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What about sticking the bases that come in the box ontop of each other - then ordering more for replacements and repeating it until you've got models on around 12 inches of base. It's the right size (some are even the ones that came in the original box) and yet now they can shoot over everything.


I mean we can sort of go nuts with all the things we could do that are not specifically ruled against. Heck I wager many other rules systems would have just as many gaps if we start gaming for all kinds of such loopholes. It might explain why some professional sports have insanely thick and complex rule books even if the games core rules are very simple to understand.

 deviantduck wrote:
My buddy pointed out that the next logical step is to deploy his shadowsword on it's back so the barrel is way up in the air and can see the entire table.

technically legal, but that puts you far in the TFG territory

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Backspacehacker wrote:

balmong7 wrote:
Yeah we are pretty sure that the models on top are supposed to be the guys embarked in the rhino.

It was the turned on its side thing that had everyone up in arms.

So BCB there really isn't anything prohibiting turning it on its side to fit?

I'm just gonna give you fair warning, if you do stuff like that, your not going to be a person people are going to want to play with. There are common sense rules, turning your rino flat on its side like that to wedge it into a place it should not be going, is one of those rules.

That's very much akin toodeling for advantage. It's a dick move and I would highly suggest not doing it or allowing it. If you wanna be TFG then by all means be TFG. But again, RAI vs RAW

Playing by the rules cannot, by definition, be TFG behaviour.

I don't believe your assertion. Care to show your reasoning?

Drager wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Backspacehacker wrote:

balmong7 wrote:
Yeah we are pretty sure that the models on top are supposed to be the guys embarked in the rhino.

It was the turned on its side thing that had everyone up in arms.

So BCB there really isn't anything prohibiting turning it on its side to fit?

I'm just gonna give you fair warning, if you do stuff like that, your not going to be a person people are going to want to play with. There are common sense rules, turning your rino flat on its side like that to wedge it into a place it should not be going, is one of those rules.

That's very much akin toodeling for advantage. It's a dick move and I would highly suggest not doing it or allowing it. If you wanna be TFG then by all means be TFG. But again, RAI vs RAW

Playing by the rules cannot, by definition, be TFG behaviour.

I don't believe your assertion. Care to show your reasoning?

Playing the rules of the game is not "TFG" behaviour; its just playing the game.
Now if you start to twist interpretation of the rules such as allowing rhinos to run on their sides because "its not disallowed" and such then yes you're getting very much into TFG territory.

Remembering that all rules are an interpretation of what is written, therefor there is always some room for variation in interpretation; however there are some which are clearly just so far out of line with the rules, theme and style of game that they are glaringly obviously not supposed to happen that way.

 Overread wrote:
Playing the rules of the game is not "TFG" behaviour; its just playing the game.

And playing the game allows you to put Rhinos on their side. That is no more "TFG behaviour" than requesting your opponent rolls to hit with their Bolters.

I think a combination of too much bacon, internetting and GW rules writing style has finally broken BCB. I think we'll all have to take the mature pathway and take him to the vet to be put down now, it would be cruel to let him continue in such a clear state of mental pain.

I'm sure the Dakka donations fund will be able to find enough spare change to pay the vet.


Then we can get a new BaconKittenLava for Christmas!

 Overread wrote:
I think a combination of too much bacon, internetting and GW rules writing style has finally broken BCB. I think we'll all have to take the mature pathway and take him to the vet to be put down now, it would be cruel to let him continue in such a clear state of mental pain.

I'm sure the Dakka donations fund will be able to find enough spare change to pay the vet.


Then we can get a new BaconKittenLava for Christmas!

BCB is a treasure... but... damn.... not sure about this one.

 Overread wrote:
I think a combination of too much bacon, internetting and GW rules writing style has finally broken BCB. I think we'll all have to take the mature pathway and take him to the vet to be put down now, it would be cruel to let him continue in such a clear state of mental pain.

I'm sure the Dakka donations fund will be able to find enough spare change to pay the vet.


Then we can get a new BaconKittenLava for Christmas!

I agree with BCB's statement and conclusion here.

By RAW BCB is right but applying pure RAW here is not and no TO would enforce it.

U02dah4 wrote:
By RAW BCB is right but applying pure RAW here is not and no TO would enforce it.

The OP explicitly asked for a RAW analysis and no other.

Saying that you should only give a RAW answer is like saying "America has Freedom of Speech" without explaining that shouting racial slurs at minorities will make you look like a total asshat. Which kinda demonstrates that just because something is RAW doesn't mean it ain't a TFG thing to do.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Playing the rules of the game is not "TFG" behaviour; its just playing the game.

And playing the game allows you to put Rhinos on their side. That is no more "TFG behaviour" than requesting your opponent rolls to hit with their Bolters.

Following the rules to absurdity is absolutely a kind of TFG behaviour. If you show up to a game and tell the Tyranid opponent who's list is built around Assault weapons that none of them actually work and are adamant about enforcing that in the game - you're TFG.

The reaction from most people in this thread indicates strongly that putting a vehicle on its side is TFG behaviour. You don't, as an individual, get to decide what constitutes TFG. The people around you do.

 Stux wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Playing the rules of the game is not "TFG" behaviour; its just playing the game.

And playing the game allows you to put Rhinos on their side. That is no more "TFG behaviour" than requesting your opponent rolls to hit with their Bolters.

Following the rules to absurdity is absolutely a kind of TFG behaviour. If you show up to a game and tell the Tyranid opponent who's list is built around Assault weapons that none of them actually work and are adamant about enforcing that in the game - you're TFG.

The reaction from most people in this thread indicates strongly that putting a vehicle on its side is TFG behaviour. You don't, as an individual, get to decide what constitutes TFG. The people around you do.

You are (effectively) claiming that asking my opponent to roll to hit with their bolters is TFG behaviour. Either following the rules is TFG behaviour or it isn't, there is no in-between. (In my opinion of course.)

 flandarz wrote:
Saying that you should only give a RAW answer is like saying "America has Freedom of Speech" without explaining that shouting racial slurs at minorities will make you look like a total asshat. Which kinda demonstrates that just because something is RAW doesn't mean it ain't a TFG thing to do.

I'm saying pay attention to the Tenets of YMDC (stickied up top) and don't be 'that guy' by giving OP a lecture he didn't ask for. It's like if somebody asks a question about wheelchairs and you respond by giving them the history of the wheel. Kind of related, but not what they were looking for.

Audustum wrote:

VladimirHerzog wrote:
Both the RAW and RAI/HIWPI are important parts of any question in YMDC.

The RAW gives the "absolute" answer so that in a vaccum, this is how it should be played.

The RAI/HIWPI gives the more "socially accepted" answer so that OP is free to decide what kind of environmen he wants to foster in his games.

The fact that people refuse to see that both point of views bring valid information is annoying. Posts need to stop becoming "Muh RAW va Muh RAI". A good answer includes both.

A good answer should sound in what the OP is looking for.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Andykp wrote:
Do the rules really need to state every minute detail, like models have to be the right way up??? Can’t we be credited with some common sense? Discussions like this put me off playing against people I don’t know.

Common sense is anything but common and is entirely subjective, so yes, they do.

Thanks for the sensible responses. This one is merely a sad reflection on the state of part of the community.

Audustum wrote:

 flandarz wrote:
Saying that you should only give a RAW answer is like saying "America has Freedom of Speech" without explaining that shouting racial slurs at minorities will make you look like a total asshat. Which kinda demonstrates that just because something is RAW doesn't mean it ain't a TFG thing to do.

I'm saying pay attention to the Tenets of YMDC (stickied up top) and don't be 'that guy' by giving OP a lecture he didn't ask for. It's like if somebody asks a question about wheelchairs and you respond by giving them the history of the wheel. Kind of related, but not what they were looking for.

I don't think anyone was lecturing the OP about anything. The sequence of events was as follows (more or less):

Everyone: "it's RAW but the reason everyone is getting mad at the guy doing it is because it's a TFG thing to do"

BCB: "no it isn't"

Everyone: "dude. It really is."

This would seem to have run its course. Moving on.