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 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Sluggaloo wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Something I have noticed about my evil sun deep striking boyz is that they are now much more vulnerable to morale than I\m used to with boyz. If you go elsewhere with each squad then they can't utilize each other LD. Even if they are together killing ~15 boyz from each squad isn't that hard so they are both basically losing d6 worth of models in addition.

Makes me think dreads instead of boyz is starting to look more and more appeal for deep strike role.

If it's just one unit you're deepstriing in, sure deffdreads seem ideal. But you could also add a 30 strong mob of stormboyz and multiple kmandos to your deepstrike too. 60 Boyz, 30 stormies and 15Kommandos spawning in and you've got Semper's index list posing a massive headache turn 2.

Yeah, units that can just come in without using tellyporta are great.
Keep in mind too that you can use the tellyporta to drop in a transport full of boyz as well. So an evil sun Battlewagon with deff rolla + 20 boys + Ramming speed could be a nasty surprise.

Exactly. The way I look at it is, if you're looking to play evil sunz to make use of the more guaranteed deepstrike, and you're not utilizing deepstrike to its fullest potential, you're better off with another clan kultur.

Evil Sunz are probably the best stand-alone Kultur, really. Especially for a "typical" ork army.

I tried Deathskulls the other day, and I found it underwhelming. The 6++ invul didn't really do much, as my army was infantry heavy and as such drew small arms fire, and the single still isn't that useful for most weapons.

I think Deathskulls are best for a "mek" army, something that uses a lot of walkers, a lot of heavy vehicles and a lot of single shot, high damage weapons.
SAG would love it, KMB units would love it, ork vehicles would love it because they will be facing high AP weapons, so the invul would be more useful than on infantry. The warlord trait and relic hints at this, as Opportunist's sniping ability works on shooting attacks (big meks have better guns), and the relic is a lot better on a unit that already has mekaniak.
The problem with deathskulls on infantry is that your opponent isn't going to bother using high AP on 6+ save models, so that invul doesn't come into play. On vehicles though you will be rolling that 6++ invul a lot.
Deathskulls on infantry is only really going to be useful against necrons and primaris, as they have -1 save modifiers on their basic weapons.

 Blackie wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Something I have noticed about my evil sun deep striking boyz is that they are now much more vulnerable to morale than I\m used to with boyz. If you go elsewhere with each squad then they can't utilize each other LD. Even if they are together killing ~15 boyz from each squad isn't that hard so they are both basically losing d6 worth of models in addition.

Makes me think dreads instead of boyz is starting to look more and more appeal for deep strike role.

You can run both: Deff Dreads, Gorkanaut or Meganobz by Tellyporta and Boyz by da jump. Boyz are for tarpit stuff or anti infantries, Dreads are anti tank. Two very different roles.

And then you run out of points from tankbustas, lootas and mek guns which have bigger impact than boyz. Boyz don't even hit that hard especially since it's fairly easy for opponent to make good spots to deep strike hard and prevent all from reaching combat.

Sure one can have boyz AND dreads but that then results in less punch...

tneva82 wrote:

 Blackie wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Something I have noticed about my evil sun deep striking boyz is that they are now much more vulnerable to morale than I\m used to with boyz. If you go elsewhere with each squad then they can't utilize each other LD. Even if they are together killing ~15 boyz from each squad isn't that hard so they are both basically losing d6 worth of models in addition.

Makes me think dreads instead of boyz is starting to look more and more appeal for deep strike role.

You can run both: Deff Dreads, Gorkanaut or Meganobz by Tellyporta and Boyz by da jump. Boyz are for tarpit stuff or anti infantries, Dreads are anti tank. Two very different roles.

And then you run out of points from tankbustas, lootas and mek guns which have bigger impact than boyz. Boyz don't even hit that hard especially since it's fairly easy for opponent to make good spots to deep strike hard and prevent all from reaching combat.

Sure one can have boyz AND dreads but that then results in less punch...

I don't know, you'll have 30-40 boyz and 3 dreads in your opponent's face in turn 1. It's basically 500 points of stuff plus the weirdboy, which you may want anyway since it's the cheapest HQ.

I'm not even a fan of deepstriking stuff and I prefer going full vehicles but if you don't want to invest 600ish points of BWs and trukks like me that deep striking combo isn't that expensive points wise. Orks are still an assault oriented army, gunlines and MSU shooty ork lists don't work at competitive levels. Lootas, tankbustas and mek gunz all together are probably too much points invested in the shooting face unless you're not maximizing these units, but then they'll underperform. When I field 2x10 tankbustas (plus 2 bomb squigs each) in trukks and 3 mek gunz I don't feel like I need more firepower, not more ranged anti tank at least.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Evil Sunz are probably the best stand-alone Kultur, really. Especially for a "typical" ork army.

I tried Deathskulls the other day, and I found it underwhelming. The 6++ invul didn't really do much, as my army was infantry heavy and as such drew small arms fire, and the single still isn't that useful for most weapons.

I think Deathskulls are best for a "mek" army, something that uses a lot of walkers, a lot of heavy vehicles and a lot of single shot, high damage weapons.
SAG would love it, KMB units would love it, ork vehicles would love it because they will be facing high AP weapons, so the invul would be more useful than on infantry. The warlord trait and relic hints at this, as Opportunist's sniping ability works on shooting attacks (big meks have better guns), and the relic is a lot better on a unit that already has mekaniak.
The problem with deathskulls on infantry is that your opponent isn't going to bother using high AP on 6+ save models, so that invul doesn't come into play. On vehicles though you will be rolling that 6++ invul a lot.
Deathskulls on infantry is only really going to be useful against necrons and primaris, as they have -1 save modifiers on their basic weapons.

Evil Sunz kultur adds nothing to the shooting phase though. I'd never take a single detachment with that kultur. Deathskulls can have some re-rolls and they have a very effective stratagem against vehicles.

Heavy Bolters and Assaul Cannons are very popular in imperium armies so that 6++ matters against a lot of stuff. I go Dis Cannons spam with my Drukhari which also serves as anti infantries. With multiple detachments I'd never take Deathskulls though but Bad Moons plus Evil Sunz/Goffs since they're decent jack of trades but they are excellent in nothing: Bad Moons are better shooters and Evil Sunz/Goffs are more effective in combat.

Actually the Evil suns do add something to shooting. You can advance and not suffer any penalty for firing assault weapons.
So instead of hitting on 6s after advancing, you'd be hitting on 5+.

We will see how things happen competitively. However 8th index orks even da jumped had a hard enough time making that charge.
Evil suns with the change to ere we go reroll effectively makes that charge highly reliable.
As much as people want to tout ork shooting it still sucks. Gitz are still overpriced and all over the place and not even impressive when in an ideal situation.
Lootas are still random shots, expensive, and glass cannons that again aren’t that impressive unless you start stacking command points on them.
Mek guns continue to be durable and good price point and strong shooting however they care absolutely nothing about most kulturs.
And tankbustas are awesome but extremely short range and glass cannons but need to be deepstruck in or transport and literally die every game I use them turn 1-2. They are best with. Badmoons but you are basically taking this clan for a 1 unit rental.
Orks are by and far best and have been best even during the index and not much has changed with ork units as assault horse army.
Ork boys have a hard time doing the heavy lifting now and are best as a screen killer or getting into combat with other low save infantry.
Ork HQs hit like a truck. Dreads hit hard. The best relics are still assault oriented. Even the best vehicles have better assault profiles as are our strategems geared for assault.
If you push orks into a shooting war you will lose to shooting armies and maybe most assault lists.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Flash Gitz are still pretty bad unless you spend the CP for MOAR DAKKA!. MANZ are surprisingly good IF they get into combat, which means you have to be Evil Sunz and Tellyport them.

Can you elaborate on why they are bad? What battle experience do you have with them? I have run them twice and they have been very good for me, especially when combined when Badrukk + Competitive Streak kicks in. You could also put MANZ in a Bonebreaker, put that on a Tellyporta and 3d6 charge it.

Most CCunits deepstriking, unless it is something with a high wound count like 3 Deff Dreads or something that can move 3d6 like an Eversor, is going to be failing 9 inch charges more than being successful.

I get you're the resident rules lawyer and sometimes that's a good thing but you have a very negative way of looking at this game. Do you only look at the bad rather than the good?

Sluggaloo wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Something I have noticed about my evil sun deep striking boyz is that they are now much more vulnerable to morale than I\m used to with boyz. If you go elsewhere with each squad then they can't utilize each other LD. Even if they are together killing ~15 boyz from each squad isn't that hard so they are both basically losing d6 worth of models in addition.

Makes me think dreads instead of boyz is starting to look more and more appeal for deep strike role.

If it's just one unit you're deepstriing in, sure deffdreads seem ideal. But you could also add a 30 strong mob of stormboyz and multiple kmandos to your deepstrike too. 60 Boyz, 30 stormies and 15Kommandos spawning in and you've got Semper's index list posing a massive headache turn 2.

Codex: Deep strike on display.

I played a tourny yesterday and I had 45 Deep striking Kommandos with 2 Bonebreakaz and 1 regular BW with a Deff Rolla AND a warboss wearing The Redder armor. On turn 2 they all appeared with 30 boyz jumping to meet them. I made almost every single charge and used the 3D6 strat on my BW with my warboss in it. in 3 out of 3 games my Warboss in BW made it into Combat turn 2 and got stuck in where he was near at the least 3 units, the rest of my Deep striking horde was attacking different units because on turn 3 my Warboss's redder armor kicked off and inflicted a lot of mortal wounds Every single opponent was so surprised they demanded to see the codex entry

Codex: Deep Strike works really well against opponents and the only downside I can see is it has a hard time dealing with screens. I am debating about whether or not to take a Dakkajet to help with this or rely on maybe a Jumping Shoota boyz mob that dumpz everything into screening units and charges to open a hole turn 1. Feels like a waste of 210pts.....wish it was still 180

Evil Sunz Kustom Boosta-blastas seem great for dealing with screens.

I've never met a screen that a da jump mob couldn't clear turn 1. I think that's honestly the biggest problem with warbikers, dakkajets, snazzwagins and other chaff clearers: we have a troops option now that's so reliable at that it's tough to consider anything else.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Evil Sunz Kustom Boosta-blastas seem great for dealing with screens.

Kbb = 5.6 dead geq 100 points
Snazzwagon = 3.9 dead geq 100? Points
Dakkajet = 6.3 dead geq 140? Points
5 warbikes = 4.3 dead geq 118? Points

Worth noting that the warbikes can charge and kill an additional 4.3 in melee. Kbb is nice in that like the Snazzwagon it's at a lower price point but hard to hit and 3+ save and 12 wounds is nice on the Dakkajet.

SemperMortis wrote:
Codex: Deep Strike works really well against opponents and the only downside I can see is it has a hard time dealing with screens. I am debating about whether or not to take a Dakkajet to help with this or rely on maybe a Jumping Shoota boyz mob that dumpz everything into screening units and charges to open a hole turn 1. Feels like a waste of 210pts.....wish it was still 180

Shootaboys might just be the best way to open up the board for you. I like how you've tried a list that's very similar to one I'm currently trying to put together myself. I too want to try BBBWs +BW rush with evilsunz deepstrike support. Only difference is I'm looking to have all my Battlewagons filled with goffs. Bonebrekers filled withx10 nobz, normal BWs filled with 20 strong Skarboyz. Evil sunz deepstrike removes all chaff, and open up the board for S5 boyz+nobz and bonebreaker S9 + mortal wounds onto high toughness vehicles. Plus the enemy can't really shoot at anything T1 other than a load of T8 vehicles that could be supported by KFF. That's the plan anyway.

I find interesting you put to use Redder armor, you're the first I've seen here that's gotten good results with it,, please elaborate.

At the minute I'm putting ogether some scrap built Mekgunz, I never ran them in the index and they seem to be strong still. I'm actually hoping that in the FAQ they'll give them clan kulturs, though I feel they might be too strong with them. Just imagine deffskullz mekguns rerolling everything....

tneva82 wrote:
Okay tournament report. Casual tournament, 1750 pts. Took following ork list>

Spoiler:

Deathskull battalion

HQ1: Weirdboy(da jump) 62
HQ2: Weirdboy(fist of gork) 62
Troop1: 13xgretchin 39
Troop2: 13xgretchin 39
Troop3: 13xgretchin 39
Elite1: 10xtank busta(nob boss) 170
Heavy1: 15xlootas 255
Heavy2: 5xflash git 150

Evil sun battalion

HQ1: Deffkilla wartrike (super cybork body) 120
HQ2: Warboss(warlord: kunning but brutal, power klaw, kustom shoota) 80
HQ3: weirdboy(da jump) 62
Troop1: 30xboyz(19xchoppa&slugga, 10xshoota, nob w/power klaw) 223
Troop2: 30xboyz(29xchoppa&slugga, nob w/big choppa) 215
Troop3: 10xgretchin 30
Fast1: 6xwarbikes(nob w/big choppa) 143
Heavy1: Mek gun(Kustom mega kannon) 60

total: 1749

Question - do you think that going Bad Moons with the first battalion would have helped?
Besides, I think Flash Gitz should cost 4 pts less, lootas at least 2 less.

SemperMortis wrote:
Codex: Deep strike on display.

I played a tourny yesterday and I had 45 Deep striking Kommandos with 2 Bonebreakaz and 1 regular BW with a Deff Rolla AND a warboss wearing The Redder armor. On turn 2 they all appeared with 30 boyz jumping to meet them. I made almost every single charge and used the 3D6 strat on my BW with my warboss in it. in 3 out of 3 games my Warboss in BW made it into Combat turn 2 and got stuck in where he was near at the least 3 units, the rest of my Deep striking horde was attacking different units because on turn 3 my Warboss's redder armor kicked off and inflicted a lot of mortal wounds Every single opponent was so surprised they demanded to see the codex entry

Codex: Deep Strike works really well against opponents and the only downside I can see is it has a hard time dealing with screens. I am debating about whether or not to take a Dakkajet to help with this or rely on maybe a Jumping Shoota boyz mob that dumpz everything into screening units and charges to open a hole turn 1. Feels like a waste of 210pts.....wish it was still 180

We're running lists that function similarly, i have 2 BW w/ deff rollas running 10 nobz and gretchin in each, and a bunch of deep strike boyz. I currently run 1 dakkajet, and I tell ya it's good at clearing, but it's just not enough (i'm snakebites, largely). I'm planning on 30 dajumping boyz as a suicide mission to clear room on top of my already included dakkajet. That or I go up to three dakkajets. This has been my feeling vs imperial soup, chaos daemons, and even against an eldar list with only 15 rangers to screen (and wave serpents), 1 dakkajet isn't enough IMO.

Honestly though, I hate turn 1 jump suicides. It feels like you're just gifting them max damage output for their first turn. 3 dakkajets might clear the way by turn 3 for me to drop everything all at once and do a proper overload. Dakkajets also protect your characters at times, move block knights really well, and soak up shots for your battlewagons (and by god, those units are so good with deff rollas and a deffkilla wartrike. Like I might even take them without filling them up).

Three could even go in a flyer detachment for +1 CP and the kulture of your choice.

Sluggaloo wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:
Codex: Deep Strike works really well against opponents and the only downside I can see is it has a hard time dealing with screens. I am debating about whether or not to take a Dakkajet to help with this or rely on maybe a Jumping Shoota boyz mob that dumpz everything into screening units and charges to open a hole turn 1. Feels like a waste of 210pts.....wish it was still 180

Shootaboys might just be the best way to open up the board for you. I like how you've tried a list that's very similar to one I'm currently trying to put together myself. I too want to try BBBWs +BW rush with evilsunz deepstrike support. Only difference is I'm looking to have all my Battlewagons filled with goffs. Bonebrekers filled withx10 nobz, normal BWs filled with 20 strong Skarboyz. Evil sunz deepstrike removes all chaff, and open up the board for S5 boyz+nobz and bonebreaker S9 + mortal wounds onto high toughness vehicles. Plus the enemy can't really shoot at anything T1 other than a load of T8 vehicles that could be supported by KFF. That's the plan anyway.

I find interesting you put to use Redder armor, you're the first I've seen here that's gotten good results with it,, please elaborate.

At the minute I'm putting ogether some scrap built Mekgunz, I never ran them in the index and they seem to be strong still. I'm actually hoping that in the FAQ they'll give them clan kulturs, though I feel they might be too strong with them. Just imagine deffskullz mekguns rerolling everything....

Redder armor is just a nice niche for a Warboss in a transport. I put him in the BW to force my opponent to choose between Bone breakers that do a ton of CC damage or a regular BW with a deff Rolla, in all 3 games nobody targetted the BW, mostly because they thought "why blow up the Warboss transport when bonebreakers are shredding me". So once he gets into CC you just position him so that he is relatively close to 2+ units and you get a pretty damned good chance of rolling a 4+ to inflict mortal wounds to the enemy. It is especially glorious if you can get close to armies with HQ Batteries. Running that into a group of 3+ HQ units is just devastating.

The trick to the Codex: Deep Strike is to overload one flank with too many threats so that the enemy has to devote a lot of his good stuff to that side, than you Deep strike behind that flank and hit his rear echelon units from behind and destroy them. Than you are in a position where you control 3/4ths of the board and he is left with little to do besides plink away at T8 4+ saves until the end of the game.

I might be misunderstanding what you mean there Semper but I'm pretty sure the character with rezmekkas redder armour only deals mortal wounds while still embarked on the transport..

That relic has sort of worked for me when I used it. The extra move is always welcome but so far I've rolled 0 out of 4 on that 4+. It has some potential I guess but I'm not sold on it

PiñaColada wrote:
I might be misunderstanding what you mean there Semper but I'm pretty sure the character with rezmekkas redder armour only deals mortal wounds while still embarked on the transport..

That relic has sort of worked for me when I used it. The extra move is always welcome but so far I've rolled 0 out of 4 on that 4+. It has some potential I guess but I'm not sold on it

Yup, he stays embarked the entire time, but if they ever do destroy his transport, he hops out, feths things up and hops back into a bonebreaker

Ah, gotcha! I guess that works, I've just put it on a cheapo mek everytime

i dont know if someone has noticed this yet but...
big guns can use kultures and stratagems, since the gretchin are a separate unit and the gun itself is not gretchin, also while the grots nearby allow the gun to shoot it is still the gun that shoots. DS is the best for any squad of biggunz (except BM for lobbas). no strats are quite worth it becasue the squad still separates. grot shield for grots for another orc infantry unit. maybe throw some guns in tellyport?

while they wont have DDD they will have better shooting with either BM/DS.

something to be glad about while we still can use the index.

i added this info to the 1st post spoilers.

Isnt the FAQ supposed to drop around now?

I can seem to see a definitive on this, so I'm asking all owners of Gorka and Morkanauts. I have one about to be built and, not expert enough to magnetise. So, is there a consensus on which one is more useful this codex?

Not tournament good; just good? Either or?

 Rinkydink wrote:
I can seem to see a definitive on this, so I'm asking all owners of Gorka and Morkanauts. I have one about to be built and, not expert enough to magnetise. So, is there a consensus on which one is more useful this codex?

Not tournament good; just good? Either or?

Mork is pretty Meh. Gork has a niche.

So I played a couple of games tonight with 2 different 1000 point lists. Nothing hyper competitive, just a mix of units because I wanted to try out the strategies and kultures so I also kept the lists mono kukture for simplicity.
First up Evil Sunz vs Death guard, this did not go well.



As we were both practising with "new" armies, we went for a nice simple Annihilation game. (p191)

I was moderately confident about this, however I underestimated what a pain it is when your opponent puts all his troops in buildings and leaves no space for a charge. That and disgustingly resilient is awful. Long story short, even though I screened perfectly to counter charge his demon prince with both zhardsnark and my wartike, even getting mortal wounds to hit with zhardsnark and ramming speed with the trike, he managed to tank all my shooting, and charges from the trike, even though it was buffed with fists of Gork. He then proceeded to kill both my characters, whilst we could only chip the odd wound off here and there.

The buggies also plinked off wounds here and there before being pretty much shot off the board by the blight hauler one at a time. The 24" range on the rokkit kannon puts you right into range of their weapons, and he just got off some lucky damage.

Victory went to DG, they juse got some lucky kills, and their resilience is just incredible, they soaked up so much punishment. Lesson learnt, never get into combat with a demon prince of Nurgle, it's just depressing.

Minor victory for DG.

Game 2 was very, very different.

Deathskulls Vs Ultramarines



My opponent apologised for how much he had tailored the list to take on Orkz, but was singing a very different song after turn 1.

All the Boyz and one Mek went into a truck each, and hid behind buildings out the way except for one which my opponent ignored. He killed 2 smasha guns turn1 and plinked 1 wound on the third.
My SAG, remaining smasha kannons, kMb on my ma big mek and 2 trucks of Boyz with kmb meks then annihilated his predator, and a razorback whilst knocking wounds off another one. My third trukk wiped the second wounded razorback, Tokyo drifted into the third razorback and disembarked marines, and chucked 3 mortal wounds into them with ramming speed.

By turn 2 there were no marines left on the table at all.

Deathskulls re-rolls to hit, wound and damage are brutal when combined with KMB and rokkits.

The combination of a truck, with rokkit with all the re-rolls and 3 flat damage, with a rokkit boy with re-rolls and 3 flat damage plus tankbusta bomb, and a KMB mek with re-rolls and d6 rerollabale damage means that this troop and elite choice becomes a mini-tankbusta unit, no strategems needed. Plus 20 shoota shots for chaff clearance. For a total of 204pts, for trukk, mek and boyz it was obscenely good.

I had 3 of them. It created quite a stir. The amount of re-rollable d6 damage felt almost broken. Even the SAG was excellent, especially combined with dakka dakka. I finished the game with nearly all my cp left, I barely used them. My first opponent said he was glad he didn't face this list in our game, as he was sure that it would have tabled him too. Seeing how it performed, I'm inclined to agree.

Major victory for Orks

Meks with Deathskulls and a kmb for 31 points are absolutely amazing, especially that even with re-rolls, if you do get a natural 1 and reroll another 1 it's only a mortal wound, you have 2 more to go and you're not slain. My only doubt is that in order to take a kmb, it's an index option and the index damage is d3, not d6 as in the codex.

Is it correct to be able to take index options for war gear, but use the codex statline?

 r_squared wrote:
Long story short, even though I screened perfectly to counter charge his demon prince with both zhardsnark and my wartike, even getting mortal wounds to hit with zhardsnark and ramming speed with the trike, he managed to tank all my shooting, and charges from the trike, even though it was buffed with fists of Gork. He then proceeded to kill both my characters, whilst we could only chip the odd wound off here and there

ooh yeah, death guard nurgle daemon princes are no joke!..."the suppurating plate" for 2+ armour, which on a 4+ hits back with a MW if you save a wound with it...or failing that, 5++...then 5+++ (4+++ with "revoltingly resilient" WLT)...though I generally run mine with "tainted regeneration" WLT, to regain a lost wound at the start of each player turn - that, on top of the 2+/5++, and 5+++ is just filth ...course, with double talons, he's also got 7 S7, AP-2, D2 melee attacks too...and a 12" move with wings...just nasty...all that for 180 too...which now just makes me sad about ghaz, thinking about it...

 r_squared wrote:

My only doubt is that in order to take a kmb, it's an index option and the index damage is d3, not d6 as in the codex.

Is it correct to be able to take index options for war gear, but use the codex statline?

You use the new stats and new costs, if any. Only the option to take them is kept from the index.

Anything with a killcannon got better, too, just for another example.

 r_squared wrote:

3x Truck, Rokkit launcha

Not in the codex anymore. Presumably you were taking the index option? That would be a pretty sweet Deffskull trukk, but do index armaments allow kultures?

Few questions:

- Are trukks cheap enough now to transport normal boyz?
- Nobs on bikes or warbikers?
- How do you run warbikers? Do you try to keep them away from melee, or try to tie up enemy shooty units?
- Same question for deffkoptas. Also is it better to keep them separate or run them in a squad?

 JimOnMars wrote:

 r_squared wrote:

3x Truck, Rokkit launcha

Not in the codex anymore. Presumably you were taking the index option? That would be a pretty sweet Deffskull trukk, but do index armaments allow kultures?

Wew, I've completely missed the fact that trukks can't take rokkits anymore. Not that it is a huge blow, just annoying since my only trukk was not magnetised and has a rokkit

 Dr.Duck wrote:

 Rinkydink wrote:
I can seem to see a definitive on this, so I'm asking all owners of Gorka and Morkanauts. I have one about to be built and, not expert enough to magnetise. So, is there a consensus on which one is more useful this codex?

Not tournament good; just good? Either or?

Mork is pretty Meh. Gork has a niche.

Gorkanauts are decent only by putting them into Tellyporta and using Ramming Speed when they appear, that's 4CPs and you also need something to clear the screeners since the walker's firepower may not be enough. Otherwise the gorkanaut is extremely luckluster. The morkanaut with the Bad Moons kultur is an overcosted source of KFF with some decent shooting. I'd rate both of them on the same level.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JawRippa wrote:
Few questions:
- Are trukks cheap enough now to transport normal boyz?

Yes they are. Problem with trukk boyz is that 10-12 boyz are not going to do much. If you make them Skarboyz maybe.

 JawRippa wrote:

- Nobs on bikes or warbikers?
- How do you run warbikers? Do you try to keep them away from melee, or try to tie up enemy shooty units?

Nob bikers are extremely overpriced, avoid them. Bikes can be played as min units (but for this role koptas are better) or in a single large blob: in this case invest that 1CP to give them -1 to hit.

 JawRippa wrote:

- Same question for deffkoptas. Also is it better to keep them separate or run them in a squad?

Only solo koptas. They're cheap brigade fillers and expendable unit to grab objective and harass the opponent. If Deathskulls rokkit are a great upgrade, otherwise the twin big shoota is fine enough.

Blackie, have you tried larger units of koptas? Why aren't they working well?

To those asking about index options, it's covered in the Designers Commentary Flowchart.