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 Nevelon wrote:
Sometimes you pay a premium for the opportunity to mount more guns. Rhinos and Razors cost the same before guns, despite the difference in capacity.

I’d bet the same is going to happen here.

The community also believes you pay a premium for transport capacity, so the likelihood that this is a wash is pretty high.

drbored wrote:

redboi wrote:
I have zero interest in using repulsors simply because I can't be hassled to fire a dozen slightly different weapon profiles for a single vehicle

This. Even Imperial Knights, fully kitted out, have fewer weapons than the Repulsor. It's such a pain to figure out all the different itty bitty forms of dakka the Repulsor has.

Many of the guns have similar profiles, which helps. All you need to do is get your range and see how many you can hit with, and roll for shots for those that need it.

The gatling cannons and HB are the same
The TLLC and lastalon as well
stormbolters and fragstorms can be done together.

Krackstorms you can’t do anything about.
The stubbers need to roll separate, but why are you putting them on a marine tank? Guard is over that way -->
Rocket pod is alone.

You can get it down to 3 profiles
HB-equivelent
Bolter-equivelent
krackstorms.

I feel it’s worth rollig the dice for the icarus rocket launcher, but not the stubbers. So I left off the “free” one of these and always upgrade the one on the tail. And when I run the repulsor with LCs, that adds another profile. But it doesn’t have to be as bad as it can be.

 Nevelon wrote:

drbored wrote:

redboi wrote:
I have zero interest in using repulsors simply because I can't be hassled to fire a dozen slightly different weapon profiles for a single vehicle

This. Even Imperial Knights, fully kitted out, have fewer weapons than the Repulsor. It's such a pain to figure out all the different itty bitty forms of dakka the Repulsor has.

Many of the guns have similar profiles, which helps. All you need to do is get your range and see how many you can hit with, and roll for shots for those that need it.

The gatling cannons and HB are the same
The TLLC and lastalon as well
stormbolters and fragstorms can be done together.

Krackstorms you can’t do anything about.
The stubbers need to roll separate, but why are you putting them on a marine tank? Guard is over that way -->
Rocket pod is alone.

You can get it down to 3 profiles
HB-equivelent
Bolter-equivelent
krackstorms.

I feel it’s worth rollig the dice for the icarus rocket launcher, but not the stubbers. So I left off the “free” one of these and always upgrade the one on the tail. And when I run the repulsor with LCs, that adds another profile. But it doesn’t have to be as bad as it can be.

Many devastator squads carry this many profiles, and there are zero complaints there, so this complaint seems like a fabricated issue.

Lemondish wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:

drbored wrote:

redboi wrote:
I have zero interest in using repulsors simply because I can't be hassled to fire a dozen slightly different weapon profiles for a single vehicle

This. Even Imperial Knights, fully kitted out, have fewer weapons than the Repulsor. It's such a pain to figure out all the different itty bitty forms of dakka the Repulsor has.

Many of the guns have similar profiles, which helps. All you need to do is get your range and see how many you can hit with, and roll for shots for those that need it.

The gatling cannons and HB are the same
The TLLC and lastalon as well
stormbolters and fragstorms can be done together.

Krackstorms you can’t do anything about.
The stubbers need to roll separate, but why are you putting them on a marine tank? Guard is over that way -->
Rocket pod is alone.

You can get it down to 3 profiles
HB-equivelent
Bolter-equivelent
krackstorms.

I feel it’s worth rollig the dice for the icarus rocket launcher, but not the stubbers. So I left off the “free” one of these and always upgrade the one on the tail. And when I run the repulsor with LCs, that adds another profile. But it doesn’t have to be as bad as it can be.

Many devastator squads carry this many profiles, and there are zero complaints there, so this complaint seems like a fabricated issue.

Not really, it's hugely different. Devastators Squads have the option to take mostly the same weapons, the Repulsor doesn't. Some people choose not to. Some people are fine with the Repulsor. That doesn't stop it being a real issue for many people.

Coupled with the fact that it is a big part of why many people simply find it to be a very ugly model.

 Stux wrote:

Spoiler:

Lemondish wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:

drbored wrote:

redboi wrote:
I have zero interest in using repulsors simply because I can't be hassled to fire a dozen slightly different weapon profiles for a single vehicle

This. Even Imperial Knights, fully kitted out, have fewer weapons than the Repulsor. It's such a pain to figure out all the different itty bitty forms of dakka the Repulsor has.

Many of the guns have similar profiles, which helps. All you need to do is get your range and see how many you can hit with, and roll for shots for those that need it.

The gatling cannons and HB are the same
The TLLC and lastalon as well
stormbolters and fragstorms can be done together.

Krackstorms you can’t do anything about.
The stubbers need to roll separate, but why are you putting them on a marine tank? Guard is over that way -->
Rocket pod is alone.

You can get it down to 3 profiles
HB-equivelent
Bolter-equivelent
krackstorms.

I feel it’s worth rollig the dice for the icarus rocket launcher, but not the stubbers. So I left off the “free” one of these and always upgrade the one on the tail. And when I run the repulsor with LCs, that adds another profile. But it doesn’t have to be as bad as it can be.

Many devastator squads carry this many profiles, and there are zero complaints there, so this complaint seems like a fabricated issue.

Not really, it's hugely different. Devastators Squads have the option to take mostly the same weapons, the Repulsor doesn't. Some people choose not to. Some people are fine with the Repulsor. That doesn't stop it being a real issue for many people.

Coupled with the fact that it is a big part of why many people simply find it to be a very ugly model.

I strongly suspect that most people think it's ugly because it's cluttered. Moving the pintle gun to a coaxial mount with the Onslaught and leave off the antennas and the random bits on the back quarter panels makes a huge difference.

(Also, why the hate for the Heavy Stubber? It's pretty much just three Bolt Rifles strapped together.)

It is cluttered. I personally left the kit off the back myself. Helps a lot.

I don’t have any rules problems with stubbers, but classically marines have never used them. Why start now? Lets take a more primitive weapon and just slap it on a state of the art tank. While there is some occasional borrowing from other imperial armies, mostly marines stick with their own gear. I can understand if it’s a primary thing, like the vindicator, but why dilute your brand/theme for a tertiary gun?

The Newman wrote:

 Stux wrote:

Spoiler:

Lemondish wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:

drbored wrote:

redboi wrote:
I have zero interest in using repulsors simply because I can't be hassled to fire a dozen slightly different weapon profiles for a single vehicle

This. Even Imperial Knights, fully kitted out, have fewer weapons than the Repulsor. It's such a pain to figure out all the different itty bitty forms of dakka the Repulsor has.

Many of the guns have similar profiles, which helps. All you need to do is get your range and see how many you can hit with, and roll for shots for those that need it.

The gatling cannons and HB are the same
The TLLC and lastalon as well
stormbolters and fragstorms can be done together.

Krackstorms you can’t do anything about.
The stubbers need to roll separate, but why are you putting them on a marine tank? Guard is over that way -->
Rocket pod is alone.

You can get it down to 3 profiles
HB-equivelent
Bolter-equivelent
krackstorms.

I feel it’s worth rollig the dice for the icarus rocket launcher, but not the stubbers. So I left off the “free” one of these and always upgrade the one on the tail. And when I run the repulsor with LCs, that adds another profile. But it doesn’t have to be as bad as it can be.

Many devastator squads carry this many profiles, and there are zero complaints there, so this complaint seems like a fabricated issue.

Not really, it's hugely different. Devastators Squads have the option to take mostly the same weapons, the Repulsor doesn't. Some people choose not to. Some people are fine with the Repulsor. That doesn't stop it being a real issue for many people.

Coupled with the fact that it is a big part of why many people simply find it to be a very ugly model.

I strongly suspect that most people think it's ugly because it's cluttered. Moving the pintle gun to a coaxial mount with the Onslaught and leave off the antennas and the random bits on the back quarter panels makes a huge difference.

(Also, why the hate for the Heavy Stubber? It's pretty much just three Bolt Rifles strapped together.)

Cluttering is part of it. It generally lacks elegance in design. Repositioning them would help, though not completely solve the issue.

Which would be fine if it was an Ork vehicle. Passable even for Guard. But for Space Marines I expect a bit more streamlining.

I like the kit on the back, that's like my favorite part of it.

I like the door guns least. The turret clutter is acceptable, since tanks generally have all kinds of crap on them, but too many like guns in hull mounts is a little odd looking.

I'm fairly confident that the repulsor was designed during 7th, just like Primaris marines in general.

Repulsor has weapons facing in every direction, some of them wouldn't even be able to fire in the last edition. But now all guns can fire from anywhere on the hull making it just a mess.

But sticking to similar profiles makes it much easier to manage. Frankly I also find it laughable that people can't/won't resolve all of its weapons

 fraser1191 wrote:
I'm fairly confident that the repulsor was designed during 7th, just like Primaris marines in general.

Repulsor has weapons facing in every direction, some of them wouldn't even be able to fire in the last edition. But now all guns can fire from anywhere on the hull making it just a mess.

But sticking to similar profiles makes it much easier to manage. Frankly I also find it laughable that people can't/won't resolve all of its weapons

agreed, Primaris make so much more sense if they where designed in 7th edition.

I just removed all the crap off the tank and just use this as a counts as repulser and a grav raider in heresy.

 Formosa wrote:
I just removed all the crap off the tank and just use this as a counts as repulser and a grav raider in heresy.

Repulsor doesn't look as bad as I thought it would with sponsons. I imagine that's inevitable.

Though as I recall from the teaser pictures we have seen of the new repulsor there will be options to reduce the amount of guns you have on the repulsor. Removing most of the turret and door guns.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/Fest2019-Sat12-Executioner2ujcsf.jpg

Seems like it drops you down to 5 guns, the pintle mount probably being optional. It could indeed be a touch cheaper and certainly easier to shoot with.

Removing storm bolters is a net gain of 4 pts, i dont see how that would help.

Also in the pic they have not been removed, they have been mounted at the rear of the turrent instead, so 7 guns minimum.

Ah you are right, there does seem to be at least one, probably 2 stormbolters mounted on the back of the turret. At first I thought they were some lights or sensors. Hopefully the icarus stubbers on the very back can be swapped out for a stormbolter too. 3 stormbolters is a lot easier to manage than the 3 stormbolters 2 krak grenades and 2 frag launchers that the regular repulsor has.

cody.d. wrote:
Ah you are right, there does seem to be at least one, probably 2 stormbolters mounted on the back of the turret. At first I thought they were some lights or sensors. Hopefully the icarus stubbers on the very back can be swapped out for a stormbolter too. 3 stormbolters is a lot easier to manage than the 3 stormbolters 2 krak grenades and 2 frag launchers that the regular repulsor has.

The stubbers are amazing - I would not remove them. I'd take as many as you can to be honest. The -1 to hit ground targets is well worth the -1 ap and range. Plus a lot of times you will be hitting on 2's with them vs jetbikes and such. -1 ap is highly valuable. Like I said before I hope this boat has the option to take 2 gatling cannons.

So something like 2 stubbers 2 HB 2 Gatling and a light gatlings + 2 storm bolters and 2 frag launchers and 2 krak launchers.13 guns LOL.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also - from that picture this new tank seems to be significantly smaller than the repulsor both shorter and thinner. That should come with a wounds reduction and point savings. If we can put these babbies on the field for under 230 points. They will be a bargain.

To my knowledge we've only seen one sprue for this vehicle so far. Looking like a portion to slip over the existing Repulsor top section and turret. Sadly I can't remember where the crewman was situated on the previous sprues but I doubt he'd get access to the lighter gatling.

cody.d. wrote:
To my knowledge we've only seen one sprue for this vehicle so far. Looking like a portion to slip over the existing Repulsor top section and turret. Sadly I can't remember where the crewman was situated on the previous sprues but I doubt he'd get access to the lighter gatling.

If they are swapping out sprues, this is the one getting switched. I’d not count on anything on it being an option for the Executioner. GW could, of course, prove us wrong, as all the parts should be compatible. But no model, no rules.

 Xenomancers wrote:

Also - from that picture this new tank seems to be significantly smaller than the repulsor both shorter and thinner. That should come with a wounds reduction and point savings. If we can put these babbies on the field for under 230 points. They will be a bargain.

Where are you getting that from? The pictures in the community article look like it's exactly the same hull as the regular Repulsor.

 Nevelon wrote:

cody.d. wrote:
To my knowledge we've only seen one sprue for this vehicle so far. Looking like a portion to slip over the existing Repulsor top section and turret. Sadly I can't remember where the crewman was situated on the previous sprues but I doubt he'd get access to the lighter gatling.

If they are swapping out sprues, this is the one getting switched. I’d not count on anything on it being an option for the Executioner. GW could, of course, prove us wrong, as all the parts should be compatible. But no model, no rules.

I really do hope to be proven wrong here, I'd love to build a dedicated tank hunter with Twin LC + Heavy Laser Destroyer.

Good eyes there, the hull-mounted twin LCs are not on the new sprue.

That's a bummer, the heavy laser destroyer is going to have to be phenomenal for the Executioner to beat out the Twin-LC + LasTalon Repulsor as an anti-tank platform, and if it doesn't then what was the point?

The Newman wrote:
Good eyes there, the hull-mounted twin LCs are not on the new sprue.

That's a bummer, the heavy laser destroyer is going to have to be phenomenal for the Executioner to beat out the Twin-LC + LasTalon Repulsor as an anti-tank platform, and if it doesn't then what was the point?

It still has an extra heavy gatling cannon for extra dakka. But yeah, there's a huge risk of this making the Executioner an overpriced allrounder.

I never use the lastalon b/c of range.

So, are we all in agreement? 350 points, can transport all Primaris troops, some elites, is basically a flying Stormlord lite? Wait, it's better, because it likely has an ++ and PoTMS, plus Repulser fields.

At this point I'm shocked the Amazon repulsor page doesn't have this is most commonly bought with these magnets.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, are we all in agreement? 350 points, can transport all Primaris troops, some elites, is basically a flying Stormlord lite? Wait, it's better, because it likely has an ++ and PoTMS, plus Repulser fields.

That's about 75 points above what I'm expecting.

Current Repulsor chassis is 185, and we know the costs of almost every single weapon except the laser destroyer. Assuming the chassis doesn't drop any points for the smaller transport capacity, this will run somewhere around 275.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, are we all in agreement? 350 points, can transport all Primaris troops, some elites, is basically a flying Stormlord lite? Wait, it's better, because it likely has an ++ and PoTMS, plus Repulser fields.

Why do you think the new super repulsor is going to have an invulnerable save when the base repulsor doesn't?

They flat-out lost a sale from me when I saw that sprue image. The fact the "tank-destroyer" Repulsor has fewer tank destroying weapons than the regular version boggles the mind.

New turret and main cannon look neat, but it also looks out of place on the Repulsor body, which I'm not a fan of to begin with.

The Executioner might have a flare shield or something, since it's more of a target. it kinda makes sense since it's more of a heavy support/assault role, like dumping a squad of Aggressors/hellblasters and sticking around to take the role of anti-tank/MC. Primaris needed a way to augment the current SM line and I think this fits the bill.

We still need the "inexpensive" (pts & $€£¥) transport. But with more armour on the field that isnt an all rounder(repulsor) but has a specific doctrine(generalterm)to use in current mixed and especially in primaris only armies. SM & Primaris rules need to be addressed (along w pts) to reflect how elite/durable they're supposed to be(rather than dying en masse).

I was considering adding another repulsor but 2 Executioners would fill the role a little better.