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What would you pay?
Books only, please
$60 / year
$120 / year
$240 / year
$360 / year
A code to download a copy with the purchase of a book

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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 Lord Clinto wrote:
There are too many "subscription" services already and now it's seeping into computer programs/sites. How long before you'll need a subscription to post on Dakka Dakka? (hopefully never lol)

I pay for Netflix and now Disney+ (The Mandalorian blows my mind so far), I patently refuse to "subscribe" to rules for a hobby. That would be a deal breaker for me and I'd drop 40K/GW cold turkey..

I know it would never happen (they'd lose too much revenue) but I would wholeheartedly go for GW providing digital codes with the purchase of a book.



The cold reality is that many things will be SaaS / PaaS in the future. Even Windows itself. Games are already a service - look at Google and PS4. Email, Excel, Word - all a service. Anything that can be turned into a stream of revenue is far preferable businesses - especially when they don't have to produce a physical product, manage license keys, etc. You either have the service or you don't.

   
Made in gb
Long-Range Land Speeder Pilot




UK

 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Lord Clinto wrote:
There are too many "subscription" services already and now it's seeping into computer programs/sites. How long before you'll need a subscription to post on Dakka Dakka? (hopefully never lol)

I pay for Netflix and now Disney+ (The Mandalorian blows my mind so far), I patently refuse to "subscribe" to rules for a hobby. That would be a deal breaker for me and I'd drop 40K/GW cold turkey..

I know it would never happen (they'd lose too much revenue) but I would wholeheartedly go for GW providing digital codes with the purchase of a book.



The cold reality is that many things will be SaaS / PaaS in the future. Even Windows itself. Games are already a service - look at Google and PS4. Email, Excel, Word - all a service. Anything that can be turned into a stream of revenue is far preferable businesses - especially when they don't have to produce a physical product, manage license keys, etc. You either have the service or you don't.

All of those examples are digital services and are vastly different to a tabletop game, it would be like saying that as playing FIFA online requires subscription, real life football is now subscription based regardless of whether you already own a football.

GW will resist change as there is momentum behind paper rules (they currently bring in steady money), but if they continue to pursue rapid rules development this might eventually change due to the shortened viable product life of printed rules that are out of date a matter months after release (paper becomes less profitable due to increased wastage and increased customer fatigue to rules churn).

Just like with football, you don't need an active digital product to participate in a miniature game, so there would be zero incentive for customers to maintain a subscription when they could get the content, save a copy, then end the subscription (or just pirate it).

The more likely model digital rules would take is that of free to play games, where miniatures/paints/scenery/hobby tools form the microtransactions. For example, I am less likely to start a new army if I have a high initial investment with multiple books to buy, and subsequently replace. I am more likely to pick up a few start collecting boxes from other factions if the rules are free.
   
Made in eu
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






Insularum wrote:
Just like with football, you don't need an active digital product to participate in a miniature game, so there would be zero incentive for customers to maintain a subscription when they could get the content, save a copy, then end the subscription (or just pirate it).

The pirate argument isn't really one, as the subscription would change nothing about how easy it is to pirate ebooks.
There are models to prevent switching on-and-off subscribers, for example you could give a free year of updates(including "campaign" books and CA) with each codex you buy and then 5$/month afterwards. If you kill your subscription ASAP and they release something like SM 2.0, you'd have to shell out for the codex again, instead of just getting it as part of your subscription.

The more likely model digital rules would take is that of free to play games, where miniatures/paints/scenery/hobby tools form the microtransactions. For example, I am less likely to start a new army if I have a high initial investment with multiple books to buy, and subsequently replace. I am more likely to pick up a few start collecting boxes from other factions if the rules are free.

This would be the most preferable way to go for both customers and GW, but they are too old-fashioned for that.

7 Ork facts people always get wrong:
Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other.
A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot.
Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests.
Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books.
Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor.
Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers.
Orks do not have the power of believe. 
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Veteran Marine with Tentacles






I don't see a way GW can offer to charge me money to update a glorified PDF that is awful and awkward to search in person. They would have to bundle it with other services like an army builder that prints out the relevant up to date datasheets of the units I'm fielding in a easily and quickly readable fashion. Think battlescribe but official so you don't have to deal with *~battlescribe can be edited~* arguments. Make it free for all factions using PL and buying a codex gives you a code that unlocks strategems, point costs, etc. Additionally, most of those codes could probably be sold online via GW so things like CA could be $10 or something once a year to update all your point costs. Piracy is a service issue, make the service awesome and people will prefer it.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Texas

I buy digital only now, so maybe this would be exclusive to digital - not sure how you could do this sort of thing for physical copies.

Sell us a book, and provide updates as erratas, and FAQ updates as they come out to the actual book. I see point values updated in my codex as the CA books come out, so I know we can get updated copies. Let's take advantage of the platform!

How much is that worth? Well, the BRB is $60? If we are not spending that, then I say maybe $10-$15 a year if we are going to a sub model.

The question is, what do I get with the subscription service? Am I getting Chapter Approved, BRB, Codexes, and Supplements? Campaign books? That would be worth $20-30 before I tell you to get bent. If the cost is based per book? It better not be more than $1-$2 per book - PER YEAR.

I think the best way forward - again for digital - would be $1 per book I need/want access to. I'd pay a total of $4/year for access to my BRB, Codex, Chapter Approved, and possible supplement. Considering I paid $60 for the BRB, this would be a nice drop in price from the big purchases we current have to pay.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Lord Clinto wrote:
There are too many "subscription" services already and now it's seeping into computer programs/sites. How long before you'll need a subscription to post on Dakka Dakka? (hopefully never lol)

I pay for Netflix and now Disney+ (The Mandalorian blows my mind so far), I patently refuse to "subscribe" to rules for a hobby. That would be a deal breaker for me and I'd drop 40K/GW cold turkey..

I know it would never happen (they'd lose too much revenue) but I would wholeheartedly go for GW providing digital codes with the purchase of a book.



The cold reality is that many things will be SaaS / PaaS in the future. Even Windows itself. Games are already a service - look at Google and PS4. Email, Excel, Word - all a service. Anything that can be turned into a stream of revenue is far preferable businesses - especially when they don't have to produce a physical product, manage license keys, etc. You either have the service or you don't.



Very very true. Entire industries are looking at moving to the cloud, and subscription services are easy to enact with that sort of platform. AWS is having a huge impact, and from a business perspective you want that monthly revenue stream over the bigger single purchase.

I do agree that the amount of subs a household ends up getting is starting to pile up. MS Office, Netflix, Hulu, Pandora, Amazon Prime, HBOGo, Disney+..... you used to be able to save some serious cash with "cutting the cord", but now you have to do it to break even!

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/11/13 18:59:08


No Pity! No Remorse! No fear! 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Yeah, I'd pay 10 bucks a month if it meant access to updated rules for all 8th edition content.

Free updated digital rules would be another solution I'd go for (have the android reader issues been resolved?).

But looking at how much GW is charging for rules and pushing new supplements/codexes out there I don't think GW is going to go away from this revenue stream (they make money off the books right?).
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






No, all other miniature companies are going to free rules online that are always updated, you can buy books still if you want

   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Texas

 Amishprn86 wrote:
No, all other miniature companies are going to free rules online that are always updated, you can buy books still if you want


Something could be said for following the industry standard, if thats what it is going to.

No Pity! No Remorse! No fear! 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 Amishprn86 wrote:
No, all other miniature companies are going to free rules online that are always updated, you can buy books still if you want


Small companies with no huge overhead like brick and mortar and supply chains.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Amishprn86 wrote:
No, all other miniature companies are going to free rules online that are always updated, you can buy books still if you want


Small companies with no huge overhead like brick and mortar and supply chains.


Do you mean small companies cant give rules out for free? Have you seen the 100's of "Bobs basement army game, fully 3D printed Armies with free rules"? Most companies are not Brick and mortar anymore, they supply to those places like Fantasy Flight Games does.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/13 20:31:46


   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 Amishprn86 wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Amishprn86 wrote:
No, all other miniature companies are going to free rules online that are always updated, you can buy books still if you want


Small companies with no huge overhead like brick and mortar and supply chains.


Do you mean small companies cant give rules out for free? Have you seen the 100's of "Bobs basement army game, fully 3D printed Armies with free rules"? Most companies are not Brick and mortar anymore, they supply to those places like Fantasy Flight Games does.


Hmm not sure I read your stuff properly.

I'm saying small companies can easily give out free rules, because they don't have large overhead like GW does.

A lot of people lament buying books from GW, but they'd take a good hit to revenue if they made all of that free.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Amishprn86 wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Amishprn86 wrote:
No, all other miniature companies are going to free rules online that are always updated, you can buy books still if you want


Small companies with no huge overhead like brick and mortar and supply chains.


Do you mean small companies cant give rules out for free? Have you seen the 100's of "Bobs basement army game, fully 3D printed Armies with free rules"? Most companies are not Brick and mortar anymore, they supply to those places like Fantasy Flight Games does.


Hmm not sure I read your stuff properly.

I'm saying small companies can easily give out free rules, because they don't have large overhead like GW does.

A lot of people lament buying books from GW, but they'd take a good hit to revenue if they made all of that free.


lol ok... you know who fantasy flight games is right? B.c almost all their rules for their miniatures are free, and many also has app builders for them for free as well.

If you dont know who FFG is then you literally dont have any say in this. (Not you as in you, but as in anyone talking about this).

   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




I would say no in the strongest possible terms. I want to own what I buy. A Subscription service these days is just "the right to use" not actual ownership. That's why Steam, GoG, EPIC, etc, all are so effective. They aren't selling anything that exists or is physical. They only sell you access to a product.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 Amishprn86 wrote:


lol ok... you know who fantasy flight games is right? B.c almost all their rules for their miniatures are free, and many also has app builders for them for free as well.

If you dont know who FFG is then you literally dont have any say in this. (Not you as in you, but as in anyone talking about this).


I'm very aware of FFG. It's kind of impossible to play a board game without the actual game and mountains of tokens, even if you have the rules. And the magical thing? The rules come with the game, so...

Do you have a figure on the number of brick and mortar stores FFG staffs?
   
Made in us
Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel




Douglasville, GA

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I would say no in the strongest possible terms. I want to own what I buy. A Subscription service these days is just "the right to use" not actual ownership. That's why Steam, GoG, EPIC, etc, all are so effective. They aren't selling anything that exists or is physical. They only sell you access to a product.


I mean, that's how a lot of things work. Renting an apartment. Leasing a car. Cab/bus/Uber fare. Cable T.V. Cell Phone plans. Etc.

To be honest, you probably spend more money on things you don't own than on things you do. And that's fine, as long as you're getting value for that money you're spending.
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




 flandarz wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I would say no in the strongest possible terms. I want to own what I buy. A Subscription service these days is just "the right to use" not actual ownership. That's why Steam, GoG, EPIC, etc, all are so effective. They aren't selling anything that exists or is physical. They only sell you access to a product.


I mean, that's how a lot of things work. Renting an apartment. Leasing a car. Cab/bus/Uber fare. Cable T.V. Cell Phone plans. Etc.

To be honest, you probably spend more money on things you don't own than on things you do. And that's fine, as long as you're getting value for that money you're spending.


You are not wrong in that, and thank you for pointing it out. But I don't have to lease, I can own. I don't have to rent, I can own. I don't have to lease a cell phone, I can own it.

All of those examples are me. It makes zero fiscal sense to rent/lease/subscribe when you can just pay once, and own. Every major book on wealth accumulation says to never give up money you don't have to. Case in point, buy a car in cash and you avoid paying the stupid doubling of fees for interest charges. Same with a phone, college debt, or a loan.

GW in this instance would be essentially betting on the laziness of their base, saying you would rather pay more money over time, than be forced to do the work of keeping up to date yourself. I am not saying anyone who advocates one way or the other is right, but my personal opinion.

I prefer to buy once, and own it. I hate giving money to people for intangible goods/services.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
 flandarz wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I would say no in the strongest possible terms. I want to own what I buy. A Subscription service these days is just "the right to use" not actual ownership. That's why Steam, GoG, EPIC, etc, all are so effective. They aren't selling anything that exists or is physical. They only sell you access to a product.


I mean, that's how a lot of things work. Renting an apartment. Leasing a car. Cab/bus/Uber fare. Cable T.V. Cell Phone plans. Etc.

To be honest, you probably spend more money on things you don't own than on things you do. And that's fine, as long as you're getting value for that money you're spending.


You are not wrong in that, and thank you for pointing it out. But I don't have to lease, I can own. I don't have to rent, I can own. I don't have to lease a cell phone, I can own it.

All of those examples are me. It makes zero fiscal sense to rent/lease/subscribe when you can just pay once, and own. Every major book on wealth accumulation says to never give up money you don't have to. Case in point, buy a car in cash and you avoid paying the stupid doubling of fees for interest charges. Same with a phone, college debt, or a loan.

GW in this instance would be essentially betting on the laziness of their base, saying you would rather pay more money over time, than be forced to do the work of keeping up to date yourself. I am not saying anyone who advocates one way or the other is right, but my personal opinion.

I prefer to buy once, and own it. I hate giving money to people for intangible goods/services.


But what if "renting" gave you access to all the books at a cost that is far less than buying all those books, which expire 2 or 3 or 4 years down the road, as well as other benefits?

I used to value buying DVDs, but that gak is cumbersome and in 10 years the format will change and I'd have to buy a whole other set of movies I already owned. Getting movies digitally is just more sensible...and more green for the planet.

I get the feeling of ownership, but sometimes stuff is just...stuff. I'll thumb through my old codexes occasionally for a hit of nostalgia, but that's like a minute of time and my life doesn't really change other than needing to store more things.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/14 02:16:51


 
   
Made in pt
Journeyman Inquisitor with Visions of the Warp




They would never do it. It's too much of a barrier to entry when you're looking to generate new clients.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Yoyoyo wrote:
They would never do it. It's too much of a barrier to entry when you're looking to generate new clients.


Make a free and premium zone.

Still incredibly unlikely.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Daedalus81 wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
 flandarz wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I would say no in the strongest possible terms. I want to own what I buy. A Subscription service these days is just "the right to use" not actual ownership. That's why Steam, GoG, EPIC, etc, all are so effective. They aren't selling anything that exists or is physical. They only sell you access to a product.


I mean, that's how a lot of things work. Renting an apartment. Leasing a car. Cab/bus/Uber fare. Cable T.V. Cell Phone plans. Etc.

To be honest, you probably spend more money on things you don't own than on things you do. And that's fine, as long as you're getting value for that money you're spending.


You are not wrong in that, and thank you for pointing it out. But I don't have to lease, I can own. I don't have to rent, I can own. I don't have to lease a cell phone, I can own it.

All of those examples are me. It makes zero fiscal sense to rent/lease/subscribe when you can just pay once, and own. Every major book on wealth accumulation says to never give up money you don't have to. Case in point, buy a car in cash and you avoid paying the stupid doubling of fees for interest charges. Same with a phone, college debt, or a loan.

GW in this instance would be essentially betting on the laziness of their base, saying you would rather pay more money over time, than be forced to do the work of keeping up to date yourself. I am not saying anyone who advocates one way or the other is right, but my personal opinion.

I prefer to buy once, and own it. I hate giving money to people for intangible goods/services.


But what if "renting" gave you access to all the books at a cost that is far less than buying all those books, which expire 2 or 3 or 4 years down the road, as well as other benefits?

I used to value buying DVDs, but that gak is cumbersome and in 10 years the format will change and I'd have to buy a whole other set of movies I already owned. Getting movies digitally is just more sensible...and more green for the planet.

I get the feeling of ownership, but sometimes stuff is just...stuff. I'll thumb through my old codexes occasionally for a hit of nostalgia, but that's like a minute of time and my life doesn't really change other than needing to store more things.



I'm sure this subscription crap could save you money, but what if you don't want all these books ? You speak as if every players wants all the rules for every army and every release, I for one don't. I don't like the trend of these sub in services that end up draining you out with the slow bleed that at one point they claimed to be saving you money. I feel like all this is just going to end up costing us all so much more over time with the guise of it being cheaper at first, I don't like it and I doubt I ever will. It started as the cheap path and it's only growing more and more expensive till it becomes the hungry pig it claims it was saving us from. That's just my over all feeling on sub services. For GW, I'd never feel right giving them steady money for promises of good. They've done nothing to earn that level of trust, and if video games as a service has taught me, and should show everyone, they can't even deliver on the promises given. They just want more and more money, feed you dreams and deliver crap. So far live service games have had a less than great record some of them being so bad as to be considered running jokes in the industry.

Stuff is stuff, but I still want to own my stuff if I'm paying the same price regardless. I don't want one more thing I need to factor into my bills for a relaxing past time. I never have liked the idea, and never will of paying for something they can take away at any time at their desire and I have no recourse. All the companies may be trying to fleece people with this, and it may only be a matter of time before GW tries it but that'll be the day I say goodbye and get rid of most of my forces as I wouldn't pay them for dreams of service when they've shown they can't make proper rules for 30 years prior, I'd be a dip to trust them that it'll be " Good " now. Same as I won't pay for all these sub services just because its the path life must follow. Feeding the machine of greed will never end up well for the customer, not in the long run.

I do get not everything we can own, but in so far as I can, I want to limit my renting of things. I get too that we only live so long so all we get is rented but that's fine so long as its rented for the duration of my life or wish to own it.
   
Made in us
Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel




Douglasville, GA

I can respect that. I kinda agree that I don't really want to, say, build an army for every Faction, or read up on rules to understand the meta better, but I think it'd be nice to have access to all that lore they include in the books. I love me some fluff. But I'm still in the boat of "the rules should be free" anyway. Have the basic rules and the relevant data cards included with the models sold, and/or have some free PDFs with the rules and such on it. I can't think of a better way to drive model sales than to get people hooked on the game with some free rules.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 flandarz wrote:
I can respect that. I kinda agree that I don't really want to, say, build an army for every Faction, or read up on rules to understand the meta better, but I think it'd be nice to have access to all that lore they include in the books. I love me some fluff. But I'm still in the boat of "the rules should be free" anyway. Have the basic rules and the relevant data cards included with the models sold, and/or have some free PDFs with the rules and such on it. I can't think of a better way to drive model sales than to get people hooked on the game with some free rules.


The bare bones of the rules should be free, with deeper versions open for purchase. If people want the fluff, let them have it. If the fluff they wrote is good and the books are quality as they keep claiming, they'd sell themselves just fine if the rules were free. I just don't think they want to release actual quality and instead learned their lesson that the only way to make people grab it in the numbers they want is to have rules in it. They used to just put out campaign books that didn't have 40k rules for factions in them aside from the campaigns and I don't think they sold like they wanted. That is just my assumption based on the new book set ups.
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





Insularum wrote:
Poll needs a $0 option.

Subscription models only work in environments where the service itself is the product - like Netflix (no subscription, no service). GW products do not meet this criteria as they do not provide a service, rather a physical product that the user does whatever they like with. With no physical book option there will only be one outcome - more piracy from there being no physical product available to buy and nothing at all stopping anyone from screen shotting every page of a rules source and distributing at will.

It wouldn't be that hard to build a better case for free rules via digital download rather than a subscription model.


If GW wants to go really evil they can make app that has the subscription incorporate element that makes it impossible to play WITHOUT that you can't just screenshot.

(albeit it could be reverse engineered and made pirate app but that's more work than screen shot. And GW can change it periodically for added fun)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/14 08:02:34


2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in pl
Fixture of Dakka




 Daedalus81 wrote:


But what if "renting" gave you access to all the books at a cost that is far less than buying all those books, which expire 2 or 3 or 4 years down the road, as well as other benefits?




Still better then being forced to pay for a bad set of rules on a monthly basis, just to be able to play. Plus as a bonus somehow the exchange rates for my currancy to something else look mighty wonky. No bank sells dollar here for 4.2zl, and most mobile apps do, plus then they often add taxs to it. And suddenly am paying more for the same rules then someone living in the US.
But probably biased. People hate renting here. After 10 years of renting you could have bought a flat with the same money. Uber go beaten by taxi mob, and then they passed laws to make it practically illegal here.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
Made in gb
Norn Queen






Make paper Codexes/Chapter Approved physical collectors items, with a voucher for a digital version which only contains rules included.

Hire a minimum wage intern to read though the reported issues and questions. Literally anyone off the street, they will be better than the people who wrote the codexes.

First of each month, release FAQs and emergency functionality errata on the digital version (i.e. no balance changes, just errata for the broken rules since GW doesn't proofread e.g. the Loot It errata) and release balance errata every 4 months. Chapter Approved will compile all the years errata and FAQ with additional bonus content.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/11/14 10:04:36


 
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




This is seemingly what D&D is becoming. They are moving to a subscription based model where it forces everyone to pay in order to play, so they aren't loosing money to groups of players with one book. And I hate that. It's against what made D&D so successful.

Imagine Monopoly moving to a service where everyone has to own the game in order to play it.

That being said, there is always one, and only one solution to this, and it was succinctly stated by a peppy pink haired pirate.

"YOU ARE A PIRATE!"

Thank Slanesh that there are Russian hackers that upload quality PDFs and digital books.
   
Made in eu
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






There is also the option to move to a subscription system which does not have the primary goal of milking its customers.

Office 365, for example, is a very successful subscription system for both sides - many people can use the same software at home which they use at work/school for a lot less money that those boxes with CDs in them used to cost and Microsoft gets lots of money because more people pay for their office instead of pirating or substituting it.

If you find fair prices for the subscription and provide enough content for that money, people will buy it.
For example you could make cheap subscriptions for people just wanting the rules for one or two codices, let's say half of what an codex ebook costs per year to get that codex updated with FAQ, new rules and point adjustments from CA.
In addition, you can get something costing five times that to get all codices for a year.
Last but not least, for ten times the price of the basic subscription, you can get the Imperator's suscription where you get all the rules, a digital copy of all white dwarfs, kill team, apocalypse, necromunda and a primaris sergeant.

Provide something for those who don't have a lot of money.
Provide something for those who have too much money.
And most importantly: Don't try to rip off your customers.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/14 13:16:08


7 Ork facts people always get wrong:
Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other.
A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot.
Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests.
Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books.
Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor.
Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers.
Orks do not have the power of believe. 
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut






I would pay if it came with an official GW army builder app that updated with the rules changes, had FAQ's and Errata's built in and an easy to use spreadsheet of individual character stats, weapon stats, strategems and psychic powers.

You could even have a "game mode" where you and your opponents upload your lists to each other and it kept track of game turn, sub phases, casualties, wound markers, stat changes. You could see each others open lists.

It could also have a "BatRep" mode where you could create your own batreps and take photos, add captions etc.

I would subscribe to that

Square Bases for Life!
AoS is pure garbage
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 Daedalus81 wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
 flandarz wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I would say no in the strongest possible terms. I want to own what I buy. A Subscription service these days is just "the right to use" not actual ownership. That's why Steam, GoG, EPIC, etc, all are so effective. They aren't selling anything that exists or is physical. They only sell you access to a product.


I mean, that's how a lot of things work. Renting an apartment. Leasing a car. Cab/bus/Uber fare. Cable T.V. Cell Phone plans. Etc.

To be honest, you probably spend more money on things you don't own than on things you do. And that's fine, as long as you're getting value for that money you're spending.


You are not wrong in that, and thank you for pointing it out. But I don't have to lease, I can own. I don't have to rent, I can own. I don't have to lease a cell phone, I can own it.

All of those examples are me. It makes zero fiscal sense to rent/lease/subscribe when you can just pay once, and own. Every major book on wealth accumulation says to never give up money you don't have to. Case in point, buy a car in cash and you avoid paying the stupid doubling of fees for interest charges. Same with a phone, college debt, or a loan.

GW in this instance would be essentially betting on the laziness of their base, saying you would rather pay more money over time, than be forced to do the work of keeping up to date yourself. I am not saying anyone who advocates one way or the other is right, but my personal opinion.

I prefer to buy once, and own it. I hate giving money to people for intangible goods/services.


But what if "renting" gave you access to all the books at a cost that is far less than buying all those books, which expire 2 or 3 or 4 years down the road, as well as other benefits?

I used to value buying DVDs, but that gak is cumbersome and in 10 years the format will change and I'd have to buy a whole other set of movies I already owned. Getting movies digitally is just more sensible...and more green for the planet.

I get the feeling of ownership, but sometimes stuff is just...stuff. I'll thumb through my old codexes occasionally for a hit of nostalgia, but that's like a minute of time and my life doesn't really change other than needing to store more things.



Great point. Personally, this is why I am going digital as much as I can. I'm that guy who bought a ton of movies from Blockbuster before they went out of business, and used to buy up a ton of movies on Black Friday from the stores... its nice to have all the movies you want, but Netflix and online services replace that. My wife can watch 10 seasons of her favorite TV show endlessly and we pay... $200-ish a year? Thats what.... 8 movies? We get FAR more than 8 movies with just one subscription service.

I agree with buying and owning for larger purchases, however on a smaller scale its not as cut and dry. Again, it comes down to what we would get for the subscription model. Am I getting access to ALL of the content that comes out? We spend at least $40 a year for CA right? Well, if I spent say $60 a year ($5/mo) for all access, then that is actually less money out of pocket per year. We wouldn't need to worry about the cost of a new edition, because we just get the new updated stuff.... and plus there aren't those old previous edition books on the bookshelf that just collect dust.

Its going to come down to price and content.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Brutus_Apex wrote:
I would pay if it came with an official GW army builder app that updated with the rules changes, had FAQ's and Errata's built in and an easy to use spreadsheet of individual character stats, weapon stats, strategems and psychic powers.

You could even have a "game mode" where you and your opponents upload your lists to each other and it kept track of game turn, sub phases, casualties, wound markers, stat changes. You could see each others open lists.

It could also have a "BatRep" mode where you could create your own batreps and take photos, add captions etc.

I would subscribe to that


Basically, they just need to make a 40k app like they have for AOS, which includes an army builder in it - in concept at least. I don't subscribe to that, but I use the app for my digital AOS books.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/14 16:04:35


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Having the option to rent is, I feel, good for a certain portion of the customer base and I think GW is far behind the times in not having some sort of online tool to view content and most especially have some sort of army builder software.

At the same time, I generally prefer something I can keep forever. For the last few years I have migrating my physical game books to electronic versions, but they are generally PDFs so I can continue to access them even if the company goes under or moves on to a new rule system.

And, of course, I use BattleScribe to put together army lists for use in 40K and other games.

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