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It dawned on me that quite a few of the Space Marine special characters don't really live up to their backgrounds in the fluff of the game.

One of the main ones is Belial for the Dark Angels. This guy is a legendary swordsman but his rules don't really show it. You can build a better close combat commander for fewer points and I think that is stupid.

I propose that he should have a 3++ in close combat with maybe a Strategem that would allow that to be bumped to a 2++ in close combat.

 Reivax26 wrote:
It dawned on me that quite a few of the Space Marine special characters don't really live up to their backgrounds in the fluff of the game.

One of the main ones is Belial for the Dark Angels. This guy is a legendary swordsman but his rules don't really show it. You can build a better close combat commander for fewer points and I think that is stupid.

I propose that he should have a 3++ in close combat with maybe a Strategem that would allow that to be bumped to a 2++ in close combat.

That sounds like an awful idea. A 2++ is just plain not fun.

Improving his offense I could get behind, but not giving him a 3++ that can be bumped to a 2++.

Is there not an instance of Ork Boyz laying waste to a character in one of the books? I could swear I heard mention of someone of note kind of getting mooked.

Can I get such awesomeness for my Boyz, as well?

Do not bother trying to equate lore with games rules, as it will leave you disappointed. "Plot armour" does not apply on the table top.

If you want to play a fluffy campaign with a friend who is also keen on the concept, then go right ahead. Bringing the table top rules to be more in line with the fluff? Not unless they start writing fiction for each faction, otherwise cheese marines are going to be at a marked advantage.

fluff does not equal crunch and it never should.

In terms of rules for “Master Swordsmen” I’ve always liked rules that give you a free attack if your opponent rolls a 1 for an attack roll.

I find it scales better against hordes ( more chances for 1’s) then when dueling equally skilled opponents.

2++ is never fun to swing into.

 greatbigtree wrote:
In terms of rules for “Master Swordsmen” I’ve always liked rules that give you a free attack if your opponent rolls a 1 for an attack roll.

I find it scales better against hordes ( more chances for 1’s) then when dueling equally skilled opponents.

2++ is never fun to swing into.

Something I've pitched in the past is giving a relatively small number of units (mostly just special characters with truly legendary melee skills) a special rule that subtracts 1 from to-hit rolls against them unless the attacker has the same rule. The idea being that Lucius the Trickster or a Solitaire should be pretty good at parrying and dodging the attacks of the rank and file but have less plot armor against fellow legends.

He has the special rule to make them be at a negative 1 to hit him already. Maybe a stat buff with plus 1 to str or toughness?

Lukas the Trickster sits in that same bin.
He’s slow and almost guaranteed to die to shooting either on the round he arrives or the one after and his “Last Laugh” has turned into a pathetic chuckle, that’s assuming it actually goes off.
For less points you can nab a WGBL with a Jump Pack, Wolf Claw and Plasma Pistol.
If I could cough up points and buy a Jump Pack for Lukas I probably would because I love the character but at the moment a HQ beats him easily.