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2019/06/12 16:16:52
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Short version - rebels in the hills of one of the poorest countries on Earth can now build, maintain and operate bomber drones that can hit 100 miles inside Saudi Arabia.
Yeah with Iranian help but information and methods tend to proliferate.
So now just about anyone can have their own air force capable of striking soft targets (they've gone after oil pipelines and airports and shown an interest in water desalination plants) inside enemy territory. Air war used to be a rich man's game, the Taliban, the Viet Cong, the IRA didn't have air power. Tomorrow...
Houthi drone attacks in Saudi 'show new level of sophistication'
Aerial attacks on oil pipeline deep inside Saudi Arabia suggest significant leap in Houthi drone capabilities.
by Alex Gatopoulos
15 May 2019
Houthi drone attacks in Saudi 'show new level of sophistication'
Houthi drones have an almost identical build and capability as the Iranian Qasef-1, the UN says [File: Jon Gambrell/AP]
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Drone attacks on a Saudi oil pipeline west of Riyadh on Tuesday have revealed an apparent significant leap in the capabilities of the Ansar Allah fighting group, otherwise known as the Houthis.
The Aramco East-West pipeline, stretching across the country to the port and oil terminal at Yenbu, was damaged in two places as pumping stations were hit.
The attacks caused minor damage but alarmed an international community already rattled by the sharp downturn in relations between Iran and the United States.
Information on the attacks is scarce, posing more questions than providing answers.
Signs of sophistication
Drones have been increasingly used by the Houthis in operations against the Saudi-UAE-led coalition. In July 2018 a drone exploded at Abu Dhabi airport causing only minor damage but sending a message to the UAE that its economic interests were not invulnerable.
In January 2019, a senior intelligence chief, along with several officers, were killed at the al-Anad air force base just outside Aden by a weaponised drone that exploded above the delegation.
In March the Houthis released video footage of a drone flying past Saudi's al-Shuqaiq water treatment and power plant, 130km from the Yemeni border.
It was not attacked but the warning was clear, with water being a vulnerable resource and many Middle Eastern countries relying heavily on desalination plants.
How have Houthis achieved this?
Analysts are divided about the extent of the help given to the Houthis by Iran.
A UN report submitted to the UN Security Council in January 2018 found compelling evidence that locally produced drones had an almost identical build and capability as the Iranian Qasef-1 UAV, or unmanned aerial vehicle.
The remains of an Iranian Qasef-1 drone, used as a one-way attack UAV to dive on targets [Cliff Owen/AP]
This drone is GPS-guided to its target, often diving into the target to cause damage.
While the Houthis have leant heavily on Iranian help in the past, Houthi drones have increasingly used parts that are commercially available in the international market, with the conflict itself acting as a catalyst for design innovations.
Sami Hamdi, editor-in-chief of the International Interest periodical, is not surprised that drones are being used in increasing numbers.
"[The Houthis] claim they are creating their own drones, that they've learnt how to make them. Outside of the war of Yemen, for example in Iraq, we've also seen this among Kurdish forces. They too have been able to create their own drones and use them ...
"So, it is not particularly strange that we find drones among the Houthis. Let us also not forget that they are backed logistically by the Iranians who continue to provide them with expertise on how to develop some of these weapons," Hamdi added.
What is different about these drones?
This latest attack signifies a big jump in abilities as the drone flew more than 800km into Saudi Arabia to successfully attack its target.
The drone was guided using satellite technology, as beyond a certain range, drones need a satellite data link for information to be sent back to the pilot.
Who can secure shipping lines in the Gulf? (24:30)
Satellites technically allow drones to be flown from halfway around the world, as many military drones are, but they also need a second pilot station with line-of-sight access to take off and land.
The is due to the delay in satellite communications - albeit minor - which causes delays that can be fatal for a drone coming in to land.
The Iranians and Houthis have no known communications satellites and would need to rely on commercially available satellite space.
All this means that imagery analysts, communications experts, uplink engineers, two-pilot crews, armourers and mechanics all need to work in unison for an attack to succeed.
This implies increasingly sophisticated levels of training.
Why did Saudi Arabia fail to detect them?
A slow, unstealthy aircraft was able to fly for several hours deep into Saudi Arabia, and was not detected and intercepted in a time of war.
This will ring alarm bells, as retired Jordanian air force general Mamour al-Nowar told Al Jazeera.
"Their air defence system completely failed to handle such attacks" and the Houthis now have the ability "to reach Riyadh and Abu Dhabi," potentially paralysing the country "if they hit desalination water pumping stations or the [almost built] nuclear plant in Abu Dhabi".
Why this target?
Analysts are divided on whether the pipeline attack and the earlier alleged sabotage attacks against the tankers off the coast of the Emirati port of Fujairah are linked in some way.
Oil and gas economist Cornelia Meyer is emphatic that a link is tangible: "Absolutely, and what that tells me is that it's not just an isolated rebel group doing this, it's a very well-orchestrated campaign."
Hamdi is more cautious: "The circumstances of the sabotage attacks off Fujairah aren't quite clear yet. The Houthis have announced that they are the ones responsible for the Riyadh attack but as far as I'm aware no one has claimed responsibility for the act on the tankers in Fujairah."
Initial US investigation 'blames Iran for UAE ship attacks' (1:48)
The pipeline is an interesting target for several reasons; it is on the same latitude as Riyadh, which means the Saudi capital is within range.
It is also a graduated escalation, avoiding mass casualties and aiming at economic interests. While the damage was minimal, a warning was sent nevertheless.
The pipeline itself was built during the Iran-Iraq war as an alternative to Saudi Arabia should the Strait of Hormuz be closed for any reason, as was the oil terminal at the Emirati port of Fujairah.
The message sent, according to military analyst Elias Farhat, is that "it is not safe" for either the UAE or Saudi Arabia "to bypass the Strait of Hormuz".
Despite the minor damage in the attack, there is now increasing concern that, given the current tension, small acts of military violence could spark a regional conflict.
2019/06/12 16:57:25
Subject: Re:Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Shrug. The only surprise is that DIY cruise missiles aren't more of a thing. Off the shelf control hardware is good enough that the only real challenge is building a sufficiently powerful bomb for it to be with doing.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2019/06/12 18:58:58
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
It's a major change in modern warfare and the calculations that go with it.
Since WWII it's been very hard to take and hold territory as guerrilla tactics and insurgency has developed (though it usually requires an outside patron). You could bomb the heck out of a country but not really command the ground. But guerrilla war has been strictly defensive, no worries that the Viet Cong were going to attack Hawaii after winning the war.
But now rich countries can be vulnerable to the same weapons they're used to using against poor ones.
And non-state actors have access to the same.
Sept 11 was a preview, but now after 18 years of improved airline security we see a new way for small actors to have air power.
If anyone's looking I'll be in the survival bunker.
2019/06/12 19:14:56
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
There getting major support from external partners whom are supplying them with high etc gear, materials and engineering that's impossible or very difficult locally.
Dones and gear can also be broken down and assembled later, so even large items can be brought in. The viet king did that all the time. They hauled entire armies on the backs on men, mules and bikes.
It's a proxy war, Hamas, Isis to some degree, hezbollah, the rebels in Syria and far has all been by other states to there own advantage many times.
Proxy armies are a way to avoid direct actions.
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
2019/06/12 21:38:13
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
The democratization of firepower and strike capability is a real thing. Forces that in the past would be limited by their local expertise and resources, now have access to far more knowledge, material, and coordination capabilities than ever before through the internet, global trade, educational & technological advance, and vast quantities of war material left floating about by various powers for various reasons over the last hundred years.
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights! The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.
2019/06/12 21:50:10
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Kid_Kyoto wrote: But now rich countries can be vulnerable to the same weapons they're used to using against poor ones.
But they aren't the same weapons. There's a huge difference between a drone with a bomb and a modern cruise missile. The cruise missile is faster, more accurate, has better stealth features, etc. The improvised drone bomb is going to be much easier to shoot down and probably borderline worthless against military targets. And if you have a source of willing martyrs then the advantage of using a drone over a truck bomb for mass murder is questionable at best.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/12 21:50:34
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2019/06/12 22:56:59
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
It's also a technique that depends on accurate GPS data, which the civilian world only got access to since around 2000 or so thanks to Bill Clinton who stopped the military from degrating the data handed over to the public
so if it became a problem for the major satellite deploying powers they could always reduce the accuracy again (although it would mean going back to paper maps instead of satnavs and rethinking how to run the driverless cars)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/12 22:57:50
2019/06/13 11:58:46
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Mind you, now there's more than just GPS; Russia has their own system, and the EU and China are in the process of building theirs too. With a proliferation of competing systems, there's the possibility of the US degrading the public GPS signal, but everyone else moving to another system.
2019/06/13 12:20:26
Subject: Re:Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
And the inaccuracy of the GPS signal is relatively easy to fix, which is why ending it wasn't very controversial.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2019/06/13 12:42:10
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Not surprising. This is one of "the" areas of concern for major militaries. They're all struggling to find effective radars and systems to strike down drones - the smaller, the harder, obviously. Been an issue with law enforcement as well. Drones flying into airfield traffic patterns, and lots of them are used now for smuggling (though Ultralights are probably still more prevalent).
Just for example they've been used heavily in Syria and Ukraine...and I'm not talking military grade ones, just commercial ones with cell phones for observation and reconnaissance.
With the advent of smaller but still very potent drones and smaller/smarter munitions - which is easier? Send a $15 million old Su-25 with a pilot, or trainer, etc...needing a runway, fuel, repairs, etc....or send a cargo container with a half dozen expendable drones and a couple dozen bombs or guided munitions? Some drones don't use pilots, they just follow a simple GPS route and then return if possible. That's clicking a few buttons on a laptop. It's a massively easier way to provide force multiplication or capability to a low-tech, low-budget "ally".
It'll be a huge part of the future of warfare and the future of terrorism. If you can fly a cheap drone over a major metropolitan area and drop something - even something as small as a couple of hand grenades) and the local law enforcement are unable to find, detect, and destroy it? That's how you start terrorizing a local populace. God forbid you have something capable of dropping a decent bomb/explosive.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/13 18:14:12
2019/06/13 18:45:37
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
I don't know about drones and am wondering why there isn't an electronic countermeasure to them is the same way as there is to IED's with things like the DUKE system, or what ever the current equipment is called.
I read an article recently about Putin being protected by a "bubble" that messes with GPS.
The rewards of tolerance are treachery and betrayal.
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2019/06/13 20:14:51
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
warhead01 wrote: I don't know about drones and am wondering why there isn't an electronic countermeasure to them is the same way as there is to IED's with things like the DUKE system, or what ever the current equipment is called.
I read an article recently about Putin being protected by a "bubble" that messes with GPS.
That can be done to say secure the White House or a military base (probably only a few building) but not an airport much less a city. If someone wants to hit infrastructure or just inflict random casualties there's no way to jam GPS or control signals over that large an area (plus y'know, that means no one can use cell phones, GPS etc).
So it comes back to WWII style detecting and intercepting bombers. Which no one in the US has ever worried about.
There were no, ZERO, fighters available on September 11th because no one ever attacked America from the air, well not since Japanese balloon bombs in WWII.
Plus telling the difference between an armed drone and courier drone, or recreational drone or 1000 other things is a challenge. Long range drones might be treated like aircraft, require certification, flight plans etc and intercepted if someone sees a strange one. But that's already a lot of resources.
The main check on drone attacks will be explosives. Easy to find in a warzone, a bit harder in a country at peace. The stuff you can make/get might blow up a room or even a car, but if you're looking to take down a bridge you need something higher grade and a lot of it.
But yeah. Dropping some small grenades on the NY Marathon... that might be very easy.
2019/06/13 20:33:38
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
warhead01 wrote: I don't know about drones and am wondering why there isn't an electronic countermeasure to them is the same way as there is to IED's with things like the DUKE system, or what ever the current equipment is called.
I read an article recently about Putin being protected by a "bubble" that messes with GPS.
That can be done to say secure the White House or a military base (probably only a few building) but not an airport much less a city. If someone wants to hit infrastructure or just inflict random casualties there's no way to jam GPS or control signals over that large an area (plus y'know, that means no one can use cell phones, GPS etc).
So it comes back to WWII style detecting and intercepting bombers. Which no one in the US has ever worried about.
There were no, ZERO, fighters available on September 11th because no one ever attacked America from the air, well not since Japanese balloon bombs in WWII.
Plus telling the difference between an armed drone and courier drone, or recreational drone or 1000 other things is a challenge. Long range drones might be treated like aircraft, require certification, flight plans etc and intercepted if someone sees a strange one. But that's already a lot of resources.
The main check on drone attacks will be explosives. Easy to find in a warzone, a bit harder in a country at peace. The stuff you can make/get might blow up a room or even a car, but if you're looking to take down a bridge you need something higher grade and a lot of it.
But yeah. Dropping some small grenades on the NY Marathon... that might be very easy.
Not surprising. The US president has a high end comms truck with numerous arieals and so. Very likely communications and jamming gear on a high level.
The military use them to intercept Ied and mobile detonators. The ability to jam drones etc is not exactly impossible.
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
2019/06/13 21:31:50
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
warhead01 wrote: I don't know about drones and am wondering why there isn't an electronic countermeasure to them is the same way as there is to IED's with things like the DUKE system, or what ever the current equipment is called.
I read an article recently about Putin being protected by a "bubble" that messes with GPS.
There is. They're used in active warzones atm, but not much domestically. I believe they got one from Israel during the Gatwick disturbance.
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2019/06/13 22:38:06
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
warhead01 wrote: I don't know about drones and am wondering why there isn't an electronic countermeasure to them is the same way as there is to IED's with things like the DUKE system, or what ever the current equipment is called.
I read an article recently about Putin being protected by a "bubble" that messes with GPS.
There is. They're used in active warzones atm, but not much domestically. I believe they got one from Israel during the Gatwick disturbance.
Yeah remember that. Israel was one of few places who make them, and they worked. They where wondering if to equip most major UK airports with the tech of the jamming, tracking and downing gear.
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
2019/06/13 22:53:01
Subject: Re:Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Yep, the problem is that you'll almost never have enough ECM based vehicles or units to cope with a battlefield or a city full of drones. Anything that strong and potent can also interfered with all of your stuff - and likewise can cost a ton if you need to specially equip all of the "good guy stuff" to operate within its range etc.
While I don't study drones in warfare, another issue is the "glide" capability of a drone. While wind will continue to be an issue, there is likely an option for a drone to aim at something 3-4-5K away and simply be set to glide, unpowered if needed --- so if the explosive is not remote, but impact detonated it wouldn't be affected by having the power shut off. Much in the same way we can do HALO jumps from outside of a dangerous flight zone...and let special forces "fly" into the target area before popping a chute. Same thing some of the Russian bombers did in WW2 --- shutting off their loud motors and gliding over Germany's lines before firing them up after dropping bombs or scouting, etc.
Again, I don't think the genuine threat is massive materiel damages - but reconnaissance, interference, and most dangerous: "terror" or civilian complications. You could land a drone on a public school with nothing more than some fireworks and it'd make the news, rattle the school, upset the parents, etc. It's far too easy (almost easier these days given the hyperbolic nature of social media and the "story first, details later" methods of reporting things) to disturb a nation.
Causing chaos isn't expensive. Our generally soft lives in a modern Western nation mean we're even more prone to exaggeration and fear when anything remotely dangerous occurs. It's the cost of having such a good life.
Imagine a handful of drone attacks on public schools, even resulting in no fatalities. What state can afford actual countermeasures or protection against this for all of their public schools? Not one. But the outcry would be there. God forbid a student or teacher (or more) were actually hurt. You can basically instill a dread in all the parents in the country with a handful of actions.
Major airliners are still at risk for bird strikes to engines (a couple crashes a year, often with a large number of fatalities). Surely the tech and software is around to pilot a small swarm of relatively cheap drones into the path of a departing airliner or one on approach (namely where they have little option to avoid). There are heaps of dangerous uses for drones - it's the start of a new era.
2019/06/13 23:02:16
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Drones of any size can be weaponized.
Homemade explosives are also relatively easy to make.
It is good enough for Terror and asymetric warfare.
For conventional it might also be used, application might be as aimed Cluster bomb like swarm, etc.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
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2019/06/13 23:05:05
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
If I was running a hostile intelligence service I'd be brainstorming these ideas constantly. And writing up long how-to guides and putting them everywhere.
There are enough crazy folks and organized extremists out there who'd go out and use them on the US, Europe or other countries without ever having to connect with them.
(Presumably my country would have their crazies and extremists locked down)
2019/06/14 02:46:36
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
warhead01 wrote: I don't know about drones and am wondering why there isn't an electronic countermeasure to them is the same way as there is to IED's with things like the DUKE system, or what ever the current equipment is called.
I read an article recently about Putin being protected by a "bubble" that messes with GPS.
It depends on the sort of drone you're talking about. Off the shelf toy with a small bomb attached? Easy enough to disrupt, if you don't mind jamming other stuff in the area as collateral damage. Autonomous weapon system designed by a competent engineer with significant resources? Not a chance. It's fully autonomous once a target is programmed in and the weapon is launched, so there's no control signal to jam. GPS jamming could possibly work, depending on the size of the bomb, if there's no secondary guidance system. But it would be fairly easy to add an inertial navigation system or laser/optical homing or similar for terminal guidance. All off the shelf components, just more expensive than putting a homemade bomb on a $100 toy from walmart.
The real issue isn't the guidance, it's the lack of effect. The drone in the OP is a ~20lb bomb, compared to the ~1000lb warhead of a tomahawk cruise missile. So it's not going to be very effective for anything but indiscriminate murder of civilians, and the main groups engaged in random murder have plenty of willing martyrs for more effective attacks. Why use a drone when you can drive a truck bomb into a crowd and kill a lot more people? Or buy some AR-15s and open fire?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/14 02:50:49
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2019/06/14 03:11:55
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Environmental group plans to fly drones around Heathrow June 18 hoping to shut it down...
Well that's certainly a stupid way to do things.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2019/06/14 04:06:55
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
It will piss on their cause when hundread of thousands have their holidays cancelled.
The average joe in the UK can afford a foreign holiday, but cant afford to just shift dates if their flights are cancelled and their travel becomes out of synch with their hotel bookings. It effects workers holiday allowance, school breaks, pet attendance services and numerous knock on costs.
No what will happen is that they are more likely to punch an environmentalist in the face than put money in their tins. These holidaymakers will be back home haemorraging hard earned money and twiddling thumbs. Many will try and track down Extinction Rebellion spokespersons for a 'little chat'. Starting with a brick through the window. Chances are they will end up needing police protection.
There is something inherently stupid in targeting the common man in a PR stunt protest, especially if you ruin their leisure.
I doubt they have thought any of this through. Thankfully as they have explained their agenda well in advance they are likely thoroughly infiltrated by MI5 now.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/06/14 04:15:33
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2019/06/14 05:58:19
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Orlanth wrote: It will piss on their cause when hundread of thousands have their holidays cancelled.
The average joe in the UK can afford a foreign holiday, but cant afford to just shift dates if their flights are cancelled and their travel becomes out of synch with their hotel bookings. It effects workers holiday allowance, school breaks, pet attendance services and numerous knock on costs.
No what will happen is that they are more likely to punch an environmentalist in the face than put money in their tins. These holidaymakers will be back home haemorraging hard earned money and twiddling thumbs. Many will try and track down Extinction Rebellion spokespersons for a 'little chat'. Starting with a brick through the window. Chances are they will end up needing police protection.
There is something inherently stupid in targeting the common man in a PR stunt protest, especially if you ruin their leisure.
I doubt they have thought any of this through. Thankfully as they have explained their agenda well in advance they are likely thoroughly infiltrated by MI5 now.
A people get really pissed.
B that's not you get arrested and sent on way with warning traffic issues. That's you get caught, you are in a serious situation where jail time can become likely.
How many belive to put there own freedom at risk.
Plus it crosses like into violant action and genuine economic damage that will be shut down quick.
That's just asking them to go all order 66 and start kicking in doors up and down the country.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/06/14 06:09:55
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
2019/06/14 22:44:37
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Environmental group plans to fly drones around Heathrow June 18 hoping to shut it down...
I mean it's one thing to tell the people that they might should not be flying, but just shutting down a airport in main vacation time just invites angry clashes.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2019/06/15 00:22:35
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Environmental group plans to fly drones around Heathrow June 18 hoping to shut it down...
I mean it's one thing to tell the people that they might should not be flying, but just shutting down a airport in main vacation time just invites angry clashes.
Its a polluters wet dream though.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2019/06/15 02:44:51
Subject: Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
I'm quite convinced a lot of this stuff is telegraphed intentionally - to try to get the message out there without having to do it with any risk. Then rabid environmentalists have always put other people at risk to make themselves feel better.
In law enforcement, there was always a rather amusing moment when someone who was all shouting/bravado/etc. suddenly has that the realization that consequences are coming. You see it wash over their face when they're sitting on a concrete bench. It's like watching someone become sober instantaneously.
2019/06/15 09:22:38
Subject: Re:Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Elbows wrote: I'm quite convinced a lot of this stuff is telegraphed intentionally - to try to get the message out there without having to do it with any risk. Then rabid environmentalists have always put other people at risk to make themselves feel better.
In law enforcement, there was always a rather amusing moment when someone who was all shouting/bravado/etc. suddenly has that the realization that consequences are coming. You see it wash over their face when they're sitting on a concrete bench. It's like watching someone become sober instantaneously.
Even halved with UK 25-30 that's 10-15 years in jail. Much as our jails are not up to the Russian or US government tx standards of dread. No ones gonna risk a 10 year stretch without good reason.
Sgt. Vanden - OOC Hey, that was your doing. I didn't choose to fly in the "Dongerprise'.
"May the odds be ever in your favour"
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I have no clue how Dakka's moderation work. I expect it involves throwing a lot of d100 and looking at many random tables.
FudgeDumper - It could be that you are just so uncomfortable with the idea of your chapters primarch having his way with a docile tyranid spore cyst, that you must deny they have any feelings at all.
2019/06/15 09:38:46
Subject: Re:Yemen-You get an air force and you get an air force and you get...
Even halved with UK 25-30 that's 10-15 years in jail. Much as our jails are not up to the Russian or US government tx standards of dread. No ones gonna risk a 10 year stretch without good reason.
Heresy World Eaters/Emperors Children 
