So what's your thoughts on the new Ork Codex ?

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**Kaiyanwang**

Pandabeer wrote:
Maybe this is the reason for the Stompa's pricetag: https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/a00l09/i_was_at_the_vigilus_weekender_and_live_reported/?st=jow39cne&sh=7dd15fae

Apparently the Orks will be able to make a Stompa their Warlord and give it a trait from a special Stompa table

Honestly? If this was supposed to be well planned, elegant design, it would have been a different datasheet, "Stompa Boss" or something.
The pricing of a model should not depend from a specific configuration occurring with a different book.

**lolman1c**

Kaiyanwang wrote:
Pandabeer wrote:
Maybe this is the reason for the Stompa's pricetag: https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/a00l09/i_was_at_the_vigilus_weekender_and_live_reported/?st=jow39cne&sh=7dd15fae

Apparently the Orks will be able to make a Stompa their Warlord and give it a trait from a special Stompa table

Honestly? If this was supposed to be well planned, elegant design, it would have been a different datasheet, "Stompa Boss" or something.
The pricing of a model should not depend from a specific configuration occurring with a different book.

oh... okay... we just have to buy another book to do this?

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Andykp wrote:
Came here to discuss the ORK codex but find an argument between competitive gamers and normal people. No mention of ORKS really. My take on the current argument, casual players do not affect the competitive scene at all but the way the competitive scene behaves has a knock on effect on the casual gamer and believe it or not competitive types, it isn’t positive. I haven’t benefited from any of the “balance” you people have have forced into the developers by using loopholes and ignoring the fluff. Because I never did that. Me and my gaming group of mates balanced each other by all wanting to have a fun game. I hardly ever have to refer to FAQs or errata because the rules work fine as are. At least now gw has matched play only rules and suggestions so we can easily avoid such things. So my comments to competitive 40k players is just leave us casual types to get on with it.

As for the ORK codex I like it. Lots of flavour and style, different clans will play as they should if you do it for effect not for min max glory. The missing units aren’t a problem as the index has it covered. Overall I’m very happy and I’m glad they waited to do it later. They really got their eye in with the character of armies after the dark eldar book. They seemed a bit cut and paste before that.

this thread is like 14 pages long now... all our codex arguments have been used up so we had to move onto the other arguments.

**Togusa**

So I'm going to try Speedfreeks with 9 Megatrakk Scrapjets. The cost seems to be the best bang for the buck from all of the buggies, though I will be bringing two Boomdakka Snazzwagons.

The plan is to shoot and charge, cars and bikes everywhere I can get them.

**Sluggaloo**

Andykp wrote:
So my comments to competitive 40k players is just leave us casual types to get on with it.

Likewise. I don't appreciate people telling me I'm ruining this game by being a competitive player. I have always had a competitive spirit which won't just die as I enter a hobby. And I bloody love orks ever since I played them as a kid in Dawn of War. Their concept is awesome and orks tend to attract people who are a laugh... what's not to love.

Sweeping statements are never nice.. I'll leave it at that.

**lolman1c**

Sluggaloo wrote:
Andykp wrote:
So my comments to competitive 40k players is just leave us casual types to get on with it.
Likewise. I don't appreciate people telling me I'm ruining this game by being a competitive player. I have always had a competitive spirit which won't just die as I enter a hobby. And I bloody love orks ever since I played them as a kid in Dawn of War. Their concept is awesome and orks tend to attract people who are a laugh... what's not to love.

Sweeping statements are never nice.. I'll leave it at that.

Get over it and toughen up pointy ears! Come on! Hit us with your best shot back! Really dig into the causal player base! It's the only way to be a true DakkaDakka member.

**Sluggaloo**

lolman1c wrote:
Sluggaloo wrote:
Andykp wrote:
So my comments to competitive 40k players is just leave us casual types to get on with it.
Likewise. I don't appreciate people telling me I'm ruining this game by being a competitive player. I have always had a competitive spirit which won't just die as I enter a hobby. And I bloody love orks ever since I played them as a kid in Dawn of War. Their concept is awesome and orks tend to attract people who are a laugh... what's not to love.

Sweeping statements are never nice.. I'll leave it at that.

Get over it and toughen up pointy ears! Come on! Hit us with your best shot back! Really dig into the causal player base! It's the only way to be a true DakkaDakka member.

Damn you Skumdreg I cant stay mad at you

**lolman1c**

Now let's all complain together about how almost 2 minths after our codex has come out it turns out that a bunch of our rules are in 2 other books we have to buy.

**Togusa**

lolman1c wrote:
Now let's all complain together about how almost 2 minths after our codex has come out it turns out that a bunch of our rules are in 2 other books we have to buy.

What are you talking about?

**Kaiyanwang**

lolman1c wrote:

oh... okay... we just have to buy another book to do this?

You buy what you want, I just think that the horrid pricing of the Stompa is due to GW clumsiness, not because the plan was to make it a warlord.

**lolman1c**

Kaiyanwang wrote:
lolman1c wrote:

oh... okay... we just have to buy another book to do this?

You buy what you want, I just think that the horrid pricing of the Stompa is due to GW clumsiness, not because the plan was to make it a warlord.

The stompa rule is just one rule. It has been revealed Orks are getting a bunch of stuff (including a blitz brigade formation) in this new book. New warlord traits, new command stratz, etc... One trait allows your battlewagon to move and bring then let your guys get out (anything in 3"of the battlewagon can move with it. That's a strat I know people are going to want).

In addition, we have chapter approved with all the new rules for the game and looted wagons. All this only a few months after our codex... GW has always added stuff in new books but normally it's a good while so we're always hungry for new stuff when it comes but this stuff feels like it should have been included in the codex. In addition, we live in a modern world now where a lot of companies are giving us this extra stuff in digital form for free.

**Geemoney**

For the record I don't give a

about the stompa; and I own two of them. The last thing I want is to have 7th edition again where the stompa was the only viable way to play.

**lolman1c**

Geemoney wrote:
For the record I don't give a about the stompa; and I own two of them. The last thing I want is to have 7th edition again where the stompa was the only viable way to play.

rumours is they're bringing back formations

(Also, i'm not joking)

**Geemoney**

I hope that is just a rumor....

**Kaiyanwang**

lolman1c wrote:
Kaiyanwang wrote:
lolman1c wrote:

oh... okay... we just have to buy another book to do this?

You buy what you want, I just think that the horrid pricing of the Stompa is due to GW clumsiness, not because the plan was to make it a warlord.

The stompa rule is just one rule. It has been revealed Orks are getting a bunch of stuff (including a blitz brigade formation) in this new book. New warlord traits, new command stratz, etc... One trait allows your battlewagon to move and bring then let your guys get out (anything in 3"of the battlewagon can move with it. That's a strat I know people are going to want).

In addition, we have chapter approved with all the new rules for the game and looted wagons. All this only a few months after our codex... GW has always added stuff in new books but normally it's a good while so we're always hungry for new stuff when it comes but this stuff feels like it should have been included in the codex. In addition, we live in a modern world now where a lot of companies are giving us this extra stuff in digital form for free.

I probably did not explain myself correctly. I was just saying that is very unlikely that the high price of the stompa was "planned" in light of the new rules. GW designers don't do that - and it this case, it's a good thing, because it would have been silly. No more, no less.

**lolman1c**

Spoiler:

yeah, we know that. Pricing stuff with the context of future books half you fan base might buy is silly, even for GW. I'm just saying how i would have loved for a warboss battlewagon in the codex as it really fits my armies lore. I mean i was going to buy the book anyway for my narrative campaigns but now I'm going to buy it with a little part of me upset.

**whembly**

Geemoney wrote:
For the record I don't give a about the stompa; and I own two of them. The last thing I want is to have 7th edition again where the stompa was the only viable way to play.

I dunno man...

A warlord Stompa with a decent trait might do it for me. Just curious if a kultur specific trait would be allowed.

Can anyone say, a Bad Moon Stompa with that 4+ inv trait? That'd be just almost broken.

**Blackie**

In 7th edition it was viable only because it had a discounted version. Now even with the buffs and new rules it's always going to cost 920 points which is half the budget of a 2000 points list. The codex also gave us a lot of viable ways to go so even if we get a super buffed stompa it wouldn't be the only viable way to play. In fact I think also in 7th it wasn't.

A bad moon stompa with 4+ invlun wouldn't be broken because it's still 920 points. Hitting on 5s and with the main weapon that could be out of ammo very soon. For the same budget you can get tons of shooting from other units, way more firepower than the stompa. In a knight based meta anti tank is usually overconsidered and even with a 4++ it's a single dude that degrades.

Maybe if it gets super buffed it could be useful in bigger games like 3000 points ones, but at 2000 points or even lower games I don't think it will never be viable at all with that price tag.

**An Actual Englishman**

Yea I'm struggling to see any warlord trait that's going to make the Stompa worth its 200-300 pt overcosting.

The rumour is that the warlord traits for the Stomps are separate, so I wouldn't expect to see the bad moons 4++, or any of the other 'standard' traits available.

The Blitz brigade doesn't look that good to me either from the rumours. 3 CP to make Gunwagons slightly better (they are by far the worst of the battlewagons) and to provide a stratagem that allows units not embarked move with a Battlewagon (but they are unable to charge). Seems like a waste of CP to me.

If there is something else I've missed it might be somewhat useful but as it is it's a strong pass from me.

**the_scotsman**

An Actual Englishman wrote:
Yea I'm struggling to see any warlord trait that's going to make the Stompa worth its 200-300 pt overcosting.

The rumour is that the warlord traits for the Stomps are separate, so I wouldn't expect to see the bad moons 4++, or any of the other 'standard' traits available.

The Blitz brigade doesn't look that good to me either from the rumours. 3 CP to make Gunwagons slightly better (they are by far the worst of the battlewagons) and to provide a stratagem that allows units not embarked move with a Battlewagon (but they are unable to charge). Seems like a waste of CP to me.

If there is something else I've missed it might be somewhat useful but as it is it's a strong pass from me.

nah, I think we can say without any kind of difficulty that because the IK warlord trait table is like:

-Knight gains a 2++ invuln
-Knight rerolls all the dice
-Knight can move twice in a battle round and charge
-Knight can get up with full HP

and it costs them 1cp to make a knight a character and take a WL trait, the stompa trait table will cost 10cp and will be like:

-The stompa can reroll advance dice
-The stompa can reroll a hit die, wound die or save die, once per game
-The stompa can exchange its attacks in melee for a single attack with double strength

**Daedalus81**

lolman1c wrote:
Now let's all complain together about how almost 2 minths after our codex has come out it turns out that a bunch of our rules are in 2 other books we have to buy.

Assuming that it's not stuff just for Vigilus campaigns.

**lolman1c**

An Actual Englishman wrote:
Yea I'm struggling to see any warlord trait that's going to make the Stompa worth its 200-300 pt overcosting.

The rumour is that the warlord traits for the Stomps are separate, so I wouldn't expect to see the bad moons 4++, or any of the other 'standard' traits available.

The Blitz brigade doesn't look that good to me either from the rumours. 3 CP to make Gunwagons slightly better (they are by far the worst of the battlewagons) and to provide a stratagem that allows units not embarked move with a Battlewagon (but they are unable to charge). Seems like a waste of CP to me.

If there is something else I've missed it might be somewhat useful but as it is it's a strong pass from me.

New warlord trait - Stompa is now 13pts each

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Daedalus81 wrote:
lolman1c wrote:
Now let's all complain together about how almost 2 minths after our codex has come out it turns out that a bunch of our rules are in 2 other books we have to buy.

Assuming that it's not stuff just for Vigilus campaigns.

Only time will tell

**SemperMortis**

An Actual Englishman wrote:
Yea I'm struggling to see any warlord trait that's going to make the Stompa worth its 200-300 pt overcosting.

The rumour is that the warlord traits for the Stomps are separate, so I wouldn't expect to see the bad moons 4++, or any of the other 'standard' traits available.

The Blitz brigade doesn't look that good to me either from the rumours. 3 CP to make Gunwagons slightly better (they are by far the worst of the battlewagons) and to provide a stratagem that allows units not embarked move with a Battlewagon (but they are unable to charge). Seems like a waste of CP to me.

If there is something else I've missed it might be somewhat useful but as it is it's a strong pass from me.

Sums it up pretty well. I do think the Bad Moonz would make a stompa a lot better though. The inherent 4++ would be a huge help to fixing the fact that it isn't durable and the added bonus of Dakkax3 AND having rerolling 1s as well as the shoot twice strat would make it a 1st turn destroyer of worlds.....but it would be CP hungry like no other.

Imagine having Dakkax3 on 5s, shoot twice, rerolling 1s and all those gunz. You could shoot 4 times in one turn with the Supa Gattler and that should mulch a few opponents.

But all of that brings me back to my biggest problem with the Ork codex and these supplements as well. None of our units can really function without Klan Tactics and stratagems. I really don't see Gorkanautz being taken except as Deep strike turn 2 with 3D6 charge. Same thing with Lootas, either you castle them up and give them shoot twice every turn or you can basically ignore them as in previous editions, ohh and they require grot shields to last more than a turn. Tankbustas might be the only exception to this rule and that is because they get complete rerolls vs vehicles with a flat 3 damage.

**Blackie**

SemperMortis wrote:

Tankbustas might be the only exception to this rule and that is because they get complete rerolls vs vehicles with a flat 3 damage.

Tankbustas, warbosses and weirdboyz are probably the only units that are good no matter what kultur you choose for them. Sure tankbustas that shoot twice perform better than standard ones, but they can do a lot of work even staying the entire game in a transport until the trukk dies sacrificing some offensive output in order to gain survivability. In fact I've played a lot with bad moons bustas: 2x10 in trukks, one unit disembarks and shoots twice, the other one remains in the vehicle and fires normally. Even without the stratagems 170 points of bustas will get 5-6 hits against a vehicle, a couple more with bomb squigs.

Also gretchins and mek gunz of course but they don't get the kultur bonus anyway.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

SemperMortis wrote:

Sums it up pretty well. I do think the Bad Moonz would make a stompa a lot better though. The inherent 4++ would be a huge help to fixing the fact that it isn't durable and the added bonus of Dakkax3 AND having rerolling 1s as well as the shoot twice strat would make it a 1st turn destroyer of worlds.....but it would be CP hungry like no other.

Imagine having Dakkax3 on 5s, shoot twice, rerolling 1s and all those gunz. You could shoot 4 times in one turn with the Supa Gattler and that should mulch a few opponents.

Yeah, the 25 lootas combo can eat 5 CPs per turn but it's suited for a triple battallion so investing that many CPs on 2-3 turns of shooting is not a problem. But if you field a 920 points single dude it's hard to get that many CPs and a viable list so dumping 4 CPs per turn on it would be a huge investment.

**r_squared**

SemperMortis wrote:
...But all of that brings me back to my biggest problem with the Ork codex and these supplements as well. None of our units can really function without Klan Tactics and stratagems...

The simple answer to that complaint is that we do have strategems and klan kultures. They are an inherent and integral part of the game now. You may as well complain that ork Boyz are useless without WS.

**Lazzamore**

Has anyone else noticed that Flash Gitz are now useful? Now bearing in mind that I am a fairly casual gamer, and Flash Gitz are my favorite unit (for reasons other than effectiveness; Great sculpts/fluff), though I have found them to be fairly decent at killing things with the damage buff to their guns.

**Trimarius**

Lazzamore wrote:
Has anyone else noticed that Flash Gitz are now useful? Now bearing in mind that I am a fairly casual gamer, and Flash Gitz are my favorite unit (for reasons other than effectiveness; Great sculpts/fluff), though I have found them to be fairly decent at killing things with the damage buff to their guns.

Yeah, Flash Gitz are perfectly usable now. Dramatically increasing their armor save and the stopping power of their guns really helped.

Like a lot of the mid-range weapons, though, they suffer a bit from being too expensive to efficiently clear chaff while being too weak to crack armor as handily as tankbustas. They really want to tackle elite infantry and light vehicles, but that's not quite as common a need. They're better than lootas in almost all cases (if you aren't running the loota bomb) and get into mek gun territory when shooting at buffed invul knights, for example, though, so it's not like they're bad.

I'd say go with them if you like them, just remember to always go for min units (to max out on BS3+ Kaptains and ammo grot rerolls) if you can.

**lord_blackfang**

I wish they hadn't been flanderized into Freebootas, I'd happily use them if they could be Bad Moonz.