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I've run the game only three times before the group's schedules changed and no one from the original run could happen to make it back to the shop to play.

This time around I have a new group who're more capable of making it. But the system has had a re-wright and I was wondering if anyone had any extra material. Expanded items/weapons list that could help fill out some of the game. As well as material for psykers and the such.

Literally anything that can be offered will help.

.Thanks.

Sadly what you've hinted at is why I was mega-unimpressed with the shockingly half-ass effort that was Wrath & Glory.

Mechanically...eh, it's fine. But the absolute lack of content in that book was staggering. The creation tables were minimal and lazily written. The character types were few and far between and the weapons/equipment provided were super scant. It was 100% written as the first of 20 books you'd need to play the RPG in a proper 40K "world". My buddy brought his copy over and we went over it, and it was just a continual "Wait...that's all there is?" every section we peeled through. The book felt like....the polar opposite of the previous 40K RPGs which were, if anything, overly detailed in a lot of areas.

Having said that, the system is pretty simple and you might as well just write up your own stuff. I don't know if the re-write is going to actually include content in their main rulebook, or if it'll just be setting you up to buy a dozen expansion books (cynically this is the path I'd imagine GW will follow).

 Oborosen wrote:
I've run the game only three times before the group's schedules changed and no one from the original run could happen to make it back to the shop to play.

This time around I have a new group who're more capable of making it. But the system has had a re-wright and I was wondering if anyone had any extra material. Expanded items/weapons list that could help fill out some of the game. As well as material for psykers and the such.

Literally anything that can be offered will help.

.Thanks.

I and my friends really like W&G. I do have the rulebook, but I can't share it, because it's a legal copy.

What's missing/are you looking for? The material for psykers should be in the rulebook.


At least in my copy, the Imperial weapons list is pretty complete for infantry weapons, arguably more complete since it has the stuff that have been introduced since DH was published that I find myself improvising rules for all the time when playing DH. There's a moderately healthy Eldar and Ork list to cover basic weapons.

Unfortunately, there's no listed Tau or Necron weapons, nor are there Tau or Necron player options, which is a little disappointing because Tau at least seems like something that should have been included as a player race/class option from the get go. I guess they might have been planning an expansion that never came or something, since there's also a lot more to work with from the Tau than from the Orks and it's offhandedly mentioned in the rulebook.


One weakness is that it's hard to directly port profiles from the codex into stats like you could in DH/BC. On the upside, there's a lot more ability to generate a character who is at least as competent as a base member of their organization, who actually makes your general vision of your character at the get go, and there's a lot more character types you can play. On the downside, once you've made your character, there's not a lot to spend BP on from there except just getting arbitrarily higher stats, because the talent list is kind of short and the total talents you can take limited by tier.

On a more mechanical complaint, I feel often that the balance of armor, penetration, and toughness are kind of wonky, and need some work.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Elbows wrote:
Sadly what you've hinted at is why I was mega-unimpressed with the shockingly half-ass effort that was Wrath & Glory.

Mechanically...eh, it's fine. But the absolute lack of content in that book was staggering. The creation tables were minimal and lazily written. The character types were few and far between and the weapons/equipment provided were super scant. It was 100% written as the first of 20 books you'd need to play the RPG in a proper 40K "world". My buddy brought his copy over and we went over it, and it was just a continual "Wait...that's all there is?" every section we peeled through. The book felt like....the polar opposite of the previous 40K RPGs which were, if anything, overly detailed in a lot of areas.

Having said that, the system is pretty simple and you might as well just write up your own stuff. I don't know if the re-write is going to actually include content in their main rulebook, or if it'll just be setting you up to buy a dozen expansion books (cynically this is the path I'd imagine GW will follow).

So uh, like every other RPG, including the FFG 40k RPG's. As much as I love Dark Heresy and Black Crusade, there's a damn lot of sourcebooks.

Could be worse. Could be 3.5e!

 Elbows wrote:
Sadly what you've hinted at is why I was mega-unimpressed with the shockingly half-ass effort that was Wrath & Glory.

Mechanically...eh, it's fine. But the absolute lack of content in that book was staggering. The creation tables were minimal and lazily written. The character types were few and far between and the weapons/equipment provided were super scant. It was 100% written as the first of 20 books you'd need to play the RPG in a proper 40K "world". My buddy brought his copy over and we went over it, and it was just a continual "Wait...that's all there is?" every section we peeled through. The book felt like....the polar opposite of the previous 40K RPGs which were, if anything, overly detailed in a lot of areas.

Having said that, the system is pretty simple and you might as well just write up your own stuff. I don't know if the re-write is going to actually include content in their main rulebook, or if it'll just be setting you up to buy a dozen expansion books (cynically this is the path I'd imagine GW will follow).

Yeah, I felt that even if the W&G book was three times larger than it was. It would still pale in detail to a single book from the Dark Heresy run.

I have written up my own stuff, adding in all of the imperial guard ab-human races. Ogryns are tier-3 for the simple amount of strength that they possess. I've added a few new guard regiments, as well as some of the more specific weapons that they usually use. Devil's Claw, Penetrating Launcher..etc.

However I did run into an issue with the publisher for most of the supplementary gear. I bought all of the card boxes and it turns out the box containing all of the psychic powers. Literally has only about half of the powers in in the box. I literally didn't realize until after we laid all the cards out for our third session and our newest player wanted to run a psyker.

I've also started hombrewing a ton of psychic powers now as well and I do know that you can find some expanded weapon list on places like reddit, but you have to do some good amounts of digging.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

 Oborosen wrote:
I've run the game only three times before the group's schedules changed and no one from the original run could happen to make it back to the shop to play.

This time around I have a new group who're more capable of making it. But the system has had a re-wright and I was wondering if anyone had any extra material. Expanded items/weapons list that could help fill out some of the game. As well as material for psykers and the such.

Literally anything that can be offered will help.

.Thanks.

I and my friends really like W&G. I do have the rulebook, but I can't share it, because it's a legal copy.

What's missing/are you looking for? The material for psykers should be in the rulebook.


At least in my copy, the Imperial weapons list is pretty complete for infantry weapons, arguably more complete since it has the stuff that have been introduced since DH was published that I find myself improvising rules for all the time when playing DH. There's a moderately healthy Eldar and Ork list to cover basic weapons.

Unfortunately, there's no listed Tau or Necron weapons, nor are there Tau or Necron player options, which is a little disappointing because Tau at least seems like something that should have been included as a player race/class option from the get go. I guess they might have been planning an expansion that never came or something, since there's also a lot more to work with from the Tau than from the Orks and it's offhandedly mentioned in the rulebook.


One weakness is that it's hard to directly port profiles from the codex into stats like you could in DH/BC. On the upside, there's a lot more ability to generate a character who is at least as competent as a base member of their organization, who actually makes your general vision of your character at the get go, and there's a lot more character types you can play. On the downside, once you've made your character, there's not a lot to spend BP on from there except just getting arbitrarily higher stats, because the talent list is kind of short and the total talents you can take limited by tier.

On a more mechanical complaint, I feel often that the balance of armor, penetration, and toughness are kind of wonky, and need some work.

Mostly weapons and upgrade, such as attachments, or any other flavored modifiers. I can homebrew some myself, but I was hoping to find out anything else was out that.

On the topic of armor penetration however and balance in that sense. It was put out there that the game was meant to be "slightly" less fatal than Dark Heresy. Because there's nothing like catching a stalker bolter to the face and being out of the fight, in session two. Teams are meant to keep up with their minimal shock levels and use stem packs when they get in trouble... my group did not. Despite how well your Scion fights with the dead Commissar's power sword. He's not going to win if he jumps into a small mob of boyz, especially when he decides to hold his ground after the Nob rounds the corner.

I also found that I like playing the game more, with people who barely know anything about Warhammer40k. Because it gives you a chance to introduce people to lore at a nice leisurely pace. One of the regular customers at the shop, who usually spends his time playing destiny-2 in the back, decided to join in on the first session and stayed to the end. He'd always "heard" what a space marine was and when he tried to intimidate the singular crimson fist for information.

I spent 5 minutes explaining exactly what a space marine is and what their status in the Imperium actually was.

 Oborosen wrote:

Mostly weapons and upgrade, such as attachments, or any other flavored modifiers. I can homebrew some myself, but I was hoping to find out anything else was out that.

On the topic of armor penetration however and balance in that sense. It was put out there that the game was meant to be "slightly" less fatal than Dark Heresy. Because there's nothing like catching a stalker bolter to the face and being out of the fight, in session two. Teams are meant to keep up with their minimal shock levels and use stem packs when they get in trouble... my group did not. Despite how well your Scion fights with the dead Commissar's power sword. He's not going to win if he jumps into a small mob of boyz, especially when he decides to hold his ground after the Nob rounds the corner.

I also found that I like playing the game more, with people who barely know anything about Warhammer40k. Because it gives you a chance to introduce people to lore at a nice leisurely pace. One of the regular customers at the shop, who usually spends his time playing destiny-2 in the back, decided to join in on the first session and stayed to the end. He'd always "heard" what a space marine was and when he tried to intimidate the singular crimson fist for information.

I spent 5 minutes explaining exactly what a space marine is and what their status in the Imperium actually was.

I feel like it's way more lethal than Dark Heresy. My party is an Intercessor, Tac Marine, Commissar w/ the Loyal 32, Rogue Trader, and Techpriest. When they get shot by like boltguns, it just blows right through their wounds, only the Intercessor is anything resembling resilient. None of them can soak enough to actually stop weapons from knocking them down. My Black Crusade party, on the other hand, is pretty able to wade through fire and none of them are Space Marines. To be fair, they weren't doing that two years ago, but they still seemed appreciably more resilient.


I don't actually think the book has noticeably less than a single Dark Heresy, owning both. Dark Heresy does have a lot more overally material, but that's because there's literally dozens of books of accumulated material if you play mix-and-match with the fact that the whole system is basically cross compatible. You're obviously not going to get as much stuff out of one book as even like the 4 or 5 books that cover DH or BC. Don't get me wrong, I love Dark Heresy and would probably still run Dark Heresy preferably, but I wish that DH had the character class options of W&G.

For reference, out of the box, DH 2e has 6 homeworlds, 7 backgrounds, and 8 Roles. Then there's 32 skills with 4 levels of mastery, 10+2 characteristics, and about 85 talents. There are 38 ranged weapons, 14 grenades, 25 melee weapons, 30 weapon upgrades, 10 ammunition types, 22 armor elements but only actually 11 different outfits, 5 force fields, 17 piece of kit, 13 drugs, 35 tools, 28 cybernetic parts, 4 vehicles [only once of which is real and relevant though], and 45 psychic powers.
Wrath and Glory has: 5 species, and 31 archetypes [though archetypes are species locked, so that's basically just 31 archetypes], and 4 backgrounds. Then there's 8 characteristics [and 12 other numbers derived from them], 18 skills with 8 levels of mastery, and about 45 talents. There are 62 ranged weapons, 35 odd melee weapons, 17 weapon upgrades, 4 ammunitions, 28 armors, 40-odd pieces of kit, 22 cybernetics, 15 vehicles, and 52 psychic powers. While admittedly, the final list will be shorter because a good number of them are eldar and ork equipment, that list isn't too shabby actually. I think the primary limiting factor is that a lot of it is locked together, so they're not all universally available, and there's a bunch of restrictions on how many upgrades you can actually buy, so out of like a bunch of talents you can only have 4.

I think that's the key problem: follow-on content.

Fantasy Flight - them as used to publish the 40k RPGs - released their new Legend of the Five Rings at about the same time as Wrath & Glory.

In the intervening time, L5R has received a core book and starter box, along with three big sourcebooks full of new background, stuff and story seeds, four big pre-written adventure books (one is the Gm's kit) and six downloadable adventures. Wrath and Glory got the starter adventure, core book, dark tides and....that's it.

The pre-release announcements implied we'd be seeing lots of storylines and campaigns right across the setting but aside from one story set in what felt like a pretty pokey backwater nothing ever emerged. I was hoping you might even see in tie-ins to the 'proper' 40k releases, like a vigilus or plague war campaign

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

I feel like it's way more lethal than Dark Heresy. My party is an Intercessor, Tac Marine, Commissar w/ the Loyal 32, Rogue Trader, and Techpriest. When they get shot by like boltguns, it just blows right through their wounds, only the Intercessor is anything resembling resilient. None of them can soak enough to actually stop weapons from knocking them down. My Black Crusade party, on the other hand, is pretty able to wade through fire and none of them are Space Marines. To be fair, they weren't doing that two years ago, but they still seemed appreciably more resilient.


I don't actually think the book has noticeably less than a single Dark Heresy, owning both. Dark Heresy does have a lot more overally material, but that's because there's literally dozens of books of accumulated material if you play mix-and-match with the fact that the whole system is basically cross compatible. You're obviously not going to get as much stuff out of one book as even like the 4 or 5 books that cover DH or BC. Don't get me wrong, I love Dark Heresy and would probably still run Dark Heresy preferably, but I wish that DH had the character class options of W&G.

For reference, out of the box, DH 2e has 6 homeworlds, 7 backgrounds, and 8 Roles. Then there's 32 skills with 4 levels of mastery, 10+2 characteristics, and about 85 talents. There are 38 ranged weapons, 14 grenades, 25 melee weapons, 30 weapon upgrades, 10 ammunition types, 22 armor elements but only actually 11 different outfits, 5 force fields, 17 piece of kit, 13 drugs, 35 tools, 28 cybernetic parts, 4 vehicles [only once of which is real and relevant though], and 45 psychic powers.
Wrath and Glory has: 5 species, and 31 archetypes [though archetypes are species locked, so that's basically just 31 archetypes], and 4 backgrounds. Then there's 8 characteristics [and 12 other numbers derived from them], 18 skills with 8 levels of mastery, and about 45 talents. There are 62 ranged weapons, 35 odd melee weapons, 17 weapon upgrades, 4 ammunitions, 28 armors, 40-odd pieces of kit, 22 cybernetics, 15 vehicles, and 52 psychic powers. While admittedly, the final list will be shorter because a good number of them are eldar and ork equipment, that list isn't too shabby actually. I think the primary limiting factor is that a lot of it is locked together, so they're not all universally available, and there's a bunch of restrictions on how many upgrades you can actually buy, so out of like a bunch of talents you can only have 4.

Yeah, the limit in variable material could be what's doing it for me.
I've only played very little BC. But DH was my bread and butter back in the day, well before I got back into things like Call of Cthulhu and D&D.

I missed being able to throw so much on one character and when it comes to W&G. The players had to depend on their skils to get things done, with very little modifiers. And on the note of being tough. Yeah, the intercessor is probably "THE" toughest, with no modifications applied. The game urges you to take cover and use ambush tactics more than anything else.

In BC, players could use a large list of items, list and abilities in even the mid game levels. To soak a lot of damage.

My brother's characters were always these twisted measure of Tank in the end. Because there's nothing like a hive ganger shrugging auto-cannon fire.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

locarno24 wrote:
I think that's the key problem: follow-on content.

Fantasy Flight - them as used to publish the 40k RPGs - released their new Legend of the Five Rings at about the same time as Wrath & Glory.

In the intervening time, L5R has received a core book and starter box, along with three big sourcebooks full of new background, stuff and story seeds, four big pre-written adventure books (one is the Gm's kit) and six downloadable adventures. Wrath and Glory got the starter adventure, core book, dark tides and....that's it.

The pre-release announcements implied we'd be seeing lots of storylines and campaigns right across the setting but aside from one story set in what felt like a pretty pokey backwater nothing ever emerged. I was hoping you might even see in tie-ins to the 'proper' 40k releases, like a vigilus or plague war campaign

W&G got a massive errata about a year ago. It pointed out a few items that I had originally gotten wrong.

But no extra material..

locarno24 wrote:I think that's the key problem: follow-on content.

Fantasy Flight - them as used to publish the 40k RPGs - released their new Legend of the Five Rings at about the same time as Wrath & Glory.

In the intervening time, L5R has received a core book and starter box, along with three big sourcebooks full of new background, stuff and story seeds, four big pre-written adventure books (one is the Gm's kit) and six downloadable adventures. Wrath and Glory got the starter adventure, core book, dark tides and....that's it.

The pre-release announcements implied we'd be seeing lots of storylines and campaigns right across the setting but aside from one story set in what felt like a pretty pokey backwater nothing ever emerged. I was hoping you might even see in tie-ins to the 'proper' 40k releases, like a vigilus or plague war campaign

It seems that they were planning additional releases, but then Ulysses sold it to Cubicle 7 and it's unsure what Cubicle 7 plans to do with it.

Oborosen wrote:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

I feel like it's way more lethal than Dark Heresy. My party is an Intercessor, Tac Marine, Commissar w/ the Loyal 32, Rogue Trader, and Techpriest. When they get shot by like boltguns, it just blows right through their wounds, only the Intercessor is anything resembling resilient. None of them can soak enough to actually stop weapons from knocking them down. My Black Crusade party, on the other hand, is pretty able to wade through fire and none of them are Space Marines. To be fair, they weren't doing that two years ago, but they still seemed appreciably more resilient.


I don't actually think the book has noticeably less than a single Dark Heresy, owning both. Dark Heresy does have a lot more overally material, but that's because there's literally dozens of books of accumulated material if you play mix-and-match with the fact that the whole system is basically cross compatible. You're obviously not going to get as much stuff out of one book as even like the 4 or 5 books that cover DH or BC. Don't get me wrong, I love Dark Heresy and would probably still run Dark Heresy preferably, but I wish that DH had the character class options of W&G.

For reference, out of the box, DH 2e has 6 homeworlds, 7 backgrounds, and 8 Roles. Then there's 32 skills with 4 levels of mastery, 10+2 characteristics, and about 85 talents. There are 38 ranged weapons, 14 grenades, 25 melee weapons, 30 weapon upgrades, 10 ammunition types, 22 armor elements but only actually 11 different outfits, 5 force fields, 17 piece of kit, 13 drugs, 35 tools, 28 cybernetic parts, 4 vehicles [only once of which is real and relevant though], and 45 psychic powers.
Wrath and Glory has: 5 species, and 31 archetypes [though archetypes are species locked, so that's basically just 31 archetypes], and 4 backgrounds. Then there's 8 characteristics [and 12 other numbers derived from them], 18 skills with 8 levels of mastery, and about 45 talents. There are 62 ranged weapons, 35 odd melee weapons, 17 weapon upgrades, 4 ammunitions, 28 armors, 40-odd pieces of kit, 22 cybernetics, 15 vehicles, and 52 psychic powers. While admittedly, the final list will be shorter because a good number of them are eldar and ork equipment, that list isn't too shabby actually. I think the primary limiting factor is that a lot of it is locked together, so they're not all universally available, and there's a bunch of restrictions on how many upgrades you can actually buy, so out of like a bunch of talents you can only have 4.

Yeah, the limit in variable material could be what's doing it for me.
I've only played very little BC. But DH was my bread and butter back in the day, well before I got back into things like Call of Cthulhu and D&D.

I missed being able to throw so much on one character and when it comes to W&G. The players had to depend on their skils to get things done, with very little modifiers. And on the note of being tough. Yeah, the intercessor is probably "THE" toughest, with no modifications applied. The game urges you to take cover and use ambush tactics more than anything else.

In BC, players could use a large list of items, list and abilities in even the mid game levels. To soak a lot of damage.

My brother's characters were always these twisted measure of Tank in the end. Because there's nothing like a hive ganger shrugging auto-cannon fire.

Yeah players can get really resilient in BC/DH. Armor as DR kind of does that. I've noticed that the meta in combat for my W&G party is for each player in turn to shift as many die as they can to glory, and then the next player immediately spends that glory to take a combat interrupt action and shoot. The low DN to hit [3, for most enemies] means that it's not a question of hitting, it's a question of how many shifts do you get, and in combat there's only really shifting for damage and shifting for glory. I don't really mind that they're that fragile, but they do spend a lot of time dropping, then passing defiance tests and standing up, and rinse and repeat. I liked the critial tables -> you explode, burn fate a little better.

Right now I run Black Crusade and Wrath and Glory. I've also run Dark Heresy, Deathwatch, and Only War and played in a Rogue Trader game in the past.

As I observed, it's not that the list is so much smaller if you just buy the one rulebook though, it's that there are 3 or 4 expansion books that also add new gear, new powers, new homeworlds, new backgrounds, new talents, and then on top of that the entire DH system is cross compatible, so beyond just the 3 or 4 named expansions for the game you're playing there's all the books and expansions for 4 other games in the same system just covering different characters that you can use for gear and stuff.

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
Yeah players can get really resilient in BC/DH. Armor as DR kind of does that. I've noticed that the meta in combat for my W&G party is for each player in turn to shift as many die as they can to glory, and then the next player immediately spends that glory to take a combat interrupt action and shoot. The low DN to hit [3, for most enemies] means that it's not a question of hitting, it's a question of how many shifts do you get, and in combat there's only really shifting for damage and shifting for glory. I don't really mind that they're that fragile, but they do spend a lot of time dropping, then passing defiance tests and standing up, and rinse and repeat. I liked the critial tables -> you explode, burn fate a little better.

Right now I run Black Crusade and Wrath and Glory. I've also run Dark Heresy, Deathwatch, and Only War and played in a Rogue Trader game in the past.

As I observed, it's not that the list is so much smaller if you just buy the one rulebook though, it's that there are 3 or 4 expansion books that also add new gear, new powers, new homeworlds, new backgrounds, new talents, and then on top of that the entire DH system is cross compatible, so beyond just the 3 or 4 named expansions for the game you're playing there's all the books and expansions for 4 other games in the same system just covering different characters that you can use for gear and stuff.

Guess I'll have to see just what expansions come out for W&G.

Though I do have a problem that I've been trying to work around. Models; mostly centering around the enemies.

I've been using markers that I got from the starter kit for the game. It has these little markers ranging around 12mm to something like 25mm and I've been looking for more sets of items just like that.

My players use miniatures, which the games measurements are completely fine with using as well. So I'm missing a way to have some enemy markers that stand out more, without taking up way too much of the board. I've tried looking for a pack of the same items, from that exact kit. But finding them being sold individually, is something that seems to be a problem at the moment. Which is strange, because they look rather simple to make and take up very minimal space. If this was my game, I'd jump into making more of those and selling them separately.

 Oborosen wrote:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
Yeah players can get really resilient in BC/DH. Armor as DR kind of does that. I've noticed that the meta in combat for my W&G party is for each player in turn to shift as many die as they can to glory, and then the next player immediately spends that glory to take a combat interrupt action and shoot. The low DN to hit [3, for most enemies] means that it's not a question of hitting, it's a question of how many shifts do you get, and in combat there's only really shifting for damage and shifting for glory. I don't really mind that they're that fragile, but they do spend a lot of time dropping, then passing defiance tests and standing up, and rinse and repeat. I liked the critial tables -> you explode, burn fate a little better.

Right now I run Black Crusade and Wrath and Glory. I've also run Dark Heresy, Deathwatch, and Only War and played in a Rogue Trader game in the past.

As I observed, it's not that the list is so much smaller if you just buy the one rulebook though, it's that there are 3 or 4 expansion books that also add new gear, new powers, new homeworlds, new backgrounds, new talents, and then on top of that the entire DH system is cross compatible, so beyond just the 3 or 4 named expansions for the game you're playing there's all the books and expansions for 4 other games in the same system just covering different characters that you can use for gear and stuff.

Guess I'll have to see just what expansions come out for W&G.

Though I do have a problem that I've been trying to work around. Models; mostly centering around the enemies.

I've been using markers that I got from the starter kit for the game. It has these little markers ranging around 12mm to something like 25mm and I've been looking for more sets of items just like that.

My players use miniatures, which the games measurements are completely fine with using as well. So I'm missing a way to have some enemy markers that stand out more, without taking up way too much of the board. I've tried looking for a pack of the same items, from that exact kit. But finding them being sold individually, is something that seems to be a problem at the moment. Which is strange, because they look rather simple to make and take up very minimal space. If this was my gave, I'd jump into making more of those and selling them separately.

I uh, well, use more miniatures. We need to chaos cultists? Oh look, [FRIEND] plays Chaos! I also draw on a board and just draw and erase letters when battles are huge or units we don't own, like Harridans or Tigersharks or Battlefortresses are involved. Moving to online 'cause of the whole COVID19 thing has required me to draw a bucked of tokens for Roll20, but on the upside I can make really big battlefields and lots and lots of tokens.

I do the same thing for my Black Crusade game.

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
uh, well, use more miniatures. We need to chaos cultists? Oh look, [FRIEND] plays Chaos! I also draw on a board and just draw and erase letters when battles are huge or units we don't own, like Harridans or Tigersharks or Battlefortresses are involved. Moving to online 'cause of the whole COVID19 thing has required me to draw a bucked of tokens for Roll20, but on the upside I can make really big battlefields and lots and lots of tokens.

I do the same thing for my Black Crusade game.

That's completely fine, I'm not short on models to use. But if I'm going to keep using my models for all of the characters, enemies and npc characters on the board. Then I'm going to have to refit one of my older army cases for just carrying everything that I need.

I've even started using older ship models from mech-tech, Star Wars and a few other choice games, with a few conversions of course. To fill out movements and combat for their ship.