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Scions seem like the mathematical choice - especially in a meta still tilted towards Marines - although the fact you have not seen people carpet tables with them is a bit odd. Guess its kind of a niche thing to load up on model wise. T3/4+ is fine on 7 point models - but with full plas, that jumps to 11.4+ and its starting to get expensive. A lot of buffed up things can just delete them.

If you were going DW I don''t think you'd run ten intercessors for shooting, you'd run 5 intercessors and 5 aggressors. No SIA, but theoretically 95 regular bolters>15 (or 30~ for the points) even with wounding on 2+, unless you find something organic thats T8. So... Wraithlords? Against T4 the aggressors kick out about the same even if they move and double if they don't.

Not really persuaded on Kabalites. A min squad in a venom is this weird bully unit. They are by no means bad - but really its the transports doing the lifting - and the combined unit often only appears awesome when you are winning. You know - you havn't killed my Ravagers/flyers/Talos, how on earth are you then going to kill 5-6 transports and 25-30 warriors in them? When things are going badly though (i.e. those other units have all died) you find that they just don't do anything and then die. I guess you could say that's true for everyone - but it strikes me every time I play my DE.

Maybe its a question of scale. Put 20-30 intercessors in a character bubble, and you have a lot of shooting/assault potential. Whereas little blobs of 5 kabalites scattered over the table, at admittedly at a fraction of the points, offer great board control, but can never really elevate themselves.

I am sure it has been mentioned, but Deathwatch all with storm bolters and SIA has gotta be up there. It depends on what your targets are...Kabalite warriors will hurt monsters on 4's, Soaring Spite Harlequins with fusion pistols can just about reach any part of the board and unload 6 strength 8, -4AP damage D6 shots at anything it chooses.

Close packing doesnt matter in 8th. For awhile there i was going against 180 conscripts frequently.

So, with literally zero parameters as to what the definition of Shooty is, or Most Shooty, it has to be the lowly guardsman. The potential for what they can do for the cost is insane. And don't DW Intercessors cost a lot more than normal Intercessors?

I suppose if we are sticking with cost, can regular stock DW marines with SBs/SS enter into this? They get a ton of Hellfire rounds off per squad every turn, and don't cost that much.I think it was 15/model? Then again, I still don't see how you out-shoot for the cost a guardsman. If we are just going off S/AP/D, it has to be the quad plas command squads from Tempestus.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, with literally zero parameters as to what the definition of Shooty is, or Most Shooty, it has to be the lowly guardsman. The potential for what they can do for the cost is insane. And don't DW Intercessors cost a lot more than normal Intercessors?

I suppose if we are sticking with cost, can regular stock DW marines with SBs/SS enter into this? They get a ton of Hellfire rounds off per squad every turn, and don't cost that much.I think it was 15/model? Then again, I still don't see how you out-shoot for the cost a guardsman. If we are just going off S/AP/D, it has to be the quad plas command squads from Tempestus.

If we are tossing points out and going to raw shooting, DW vets can pack a LOT of fire on 10 guys. 4 frag cannons, 3 terminators with cyclones/SBs/Meltafists, 2 SB/SS guys to eat wounds, a a plasma gunslinging vanguard, because you want to be able to fall back and shoot. Sure, it’s over 400 points for a troop pick. But it IS a troop pick.

DW intercessor squads are similar, if not quite as extreme or glass hammer. 5 guys pushing special ammo downrange, backed up by either aggressors or plasma inceptors.

You end up paying land raider prices for 10 guys. But they do pack on the dakka!

 Nevelon wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, with literally zero parameters as to what the definition of Shooty is, or Most Shooty, it has to be the lowly guardsman. The potential for what they can do for the cost is insane. And don't DW Intercessors cost a lot more than normal Intercessors?

I suppose if we are sticking with cost, can regular stock DW marines with SBs/SS enter into this? They get a ton of Hellfire rounds off per squad every turn, and don't cost that much.I think it was 15/model? Then again, I still don't see how you out-shoot for the cost a guardsman. If we are just going off S/AP/D, it has to be the quad plas command squads from Tempestus.

If we are tossing points out and going to raw shooting, DW vets can pack a LOT of fire on 10 guys. 4 frag cannons, 3 terminators with cyclones/SBs/Meltafists, 2 SB/SS guys to eat wounds, a a plasma gunslinging vanguard, because you want to be able to fall back and shoot. Sure, it’s over 400 points for a troop pick. But it IS a troop pick.

DW intercessor squads are similar, if not quite as extreme or glass hammer. 5 guys pushing special ammo downrange, backed up by either aggressors or plasma inceptors.

You end up paying land raider prices for 10 guys. But they do pack on the dakka!

I don't think we should count 250pt units of DW, simply because we could start throwing in Custodes with shields/swords, and MElta Spears. I think DW has to take the cake though, simply due to the fact that they are so versitile as to what they can include. Terminators, Bikes, Vanguard Vets, regular guys, Black shields. They can literally fill every single block on a check list. Their shooting is also slightly overpowered for the cost.

If we are going singly best shooty model, I'd say it has to be a Grey Knights CMNDK, With dual Psi gatlings. With their stupid strats, they can hit you from out of line of site, from over 24" away, with a stupid number of suped up shots.

I'll chime in with the T'au Strike Team. 12 guys with S5 guns pumping out 3 shots each at decent range (with appropriate buffs, of course) is actually better than a lot of troops can do. With 5 Markerlights on their target, they are hitting on 3's rerolling 1's, and wounding most enemy infantry on 3's. If a nearby warlord has Through Unity, Devastation and chooses their target, those shots are AP-1 on 6's to wound as well. Probably not as strong as some of the other infantry that people are mentioning, but not too shabby IMO.

Though I don't play Orks, I could also mention maxed Boyz squads with Shootas (and perhaps whatever specials they can bring like Big Shootas, Rokkit Launchas, etc.). Yes, yes, I know they hit on 5's, but with their Dakka! Dakka! Dakka! rule and stratagem support I think they could be a contender. Of course, as a non-Ork player, I don't actually know if anyone actually takes Shoota Boyz, much less any special weapons.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
I'll chime in with the T'au Strike Team. 12 guys with S5 guns pumping out 3 shots each at decent range (with appropriate buffs, of course) is actually better than a lot of troops can do. With 5 Markerlights on their target, they are hitting on 3's rerolling 1's, and wounding most enemy infantry on 3's. If a nearby warlord has Through Unity, Devastation and chooses their target, those shots are AP-1 on 6's to wound as well. Probably not as strong as some of the other infantry that people are mentioning, but not too shabby IMO.

Though I don't play Orks, I could also mention maxed Boyz squads with Shootas (and perhaps whatever specials they can bring like Big Shootas, Rokkit Launchas, etc.). Yes, yes, I know they hit on 5's, but with their Dakka! Dakka! Dakka! rule and stratagem support I think they could be a contender. Of course, as a non-Ork player, I don't actually know if anyone actually takes Shoota Boyz, much less any special weapons.

Shoota boyz are okay on the turn you Da Jump them and if they're Bad Moonz, since they could shoot twice, but the lack of AP from their guns means that against anything entrenched in cover (ala Intercessors) will be able to weather through most of the fire even after dumping that amount of shots into them. They certainly aren't the best in terms of efficiency, I would give that to regular guard infantry squads.

 Grimskul wrote:

 ZergSmasher wrote:
I'll chime in with the T'au Strike Team. 12 guys with S5 guns pumping out 3 shots each at decent range (with appropriate buffs, of course) is actually better than a lot of troops can do. With 5 Markerlights on their target, they are hitting on 3's rerolling 1's, and wounding most enemy infantry on 3's. If a nearby warlord has Through Unity, Devastation and chooses their target, those shots are AP-1 on 6's to wound as well. Probably not as strong as some of the other infantry that people are mentioning, but not too shabby IMO.

Though I don't play Orks, I could also mention maxed Boyz squads with Shootas (and perhaps whatever specials they can bring like Big Shootas, Rokkit Launchas, etc.). Yes, yes, I know they hit on 5's, but with their Dakka! Dakka! Dakka! rule and stratagem support I think they could be a contender. Of course, as a non-Ork player, I don't actually know if anyone actually takes Shoota Boyz, much less any special weapons.

Shoota boyz are okay on the turn you Da Jump them and if they're Bad Moonz, since they could shoot twice, but the lack of AP from their guns means that against anything entrenched in cover (ala Intercessors) will be able to weather through most of the fire even after dumping that amount of shots into them. They certainly aren't the best in terms of efficiency, I would give that to regular guard infantry squads.

Oh, neither one of the ones I mentioned are the best of the best, but I figured they deserved mention and consideration at least in a thread like this. I actually don't think anything beats Guardsmen in terms of efficiency. Slaanesh Cultists might be close with Endless Cacophony, Prescience, and other things, but then you're sinking a bunch of resources into an otherwise trash unit.

I mean isn't the Ork HQ with the Relic Shokk Gun theoretically the strongest shooter in the game? It can one shot a knight if all goes right. Or an entire squad of Aquilon Terminators

D6 Shots of S-2D6/AP-5/D? with rolls over 11 each shot does D3 mortals.

That has to be the most powerful shooter in the game by cost.

I have to say my army is the most shooty.
Cadian troops with grenade/missle/bolter are very reroll shooty and put out good long range dakka. 2d6 frag + 7 lasguns + 1 bolter shot is pretty good long range shooting for gaurd, twice the 24 inch power of a usual 10 man squad for a 33 percent price hike! And full rerolls!
In fact, a horde army built with 18 such units should be rightly terrifying to everyone, not that I would do that.
Elysians are incredibly short range shooty, converting all their weaponry into assault weapons and firing a flurry of up to 84 or so shots per squad at range >1 to 6 inches, including a trio of plasma shots and 10 s6/-1/d3 krak.
Scions are very hotshotlasgunish, popping a strat to raise the strength and a second one to bring in future units to wound at +1 on the roll, with a trio of plasma shots thrown in (2 gun + 1 pistol)
The differences in price between any of these units and the more expensive marine units only adds to the shooty on the air mobile mixed gaurd side! Based on discussions in here this week, the scions could also be given (in any doctrine) the lambda lions 1+ free reroll warlord with the lambda lions 5++ invuln aura. Greatly improving their shooty, when you figure that lets the lambdas (even if they chose stormtrooper doctrine) stack orders on that free reroll.

Another unit nobody has mentioned that I have seen, though, is the dkok engineers with their amazing "woudns on a 2+" stuff.

I think the valerian sisters with ap-1 and ap-2 ignored and a 2+ save in cover are another viable contender for the "best shooter" .. a squad of 5 with 2 stormbolters is pretty shooty with its blessed bolts, and darn hard to kill, so it KEEPS shooting. My army would be terrified of that action!