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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/13 23:21:38
Subject: Doomstalker Overwatch
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Ancient Space Wolves Venerable Dreadnought
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OK so 9th edition Overwatch doesn’t have a built-in 1/turn restriction and the Canoptek Doomstalker doesn’t have one either. Can a Doomstalker therefore fire Overwatch at every enemy unit that charges a friendly Necron unit in range of its effect?
Contrast the T’au Greater Good rule which does have a specific limitation to prevent multiple, let’s call them “supporting fire”, attempts by any one unit.
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"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 00:07:56
Subject: Re:Doomstalker Overwatch
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Chalice-Wielding Sanguinary High Priest
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9th ed absolutely does have a built-in Overwatch restriction - it's now a stratagem. And like all stratagems, you can only use a particular strat once per phase.
So not only can the Doomstalker only fire Overwatch at one enemy unit, if it does so, you're not getting any other Overwatch that turn.
Now, this assumes it doesn't have access to Overwatch by itself, outside of the strat, but I'm not seeing anything to suggest that (whereas the Tau do).
I'm also not at all sure where you've gotten the idea that a Doomstalker can fire Overwatch at any units other than one that's directly charging it. I don't see anything to grant this on its datasheet - is it getting that from somewhere else in the Codex? (Is this even coming from the new Necron Codex?)
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"Hard pressed on my right. My centre is yielding. Impossible to manoeuvre. Situation excellent. I am attacking." - General Ferdinand Foch |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 00:25:56
Subject: Re:Doomstalker Overwatch
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Dakka Veteran
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Super Ready wrote:9th ed absolutely does have a built-in Overwatch restriction - it's now a stratagem. And like all stratagems, you can only use a particular strat once per phase.
So not only can the Doomstalker only fire Overwatch at one enemy unit, if it does so, you're not getting any other Overwatch that turn.
Now, this assumes it doesn't have access to Overwatch by itself, outside of the strat, but I'm not seeing anything to suggest that (whereas the Tau do).
I'm also not at all sure where you've gotten the idea that a Doomstalker can fire Overwatch at any units other than one that's directly charging it. I don't see anything to grant this on its datasheet - is it getting that from somewhere else in the Codex? (Is this even coming from the new Necron Codex?)
Yes Doomstalker has a special rule Sentinel Construct - that gives it a free overwatch shot every time a friendly unit within 6″ is charged.
The rule itself doesn't have the same once per turn limit wording that the T'au rule does.
The Doomstalker datasheet that was released in the back of the command edition book was only partially complete - it has this extra rule in the codex.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 00:26:07
Subject: Re:Doomstalker Overwatch
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Lieutenant General
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The Doomstalker's 'Sentinel Construct' ability allows it to fire Overwatch when a nearby <DYNASTY> or DYNASTIC AGENT unit is charged.
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'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 00:40:29
Subject: Doomstalker Overwatch
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
UK
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The rule specifically allows for it to fire multiple times. It clearly is worded that they expect it to have the option.
The limit is this bit
" Unless this model is within Engagement Range of any enemy models".
So clearly if an opponent knows about this they are thus encouraged to charge so that they end their charge within engagement range if they can. The Stalker doesn't have to be engaged, only be within engagement range of the enemy. That's the limit that shuts it down; otherwise yes every time an enemy unit charges a unit within 6 inchs of the stalker it can fire using its high-power option (even if it did move in the preceding movement phase).
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 07:11:29
Subject: Doomstalker Overwatch
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Ancient Space Wolves Venerable Dreadnought
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Overread wrote:So clearly if an opponent knows about this they are thus encouraged to charge so that they end their charge within engagement range if they can. The Stalker doesn't have to be engaged, only be within engagement range of the enemy. That's the limit that shuts it down.
Being in engagement range makes you engaged and an eligible unit to fight (Fight Phase, first para, second sentence). Also, charging units are not allowed to move into engagement range of units which they have not declared a charge against (Charge Phase, Charging a Unit, fourth sentence). Doing so would lock it down though.
But this raises another question:
If a unit declares a charge against some warriors and a Doomstalker, can the Doomstalker fire Overwatch twice at that charging unit? It satisfies all the conditions for its own rule itself and again we find that the core Overwatch rule says nothing about a unit firing Overwatch multiple times in a turn.
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"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 08:08:40
Subject: Re:Doomstalker Overwatch
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Chalice-Wielding Sanguinary High Priest
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Aha, so I was missing something - I must have been looking at the starter box version of the datasheet, as Cryptek of Awesome suspected.
For that last question - is there anything about how Sentinel Construct is worded that could suggest it's once per charge? Or just once per unit charged?
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"Hard pressed on my right. My centre is yielding. Impossible to manoeuvre. Situation excellent. I am attacking." - General Ferdinand Foch |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 17:48:38
Subject: Re:Doomstalker Overwatch
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Dakka Veteran
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Super Ready wrote:Aha, so I was missing something - I must have been looking at the starter box version of the datasheet, as Cryptek of Awesome suspected.
For that last question - is there anything about how Sentinel Construct is worded that could suggest it's once per charge? Or just once per unit charged?
Here's the full rule for reference:
Sentinel Construct
Each time an enemy unit declares a charge against a friendly <Dynasty> or Dynastic Agent unit within 6” of this model, unless this model is within Engagement range of any enemy models, this model can fire Overwatch at the charging unit as if it were also a target of that charge (this is in addition to any other units that are firing Overwatch). Each time this model fires Overwatch, it makes attacks with its doomsday blaster using the high power profile.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/14 18:32:34
Subject: Re:Doomstalker Overwatch
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Chalice-Wielding Sanguinary High Priest
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Nice, thanks Cryptek. Looks to me that the Doomstalker does benefit from its own rule - it's within 6" of itself, after all.
However, I'd say you only get to fire once per charge declaration. The rule triggers "Each time an enemy unit declares a charge", and when you declare a charge against multiple units, you're still only declaring it once.
This is also backed up by the core rules for Overwatch:
"If an enemy unit declares a charge that targets one or more units from your army that have such a rule, each of those units can fire Overwatch before the charge roll is made."
(Emphasis mine, of course.)
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"Hard pressed on my right. My centre is yielding. Impossible to manoeuvre. Situation excellent. I am attacking." - General Ferdinand Foch |
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