Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 frankelee wrote:
Of course their new stuff like Reaper Black doesn't even give GW that much of an edge.

Never mind Bones... Wargames Atlantic is putting out a box of LOTR trolls that'll probably be 9 or 12 for $35

Warhammer wrote:Download the free rules for the Middle-earth Strategy Battle Game and unit profiles for the new Battlehost boxes here: https://bit.ly/3cQVymP

They're 'just' Quickstart Rules, but it's better than nothing...

Let's pretend I don't know anything at all about MESBG. Are the new army boxes an okay buy? Do they need a lot of other purchases to play regular sized games? Are those four factions good to play? What else do I need?

Yes, they're very good. You're essentially getting a unit for free. All of them are good armies, and no you don't need too much else. Probably a command box and maybe an extra troop/cavalry box. Then you can look at expanding to more elite units from there. Typical points range at around 700-800 but the game is more designed in mind with scenario play.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Let's pretend I don't know anything at all about MESBG. Are the new army boxes an okay buy? Do they need a lot of other purchases to play regular sized games? Are those four factions good to play? What else do I need?

Yes indeed, they are a great core to each of those 4 armies. Each includes a mighty hero who'd you wind up eventually getting as well. Here's some of my thoughts about them, in no particular order:


Minas Tirith focuses us primarily on, obviously, Minas Tirith. the Gondor Commanders pack and a pack of Citadel Guard will do wonders. Maybe even add Beregond for some siege of MT theme (with Gandalf the White). Obviously the Starter + Minas Tirith is very useful for continuing an Osgiliath theme as well.

Mordor box is wonderful for going Angmar or Mordor. New Starter + Mordor even better for Mordor for a mix of the soldier orcs, orc rabble, warg riders, and some trolls. In either Angmar or Mordor, adding the box of orc commanders is useful. For Mordor, how about some Morgul Knights and the Mouth of Sauron? For Angmar, can't go wrong with some spooky stuff like Spectres and Barrow-Wights!

The obvious pairing here would be Starter + Minas Tirith + Mordor box and you'll have just a pile of War of the Ring in Gondor options to choose from, maybe adding a Fell-Beast for late War of the Ring, and Boromir to go with his bro for earlier pre-Fellowship reclamation of Osgiliath.

Rohan box sets you up well, the next logical step from here would be more Riders of Rohan. Mounted Rohan command would be useful, or if you want to go hero-heavy, Gamling with his banner. Wanna redo some Fords of Isen action? Add Theodred and Grimbold. Later in the War of the Ring? Theoden and some Royal Guard.

Isengard is a great core for Isengard in general or branching into Scouts or Soldier Uruks only. Logical next purchases: for Scouts, the Scout Command pack and Lurtz/Ugluk. For soldiers, Fighting Uruk-hai command pack, crossbowme, berzerkers.

And of course the obvious pairing here would be Rohan and Isengard and either build towards early War of the Ring battles such as the Fords of Isen w/ Theodred/Grimbold vs Uruks (and maybe grab a box of Warg Riders and normal Orcs for these battles). Or Eomer's riders (add more Riders) vs Uruk Scouts roaming throughout Rohan. Or Theoden, Eomer, etc vs soldier Uruks for late-War in Rohan. Or Theoden and Dernhelm/Eowyn for Pelennor era.

In all cases, you can absolutely use a normal soldier fella as a Captain (for example, the Knights of Minas Tirith, I would 100% use one as a mounted captain).

And additionally, I'd say "which battle or event in the books or films do you like the most" because it's real, real easy to theme some armies around those events, and if it's a battle or event you just love, it makes building the armies all that more enjoyable.

Thanks y'all. Sad, I would love Isengard the most as a faction and trolling people with Saruman/Grima, but I can't live without cavalry and they seem to have none. Losing the Army rule to take allies is probably a big deal, yea?

Isengard gets Dunlending Cavalry and Warg Riders.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Thanks y'all. Sad, I would love Isengard the most as a faction and trolling people with Saruman/Grima, but I can't live without cavalry and they seem to have none. Losing the Army rule to take allies is probably a big deal, yea?

If you're talking matched play, they have a few in-list cavalry options.

Oooh I skipped over Warg Riders because their stats aren't under Isengard. Still can't see Dunlending Cavalry. Is "Armies of the Lord of the Rings" the most current list?

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Oooh I skipped over Warg Riders because their stats aren't under Isengard. Still can't see Dunlending Cavalry. Is "Armies of the Lord of the Rings" the most current list?

Yep if the stats for units were repeated on every army the unit would be in the damn book would be like 500 pages.

"War in Rohan" is the campaign book you are looking for; big ol book with a ton of scenarios that also has a bunch more Rohan specific stuff including Dunland expanded to cover the units and heroes that are more book-based versus film-based.

Oooh I was completely unaware there's already a bunch of splatbooks for this edition. Thank you. I really might go Rohan&Isengard.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Oooh I was completely unaware there's already a bunch of splatbooks for this edition. Thank you. I really might go Rohan&Isengard.

Most of them are really great, especially if you're into campaigns and scenarios like I am. Some are merely okay, like Fall of the Necromancer is a little light. But War in Rohan has over 20 scenarios and a campaign play system if you want to link them, in addition to new profiles for different Ents (Quickbeam, etc), expanded Dunland, historical figures like Helm Hammerhand, etc etc, plus oldschool GW style painting guides for Rohan scenery, etc. edit: oh plus greatly expanded siege rules and new siege scenarios!

I managed to score a copy of Pelennor Fields online over the weekend, and have asked my lfgs to order in the Osgiliath, Rohan, Gondor, and Isengard boxes. That should give me sizeable Mordor, Rohan, and Gondor forces to go alongside my already fairly sizable Easterlings force plus a start on my Isengard force.

chaos0xomega wrote:
I managed to score a copy of Pelennor Fields online over the weekend, and have asked my lfgs to order in the Osgiliath, Rohan, Gondor, and Isengard boxes. That should give me sizeable Mordor, Rohan, and Gondor forces to go alongside my already fairly sizable Easterlings force plus a start on my Isengard force.

That's what I'm talkin' about! The only thing is that you may wind up with an excess of soldier/morannon orcs, but could always trade away a frame or two of them to someone for something else! With Pelennor I'd recommand grabbing the King of the Dead as well (the new plastic one comes with Heralds as well) and maybe The Three Hunters so you could do an Aragorn/Dead/Pelennor themed force.

Hmmm actually there's still plenty of Battle of Pellenor Fields in German floating about for about the cost of two Battlehosts. I'd have to toss the book, but the savings on minis are even better, right?

Oh is the book in Pelennor the old one? Didn't realize (not a problem since I'm also getting Osgiliath) - but yeah the savings is better for Pelennor than Osgiliath.

 judgedoug wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
I managed to score a copy of Pelennor Fields online over the weekend, and have asked my lfgs to order in the Osgiliath, Rohan, Gondor, and Isengard boxes. That should give me sizeable Mordor, Rohan, and Gondor forces to go alongside my already fairly sizable Easterlings force plus a start on my Isengard force.

That's what I'm talkin' about! The only thing is that you may wind up with an excess of soldier/morannon orcs, but could always trade away a frame or two of them to someone for something else! With Pelennor I'd recommand grabbing the King of the Dead as well (the new plastic one comes with Heralds as well) and maybe The Three Hunters so you could do an Aragorn/Dead/Pelennor themed force.

Yeah, I forgot about the Army of the Dead minis. TBH I was thinking of dumping them, not sure its worth collecting an army that has such few options available and in general they don't much appeal to me.

Not really worried about having too many morannon orcs, 60 seems like a solid number XD

Is the new Rohan box still a good buy for someone with both the Two Towers and Pelennor starters?

Not sure whats in the Two Towers box, but as far as Pelennor + Rohan battlehost is concerned, yes. Pelennor gave you a lot of riders and a good amount of warriors, but because you need warriors as dismounted minis for your riders it doesn't quite add up to being a larger force. By adding the Battlehost you get a few extra riders but you get a lot more warriors, which means you'll have enough for dismounts AND still be able to field a good number of guys on foot alongside your cavalry.

Keep in mind that you really don't need a 1:1 of cavalry and dismounts - only need a dismount on the off-chance your mount gets killed and the rider doesn't.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Hmmm actually there's still plenty of Battle of Pellenor Fields in German floating about for about the cost of two Battlehosts. I'd have to toss the book, but the savings on minis are even better, right?

Considering the rules are 99%+ unchanged, no reason to toss the book

 judgedoug wrote:
Keep in mind that you really don't need a 1:1 of cavalry and dismounts - only need a dismount on the off-chance your mount gets killed and the rider doesn't.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Hmmm actually there's still plenty of Battle of Pellenor Fields in German floating about for about the cost of two Battlehosts. I'd have to toss the book, but the savings on minis are even better, right?

Considering the rules are 99%+ unchanged, no reason to toss the book

Well the reason is that it's in German English copies are already at scalper prices but German copies can still be found at 20% off original retail - a smidge above the GW retail cost of 3 plastic infantry boxes.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

Well the reason is that it's in German English copies are already at scalper prices but German copies can still be found at 20% off original retail - a smidge above the GW retail cost of 3 plastic infantry boxes.

woops! somehow missed that. toss it on ebay and make a few bucks or post it on the FB MESBG trade group(s)?

This thread got me fired up about revisiting a few SBG projects I had half finished, but now I am bummed, because it seems like the camel riders are all gone? I really wanted to do a full camel list. :-(

Anyway, for someone away from the game for a few years, is there any way to catch up on what supplements have new units, and the new army-lists? I've heard they added quite a few, but I haven't bought a book since the new Battle Companies skirmish guide.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
This thread got me fired up about revisiting a few SBG projects I had half finished, but now I am bummed, because it seems like the camel riders are all gone? I really wanted to do a full camel list. :-(

It was mentioned on Warhammer Community that Mahûd Raiders and King are a part of the range rotation and are due to return in October.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/07/21/middle-earth-range-rotation-dunedain-and-dale-heroes-retire-as-old-warriors-re-enter-the-fray/

Hell yeah! Thanks Ghaz! I guess I know what i'll be dropping a boatload on!

It has been a long time since I played LotR, but the game stills seems great, one of the only games GW makes which hasn't been overcomplicated into oblivion.

Very tempted to dust off some of the few minis I have left from it (bunch of nice metals from the original release + Battle Games in Middle Earth) and make an Osgiliath board.

Middle Earth SBG is pretty much the best ruleset GW have ever made, and they don't tinker with it very much! A lot of the core miniautres are old, and can be quite frustrating to paint, but they look great on the table - no better time to start!

While there is a healthy faq section for odd rules interactions, at least anecdotally it seems like I very very rarely need to ever reference it. The core rules have been stable for two decades.

I'm also getting back into the game after more than a decade and some of the newer plastics are just excellent. Gandalf the White on Shadowfax with Pippin seamlessly slotting in is such clever little feature, the Witch king on horse/foot are stellar sculpts.

Holy feth, 160 euros for the Osgiliath box, good god!

We used to sell the core LotR boxes for 65, back in the day. Good gracious.

I mean, Pelennor was 140€ retail, right? And this definitely has a "Kill Zone"'s worth of new terrain. About 1/2 - 1 boxes less models per side tho, right?

The original original LOTR box if I remember correctly was 9 metal fellowship and a few sprues of moria goblins?