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I can definitely say first pass wasn't amazing. There's a few models from the first kickstarter that never hit production because of how lousy they turned out.
That said, I have the previous kickstarter and the minis are fine for anything short of show pieces, and look forward to seeing how some of the black pieces come out. If it's the same material as the blacksun power armored dudes it should be pretty good, honestly thought that was standard plastic.
I don't recall the names of the characters. As I just bought them on a whim for £2.50 each.
I had an elven archer permanently leaning back a good 20 degrees that I was forced to replace the bow on.
I had a sorceress. Probably elven who had a sword bent back on itself a full 180 curve.
A daemon devil sorceress with a staff made from a spine which needed replacing with brass rod as it was warped and twisted.
A daemon girl with two daggers with so much flash it was impossible to clean.
And a Rogue stepping off a rock that needed both swords replacing with plastics and the face was just a blob.
In general I found the flash and mould lines extremely difficult to clean and in some cases so much and so thick damage was unavoidable.
The bent pieces I tried fixing with hot water and fridge.
Boiling water and fridge.
Boiling water and freezer.
Boiling water and room temperature.
But none of the twisting and bending was ever more than 25% repaired.
The inability to prime was...odd.
I tried painting without primer and paint flaked off.
I primed them just in case and paint still flaked off.
I had some success washing with Agrax and then priming...
But at this point I'd had the models for 2 or 3 weeks and only got the bare basics done on one model.
I picked up a metal Astrid (it was in the painting section but gathered zero interest so thread was deleted). Painted her in one evening.
Loved it.
Tossed the bones crap away.
Priming was odd, though there are several reaper paints, including their primer, that actually worked quite well but this was info you didn't know unless you hung around the forums.
Moldlines were the worst part about white bones as they just got fuzzy and harder to remove if you tired to clean them. Really turned me off to PVC plastics and restic (as around that time people had a real hate for them as well) in the past two years though I've come to really like both just not Bones as everyone else were better then what Reaper was putting out. Outside of small outfits I like to support, like Redbox, i'll rarely touch metal anymore. Horrible material for something you actually want to play with.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/01/03 19:45:20
Did you wash them before painting? I've found that if you don't, they chip like crazy, but if they're well washed they hold on pretty well.
I did find you had to do some rebends with mine (Bones 3) but only ended up with one or two who were doing crazy leans.
I must admit I trolled their forums pretty hard in the months before my kickstarter was delivered, specifically because I heard that Bones would not respond to your normal painting techniques. Then too, I will never be more than a tabletop quality painter at my best, so I wasn't too concerned about the lack of hard details. If you're an awesome painter, I'd definitely stick to metals or boutique plastic.
Klawz-Ramming is a subset of citrus fruit?
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I admire your aplomb and instate you as Baron of the Seas and Lord Marshall of Privateers.
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Bones 1 had a lot of, well, trash quality human and smaller figures. Each subsequent KSer they got better, even tweaking their PVC formula some as there's no way Bones 1 and Bones 3 are the same material, but the white bones still has lots of flaws.
I think the Bones 1 quality really hurt them with a lot of people but you can fine some really nicely painted bones from pros -- they're just all very large figures that don't fall prone to most of the PVC Reaper used weaknesses.
I'm glad Reaper is wanting to improve as them staying successful is a plus for the miniature hobby as no one else does the scale of production they do with most of their stuff not being really for one game or another. But other manufacturers like Wizkids, CMoN and Monolith have really left them behind in quality.
Well, my thoughts about Reaper, CMON, Monollith, etc. is that they don't all make the same sculpts (or games!), so I'll pick up whichever company offers a sculpt I don't have at a reasonable price. I'm also an advanced tabletop painter who paints for gaming, so a good sculpt for a figure I need for a game is preferable over one that's higher quality but whose sculpt doesn't match. I'm kind of tired of using an ogre miniature when the scenario calls for a minotaur!
Still, I'm currently painting Tiny Furniture's resin miniatures, and will agree that metal and resin can blow away plastic. But resin and metal are more expensive, and I "need" a wide variety of miniatures for all sorts of gaming, so couldn't afford everything that I have in plastic in metal or resin. OTOH, If you're in the hobby to paint only a few figures, either for display or for your RPG character, then it's probably worthwhile to just buy a few miniatures, of higher quality.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: I would concede CMON and Monolith surpassing them in detail (especially at regular human folk scale), but Wizkidsd?
I dunno about that one...some have been just as bad, if not worse, than some of those early Bones in terms of details folding in on each other.
I don't have much of Wizkids D&D but I do have a gnome druid and some rat swarms on my desk and both of these blow anything reaper has ever put into bones at that size out of the water. If you're talking about a different line, like Clix, then maybe. I haven't followed those in years but they were never impressive but that isn't the point of those figures.
I'm curious to see the side by side comparisons of the black vs white reaper bones once they hit the store shelves. I tend not to trust the cherry picked promo pics as even crappy kickstarted PVC products from 5 years ago looked good in those.
We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
On prepping Bones - wash with dish soap and water - using an old toothbrush.
When cleaning mold lines and flash off - use the edge of a sharp hobby knife, and slice, not scrape the lines off.
I never had any problem resetting using hot water, so I have no idea what went wrong with Valentine's attempts.
All pretty much standard for any vinyl modeling.
The blobbiness... yeah, some of the early Bones are... less than stellar.
That said, I have hopes that Reaper can at least match, or nearly match, that of WizKids Deep Cuts line. (Extremely happy with the Deep Cuts and Nolzur's lines.)
The Auld Grump
Kilkrazy wrote:When I was a young boy all my wargames were narratively based because I played with my toy soldiers and vehicles without the use of any rules.
The reason I bought rules and became a real wargamer was because I wanted a properly thought out structure to govern the action instead of just making things up as I went along.
Thanks folks - about to paint my first Bones figure, so the feedback is much appreciated...
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2019/01/08 04:20:59
Subject: Re:Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Miniature of the Month
Got mine in today, so first impressions and a few pictures. I'm uploading straight from my phone so the pick dump will be at the end.
This new material is hard. There is virtually no flex at all, and it feels about like some resins I've worked with. He is all one piece, but with a separate sculpted base, so rather excited about that.
The color is darker that the previous 'grey' bones, which really shows off the fine detail in the feathers. In the second pic are Kord, in white bonsium, and part of kyphrixis in grey
Lastly he is a great intimidating size to face down your adventurers. Or Sir Forscale in a pinch.
Corsair:
No, it is not that easy to cut. This is a tough, hard material. Think more along the lines of an ABS plastic, I bounced this thing around and it is very tough, it will stand up to transport and use. I am thrilled that I found out new CAVs will be made from this. The few lines that needed to be trimmed were easily cut with a sharp Xacto knife.
CorallineAlgae:
Just got my order in! This new material is shockingly firm, :: and looks to have metal mini level detail. The mold lines are very minor and in easy places to remove, like along the ends of the arm feathers, the outside edges of the feet, across the brow of the face and up the ears. I haven't tried removing them yet, but with such a hard plastic it should be night and day easier than soft bones models. Most of them would be hard to notice on a painted figure without removing them at all. Like the others have said, I do with the left arm wasn't glued on at the factory. It's gonna be hard to get in there with a brush.
Overall, the new plastic looks even better than I had hoped. We're gonna need way more than one chunky figure to know what to expect from Bones Black. Cannot wait to see some BoBla characters minis. I already have quite a few of the Bones IV expansion minis in metal. Looking forward to priming them all up grey and comparing the figures side by side.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/01/08 04:24:30
The new material looks quite good. I wonder if it's some variation of Trollforge restic?
I really wish they'd made us aware they were changing the mix for Bones 4... I would have actually added stuff to the pledge manager. As is I kicked in a buck to see the show, but I'd had my fill trying to wrangle decent paint jobs on man sized Bones figures where I couldnt even tell what half the detail was.
2019/01/08 16:29:03
Subject: Re:Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
Looks like Reaper UK/EU have "sold out" of the free Bones Black Owlbear for now - have tweeted a query to Reaper to see what that means for orders which would qualify which are placed before the restock arrives.
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Kanluwen wrote: This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote: You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
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2019/01/23 20:10:13
Subject: Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
They have a video on youtube showing them primed with lots of different primers like Army Painter as well as Krylon. So basically they haven't found one that it doesn't take.
2019/01/23 23:56:25
Subject: Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
Comparison video of the Bones Black Owlbear vs the WizKids Nolzur's Owlbear -
The Auld Grump
Kilkrazy wrote:When I was a young boy all my wargames were narratively based because I played with my toy soldiers and vehicles without the use of any rules.
The reason I bought rules and became a real wargamer was because I wanted a properly thought out structure to govern the action instead of just making things up as I went along.
2019/01/23 23:57:00
Subject: Re:Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
Dunno yet about black bones, but here're some threads about Bones and spray primer. My guess is that the solvent in the spray primer is causing problems.
You can paint (including air brush) directly on Bones (white) plastic, although the plastic is hydrophobic. Brown liner is commonly recommended.
I'm a bit disappointed with the fact that they're made in China. I thought the regular bones line was made in the US. I don't have anything against Chinese manufacture (I'd be stuck buying nothing but lego figs and posting this from a 486 desktop if I did!) but it was a small plus that they were manufactured in the US (assuming I'm recalling that correctly).
We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
2019/01/24 03:08:15
Subject: Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
They have a machine, named Thomas as it looks like a certain engine, for making bones in the US but their production volume is so high they can't keep up with the single machine they do have so a large volume is still made in china but there are many that are produced in the US.
2019/01/25 00:39:17
Subject: Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
Stick with (and pay for) metal and resin if you want MADE IN USA. Even then, check where the manufacturing is done. I do think I've seen plastic manufacturers in the USA, but that's only been a handful of times.
IIRC, Reaper casts plastic bases in USA, so you're good to go if you have an invisible army.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/01/25 00:40:22
fwiw, A common comment about Bones is that it's good for large figures -- including by making them affordable -- while not as good for smaller ones. IIRC, Reaper said that a metal version of a Bones hill giant would cost $30 in metal. Yeah, I'm not paying that!
Even with CMONs PVC the bigger stuff is better than the little stuff, so i'm sure that will be the case here too,
so give away bigger stuff that make the material look better (and it clearly is, not to put it down unnecessarily) and because people are more likely to put in an order to get a 'free' big monster than a random small sculpt
2019/01/26 02:47:42
Subject: Re:Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
While I don't tend to bother with Bones infantry sized figures, their big beasties are superb in the material --- Black looks like it could be even better.
2019/01/26 03:58:41
Subject: Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear
I really wish Reaper would either not texture their bases or make the sculpted texture a circle. The jagged/random shape of textured base is the worst of both worlds. You still have to use basing material and it is difficult to blend in the random texture shape, and you still have to purchase another base for the miniature!
2019/01/26 05:11:02
Subject: Reaper 2019 News: Bones Black and Free Bones Black Miniature of the Month: Owlbear