Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

torblind wrote:
Huh. It never says the Reanimators ray can only be benefited by once, for a unit, as it says for the crypteks we have seen.

Could reanimate stuff no 2+.

I can certainly see stiff breezes coming their way.

Hello, yes I'd like to order all the Obscuring terrain you have please. Yes you heard me, all of it.

Sterling191 wrote:
Attack allocation order change is significant.

Repentia are so screwed. Targets you want to use them, primaris marines and knights, will simply delete t3 6++5+++ w1 models first.

Just recently got squads 2 and 3. Lol

 RaptorusRex wrote:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
They fixed Assault Weapons!

Only certain people thought they were broken in the first place.

Given that the rule/wording was changed, apparently they included the GW rules writers.

Sterling191 wrote:
Attack allocation order change is significant.

I don't really think so. If you look at the allocation rules, it says if you have allocated an attack to a model, then you must continue to allocate to that model. So, people will allocate to the models they want to remove and keep allocating there until they're removed. For speed, they'll just roll all at once (see Fast Dice Rolling) and remove whoever they would allocate to. It doesn't allow you to allocate multiple shots to multiple models.

It's not like you take 10 shots and allocate 2 each to a 5-man squad. You allocate 1 to 1 guy, then roll his saves and remove him. Then you allocate another. You continue to allocate to one model until he is gone.

tneva82 wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

nokranok wrote:
Full rule book is out:
https://imgur.com/a/J4Bygoq

Some interesting stuff thanks

The Fortification Network especially - Sisters Statue gives 1Cp

Could you make out cp cost?

Did i miss it or did chargers start go away so enemy gets first dip in melee? Poor repentia

Ahh I have misread it - it costs 1 CP and you get one so its free if its of your own faction.

 puma713 wrote:


I don't really think so. If you look at the allocation rules, it says if you have allocated an attack to a model, then you must continue to allocate to that model. So, people will allocate to the models they want to remove and keep allocating there until they're removed. For speed, they'll just roll all at once (see Fast Dice Rolling) and remove whoever they would allocate to. It doesn't allow you to allocate multiple shots to multiple models.

Its going to prompt very significant decisions on how to use ablative wounds in units. Once the thing you want to keep alive takes an attack, it then takes attacks until its dead.

For Custodes and Deathwatch for example, its a *big* fething deal.

tneva82 wrote:

Sterling191 wrote:
Attack allocation order change is significant.

Repentia are so screwed. Targets you want to use them, primaris marines and knights, will simply delete t3 6++5+++ w1 models first.

Just recently got squads 2 and 3. Lol

Yeah painful. On the plus side models/units with "always strikes first" aren't as hosed unless of course that unit charges enemy unit with the same rule.

My Slaanesh don't mind this change too much.

Charging units still fight first, dunno where anyone got the idea they don't. If nobody made a charge, it's true that the opponent gets the first activation - but we've known about that for a week or two now, it's not new info. And with free fall back staying in plus even being able to fall back when wrapped, I really don't think you're going to see much fighting that didn't involve a charge that turn anyway in 9th edition, unless two combat armies happen to come up against one another.

Sterling191 wrote:

 puma713 wrote:


I don't really think so. If you look at the allocation rules, it says if you have allocated an attack to a model, then you must continue to allocate to that model. So, people will allocate to the models they want to remove and keep allocating there until they're removed. For speed, they'll just roll all at once (see Fast Dice Rolling) and remove whoever they would allocate to. It doesn't allow you to allocate multiple shots to multiple models.

Its going to prompt very significant decisions on how to use ablative wounds in units. Once the thing you want to keep alive takes an attack, it then takes attacks until its dead.

For Custodes and Deathwatch for example, its a *big* fething deal.

How is that any different to the way it is now? If you take an attack now, you have to keep allocating to that model. In 9th, you allocate before saves, but you must continue to allocate to the same model until it is dead. So, if I have 5 guys and I want to keep 1 specfically alive, I don't allocate to him until all others are dead. If you hit me with 10 shots and I fail all but 1, I know who is alive.

It's really no different than 8th.

An example, for clarity:

I have a unit of 5 Marines. I take 5 hits from bolter fire. I allocate to one guy who I don't mind losing. He saves. I allocate to him again, he saves again. I allocate to him for the third time and he dies. Now I allocate the 4th shot to the next marine and he dies. Finally, I allocate the last shot to another Joe Schmo marine and he lives. The shots didn't even reach my Seargent or my Special Weapon because I allocate to a single model until it is dead. The same way you do now.

Actually we did miss it. Charging unit strikes first.

So repentia isn't totally screwed

The big nerf that screws melee is the activation range nerf. I just honestly have no idea why they thought this was a good change at all. Who on earth thought that too many models could fight in close combat in 8th edition?

And if it hasn't been posted, all the specialist detachments are 3CP, with no refund, as people suspected.

 puma713 wrote:

How is that any different to the way it is now? If you take an attack now, you have to keep allocating to that model. In 9th, you allocate before saves, but you must continue to allocate to the same model until it is dead. So, if I have 5 guys and I want to keep 1 specfically alive, I don't allocate to him until all others are dead. If you hit me with 10 shots and I fail all but 1, I know who is alive.

It's really no different than 8th.

Its exceptionally different in 8th. 8th only requires a model that has lost a wound to take subsequent attacks, and does not lock a target model into taking every subsequent attack until its dead (if it hasnt taken damage).

Each attack and wound is resolved individually, allowing you to keep shifting saves around inside a unit based on ideal conditions (again, this is a key part of how particular factions kept units alive).

In 9th, that's off the table.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
The Necrons are hardly chopped liver in that regard.

The Necrons are getting similar or less release than marines are getting in this wave. Marines had, what, 10 waves since Necrons got their previous meaningful update?
It's tiring and annoying.

 Mr Morden wrote:
The Fortification Network especially - Sisters Statue gives 1Cp

Gives back 1CP, but cost 1CP. In other words, refund itself. Like your first detachment, or the supreme command detachment.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
The Necrons are hardly chopped liver in that regard.

The Necrons are getting similar or less release than marines are getting in this wave. Marines had, what, 10 waves since Necrons got their previous meaningful update?
It's tiring and annoying.

 Mr Morden wrote:
The Fortification Network especially - Sisters Statue gives 1Cp

Gives back 1CP, but cost 1CP. In other words, refund itself. Like your first detachment, or the supreme command detachment.

Yep I misread it - quite nice as I want to use my shiny new Statue

 puma713 wrote:

It's really no different than 8th.

it is not that it is different, but that most players won't follow those rules an favour of speed

roll to hit, roll to wound, saves, damage, allocate wounds and remove models

as you only can speed it up if you already know how much wounds you have to allocate, removing the opportunity that one model sucks up all the damage

tneva82 wrote:
Actually we did miss it. Charging unit strikes first.

So repentia isn't totally screwed

You know i keep scouring the images and cant see where it says that. Anyone know where that is said?

Not sure if it's current in 8th or not but I noticed "Insane Bravery" stratagem is only once per BATTLE.

I swear in current edition it can be done multiple times?

21stPrimarch wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Actually we did miss it. Charging unit strikes first.

So repentia isn't totally screwed

You know i keep scouring the images and cant see where it says that. Anyone know where that is said?

The pages are out of order. It's this one.

yukishiro1 wrote:
Wow, melee got utterly screwed with engagement range - now you can only fight if you're within 1" or within 1/2" of another model in your unit that is itself within 1/2" of the enemy.

What on earth prompted that? Seems like just another logic-free nerf to larger units.

Only to models on 25mm bases which are already dying out. All other models could already only fight in 2 ranks. 25mm bases could fight in 4 ranks now which is a bit unfair to all those models that got rebased (enemy and 4 25mm bases all in a straight line touching each other, the first and second model are in direct engagement range, the 3rd and 4th within 1" of an engaged model.

This is a very good rule IMHO

Sterling191 wrote:

 puma713 wrote:

How is that any different to the way it is now? If you take an attack now, you have to keep allocating to that model. In 9th, you allocate before saves, but you must continue to allocate to the same model until it is dead. So, if I have 5 guys and I want to keep 1 specfically alive, I don't allocate to him until all others are dead. If you hit me with 10 shots and I fail all but 1, I know who is alive.

It's really no different than 8th.

Its exceptionally different in 8th. 8th only requires a model that has taken a wound to take an attack, and does not lock a target model into taking every subsequent attack until its dead.

Each attack and wound is resolved individually, allowing you to keep shifting saves around inside a unit based on ideal conditions (again, this is a key part of how particular factions kept units alive).

I think I see what you're saying now.. You might say, "Okay, I take that bolter shot on this guy." And you roll a save. "Now I take that lascannon shot on this guy with the Storm Shield." And take his save. Now, you have to allocate the bolter shot and the lascannon both to the same guy (non Storm Shield guy, in this example).

jivardi wrote:
Not sure if it's current in 8th or not but I noticed "Insane Bravery" stratagem is only once per BATTLE.

I swear in current edition it can be done multiple times?

Yeah and it isn't broken because it's a whopping 2CP.

 puma713 wrote:

I think I see what you're saying now.. You might say, "Okay, I take that bolter shot on this guy." And you roll a save. "Now I take that lascannon shot on this guy with the Storm Shield." And take his save. Now, you have to allocate the bolter shot and the lascannon both to the same guy (non Storm Shield guy, in this example).

Exactly.

yukishiro1 wrote:

21stPrimarch wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Actually we did miss it. Charging unit strikes first.

So repentia isn't totally screwed

You know i keep scouring the images and cant see where it says that. Anyone know where that is said?

The pages are out of order. It's this one.

Spoiler:

you the best!

Horde combat looks totally dead. You won't be able to fight with most of your models due to the bizarre massive nerf to engagement range, and you have to keep coherency when piling in and when consolidating - which are still limited to being towards the closest model - which means trapping is also very hard.

And even if you do trap, they can just fall back using the strat and have the rest of their army wipe you off the table. Whereas you got one round of combat with maybe 10 guys.

21stPrimarch wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Actually we did miss it. Charging unit strikes first.

So repentia isn't totally screwed

You know i keep scouring the images and cant see where it says that. Anyone know where that is said?

Was shown screenshot. Title charging unit strikes first, text in same style, bullet point, another title saying fight

Something I don't get: why are we allocating after the wound roll, and which T are we rolling against if we haven't allocated yet?
Would be so much easier to allocate first!!!

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
The Necrons are hardly chopped liver in that regard.

The Necrons are getting similar or less release than marines are getting in this wave. Marines had, what, 10 waves since Necrons got their previous meaningful update?
It's tiring and annoying.

 Mr Morden wrote:
The Fortification Network especially - Sisters Statue gives 1Cp

Gives back 1CP, but cost 1CP. In other words, refund itself. Like your first detachment, or the supreme command detachment.

It's not waves it is a constant stream.

Also, no soup penalty that I can see; detachment costs are the same whether they're in-faction or out-of-faction.

You’re missing the point.

CP Farming Soup is now a thing of the past. Soup otherwise hasn’t been changed in terms of appeal.

yukishiro1 wrote:
Also, no soup penalty that I can see; detachment costs are the same whether they're in-faction or out-of-faction.

Soup penalty comes via CP cost only the WL's detachment is free.