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Competitive Tyranids - Help a Noob? (List Discussion)
40k List

Howdy,

Orignally posted to reddit, but thought to try here as well

I'm fairly new to actually playing warhammer. I've painted models on and off over the years, and I finally have a collection large enough to warrant an army. I like Tyranids and I'm trying to make a pass at a competitive list after reading the "Intro to competitive list building post" ( https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/c9mpml/intro_to_competitive_list_building/ ), as well as some other material online. Thanks to those that contribute to the message boards, community sites, and videos for making this much easier. The list is below, but I'll put my strategic thoughts/goals/combos here:


The consensus I gather online is that the best offensive units available to Tyranids are Kraken Genestealers backed by a Broodlord/Swarmlord. They hit hard and fast with a reliable turn one assault despite the attention they draw. However, it seems like the best global defensive buffs are the Hive Fleet adaptations for Leviathan (1/6th chance feel no pain when in 6" of synapse creature) and Jormungandr (cover from shooting, provided the unit did not charge or advance). Deep strike appears to be an incredible strong tactic, and as such I leaned into Jormungandr for the "Tunnel Networks" stratagem.


A constraint I encountered early in list building was the inability to optimally deep strike through a Trygon tunnel with Genestealers. The Genestealers need to charge in order to deal damage and as a result would lose the Jormungandr defensive buff. I concluded that the build direction for a sound Jormungandr centered list was Deep Strike with dakka instead of Deep Strike with close combat.


The ideal "win condition" looks something like:

Hive Tyrant and Carnifexes deploy board centered in order to march the middle ground. The Jormungandr buff plus Spore Cysts should make the squad sufficiently hard to wound despite their trudging nature. The group is decently bulking (toughness/wounds) such that they can survive. They carry a good amount of quality firepower and once they occupy the center they ought to be able to clear out several opposing units. Insidious Threat denies enemy cover, and the Horror hedges against assaults where I would lose the Jormungandr buff. Catalyst to buff the Tyrant himself (since he can't gain the Spore Cysts) unless one of the Fexes gets low on wounds to early. I was thinking this would be a "king of the hill" detachment, not dissimilar to many strong Chess openings.


Meanwhile, the Kraken detachment contains my flanking squads. The Genestealers/Broodlord are obviously the stronger between them and the Warriors/Prime. I'll try and deploy these groups last in order to gain the best positional advantage. Both with attempt to rocket down field and chew up any isolated targets. If I suspect a counter assault or Deep Strike, I'd hold the Warriors/Prime back in order to intercept and defend the Tyrant/Carnifexes. The Broodlord has Catalyst to give the Genestealers suitability as they blitz, while holding Chameleonic Mutation for itself.


Everything else gets to go underground. The Trygons bus the devilgaunts to the backline and, using 2 Command Points for Tunnel Networks, I can bring the Neurothropes. The devilgaunts should be able to clear chaff while the Trygons and brain bugs go for hardened targets. The Neurothropes give Catalyst to the Trygons because they will lose the Jormungandr buff when they assault. The Neurothropes should be able to vampire heal each other with smite since both also count as Zoanthropes. Make sure that both Trygons emerge within 12 inches of each other, so the Neurothropes can each emerge 3 inches from their personal Trygon and maintain a 6 inch bond.


The rippers do what they always do. They can Deep Strike an objective and hold with priority as a troop, or can chump block an otherwise devastating assault of any of the fire bases.


I made sure that the tunneling portion of the army was no more than half the total units and half the total points.


I'm worried about 2 things. First, assaults on the fire bases. Second, that I should bring more Fexes or devilgaunt dakka.

I could cut the warriors, but I needed another cheap HQ to get the second Battalion, and they have inherent synergy with the Prime (cheapest option). In addition they give the points I need to but half of my units underground. If I was to cut them it would have to be for a unit I can deploy normally and not Deep Strike.


Ideas, suggestions, pointers and criticisms are all welcome. Thanks for reading this far.



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Points Total: [112 PL, 2,000pts]

Created with BattleScribe


== Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Tyranids) [27 PL, 532pts] ==

Hive Fleet: Jormungandr


++ HQ [9 PL, 175pts] ++


Hive Tyrant [9 PL, 175pts]

Warlord; Warlord Trait: Insidious Threat

Selections: Heavy Venom Cannon[18pts], Two Deathspitters with Slimer Maggots [14pts]

Psychic Powers: Catalyst, Power: The Horror, Smite


++ Heavy Support [18 PL, 357pts] ++


Carnifexes [6 PL, 119pts]

1x Carnifex [119pts]

Selections: Heavy Venom Cannon [18pts], Two Deathspitters with Slimer Maggots [14pts], Enhanced Senses [10pts], Spore Cysts [10pts]


Carnifexes [6 PL, 119pts]

1x Carnifex [119pts]

Selections: Heavy Venom Cannon [18pts], Two Deathspitters with Slimer Maggots [14pts], Enhanced Senses [10pts], Spore Cysts [10pts]


Carnifexes [6 PL, 119pts]

1x Carnifex [119pts]

Selections: Heavy Venom Cannon [18pts], Two Deathspitters with Slimer Maggots [14pts], Enhanced Senses [10pts], Spore Cysts [10pts]



== Battalion Detachment +5CP (Tyranids) [48 PL, 930pts] ==

Hive Fleet: Jormungandr

++ HQ [8 PL, 180pts] ++

Neurothrope [4 PL, 90pts]

Selections: Power: Catalyst, Smite


Neurothrope [4 PL, 90pts]

Selections: Power: Catalyst, Smite

++ Troops [22 PL, 444pts] ++


Termagants [9 PL, 200pts]

20x Termagant (Devourer) [160pts]

10x Termagant (Fleshborer) [40pts]


Termagants [9 PL, 200pts]

20x Termagant (Devourer) [160pts]

10x Termagant (Fleshborer) [40pts]


Ripper Swarms [4 PL, 44pts]

4x Ripper Swarm [44pts]


++ Heavy Support [18 PL, 306pts] ++


Trygon [9 PL, 153pts]

1x Trygon [153pts]

Selections: 3x Massive Scything Talons [40pts],Biostatic Rattle, Adrenal Glands [5pts]


Trygon [9 PL, 153pts]

1x Trygon [153pts]

Selections: 3x Massive Scything Talons [40pts],Biostatic Rattle, Adrenal Glands [5pts]



== Battalion Detachment +5CP (Tyranids) [37 PL, 538pts] ==

Hive Fleet: Kraken


++ HQ [14 PL, 190pts] ++

Broodlord [8 PL, 115pts]

Bio-Artifact: Chameleonic Mutation

Psychic Power: Catalyst, Smite


Tyranid Prime [6 PL, 75pts]

Selections: 2x Boneswords [4pts], Adrenal Glands [1pts]


++ Troops [23 PL, 348pts] ++

Genestealers [16 PL, 240pts]

20x Genestealer [240pts]

Selections: 5x Acid Maw, 20xScything Talons, 20x Rending Claws [40pts]


Tyranid Warriors [5 PL, 75pts]

3x Tyranid Warrior [25pts]

Selections: 2x Boneswords [4pts], Adrenal Glands [1pts]


Ripper Swarms [2 PL, 33pts]

3x Ripper Swarm [33pts]


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You should consider hive guard with impaler cannons. No need for LOS, and they can shoot twice for 2CP. A malanthrope has shrouding spores which work for all units, he could protect your dakkafexes.

 p5freak wrote:
You should consider hive guard with impaler cannons. No need for LOS, and they can shoot twice for 2CP. A malanthrope has shrouding spores which work for all units, he could protect your dakkafexes.

The malanthrope doesnt protect Carnifex
They are equiped with "Spore Cysts" and it's not cumulative

If you want to optimize, drop the warriors and prime and sub them for another unit of rippers and a Neurothrope put the Neuro in the Jorm detachment and move your Tyrant to the Kraken detachment, give it wings, chameleonic mutation and 2x Devs or Devs/MRC. Broodlord already has character protection so your tyrant benefits much more from it. Drop a trygon for a unit of raveners w/ deathspitters for a more flexible tunnel deployment for a unit of devilgaunts/make up for points spent elsewhere

Thank you for the feed back. I'll mess try some of these edits. While is does break some of the symmetry I think everyone made decent observations. I'll be doing a test run tomorrow against some space marines, and I'll post the results here.