're paying a lot for those burna bottles that I'm not sure if you'd ever get to use.

**pismakron**

Frontline989 wrote:

Is the Big Mek with Shock Attack Gun any good? With the Freeboota kultur it might be a good combo to up the BS and then let loose with the SAG?

He is pretty useless and pretty boring.

**BaconCatBug**

redboi wrote:
How does Loot It work with Deathskulls trait? Is the 6++ considered part of the units save characteristic?

No, a 6+ invulnerable save is not the save characteristic. Loot It only works with the save characteristic, not any Invulnerable saves a unit may have.

**Vineheart01**

PiñaColada wrote:
Has anyone had a chance to try out the Boomdakka Snazzwagon yet? I'm not sure how much I like that datasheet. The model is basically perfect IMO but it feels like you're paying a lot for those burna bottles that I'm not sure if you'd ever get to use.

only buggies that feel worth messing with at all are the Deffkilla, Boostablasta, Megatrakk, and in a more looser sense the Dragsta (easily the bottom of the 4 but sitll usable). The other two are like 20-40pts overpriced.
i swear Rukkatrukk is paying 30pts for +1 wound....

**PiñaColada**

Vineheart01 wrote:
PiñaColada wrote:
Has anyone had a chance to try out the Boomdakka Snazzwagon yet? I'm not sure how much I like that datasheet. The model is basically perfect IMO but it feels like you're paying a lot for those burna bottles that I'm not sure if you'd ever get to use.

only buggies that feel worth messing with at all are the Deffkilla, Boostablasta, Megatrakk, and in a more looser sense the Dragsta (easily the bottom of the 4 but sitll usable). The other two are like 20-40pts overpriced.
i swear Rukkatrukk is paying 30pts for +1 wound....

The squigbuggy is just hot trash IMO, placing one smite per game is nice but other than that I doubt it's doing much. I wouldn't love it at 100 points. The Boomdakka Snazzwagon would be a lot more tempting at 85 points, or if all the shots hit a 4+ and not just the singular big shoota. I love all the other buggies though, and plan to use all of them

**gungo**

Dekilla #1
Megatrakk #2
Especially together

I feel the dragsta and boomblasta are both okay in thier own way. Maybe a slight lead to boomblasta. If the dragsta wasn’t higher priced or give mortal wounds for jumping it might be better.

Other 2 are dead to me