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Hey all

Been playing a game of 40k today, and whilst reading the rules for close combat, as you do, a couple of things occurred to me -

1. There is nothing that states your opponent gets to attack back in melee during your turn, only overwatch. So you would charge, they would overwatch, you would then conduct your melee attacks and that's it, your opponent has to wait until it's his turn to do his melee attack(s)?
2. There is nothing that states that you cannot withdraw from combat, there is also nothing that states that you can?
3. Same thing but for vehicles, I might be wrong, but I vaguely recall reading something related to this for vehicles, but I might be mistaken?
4. There is nothing that states you cannot shoot into melee combat, unless I'm overlooking a rule elsewhere?
5. There is nothing that states you cannot shoot out of melee combat, for example a dreadnought shooting at a unit x inches away whilst he bashes a chaplain on the head?


Am I wrong on all of that, or have I overlooked a rule or rules elsewhere in the core rules (page numbers would be helpful if I have) other than the close combat pages?

Thanks in advance.

Yeah, wrong on all of that. Reread all the pages of the rules and you'll very quickly find the answers to all those questions. Units within an inch can attack, the rules on movement describe falling back to leave combat, and the rules on shooting say you can't target units within 1 inch of enemy units.

Rob Lee wrote:
Hey all

Been playing a game of 40k today, and whilst reading the rules for close combat, as you do, a couple of things occurred to me -

1. There is nothing that states your opponent gets to attack back in melee during your turn, only overwatch. So you would charge, they would overwatch, you would then conduct your melee attacks and that's it, your opponent has to wait until it's his turn to do his melee attack(s)?
2. There is nothing that states that you cannot withdraw from combat, there is also nothing that states that you can?
3. Same thing but for vehicles, I might be wrong, but I vaguely recall reading something related to this for vehicles, but I might be mistaken?
4. There is nothing that states you cannot shoot into melee combat, unless I'm overlooking a rule elsewhere?
5. There is nothing that states you cannot shoot out of melee combat, for example a dreadnought shooting at a unit x inches away whilst he bashes a chaplain on the head?


Am I wrong on all of that, or have I overlooked a rule or rules elsewhere in the core rules (page numbers would be helpful if I have) other than the close combat pages?

Thanks in advance.

Yeah, that's all totally wrong. "It doesn't say I can't" is not a valid argument. Re-read the core rules, especially the ones regarding the fight phase.

Here are the specific things you want:
1. BRB Page 182, "1. Choose Unit to Fight With", Sentence 2.
2. BRB Page 177, "Falling Back", Sentence 1.
3. BRB Page 177, "Falling Back", Sentence 1.
4. BRB Page 179, "2. Choose Targets", Paragraph 2, Sentence 1.
5. BRB Page 179, "1. Choose Unit to Shoot With", Sentence 2.

Thanks. Had a feeling I had that all wrong. Both myself and my gaming buddy have had a "hard of reading and comprehending" day today. Luckily we didn't query the rules whilst playing the game!

I have to tell you guys that it is possible to shoot into melee combat, some units have guns that allow them to target enemy models who are within 1" of friendly models. And that its possible to shoot out of melee combat, if the model has a pistol, and another enemy model is closer. But in general, you cant shoot into melee combat, and out of melee combat.

 p5freak wrote:
I have to tell you guys that it is possible to shoot into melee combat, some units have guns that allow them to target enemy models who are within 1" of friendly models. And that its possible to shoot out of melee combat, if the model has a pistol, and another enemy model is closer. But in general, you cant shoot into melee combat, and out of melee combat.

Yes, but the "unless a special rule says otherwise" is implicit to any post regarding the CORE rules.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 p5freak wrote:
I have to tell you guys that it is possible to shoot into melee combat, some units have guns that allow them to target enemy models who are within 1" of friendly models. And that its possible to shoot out of melee combat, if the model has a pistol, and another enemy model is closer. But in general, you cant shoot into melee combat, and out of melee combat.

Yes, but the "unless a special rule says otherwise" is implicit to any post regarding the CORE rules.

Wait, what?

BCB is simply saying that any general rule may potentially be overturned by a specific rule if it tells you to.

A game rule "always do X", for instance, wouldn't apply in an instance where a unit had a rule "don't do X".

It's such a basic tenant of interpreting the rules that it doesn't generally need stating explicitly.

Indeed. It’s frustrating when there’s a simple answer to a simple question and someone parachutes in with “BUT NOT IF YOU USE THIS SPECIAL RULE IN THIS SITUATION!” Like great, change the situation and you change the answer... obviously... have a brain medal.

The shooting out of melee pistol rule is not a special rule. Its all in the core rules. The other weapon shooting into melee from the outside is a special rule, not found in the core rules.

 p5freak wrote:
The shooting out of melee pistol rule is not a special rule. Its all in the core rules. The other weapon shooting into melee from the outside is a special rule, not found in the core rules.

If it's an exception to the normal rules, I'd call it a special rule

That said, it can be useful to point out exceptions, depending on the context.

"I could have sworn it worked that way!"
"It doesn't, but you might be thinking of XYZ special rule."

It also bears mentioning that "being in combat" isn't really a thing like it used to be (in 7th). The term through out the rules texts is 'being within 1" of an enemy model' , so the relevant rules would be worded 'shooting at an enemy that is within 1" of .. etc..'