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As the subject says, what do you think poses the greater threat to the galaxy: Chaos or Tyranids?

Chaos may be more malignant and more consistent in its threat, but do the all-consuming Tyranids pose the greater threat?

Also, is it perhaps easier to envisage overcoming Chaos than it is overcoming the Tyranids?

Is perhaps another faction an even bigger threat that I haven't even considered...

Orks.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Orks.

I see where you're coming from, but personally I feel Orks actually provide a kind of natural balance to the galaxy rather than posing a great threat.

I also think Orks, being Orks, are in it for the fight - not for any ultimate objective. Sometimes this makes them more dangerous, but as a threat to the galaxy, I feel it makes them less so.

Before Abbadon gave the galaxy a backside crack, i'd imagine Nids.

There's a standing theory that Chaos doesn't actually want to win the war. That the Great Gods will forever pull their support from the mortal champions to ensure that they fail so that the war is prolonged forever. As they feed off the mortal suffering and emotions and turmoil of war they basically want to prolong the conflict. For them an endless war that never ends is basically the ideal feeding ground. Plus it stops pesky forces like the Eldar from getting their heads up and causing all kinds of their own trouble.


Orks I have to agree almost seem like a galactic balancing system. The size of their waaarghs appears to be defined partly by resistance. If enough resistance mounts then more and more orks unit and once that resistance is gone they collapse into infighting.


Tyranids have an objective which we have no idea what it is. Thus far the Imperium assumes all the Tyranids want to do is eat - EVERYTHING. Which in itself is pretty disastrous for the rest of the life in the Galaxy. Furthermore Tyranids have unkown potential as its not known what context the fleets we've seen are to the greater body of the Tyranids. Are they scouts or the last fleets of a dying race. It's really unknown (as is much of the Tyranids).
Suffice to say that they are one of two forces that has no desire to see other life in the Galaxy, plus they most likely have the means to carry out their intention without pause.


The other threat is Necrons, however the greater bulk of their forces still slumbers. Furthermore they appear to, as they awaken more, be suffering from some splits in their viewpoints. However like the Tyranids they do seek the destruction of all life in the Galaxy, though seeing as they did it before and failed it suggests that they might not have the means to fully carry out their plans.



So I would say of Chaos or Tyranids the Tyranids are the far greater threat.

Chaos is the greatest threat in pretty much every conceivable way. Tyranids are ultimately just a logistical problem.

Tyranids are the only ones who featured in visions devouring the Galaxy and leaving nothing alive behind. Chaos needs you alive but Tyranids need you in their belly.

The thing is, this thread question is a little too vague. What does the poster mean, exactly, by "threat to the galaxy"? The biggest threat to all living things? The biggest threat to humanity? The biggest threat to existence?

Chaos is the only force that may literally wipe the galaxy out of existence, that I know of. It is probably the largest threat to humanity as a whole, because it is insidious and corrupting.

Tyranids will eat everything, but their threat level is relatively unknown and honestly getting eaten is one of the nicer things to happen in 40k. I mean compared to becoming the face of a living cape eternally in horrendous pain? Or transferring your consciousness into a metallic body that can't feel and forever missing the sensation of feeling until you go insane? Yea getting eaten doesn't seem so bad.

Orks are quite happy with the current status quo, they don't want change as the galaxy is exactly how they want it (war everywhere). In many ways, Orks may be "winning" the great war in terms of getting what they want collectively (which makes sense, because they are the most prolific species and their psychic gestalt can affect reality).

Eldar aren't really a threat by intention, but they might accidentally cause another catastrophe ala the fall.

The biggest threat to *the galaxy* is Chaos, as demonstrated by the fact that its followers have already put a big chip in part of it. I mean, really, all of you entities existing in the galaxy, you're not getting your security deposit back unless you fix that.

* Chaos - Already broke part of the galaxy. Going to get in trouble with landlord.
* Necrons - Trying to kick everyone else out of the galaxy. Landlord probably approves, as long as nothing else gets broken.
* Eldar - Weird people, but haven't broken anything yet. But getting side-eye for that whole 'web way' thing.
* Imperium - Landlord needs to talk to the tenants, to find out if this Chaos is their friend or whatever.
* Tyranids - Haven't been returning phone calls or answering questions about the new lease, but their check cleared.
* Orks - Mostly harmless
* Tau - Who?

We all know the most dangerous thing is the hair squig.

An all-powerful race of mice-spiders who will immobilize human beings in giant webs in order to steal cheese.

Of all the threats to humanity in 40K, the vast majority are threatening humanity with some form of enslavement or foreign domination. Whether it be to Orks, to Dark Eldar, to the C'tan, to the Chaos gods, Tau, or whatever humanity would still survive albeit in some oppressed or degraded fashion. The manner of survival may be repugnant to the reader but the species as a whole would still survive even if the life of any one individual is short or brutal.

However Tyranids present a different sort of threat: that of total and utter extinction for the individual and the species. That is where their horror lies: they don't care about you. You are not even a plaything or slave to them. Other races and factions care enough to hate and oppose your ideals, or look down on you as primitive and barbaric or effete and wimpy. The Tyranids are like an implacable and uncaring force of nature, and puts individuals of all races in their place as insignificant specks in a hostile but most of all uncaring universe, to be swept away in an avalanche of claws and teeth.

Like mice-spiders.

Iracundus wrote:
Of all the threats to humanity in 40K, the vast majority are threatening humanity with some form of enslavement or foreign domination. Whether it be to Orks, to Dark Eldar, to the C'tan, to the Chaos gods, Tau, or whatever humanity would still survive albeit in some oppressed or degraded fashion. The manner of survival may be repugnant to the reader but the species as a whole would still survive even if the life of any one individual is short or brutal.

However Tyranids present a different sort of threat: that of total and utter extinction for the individual and the species. That is where their horror lies: they don't care about you. You are not even a plaything or slave to them. Other races and factions care enough to hate and oppose your ideals, or look down on you as primitive and barbaric or effete and wimpy. The Tyranids are like an implacable and uncaring force of nature, and puts individuals of all races in their place as insignificant specks in a hostile but most of all uncaring universe, to be swept away in an avalanche of claws and teeth.

It’s the combination of threats that is the real problem. Though Tyranids would wipe humanity to a man - they would also wipe other races indiscriminately which could benefit humanity in many ways. Tyranids do not focus their attacks on humanity primarily, so they wouldn’t focus them over any other race.

Orks fight the biggest and hardest thing going - and are described akin to a virus or cancer in that once they have their mind set on a war zone or faction they will perpetually attack it until it is destroyed. It is likely that Orks deal such a crippling blow that humanity simply can’t recover. Orks very nearly ended humanity in the Beast Arises series - they teleported ‘ambassadors’ onto Terra, in the Imperial palace no less, and only through their mood was humanity not annihilated. The attack moon could’ve munched Terra (and the Emperor) at any time and it’s effectively gg humanity. So even if they don’t wipe them to a man, the risk is that Orks deal such a grievous wound that humanity is left completely defenceless as another faction cleans up the remains and the Orks go off to fight another race that gives them a better fight.

Chaos is actively trying to destroy humanity (or are they?) and want to obliterate reality. The ‘problem’ with Chaos is that it’s inconsistent and fickle. How many crusades did poor Abby have to try before he did anything of real note? I get the feeling that Chaos would never completely wipe out humanity, or even those elements that oppose it, because that would be too final.

I think one key to realise is that Chaos (at least the four gods, not the warriors) views the Galaxy like a farm. They are tending their crop of suffering and war. So for them whilst they will reap a harvest every so often; they don't actually want to take everything in one go otherwise there's nothing for tomorrow (and whilst time has no meaning in the Warp it does have meaning in Reality. Thus we can suppose that if reality had no more food (life) for Chaos then Chaos would forever and always and never end.

Tyranids are more akin to locusts in their activity. They are (currently and in so far as we've seen) consuming everything in their path with an apparent single approach to devouring without any consideration of leaving life behind to rejuvenate. If we consider them as potentially a "passing through the galaxy" race then this makes sense; they swarm through, feed and then leave - moving onto another Galaxy.


In theory Tyranids might well leave some worlds untouched if they are far enough out of the way or surrounded by many dead systems with nothing to attract them. However any major race is bound to be torn apart.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

Iracundus wrote:
Of all the threats to humanity in 40K, the vast majority are threatening humanity with some form of enslavement or foreign domination. Whether it be to Orks, to Dark Eldar, to the C'tan, to the Chaos gods, Tau, or whatever humanity would still survive albeit in some oppressed or degraded fashion. The manner of survival may be repugnant to the reader but the species as a whole would still survive even if the life of any one individual is short or brutal.

However Tyranids present a different sort of threat: that of total and utter extinction for the individual and the species. That is where their horror lies: they don't care about you. You are not even a plaything or slave to them. Other races and factions care enough to hate and oppose your ideals, or look down on you as primitive and barbaric or effete and wimpy. The Tyranids are like an implacable and uncaring force of nature, and puts individuals of all races in their place as insignificant specks in a hostile but most of all uncaring universe, to be swept away in an avalanche of claws and teeth.

It’s the combination of threats that is the real problem. Though Tyranids would wipe humanity to a man - they would also wipe other races indiscriminately which could benefit humanity in many ways. Tyranids do not focus their attacks on humanity primarily, so they wouldn’t focus them over any other race.

Actually the Tyranids would end up focusing more on humanity, even though they do also attack other races. One (though not the only) of the methods the Tyranid fleets are steered to targets is via the psychic beacons of Genestealer Cults. Though not immune to Genestealer infection, the other alien races that have Codices have various factors (described in the GSC Codex) that make Genestealers less likely to establish a cult of significant size. Humanity is numerous and far-flung throughout the galaxy, while lacking those protective factors so more human worlds would fall prey to GSC, leading to human worlds more often than not being the target of the Tyranid fleets.

Tyranids.

They are able to replace themselves at an absorbent rate, recycling and reusing bio-matter from themselves or others to make more. Chaos, while powerful at the moment, what with the Fall of Cadia and the second Warp Rift/Cicatrix Maledictum cutting off half of the Imperium, aren't able to recruit new forces at the rate that Tyranids are. What we are seeing are the "fingers" of the Tyranid force. That being said, the hand comes next and then the rest of the body. In other words, we are only seeing a taste of what is to come.

 Psionara wrote:
Tyranids.

They are able to replace themselves at an absorbent rate, recycling and reusing bio-matter from themselves or others to make more. Chaos, while powerful at the moment, what with the Fall of Cadia and the second Warp Rift/Cicatrix Maledictum cutting off half of the Imperium, aren't able to recruit new forces at the rate that Tyranids are. What we are seeing are the "fingers" of the Tyranid force. That being said, the hand comes next and then the rest of the body. In other words, we are only seeing a taste of what is to come.

Chaos has an endless supply of daemons.

Tyranids.

While chaos does a lot of running about and posing, tyranids are usually written as an inevitable end, that they've already reached a critical mass that can't be stopped and there are even more coming. Its makes for a somewhat boring and repetitive set up, but they've reached a point where everything is so incredibly extra doomed that it doesn't really matter.

TV Tropes has the Evil Versus Oblivion trope for just this situation.

"Evil" is about cruelty, oppression and suffering, forever and ever. Chaos is evil.

"Oblivion" is about the destruction of everything... or at the very least, the extinction of free will. Tyranids are all about oblivion.

Of course, the debate about who poses the greater threat is often more about the respective power of both parties (therefore, their likelihood to win) than about the undesirability of them winning. But if I really had to choose, and assuming one side or the other has to win (that is to say, the "good guys" don't stand a chance), I would rather side with the cruel bad guys who preserve free will than with the emotionless bad guys who destroy free will.

I would see Tyranids as the greater threat.


.

Humans can come back after chaos. Chaos just wants to pepetuate war, suffering etc. and requires that life exist in the galaxy.

A Tyranid victory means a lifeless galaxy once the Nids move on. Destruction is absolute.

Animus wrote:

 Psionara wrote:
Tyranids.

They are able to replace themselves at an absorbent rate, recycling and reusing bio-matter from themselves or others to make more. Chaos, while powerful at the moment, what with the Fall of Cadia and the second Warp Rift/Cicatrix Maledictum cutting off half of the Imperium, aren't able to recruit new forces at the rate that Tyranids are. What we are seeing are the "fingers" of the Tyranid force. That being said, the hand comes next and then the rest of the body. In other words, we are only seeing a taste of what is to come.

Chaos has an endless supply of daemons.

It's true that they CAN have an endless supply, but need sentient beings and their emotions to fuel the factory. With Tyranids eating away at the Milky Way and its inhabitants, Daemons will always be short of infinity. That can also be said for the Tyranids as Chaos can wring in certain parts of the Materium into their dimension. One could say that this is a situation where an unstoppable force meets an immovable object.

Chaos on one side, Tyranids on the other, and the Orkz in the middle saying: "I dunno wut ya Gitz are komplainin' bout. I'm 'aving a 'ell ova gud toim!"

Animus wrote:

 Psionara wrote:
Tyranids.

They are able to replace themselves at an absorbent rate, recycling and reusing bio-matter from themselves or others to make more. Chaos, while powerful at the moment, what with the Fall of Cadia and the second Warp Rift/Cicatrix Maledictum cutting off half of the Imperium, aren't able to recruit new forces at the rate that Tyranids are. What we are seeing are the "fingers" of the Tyranid force. That being said, the hand comes next and then the rest of the body. In other words, we are only seeing a taste of what is to come.

Chaos has an endless supply of daemons.

But those daemons only exist while there are sentient beings in the materium feeding them psychically in the immaterium.

Chaos. Just as hard to beat logistically due to their ability to either use conquered people to summon daemons or create new followers, and with far more formidable and dangerous individuals making up its leadership. The Swarmlord is powerful and dangerous, but pales before powerhouses like the Daemon Primarchs or some of the more powerful sorcerers and Champions.

 Void__Dragon wrote:
The Swarmlord is powerful and dangerous, but pales before powerhouses like the Daemon Primarchs or some of the more powerful sorcerers and Champions.

The swarmlord is not ment to be a powerhouse. Its the hive minds ultimate general, deployed to win wars - not fights.
That being said, the SL has (sadly) gone from being an unbeatable monster, to a punching bag for named characters. I will give you that.

I feel like y'all are under-estimating mice-spiders.

Kind of depends on your definition of 'Threat'.

Because nids want to eat the galaxy and leave it barren and lifeless to fuel their intergalactic expansion. That's not exactly great for the inhabitants of the galaxy, but technically, the galaxy will continue to exist, more or less as it has for eons. Just less life.

Chaos' goal is nebulous, but probably involves a lot of warp fuckery which could actually damage the galaxy, such as the recent chaos crack in reality.

If chaos gets their way, those cracks in reality get bigger and bigger until it starts to consume realspace - planets, stars and the like. At that point, they actually ARE doing damage to the galaxy. And mork knows what happens after that.

I'd rate chaos as being more destructive, overall, because of that.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
I feel like y'all are under-estimating mice-spiders.

Mice-Spiders are the greatest threat.

 Kap'n Krump wrote:
Kind of depends on your definition of 'Threat'.

Because nids want to eat the galaxy and leave it barren and lifeless to fuel their intergalactic expansion. That's not exactly great for the inhabitants of the galaxy, but technically, the galaxy will continue to exist, more or less as it has for eons. Just less life.

Chaos' goal is nebulous, but probably involves a lot of warp fuckery which could actually damage the galaxy, such as the recent chaos crack in reality.

If chaos gets their way, those cracks in reality get bigger and bigger until it starts to consume realspace - planets, stars and the like. At that point, they actually ARE doing damage to the galaxy. And mork knows what happens after that.

I'd rate chaos as being more destructive, overall, because of that.

So Tyranids are the greater threat to life, but Chaos are the greater threat to spacetime?