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Hey folks, I was told a thing lately that I haven't been able to confirm. Does separating Marines into combat squads require using CPs?
Thanks

 CATACLYSMUS wrote:
Hey folks, I was told a thing lately that I haven't been able to confirm. Does separating Marines into combat squads require using CPs?
Thanks

No. It's not a stratagem, it's an ability on their datasheet.

 CATACLYSMUS wrote:
Hey folks, I was told a thing lately that I haven't been able to confirm. Does separating Marines into combat squads require using CPs?
Thanks

No, it's a rule on their Datasheet, not a stratagem. There is a stratagem somewhere that allows you to combat squad AFTER the battle has started iirc.

 CATACLYSMUS wrote:
Hey folks, I was told a thing lately that I haven't been able to confirm. Does separating Marines into combat squads require using CPs?
Thanks

If done before they're deployed, it's free.
If done mid-game with a Stratagem, it costs CP.

And either way, it's rarely worth it.

Ok, clarified. Thanks!
I have another question- what makes it not worth it? I've just recently come back into the game (last played 5th), so I haven't wrapped my head around pros and cons of deployment. Is it the way the 'new' morale rules are written?

It’s more that two small squads gets an extra Sergeant for free, vs splitting one larger squad.

 CATACLYSMUS wrote:
Ok, clarified. Thanks!
I have another question- what makes it not worth it? I've just recently come back into the game (last played 5th), so I haven't wrapped my head around pros and cons of deployment. Is it the way the 'new' morale rules are written?

Two reasons:

Sgts get a free attack and higher LD. They cost the same as a regular marine. If you just took two squads you have two sgts.

Tacticals aren't very good. You generally want to take as few as possible to fill up Troop slots, if you're taking them at all (Scouts are better. Arguably so are Intercessors). 10 man squad split in two only fills 1 Troop slot. Taking two 5 man squads fills 2 Troop slots.

There's basically no reason to ever combat squad, other than for fluff/narrative.

 Stux wrote:


There's basically no reason to ever combat squad, other than for fluff/narrative.

Unless you're running Deathwatch, in which case you have several edge cases where squadding down is quite effective.

Sterling191 wrote:

 Stux wrote:


There's basically no reason to ever combat squad, other than for fluff/narrative.

Unless you're running Deathwatch, in which case you have several edge cases where squadding down is quite effective.

I don't know Deathwatch well enough to comment.

My post was primarily about Tacticals, although it broadly applies to all Codex Space Marine units with the rule.

Generally more Sgts is better, as is using more detachment slots.

 Stux wrote:

Generally more Sgts is better, as is using more detachment slots.

No disagreement, but when you can do things like push squads behind stormshields to T5, allow biker units to move into and through terrain like Infantry, or pull other mixed squad shenanigans that Deathwatch have in their arsenal, losing out on one attack isn't really an issue.

Sterling191 wrote:

 Stux wrote:

Generally more Sgts is better, as is using more detachment slots.

No disagreement, but when you can do things like push squads behind stormshields to T5, allow biker units to move into and through terrain like Infantry, or pull other mixed squad shenanigans that Deathwatch have in their arsenal, losing out on one attack isn't really an issue.

So the idea is you take a squad with like 5 regular dudes and 5 bikes, then combat squad it into one unit of regular dude and one of bikes, but the bike one still has the Infantry keyword. Is that how it works?

Sneaky!

 Stux wrote:

So the idea is you take a squad with like 5 regular dudes and 5 bikes, then combat squad it into one unit of regular dude and one of bikes, but the bike one still has the Infantry keyword. Is that how it works?

Sneaky!

Something like that. Though generally you only want three bikes. Mixed unit rules allow for squads to inherit their toughness from the majority (technically 50% and up inclusive) of models in a given unit, which leaves you with two slots to play with in a combat squad. Works for Primaris to, with Aggressors and/or Inceptors.

The component units also keep ObSec.

Actually, it is better to do 5 guys and 3 bikes with 2 vanguard vets. You then split off the 3 bikes along with 2 vanguard vets with storm shields so that the group has T5 and 3++ until the non biker vets die. The vanguard vets also allow them to fall back and shoot, hooray!

 ikeulhu wrote:
Actually, it is better to do 5 guys and 3 bikes with 2 vanguard vets. You then split off the 3 bikes along with 2 vanguard vets with storm shields so that the group has T5 and 3++ until the non biker vets die. The vanguard vets also allow them to fall back and shoot, hooray!

That is pretty disgusting. Ok I'm sold!

 Stux wrote:

 ikeulhu wrote:
Actually, it is better to do 5 guys and 3 bikes with 2 vanguard vets. You then split off the 3 bikes along with 2 vanguard vets with storm shields so that the group has T5 and 3++ until the non biker vets die. The vanguard vets also allow them to fall back and shoot, hooray!

That is pretty disgusting. Ok I'm sold!

No, the disgusting part is that those Bikers don't actually have the BIKER keyword, so can magically climb up ruins. They lose the Beta Bolter Discipline benefit for being a BIKER though, so it's give and take. Derp, already mentioned.

I do like the concept though because you're immune to morale and have a speedy and chunky unit able to lay down dakka and get up close with Thunder Hammers.