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2020/12/06 20:51:33
Subject: I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
kirotheavenger wrote: Depends on which background, I think 8th edition completely overhauled the lore.
The Imperium is no longer backwards and fighting a losing battle.
Now they're advancing at record pace and are summoning vast crusades to fight back.
Which completely misses the point as to why 40k was great.
Luckily it’s a forlorn hope, the universe is still under attack from all sides, situation bleaker than ever blah blah basically exactly the same as it ever was, save for people still being salty about some slightly taller Marines over three years later.
Stormonu wrote: For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
2020/12/06 21:05:29
Subject: I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
kirotheavenger wrote: Depends on which background, I think 8th edition completely overhauled the lore.
The Imperium is no longer backwards and fighting a losing battle.
Now they're advancing at record pace and are summoning vast crusades to fight back.
Which completely misses the point as to why 40k was great.
Luckily it’s a forlorn hope, the universe is still under attack from all sides, situation bleaker than ever blah blah basically exactly the same as it ever was, save for people still being salty about some slightly taller Marines over three years later.
The Great Rift was the best thing to happen to the Imperium in a long time. Guilliman got brought back as a direct result of it, Cawl suddenly pulled the covers off untold numbers of (better than ever) Marine reinforcements, the Imperium's actively going back on the offensive, crossing the Great Rift apparently only costs you a ship or two of redshirts so long as you've got plot armour, Chaos can't/won't keep any kind of momentum up.
The tone's never been more optimistic in 40k.
2020/12/06 21:11:04
Subject: I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
kirotheavenger wrote: Depends on which background, I think 8th edition completely overhauled the lore.
The Imperium is no longer backwards and fighting a losing battle.
Now they're advancing at record pace and are summoning vast crusades to fight back.
Which completely misses the point as to why 40k was great.
Totally agree, and I really dislike the aesthetic of the new Space Marine stuff.
My personal approach is to just ignore the new stuff and pretend it doesn't exist. Of course, that only works so well as not using Primaris is tantamount to slitting your own throat when it comes to competitive Space Marines.
2020/12/06 21:12:27
Subject: I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
kirotheavenger wrote: Depends on which background, I think 8th edition completely overhauled the lore.
The Imperium is no longer backwards and fighting a losing battle.
Now they're advancing at record pace and are summoning vast crusades to fight back.
Which completely misses the point as to why 40k was great.
Luckily it’s a forlorn hope, the universe is still under attack from all sides, situation bleaker than ever blah blah basically exactly the same as it ever was, save for people still being salty about some slightly taller Marines over three years later.
Well, it would probably help if we got some lore that wasn't constantly talking primaris up. Maybe stories where instead of having CSM characters talk about how awesome primaris are we could get some where the old veterans show the thin bloods what a few millennia of experience can do.
Or show us what Chaos and Xenos factions have been up to around and past the Great Rift in the couple of centuries since Cadia fell (that is where the timeline is right now, isn't it?). Maybe see what they've been building out there. The 8th edition CSM codex hinted at some of the more scattered Legions starting to reunite, that could be bad news for the corpse worshippers.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/12/06 21:14:37
2020/12/06 21:54:04
Subject: I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
Gadzilla666 wrote: Or show us what Chaos and Xenos factions have been up to around and past the Great Rift in the couple of centuries since Cadia fell (that is where the timeline is right now, isn't it?). Maybe see what they've been building out there. The 8th edition CSM codex hinted at some of the more scattered Legions starting to reunite, that could be bad news for the corpse worshippers.
At least for the orks they have done that. Thrakka has created a sector-spanning and continuously growing empire that is amassing orks, ships and wargear for something and Sage of the Beast was mostly about the Space Wolves spectacularly failing to do anything about it.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2020/12/06 22:12:25
Subject: I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
kirotheavenger wrote: Depends on which background, I think 8th edition completely overhauled the lore.
The Imperium is no longer backwards and fighting a losing battle.
Now they're advancing at record pace and are summoning vast crusades to fight back.
Which completely misses the point as to why 40k was great.
Luckily it’s a forlorn hope, the universe is still under attack from all sides, situation bleaker than ever blah blah basically exactly the same as it ever was, save for people still being salty about some slightly taller Marines over three years later.
The Great Rift was the best thing to happen to the Imperium in a long time. Guilliman got brought back as a direct result of it, Cawl suddenly pulled the covers off untold numbers of (better than ever) Marine reinforcements, the Imperium's actively going back on the offensive, crossing the Great Rift apparently only costs you a ship or two of redshirts so long as you've got plot armour, Chaos can't/won't keep any kind of momentum up.
The tone's never been more optimistic in 40k.
I mean Cadia got fried; there's a Chaos fleet that almost cut the Imperium in half; it seems Abbadon has been building up Crusades for more than just smashing things up; Necrons are starting to actually organise and unite behind a single leader who in turn only fled back to the Galaxy because of a threat he saw without in the black which we assume is the Tyranids. Tyranids themselves are building a vast planet sized weapon for a purpose no one knows; Genestealer Cults are on the Rise. Upstart Xenos races are not just pushing back, but securing and corrupting humans to their cause on the Fringe
About the only Xenos not causing trouble en-mass is Eldar and there's every chance that that will change if they get a big model and lore update. With the revelation likely being that Eldar will shift from a race dwindling and on the fringe that acts in secret; to one that actually starts to push back boundaries and take new worlds (heck if GW ever releases Exodites they'd be ideal for pushing the story of Eldar starting to reclaim worlds and territories of their own once more)
Sure the Imperium got a Primarch back and some new toys, but by heck its not all that hopeful when almost everything else has turned against them. I mean sure we won't see the Imperium fall, but its not like its enjoying a second Golden Age of prosperity. Heck the returned Primarch has to deal with all kinds of political issues from major segments of the Imperium who don't really want him around!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/12/06 22:14:15
Gadzilla666 wrote: Or show us what Chaos and Xenos factions have been up to around and past the Great Rift in the couple of centuries since Cadia fell (that is where the timeline is right now, isn't it?). Maybe see what they've been building out there. The 8th edition CSM codex hinted at some of the more scattered Legions starting to reunite, that could be bad news for the corpse worshippers.
At least for the orks they have done that. Thrakka has created a sector-spanning and continuously growing empire that is amassing orks, ships and wargear for something and Sage of the Beast was mostly about the Space Wolves spectacularly failing to do anything about it.
Now that could be interesting. Maybe Ghaz could be planning on taking back Ullano.... I mean Armageddon, back permanently. Hopefully gw will finally let Orks win for once, though it sounds like they did in War of The Beast. Though it was a close call for Ghaz.
2020/12/06 22:46:54
Subject: Re:I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
There is no tank comparable to the Predator in real life.
*cough*
M113A1 Medium Reconnaissance Vehicle (MRV) - Full designation Carrier, Fire Support, Full Track M113A1 (FS) Scorpion Turret[4] was an Australian variant similar to the M113 FSV, but using the turret from the FV101 Scorpion light tank,
Crew weapons would often be served, in practice, by crews larger than the official.
Although even if they go tjr other way, Germany's chronic man power shortages is not evidence of similarity to a lascannon, because a lascannon is clearly far more widely deployed and more mobile than the 50mm (we also established it's more powerful than the 50mm).
Where's the sponson mounted weapons on that vehicle? Where's the variant with two powerful anti-tank guns? Why is it much less armoured than a Predator? (A Predator is 13 out 14 possible armour armour points).
A visual similarity is not really relevant.
Even a Leman Russ, a more clear call back to real life armour, mounts 3 large crew served weapons as *secondary* armament, no WW2 tank has ever mounted anything more than small machine guns as secondary armament, and normally only ~2. Post war experiments with heavier co-axs have all failed and we're back to 1 machine gun as secondary. Weaker in both impact and number than a Russ.
It's a baffling argument that 40k closely follow real life.
Okay maybe I was a little overzealous in "no tank ever", I forgot about those two fairly niche tanks.
Feel free to declare intellectual victory.
Regardless, so what?
It doesn't change the crux of the matter at all.
Beyond a rare, bad, joke of a tank and a stop gap measure I'm right.
In 40k those tanks are *very much* the norm.
To head off the inevitable "the Imperium isn't the norm" it is on the tabletop, which is what matters to this discussion.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/12/06 23:02:14
2020/12/06 23:38:06
Subject: Re:I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
Nurglitch wrote: Yes, pinning, falling back, stunning, and shaking vehicles were some great breaks on the whole 'overwhelming firepower' thing that was going on.
They made sense with the rate of fire of older editions. Now rate of fire is massively superior and with more lethality around the last thing we need is the abiltiy to invalidate enemy units in addition to casualties.
Maybe? I think allowing weapons to do something other than cause casualties would be a good offset to the ridiculous arms race of the last couple of editions.
2020/12/07 18:50:21
Subject: Re:I am getting back into 40k. Is 9th ed any good?
