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So, I got a new player into the game, and he is interested in necrons. I don't have a fething clue about them, so what should he get?

I understand that they aren't top tier now, but our gaming group isn't too cut-throat. He will be facing solid mono-codex armies, piles of primaris, but no top tournament lists. Seeing 3 of a powerful unit is rare, a knight or a primarch occasionally make an appearance, but aren't something you regularly need to take down.

He should be aiming to complete 1500 points first, with at least a battalion at the core. Should he hunt down half of forgebane? How about the start collecting box or the spearhead? What HQs and troops should he get?

If power level concerns aren't super critical, the Star Collecting box probably won't lead you too far astray. It's got a faceless horde of troops, a HQ choice, elite infantry unit in form of the immortals/deathmarks and a hovering death machine - a pretty good cross section of the Necron range.

EDIT: It's also very good value. In Europe at least you're essentially getting the Warriors and Scarabs for free and then some, as an Overlord + Annihilation Barge + Immortals are already 84,50€, and the SC box is just 70.

Warriors, Destroyers, Doom Scythes, Doomsday Arks are all a great place to start.

Obviously some characters also.

Immortals are always a good core choice, and an Overlord will always be present in any Necron list. For heavy hitters, Doomsday Arks are almost essential for anti-tank duties, and Tomb Blades put in a lot of work. Destroyers do well too, but only as a single unit.

Me personally?

I'd probably get this model in lieu of an Overlord:

Good necron units are overlords, crypteks, tesla immortals, destroyers, DDAs (at least 2, better 3), tomb blades, lots of warriors (at least 40, better 60) in combination with ghost ark and cryptek, scarabs, doom scythes (3 of them), triarch stalker.

Can't go too far wrong with Immortals, Warriors, Cryptek, Overlord, Destroyers and Tomb Blades. Scarabs are pretty good too, but you get them anyway if you buy Warriors. Doomsday Arks, Doom Scythes and Wraiths are also pretty decent.

Thanks for all the replies. I've got more questions:

Warriors in units of 10 or 20?
Two units of warriors and one unit immortals or the other way around?
Should he aim for two battalions or is one enough?
HQs should be one overlord and one cryptek or two overlords?
Are Ghost Arks worth playing?
What about the CCB?
Triarch stalker?
Any units he should avoid at all costs?

 Jidmah wrote:
Thanks for all the replies. I've got more questions:

Warriors in units of 10 or 20?
Two units of warriors and one unit immortals or the other way around?
Should he aim for two battalions or is one enough?
HQs should be one overlord and one cryptek or two overlords?
Are Ghost Arks worth playing?
What about the CCB?
Triarch stalker?
Any units he should avoid at all costs?

10 or 20 works for Warriors. 10 is cheap enough that you don't care too much if the absorb some firepower and die but 20 takes some real effort to clear, especially if in cover. There's a WL trait to make units Fearless that's very useful if you take big units of Warriors (it's very useful in general, in fact).

I go with more Immortals than Warriors, usually 2 Tesla Immortals and one unit of Warriors.

I usually just go with a single Battalion, then 2 of any of the other types. Fast Attack and DDA in Heavy Support make for good secondary detachments. Necron Troops are OK but most of their power is in either Fast Attack or Heavy Support so the extra Troops tax of a second Battalion isn't worth it, IMO. For characters, you'll want at least one Cryptek and one Overlord. Personally, I quite like the Catacomb Command Barge, but from an efficiency point of view another Overlord is better. Lords are useful for their re-roll 1s buff. Necron characters are very expensive, though, and terrible in combat with restrictive buffs so I'd only go with what you need for your detachments.

Ghost Arks are OK - lots of wounds and Quantum Shielding keeps them alive against lascannons and the like. Unfortunately, their low Toughness and save makes them a prime target for things like Autocannons. They have OK shooting but you rarely use their transport capabilities as units inside can't shoot out. They're generally too expensive for me to fit into my lists but they're not terrible in the same way a Tamb Spyder is, for example. Same goes for the Stalker. I like it for the long-range firepower and the re-roll 1s buff is great, but it's still a little pricey, I think.

For units to avoid, the Monolith is pretty bad and the Tomb Spyder might be one of the worst units in the game due to how fast it dies. I'm not a fan of Lychguard either, as they're too slow. Praetorians are far too expensive. Heavy Destroyers are, I believe, statistically worse than regular Destroyers and Destroyer Lords have a weird set of buffs that don't synergise with Destroyer units. Night Scythes are fairly pointless, as is the Annihilation Barge and both of the Superheavies.

Overall, be prepared to face a lot of frustration using Necrons. They're not a good army at all, and their core playstyle is one that doesn't seem to work very well in 40k right now. Add to that the sheer number of units that are just bad, and you can quite easily end up with a failure of an army if you're not careful.

Thanks very much for that response.

Are most unit bad because they cost too much, or are irredeemable even if CA drops their points?

If your friend is concerned with winning games, check out https://www.40kstats.com/top-4s

There are 14 Necron lists posted there that have placed in the top 4 of major tournaments.

Most rely on a "backbone" of 3 doomsday arks and 3 doom scythes, they kinda form the core, backed up by some immortals and other choices. Necron armies have a lot of units that are just not viable, like Monoliths and Praetorians, They're not viable because they're too expensive for what they do. Every unit has a points cost at which it becomes good, like tactical marines are considered bad, but a 1 point tactical marine would be ungodly strong.

You don't need to start building meta lists straight away, the meta will likely change. Just start up a back bone of good units and don't spam from the outset.

Thanks for the link!

 Horst wrote:
Every unit has a points cost at which it becomes good, like tactical marines are considered bad, but a 1 point tactical marine would be ungodly strong.

In my opinion, if a unit needs to drop to a point cost where it becomes auto-include before being used at all means the unit is flawed at its core, ie irredeemable by point reductions.
For example, ork burna boyz don't make sense until they drop in points below regular boyz, at which points they would become auto-includes just because they have more wounds per points than boyz. Which completely misses the point of an elite flamethrower unit.

IMHO go all tesla immortals (3x10 or 2x10 and 1x5), or go all silver tide (3x20 or 2x20 and 1x10) with a ghost ark and optional cryptek. Mixing them isnt effective. Always try to max units to make it as hard as possible to wipe out an entire unit. A wiped out unit cant roll for RP. One model left alive, and the entire unit can reanimate.

 Jidmah wrote:
Thanks very much for that response.

Are most unit bad because they cost too much, or are irredeemable even if CA drops their points?

Some units would be fine with points drops. Ghost Arks and Praetorians would probably be fine, as would the Superheavies, for example. Necrons' biggest problem is they are an army designed around being very good at medium range shooting but 40k doesn't really reward that well. Necrons have very few long-range weapons but their basic guns like Tesla Carbines and Gauss Flayers/Blasters are designed to be good at 12"-24" but Necrons die too easily at those ranges and at longer ranges, so you end up with a shooting army that gets out-shot by most comparable lists. I think that's a fundamental design flaw that may be difficult to fix just with points.

 Ishagu wrote:
You don't need to start building meta lists straight away, the meta will likely change. Just start up a back bone of good units and don't spam from the outset.

As far as I can tell those lists just reflect what was said already. And I as sure as hell won't advise a newbie to buy three of the current hot stuff. He wants a doomsday ark and some destroyers anyways, that should set him up with enough anti-tank for the first few games.