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Tau Shield Drone and question....can you take the Shield Drone x2 and get an additional improvement to your Save?

Here is how the rule reads, and I am stuck on "can have up to 2"....which for the Gun and Marker drones, doesn't make sense to have 2 of the same. But potentially really good for 2 shield drones....

This unit can have up to two of the following (Power Rating +1): Gun Drone, Marker Drone,
Shield Drone.
- If this unit has a Gun Drone, re-roll wound rolls of 1 for attacks made with ranged weapons by
this unit.
- If this unit has a Marker Drone, re-roll hit rolls of 1 for attacks made with ranged weapons by
this unit.
- If this unit has a Shield Drone, improve its Save characteristic by 1.

 TheMeanDM wrote:
Tau Shield Drone and question....can you take the Shield Drone x2 and get an additional improvement to your Save?

Here is how the rule reads, and I am stuck on "can have up to 2"....which for the Gun and Marker drones, doesn't make sense to have 2 of the same. But potentially really good for 2 shield drones....

This unit can have up to two of the following (Power Rating +1): Gun Drone, Marker Drone,
Shield Drone.
- If this unit has a Gun Drone, re-roll wound rolls of 1 for attacks made with ranged weapons by
this unit.
- If this unit has a Marker Drone, re-roll hit rolls of 1 for attacks made with ranged weapons by
this unit.
- If this unit has a Shield Drone, improve its Save characteristic by 1.

If you have two shield drones your save is still only improved by one. It's not improved by one for each shield drone.

Yup. Gotta take 2 different kinds of Drones, unless you want redundant bonuses that don't stack.

Found my official answer....yowza!

How about a really survivable Commander to be your army’s Warmaster? Make sure he’s piloting an XV8-02 Crisis Iridium Battlesuit and has a pair of Shield Drones for a cumulative 3+ Save!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/06/27/apocalypse-faction-focus-tau-empiregw-homepage-post-4/?fbclid=IwAR2oWsxE9Eheh-PS32PEgOh59WjbVs1xvLUZv0JAJykXZGk-wf9BAP9dVb8

 TheMeanDM wrote:
Found my official answer....yowza!

How about a really survivable Commander to be your army’s Warmaster? Make sure he’s piloting an XV8-02 Crisis Iridium Battlesuit and has a pair of Shield Drones for a cumulative 3+ Save!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/06/27/apocalypse-faction-focus-tau-empiregw-homepage-post-4/?fbclid=IwAR2oWsxE9Eheh-PS32PEgOh59WjbVs1xvLUZv0JAJykXZGk-wf9BAP9dVb8

That article is completely wrong as regards to what the rule actually says. Not the first time Warhammer Community has given incorrect information and won't be the last.

"Warhammer Community" is not rules.

Perhaps it isn't completely wrong given that this is a new game with new and different rules/mechanics.

 TheMeanDM wrote:
Perhaps it isn't completely wrong given that this is a new game with new and different rules/mechanics.

The rule doesn't say "If this unit has a Shield Drone, improve its Save characteristic by 1 for each Shield Drone", it says "If this unit has a Shield Drone, improve its Save characteristic by 1."

The answer to the If statement is either True or False and only applies once regardless of how many Shield Drones you have. It's a new game but you still use the rules of the English Language to parse it.

If they want the Shield Drone effect to be cumulative they need either errata or a special snowflake FAQ, but that's just par for the course when it comes to GW rules.

 TheMeanDM wrote:

- If this unit has a Shield Drone, improve its Save characteristic by 1.

If you have zero Shield Drones then this rule does nothing.
If you have one Shield Drone then this rule allows you to improve your save by 1.
If you have two Shield Drones then this is not covered by the wording of the rule. Nothing is giving you permission to make any further improvements.

To me the wording of 'if this unit has a Shield Drone' essentially means 'if this unit has at least one Shield Drone'.

Alternatively, if you want to blatantly misinterpret intent, the rule only works if you have exactly one Shield Drone. Having two will disable the ability until one of them is destroyed

 Bilge Rat wrote:
Alternatively, if you want to blatantly misinterpret intent, the rule only works if you have exactly one Shield Drone. Having two will disable the ability until one of them is destroyed

Very good catch!

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Bilge Rat wrote:
Alternatively, if you want to blatantly misinterpret intent, the rule only works if you have exactly one Shield Drone. Having two will disable the ability until one of them is destroyed

Very good catch!

It's amusing, but not really how language works.

Someone: "Do you have a pen?"
Me (who has 4 pens): "Yes I do."

 Stux wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Bilge Rat wrote:
Alternatively, if you want to blatantly misinterpret intent, the rule only works if you have exactly one Shield Drone. Having two will disable the ability until one of them is destroyed

Very good catch!

It's amusing, but not really how language works.

Someone: "Do you have a pen?"
Me (who has 4 pens): "Yes I do."

No, you have 4 pens, you don't have "a" pen. Much like people using "they" instead of "he or she", or "literally" to mean "figuratively".

No, this is very different. If I have 4 pens then I do have a pen, that's just how the language works. It would be inaccurate to say I had 1 pen of course, but a pen is perfectly valid.

Also, check a recent dictionary. Literally can literally mean figuratively now

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Stux wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Bilge Rat wrote:
Alternatively, if you want to blatantly misinterpret intent, the rule only works if you have exactly one Shield Drone. Having two will disable the ability until one of them is destroyed

Very good catch!

It's amusing, but not really how language works.

Someone: "Do you have a pen?"
Me (who has 4 pens): "Yes I do."

No, you have 4 pens, you don't have "a" pen. Much like people using "they" instead of "he or she", or "literally" to mean "figuratively".

They is also a perfectly acceptable third-person singular pronoun.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Stux wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Bilge Rat wrote:
Alternatively, if you want to blatantly misinterpret intent, the rule only works if you have exactly one Shield Drone. Having two will disable the ability until one of them is destroyed

Very good catch!

It's amusing, but not really how language works.

Someone: "Do you have a pen?"
Me (who has 4 pens): "Yes I do."

No, you have 4 pens, you don't have "a" pen. Much like people using "they" instead of "he or she", or "literally" to mean "figuratively".

What's wrong with "they" instead of "he or she"?
Singular they is 100% valid.

 Blndmage wrote:
What's wrong with "they" instead of "he or she"?
Singular they is 100% valid.

Singular They is not valid in English. It's just a widely used mistake, like people saying "I could care less".

Anyway, this thread is getting silly.

The rules don't let the Drones stack. The Community Website is wrong. Pray to the Man-Emperor that GW errata or FAQ it.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Blndmage wrote:
What's wrong with "they" instead of "he or she"?
Singular they is 100% valid.

Singular They is not valid in English. It's just a widely used mistake, like people saying "I could care less".

Anyway, this thread is getting silly.

The rules don't let the Drones stack. The Community Website is wrong. Pray to the Man-Emperor that GW errata or FAQ it.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/singular-nonbinary-they
https://www.dictionary.com/e/they-is-a-singular-pronoun/
https://public.oed.com/blog/a-brief-history-of-singular-they/

Singular they has been in use for a long time.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Blndmage wrote:
What's wrong with "they" instead of "he or she"?
Singular they is 100% valid.

Singular They is not valid in English. It's just a widely used mistake, like people saying "I could care less".

Simply not true.
https://public.oed.com/blog/a-brief-history-of-singular-they/

Not to mention that a "widely used mistake" is a contradiction in language. Usage determines meaning. It's just language evolving.

So the rule in the book says the following under Modifying Characteristics:

"All modifiers are cumulative"

So it seems, to me, that each Shield Drone you take is cumulative.

 TheMeanDM wrote:
So the rule in the book says the following under Modifying Characteristics:

"All modifiers are cumulative"

So it seems, to me, that each Shield Drone you take is cumulative.

Except the rule doesn't say that you get two +1s to your save. You only get a single +1 if you have a (or if we want to go that route, any) Shield Drones. You don't get +1 for each Shield Drone.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 TheMeanDM wrote:
So the rule in the book says the following under Modifying Characteristics:

"All modifiers are cumulative"

So it seems, to me, that each Shield Drone you take is cumulative.

Except the rule doesn't say that you get two +1s to your save. You only get a single +1 if you have a (or if we want to go that route, any) Shield Drones. You don't get +1 for each Shield Drone.

I agree with this. For +1 PL you get to pick 2 of 3 bonuses. You don't get to pick the same bonus twice.