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So,the other day we were doing two 2vs2 games (1000 pts each/2000pts per side)

I played knights both times. 1k gives me a crusader, an errant and a helverin.

First game i partenered up with DG (i know heresy but w/e) we came up against a DA/AM(Tempestus Scions) list.

2nd turn a few deep striking command squads all kitted out with plasmas and other stuff giving them an ungodly amount of plasma shots against my Errant, which promply died on the spot even with rotate ion shields. My other knight came up against a lovely squad of deep striking Deathwing knights with 3++ that charged my Crusader, and killed it. Game lost.


Second game was me and Tempestus vs double Ork list

Second turn they deep stike in 2 squads of Killasaw Meganobz that charged the crusader, each squad with 20 str 10 dmg2 attacks, result: Dead knight. Errant didnt do much good since it was a mission where only a few designated characters could hold objectives so was stuck at an objective with only his d6 shots gun. Game won (mostly due to my tempestus partner promptly deesp striking in his squads and decimating the mega nobz squads.


So my question is, how the heck do you deal with deep strike as Knights? Their melee saves are also abyssmal when many factions can field str8 melee weapons with heavy AP easily.

Use allys to screen and prevent Melee deepstrikers dropping in within 9

2 half their units must be on the board so focus on the half that isn't deepstriking.

deepstrike shooting is often squishy - sure they hit hard but your other units should blow them away after

Correct Board positioning can limit where DS arrive for example DS useing the new reserve rules can only come in from certain board edges and not within 9" of your models so you block them from arriving


4 don't play extreme skewlists at 1000pts your going to encounter armies that are geared to destroying yours or the opposite and you don't get a real game

Couple options. Mostly, you just need to survive the turn they come in. You've got a couple good options.

1) one of the stratagems you have gives you the ability to shoot a unit that just desp struck. I dont know if it requires a specific household.

2) if chargers deep strike, such as the nobz you just mentioned, use the universal cc interrupt stratagem and hit the second unit. For example in the nobz you mentioned, the first unit should just about half-health you, then in your first bracket you should kill on average 3/5 of the second nobz squad with a reaper chainsword in your first damage bracket, allowing you to survive, fall back, and kill the nobz on your turn.

3) overwatch if yiu have helverins, crusaders or castellans being charged

4) screen with warglaives and use them to tank likely deep strikes if all else fails.

For 2...don't chainswoid. Stomp em. Squad will go splat

I think sanctuary/rune are pretty important to have on one of your knights, more and more, to be frank. You can't easily avoid having a knight deepstruck unless you've gone in deep for some soup, but you can often make it so that only one of your knights is a viable/high priority target for it, and put your 5++ in cc knight in that role.

Rotate ion shields to give it a 4++, and you're in business.

 grouchoben wrote:
I think sanctuary/rune are pretty important to have on one of your knights, more and more, to be frank. You can't easily avoid having a knight deepstruck unless you've gone in deep for some soup, but you can often make it so that only one of your knights is a viable/high priority target for it, and put your 5++ in cc knight in that role.

Rotate ion shields to give it a 4++, and you're in business.

Wait, so you mean rotate ion on a knight with sanctuary gives it 4++ even in melee?

Totto wrote:

 grouchoben wrote:
I think sanctuary/rune are pretty important to have on one of your knights, more and more, to be frank. You can't easily avoid having a knight deepstruck unless you've gone in deep for some soup, but you can often make it so that only one of your knights is a viable/high priority target for it, and put your 5++ in cc knight in that role.

Rotate ion shields to give it a 4++, and you're in business.

Wait, so you mean rotate ion on a knight with sanctuary gives it 4++ even in melee?

Yes. It's not phase locked. It makes zero mention of any phases except that lasts until end of phase. The specific trigger is when enemy targets knight. That is common for both melee and shooting. Can't attack in melee without targeting something eh?

It's not as common as in shooting as most knights don't have melee inv save but if you have then it's 100% valid.

tneva82 wrote:
For 2...don't chainswoid. Stomp em. Squad will go splat

Most squads, but I was using the specific example of MANZ, which I don't believe are particularly great targets for the stomps due to lower AP mattering and lost efficiency from D3 damage rolls. I dunno, I guess I could be wrong there.

tneva82 wrote:

Totto wrote:

 grouchoben wrote:
I think sanctuary/rune are pretty important to have on one of your knights, more and more, to be frank. You can't easily avoid having a knight deepstruck unless you've gone in deep for some soup, but you can often make it so that only one of your knights is a viable/high priority target for it, and put your 5++ in cc knight in that role.

Rotate ion shields to give it a 4++, and you're in business.

Wait, so you mean rotate ion on a knight with sanctuary gives it 4++ even in melee?

Yes. It's not phase locked. It makes zero mention of any phases except that lasts until end of phase. The specific trigger is when enemy targets knight. That is common for both melee and shooting. Can't attack in melee without targeting something eh?

It's not as common as in shooting as most knights don't have melee inv save but if you have then it's 100% valid.

Pretty sure that doesn't work as the Ion Shield save only works against ranged attacks and Rotate Ion Shields improves the Ion Shield save...which doesn't apply. Been a while since I played against Knights though so I may be wrong.

Slipspace wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Totto wrote:

 grouchoben wrote:
I think sanctuary/rune are pretty important to have on one of your knights, more and more, to be frank. You can't easily avoid having a knight deepstruck unless you've gone in deep for some soup, but you can often make it so that only one of your knights is a viable/high priority target for it, and put your 5++ in cc knight in that role.

Rotate ion shields to give it a 4++, and you're in business.

Wait, so you mean rotate ion on a knight with sanctuary gives it 4++ even in melee?

Yes. It's not phase locked. It makes zero mention of any phases except that lasts until end of phase. The specific trigger is when enemy targets knight. That is common for both melee and shooting. Can't attack in melee without targeting something eh?

It's not as common as in shooting as most knights don't have melee inv save but if you have then it's 100% valid.

Pretty sure that doesn't work as the Ion Shield save only works against ranged attacks and Rotate Ion Shields improves the Ion Shield save...which doesn't apply. Been a while since I played against Knights though so I may be wrong.

There is a relic that grants you the ion shield in melee. It is a very standard relic to take against melee army oppoents.

Yeah, almost mandatory in my experiencee. A 4++ in CC Krastigator gives a lot of armies the heebyjeebies.

Slipspace wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Totto wrote:

 grouchoben wrote:
I think sanctuary/rune are pretty important to have on one of your knights, more and more, to be frank. You can't easily avoid having a knight deepstruck unless you've gone in deep for some soup, but you can often make it so that only one of your knights is a viable/high priority target for it, and put your 5++ in cc knight in that role.

Rotate ion shields to give it a 4++, and you're in business.

Wait, so you mean rotate ion on a knight with sanctuary gives it 4++ even in melee?

Yes. It's not phase locked. It makes zero mention of any phases except that lasts until end of phase. The specific trigger is when enemy targets knight. That is common for both melee and shooting. Can't attack in melee without targeting something eh?

It's not as common as in shooting as most knights don't have melee inv save but if you have then it's 100% valid.

Pretty sure that doesn't work as the Ion Shield save only works against ranged attacks and Rotate Ion Shields improves the Ion Shield save...which doesn't apply. Been a while since I played against Knights though so I may be wrong.

Yeah the strategums is way more permisive than you think it's all flavour text the actual rule is just improve the units invulnerable save by 1 (to a maximum of 4) untill the end of the phase.

Also if your playing imperial Knights taking Armour of the sainted ion gets you a 2+Save meaning that someone has to be dropping serious AP even in CC.

Slipspace wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Totto wrote:

 grouchoben wrote:
I think sanctuary/rune are pretty important to have on one of your knights, more and more, to be frank. You can't easily avoid having a knight deepstruck unless you've gone in deep for some soup, but you can often make it so that only one of your knights is a viable/high priority target for it, and put your 5++ in cc knight in that role.

Rotate ion shields to give it a 4++, and you're in business.

Wait, so you mean rotate ion on a knight with sanctuary gives it 4++ even in melee?

Yes. It's not phase locked. It makes zero mention of any phases except that lasts until end of phase. The specific trigger is when enemy targets knight. That is common for both melee and shooting. Can't attack in melee without targeting something eh?

It's not as common as in shooting as most knights don't have melee inv save but if you have then it's 100% valid.

Pretty sure that doesn't work as the Ion Shield save only works against ranged attacks and Rotate Ion Shields improves the Ion Shield save...which doesn't apply. Been a while since I played against Knights though so I may be wrong.

There's relic that gives invulnerable save in melee. We are talking about that. As for RIS...

"use this stratagem when enemy unit targets...that has invulnerable save....Unit the end of the phase that vehicle unit's invulnerable save is improved by 1(to maximum of 4+).

Cut of keywords and CP cost things.

Where does stratagem rules refer to ion shields? Yes name says but name!=rules. Nor does fluff matter. It's all the text from "Use this stratagem..." and onward that matters. It specfically speaks about invulnerable saves. Not ion shield saves etc. And if you want fluff explanation the relic is just more advanced ion shield.