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Quite simply, what is Games Workshop's plan for the "Astra Militarum?"

As of this year over 70% of the regiments no longer are supported with models. Of the regiments that remain one just had its homeworld destroyed (Cadia) and its greatest hero (Creed) pokeball'd. Yes I am aware they're likely billions of Cadians left in the galaxy but their models are saturated to the point of non interest. Leaving us with DKoK & Catachans. Unless you want to take out second mortgage DKoK isn't realistic for most people, leaving Catachans. I love Catachans, they are great but most of their models are 20+ years old. Which leads to my opening, what is going on with the IG? For an army that is supposed to be composed of untold trillions of bodies consisting of countless regiments, there is basically no model support. Many of the regiments have models that are 15-20+ years old. How many more years do we have to wait to see new models? Is there even plans to support these regiments or does Games Workshop simply plan to primaris the guard & exile all of their old customer base?

I've basically checked out this edition. Despite being the main fighting force of the Imperium & likely responsible for over 90% of the fighting we barely receive mention. Its non stop primaris. Non stop. I'm happy Sisters of Battle are finally getting model support after waiting for decades. How much longer do guard players have to wait to receive similar treatment when many of our regiments are just as old or older?

Lastly & somewhat offtopic but I recently learned Mephiston is to become primaris? Let me see if I understand this correctly. One of the oldest living space marines, who is one of the only blood angels immune to red thirst proving his genetic superiority, feels the need to undergo primaris treatment that has a 61.6% fatality rate for a minor increase in performance? Forgive me but this is grey knights killing sisters of battle & wiping their blood on their armor levels of stupid.

Up until the latest Marine book I feel like it's been non-stop complaining about guardsmen by many marine players.

But in general, I hope for new Guard minis to replace the Cadians.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Up until the latest Marine book I feel like it's been non-stop complaining about guardsmen by many marine players.

But in general, I hope for new Guard minis to replace the Cadians.

Which regiment are you hoping for?

Yeah, unfortunately, GW is doubling down on marines in their self-fulfilling prophecy that marines are the only things that will sell. Hence why even in Faith and Fury, generic SM (not including BT) got even MORE options available to them that were largely unnecessary. I think the fact that the Cadian and Catachan troop kits are plastic is the main reason why GW haven't bothered updating them unfortunately, since the vast majority of IG players have all the infantry squads they need. They only seem to have any immediacy to creating new plastic kits if they were previously metal or finecast (Incubi and Banshees), or for completely new factions like Ossiarch Bonereapers or new things for marines. I think the other issue is that the IG range is largely plastic at this point, since only a few things (mainly support staff, specila weapons and ratlings) are finecast. So they are similar to the Freeguild side of AoS, who haven't gotten anything new for all of Age of Sigmar so far. On the plus side, with the traitor guardsmen in Blackstone Fortress, they have shown what a potential redesign of the cadian models would look like. I think the only impetus they would have for redesigning them is to incorporate the full set of SW in their squads, since right now the flamer and grenade launcher are the only ones available outside of the command squads.

If they were to replace Cadians as the poster boy regiment, I would feel that Armageddon Steel Legion is a good candidate since they have a good baseline for other greatcoat regiments while also being one of the more prominent regiments being tied to Armageddon as one of the lynchpin planets still left standing in the Imperium.

Far more than the lack of new model support (as I've not been terribly impressed with any of GW's updates to models like the Russ, Chimera, Hydra) is the constant reduction in value of many of these kits. Gone are the accessory sprues from vehicles, for no reduced price of the vehicle kits and available instead at a $15 price tag separately. The same box of 10 cadians we have now used to be a box of 20 for the same price.

The lack of new models doesn't terribly irritate me, the Cadians are actually pretty good as long as you head-swap them, but I do wish they'd move to a more greatcoat/gas-mask type kit. Something that can do something along the lines of an Armageddon/Krieg/Vostroyan type thing.

To be fair, at least the IG function as an army this edition in terms of rules, and aren't just competitive roadkill like they were in most of 3rd-7th (with the exception of 5th and a couple artillery-unit focused builds during part of 6th). I've got a large collection of existing models and units and that matters a bit more to me as a result.

As for it being All Space Marines All The Time and Primaris!Primaris!Primaris! well...that's unfortunately nothing new and is pretty par for the course with GW .

No real answer, but thoughts;

Simply put, old metal lines are going away, and the whole fine cast debacle has not extended anything. So, Cadian and Catachan are the two plastic lines existing. Do I want a plastic tallarn, or The First or whatever? Sure...

I suspect part of the IG dearth of model support is the Cadian line. It really isn't just Cadians, but supposed to be the generic uniform of a force galaxy wide. Paint it those colors and it's cadian. Paint it different, do a head swap, add a cloak, whatever, and it's a unit from any one of a million other planets recruited and equipped by the Imperium. This isn't really a good defense of course.

Also, the massive amount of third part minis available puts a crimp on where GW can go. Anything they produce must compete somewhat with third party companies (some doing far better work than even a few years ago). Since GW's model is maximize profit immediately upon release, they need to be very careful what, when and how much of any new line that has massive competition they release.

I know, nothing special to see here, but my input.

edwardmyst wrote:
No real answer, but thoughts;

Simply put, old metal lines are going away, and the whole fine cast debacle has not extended anything. So, Cadian and Catachan are the two plastic lines existing. Do I want a plastic tallarn, or The First or whatever? Sure...

I suspect part of the IG dearth of model support is the Cadian line. It really isn't just Cadians, but supposed to be the generic uniform of a force galaxy wide. Paint it those colors and it's cadian. Paint it different, do a head swap, add a cloak, whatever, and it's a unit from any one of a million other planets recruited and equipped by the Imperium. This isn't really a good defense of course.

Also, the massive amount of third part minis available puts a crimp on where GW can go. Anything they produce must compete somewhat with third party companies (some doing far better work than even a few years ago). Since GW's model is maximize profit immediately upon release, they need to be very careful what, when and how much of any new line that has massive competition they release.

I know, nothing special to see here, but my input.

I think the fact that there are so many explicitly "not-IG" guard regiment 3rd party models proves that GW dropped the ball when it came to providing IG more regimental model options, given that especially in this edition they gave back actual rules for regimental doctrines in the army. Sure, you can use Cadians/Catachans, slap a different coat of paint on them to make your own "custom" regiment, but when the whole purpose of the guard is to show the diversity of the Imperium's largest fighting force and you're stuck with two largely dated lines for models, people are going to search elsewhere. The worst part is that given the amount of Primaris lieutenant variants GW has created (not to mention SM captains, etc), shows that they easily have the capability to release a few core regimental boxes but would rather opt for Raven Guard/UM upgrade kits, because its a "guaranteed sell" rather than risk investing in their other model lines. Which is a shame, because I think they wouldn't have had the issue of needing to add an entirely new SM line so quickly if they had spent more time keeping other factions updated as well.

GW has put themselves into a corner with regard to the Imperial Guard (or Imperial Army if you're old enough). Originally they had one generic look because the Imperial Army plastics were one box, and a line of metals.

In 2nd edition with the ease of metal production they decided to expand into numerous regiments (which is far more likely and realistic - and is more in line with the later fluff, and the new...old? fluff from stuff like the Horus Heresy). Then when they dove into plastics again they had to retcon their own narrative and go back to "Well, really everyone uses Cadian style gear..." simply because they couldn't afford to manage 6-7 lines of plastic Imperial Guard kits.

Cadians are fething boring, and not representative of the likelihood that Guard regiments across the vast gulf of space would all wear the same crap. They look like B-movie extras from Starship Troopers. Luckily the 3rd party environment is literally awash in characterful, interesting alternate models for a variety of regiments. As much as I detest resin, I would just go full 3rd party for a Guard army.

Even now, GW knows they can't afford to sell 5-6-7 lines of plastic Guard boxes. I still think they should do two aesthetics (semi-normal, and greatcoats), do a command, heavy weapon, and basic squad for each (hell throw in a Rough Rider box while we're at it)...and in each line, have 3-4 head options. This would at least give the GW plastics some vague form of variety. Guard were hurt the most when GW started killing off the metal lines.

The plastic Cadian are basically shown as the 'default' look of guardsmen. I agree they are relatively old, but whilst the basic Cadian infantry squad is comparable in age to the metal battle sisters - they came out just after the eye of terror campaign - GW has added a full range of plastic characters, heavy weapons, and command squads with all the special weapon, standards, etc in it over the years.
Plus the scions give you a second, newer and equally flexible range, and you're one of the only factions with a flexible codex TITANIC unit in the form of the whateverbladehammerlord.

Appearance in the fluff - I agree. Guard have always been underrepresented, but it's especially noticeable at the moment. Ironically there are great 'basic human infantry' ranges but necromunda ranges are moving away from guardsmen-esque weapons: I'm not sure how easily a ranger box could produce a counts-as squad.

I don't know what they'll do. You're right that they've basically got 'complete ranges, so short of a primaris-type event (And I'm not sure how something like that would even work) there's limited scope for new models. The sheer number of extent tank ranges is a case in point.

What I'd love to see, actually, is an expansion of the elutarian starstriders. Theyre new and look great, but currently only a single squad exists. The rogue trader armsmen aren't quite the same as guardsmen but they're gorgeous models and I'd love to see a full range of them.

I think the overarching question should be, what are GWs plans for 40k?

Ive said this before but before GW was synonymous with 40k. Now every article is about one of the side games, AOS etc.

It seems they are heavily focused on those and 40k feels pretty neglected. (Yes, I know SM got lots of stuff...But SM is not 40k..)

With the whole chaos thing and story arcs progressing it all seems very end timesish.

GW won't end times 40k. There's way too much money at risk in doing so

Plus Psy Awakening isn't really like End Times. It ended with f all happening except a ridiculous fight between Hexbane and Eldar and a load of dumbassery before it.

pm713 wrote:
GW won't end times 40k. There's way too much money at risk in doing so

Plus Psy Awakening isn't really like End Times. It ended with f all happening except a ridiculous fight between Hexbane and Eldar and a load of dumbassery before it.

Post end times 40`k would still have marines though...without those xenox NPC factions that don't sell as well so problem solved ?
I'm joking of course I dont think they will actually end times it proper.

But I do think GW seems to be trying to distance itself from 40k. Maybe its the community? Haven't been paying attention to their FB but if its anything like dakka but without filters/mods... Yaaaiks!

There is vastly more potential in Guarad regiments - they are so diverse and different.

But Marines.........

I would play guard if they had better variety of sculpts. I'm not afraid of converting but doing that 100+ times for a decent force and I suddenly have lost interest.

I love the DKOK aesthetic but not in the wallet, was considering Elysians but bam not available and Steel Legion but...

They need to do something, Solar Auxilia look great and should be redone in plastic(as much as possible).

40K already had its end times with the Fall of Cadia. Abby ripped the galaxy in two, which was far more relevant than the Psychic Awakening stuff or Vigilus seem to be.

As for the Guard... If I played them and wanted to keep it cheap and didn't want to go to GW tournaments, I'd take whatever historical miniatures I like, equip them with any kind of lasrifle or autogun I like and never waste money on these outdated and rather ugly Cadians or Catachans. Every Guard player (and Ork or Tyranid player) should be aware that whenever GW should decide to redo their Basic troops it will also mean a massive increase in price, but not in points. You'll still need(and/or want) 100 Guardsmen for your Basic Battaillons, but now you'll have to pay 40€ for 10 of them.

There really needs to be new infantry models for the Guard. The Cadians are just old and awkwardly proportioned and the Catachans are even worse.

Most people here seem to lack imagination or feels their collection must 100% GW, or must be build like the box art without any modifications. IG is one of the easiest range to make it uniquely your own.

My Cadians have their eagles sanded off and added catachan bits.
https://imgur.com/gallery/7Kr6Vcc

EDIT: suggestions: IG kits are widely interchangeable with other GW kits, like GSC range, skitarii, AoS free people(as in the old WD for plastic praetorians); 3rd party madrobot miniatures for head/torso swaps that will be legal for tourneys, or go full 3rd party.

True but would it not be nice to have some official models rather than endless Marines.

 Big Mac wrote:
Most people here seem to lack imagination or feels their collection must 100% GW, or must be build like the box art without any modifications. IG is one of the easiest range to make it uniquely your own.

My Cadians have their eagles sanded off and added catachan bits.
https://imgur.com/gallery/7Kr6Vcc

EDIT: suggestions: IG kits are widely interchangeable with other GW kits, like GSC range, skitarii, AoS free people(as in the old WD for plastic praetorians); 3rd party madrobot miniatures for head/torso swaps that will be legal for tourneys, or go full 3rd party.

Given that guard are already one of the more expensive armies to collect, I don't think it's unreasonable that people would want more variety without having to buy other full price kits just to customize them beyond the pretty bland offerings they have right now between Cadians and Catachans. If GW still offered bitz services, then I'd be all for it. As it is currently, it makes an expensive army even more expensive, and it doesn't solve the core issue of the main infantry kits for guard being pretty outdated.

 Grimskul wrote:

 Big Mac wrote:
Most people here seem to lack imagination or feels their collection must 100% GW, or must be build like the box art without any modifications. IG is one of the easiest range to make it uniquely your own.

My Cadians have their eagles sanded off and added catachan bits.
https://imgur.com/gallery/7Kr6Vcc

EDIT: suggestions: IG kits are widely interchangeable with other GW kits, like GSC range, skitarii, AoS free people(as in the old WD for plastic praetorians); 3rd party madrobot miniatures for head/torso swaps that will be legal for tourneys, or go full 3rd party.

Given that guard are already one of the more expensive armies to collect, I don't think it's unreasonable that people would want more variety without having to buy other full price kits just to customize them beyond the pretty bland offerings they have right now between Cadians and Catachans. If GW still offered bitz services, then I'd be all for it. As it is currently, it makes an expensive army even more expensive, and it doesn't solve the core issue of the main infantry kits for guard being pretty outdated.

Anvil is atm cheaper then gw here for infantry.
Also with the bsf traitor guardsmen gw showed they could deliever great cadians

Just a thought

Warcry basically took the concept of Chaos Marauders and made 8 brand new dynamic kits from that concept. If that sells well and does ok then it might be something that GW considers for Imperial Guard. They'd still end up with a core of unified models; but you could see them release a selection of world-themed infantry with heavy weapons teams etc... in their own plastic boxed set.

It won't get back to the days of old where they could do an entire themed regiment of models in metal per subgroup; but they could at least do the core infantry and then let gamers use conversions and paint for the standard models. Plus they can release unique commisars and such steadily over the years as they desire.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just a thought

Warcry basically took the concept of Chaos Marauders and made 8 brand new dynamic kits from that concept. If that sells well and does ok then it might be something that GW considers for Imperial Guard. They'd still end up with a core of unified models; but you could see them release a selection of world-themed infantry with heavy weapons teams etc... in their own plastic boxed set.

It won't get back to the days of old where they could do an entire themed regiment of models in metal per subgroup; but they could at least do the core infantry and then let gamers use conversions and paint for the standard models. Plus they can release unique commisars and such steadily over the years as they desire.

I have a sneaky suspicion that it won't be a huge distance in the future that we get plastic multi-pose DKoK or Steel Legion.

The latter would tie in with a new Armageddon campaign which my be the point of release for the highly rumoured new Ghazzy model.

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Up until the latest Marine book I feel like it's been non-stop complaining about guardsmen by many marine players.

But in general, I hope for new Guard minis to replace the Cadians.

Which regiment are you hoping for?

No regiment in particular, but I always revert to the original greatcoat artwork. I don't even mind the Cadian aesthetic in the artwork, it's just the models themselves are pretty blocky.

A kit that included various regimental upgrade bits would be phenominal. Different heads, decorations, styles of lasguns and kit, etc.

 NoiseMarine with Tinnitus wrote:
I have a sneaky suspicion that it won't be a huge distance in the future that we get plastic multi-pose DKoK or Steel Legion.

The latter would tie in with a new Armageddon campaign which my be the point of release for the highly rumoured new Ghazzy model.

I'd get behind this if true!

I am really wondering when Creed is going to come back.

 Overread wrote:
Just a thought

Warcry basically took the concept of Chaos Marauders and made 8 brand new dynamic kits from that concept. If that sells well and does ok then it might be something that GW considers for Imperial Guard. They'd still end up with a core of unified models; but you could see them release a selection of world-themed infantry with heavy weapons teams etc... in their own plastic boxed set.

It won't get back to the days of old where they could do an entire themed regiment of models in metal per subgroup; but they could at least do the core infantry and then let gamers use conversions and paint for the standard models.

Or they could fluff it as the material that was destined for the Cadian Gate and the Cadian Sector has been diverted elsewhere. That stuff is, effectively, coming from an STC. One of the weirder things about the Guard is how much of a big deal they always made about there being no room for individuality and yet...individuality is everywhere.

Plus they can release unique commisars and such steadily over the years as they desire.

...Why would there be "unique Commissars"? That's like saying "unique Regimental Scions". Commissars aren't raised up as part of the Regiment, they're thrown into the mix from elsewhere.

I think Cadians need to stay. They look generic enough without being bland, and realistic enough to look like and feel like military while still having "dark sci-fi" theme going on. Cadians are almost perfect. If their entire abdomen was covered in flak armour then they would be perfect.

Also, the fact most Cadian guardsmen dont have masks/covered faces like space marines and the high tech xenos sets them apart and shows us they are the backbone military of the Imperium.

This, among other reasons, is why they must stay as the guard's posterboys

 Kanluwen wrote:

Plus they can release unique commisars and such steadily over the years as they desire.

...Why would there be "unique Commissars"? That's like saying "unique Regimental Scions". Commissars aren't raised up as part of the Regiment, they're thrown into the mix from elsewhere.

I was more plucking commisars as a higher rank that I could think of. Granted even if they are thrown in from elsewhere its my impression that many of the more notable ones tend to become influenced by the guardsmen they lead.


That said I can certainly see Cadians being the backbone grunt and then GW can flavour in other bands around the edges. There's a lot of potential for them, it really depends how much of an investment they want to make.

I find it one of the more confusing aspects of 40k currently. GW are able and willing to have 9 plastic cool boxsets for each Nercromunda Gang and 9 WarCry Warbands but when it comes to the guard? 2x 20+ year old boxsets of seriously dated models.

I think they should go for a Full IG release. With plastic box sets for several regiments. A command boxset, character clam pack and a "weapons box" with a selection of heavy weapons and special weapons that could be used by all of the regiments.

Eventually they'll update Guard. Its almost guaranteed I think.

I suspect that when they do though there won't be any special models for different regiments. It'll be one, probably new aesthetic and that is your lot. Like most/all other factions.

I could even see GW going all in on the Tempestus Scions aesthetic and making the other regimental models legacy (at some point in the far future, not now). Tempestus scions are unique, easily trademarkable and fit the current 40k setting perfectly so I could see them leaning into them.

All of this is speculation of course, I have no leaks to back this up or anything.