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Hi all,

Hoping someone can help clear up the rules for the Tide of Traitors stratagem. I've scoured a number of sources and can't seem to find anything!

My opponent cast The Horror (-1 to hit rolls) on to one of my units of Cultists, then at the end of my subsequent movement phase, I use Tide of Traitors to remove them and set them up again as a full strength unit.

When I then selected them to shoot in the shooting phase, my opponent was adamant that they should still have The Horror applied to them, however my argument was that because they've been removed, the psychic de-buff should have been removed as well.
I ended up just keeping The Horror on them to avoid any more arguments, but would like some clarification for future use.

For reference, the exact wording of Tide of Traitors is:

"Use this Stratagem at the end of your Movement phase. If you do, pick a unit of Chaos Cultists and remove it from the battlefield. You can then set it up again wholly within 6" of the edge of the battlefield and more than 9" from any enemy models, at its full starting strength"

Thanks
cmd-

We're in a bit of a weird place, waiting for GW to respond. Their own FAQ says that when a unit leaves and re-enters the battlefield, then any "persistent effects" on that unit end. However, this interpretation opens up a huge can of worms.

Q: If you use a Stratagem to remove a model from the battlefield and set it up again, does the model retain any persistent effects (for example, a bonus to one of its characteristics as a result of an ability)?

A: No.

Source: https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/warhammer_40000_rulebook_en.pdf


So, as of today's date, this "persistent effect" on the unit will end when you set them back up. Just keep note that, theoretically, anything that's "persistent" would also end, including your own beneficial powers and stratagems.

Thanks for the quick reply, much appreciated.

I must admit, some of GW's wordings aren't the best at times and I wasn't sure if I was just reading it my own way to get the best result for me!

In my eyes, it's technically a new unit entering the battlefield (but not technically a reinforcement) so shouldn't have any effects applied to them. Unfortunately in this case I was already hitting on 5's and this made it 6's, so safe to say I wasted 2 CP!

Also keep in mind this only applies to stratagems, and stratagems alone, that remove the unit, not anything else.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Also keep in mind this only applies to stratagems, and stratagems alone, that remove the unit, not anything else.

unless you are playing itc then it applies to everything.

Nastavious wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Also keep in mind this only applies to stratagems, and stratagems alone, that remove the unit, not anything else.

unless you are playing itc then it applies to everything.

Well if we're going to have to include all house rules when discussing rules we won't get anywhere.

Nastavious wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Also keep in mind this only applies to stratagems, and stratagems alone, that remove the unit, not anything else.

unless you are playing itc then it applies to everything.

Where's that written?