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If you are shooing with 2 different weapons that both do mortal wounds, when do you resolve mortals?  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Made in us
Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin





Livermore, Ca

We have two weapons shooting a unit, and they have different profiles but both throw out mortal wounds because that what imperial knights do. If the first weapon does its thing and leave a model with 1 wound, do we resolve the second weapon damage rolls before applying the mortal wounds from the 1st weapon? I just got back from a tournament... I my opponenet was Imperial Knights and I decided to resolve the 1st weapons mortals before going to the 2nd weapon. My opponent thought that mortals get applied at the very end after all weapons of both types were fired.

Not sure how which way is proper.
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






Depends on the specific wording of the abilities/weapons in play here, but usually when mortal wounds are inflicted in addition to normal damage on an attack...

1. You'd roll the attack's hit roll.
2. You'd roll the attack's wound roll.
3. Your opponent would roll a Save, if applicable.
4. Normal damage, if any, would be allocated for the attack.
5. Mortal wounds dealt in addition to the normal damage would be allocated.

Then you'd move on to resolving the next step.

If you're fast rolling, you'd roll many attacks' steps 1 and 2 at the same time, and then proceed per attack for 3-4-5 for each successful wound.

example, for a weapon which does 10 attacks:
11111 11111
2222
345 345 345 345

Edit: I am incorrect, see Rare Rule below.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/09/26 17:32:31


I'm on a podcast about (video) game design:
https://makethatgame.com

And I also make tabletop wargaming videos!
https://www.youtube.com/@tableitgaming 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

Warhammer 40,000 Core Rulebook FAQ wrote:Page 363 – Rare Rules
Add the following:
Multiple attacks that inflict mortal wounds
Some attacks can inflict mortal wounds either instead of, or in addition to, the normal damage. If, when a unit is selected to shoot or fight, more than one of its attacks that target an enemy unit have such a rule, all the normal damage inflicted by the attacking unit’s attacks are resolved against that target before any of the mortal wounds are inflicted on it.
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Cardiff

Attacks are resolved one at a time, by the Core rules, and it avoids a bunch of confusion with weird weapons. Even if you roll all of one gun’s attacks together, by the rules you apply regular damage, then MW. You’d then move onto the next weapon once all attacks with one weapon made.

If you’re fast-rolling things that shouldn’t be fast rolled that’s when you get into a pickle, so don’t do it. If the two weapons can legitimately be fast rolled together, do all normal damage then MWs.

 Stormonu wrote:
For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

Read that FAQ quote again, JohnnyHell.
   
Made in us
Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin





Livermore, Ca

 alextroy wrote:
Warhammer 40,000 Core Rulebook FAQ wrote:Page 363 – Rare Rules
Add the following:
Multiple attacks that inflict mortal wounds
Some attacks can inflict mortal wounds either instead of, or in addition to, the normal damage. If, when a unit is selected to shoot or fight, more than one of its attacks that target an enemy unit have such a rule, all the normal damage inflicted by the attacking unit’s attacks are resolved against that target before any of the mortal wounds are inflicted on it.




So regardless of fast rolling groups of weapons... resolve all the normal damage, then at the very end apply all mortal wounds?
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

 Sazzlefrats wrote:
 alextroy wrote:
Warhammer 40,000 Core Rulebook FAQ wrote:Page 363 – Rare Rules
Add the following:
Multiple attacks that inflict mortal wounds
Some attacks can inflict mortal wounds either instead of, or in addition to, the normal damage. If, when a unit is selected to shoot or fight, more than one of its attacks that target an enemy unit have such a rule, all the normal damage inflicted by the attacking unit’s attacks are resolved against that target before any of the mortal wounds are inflicted on it.

So regardless of fast rolling groups of weapons... resolve all the normal damage, then at the very end apply all mortal wounds?
Yes. Your unit can have 20 models with a total of 40 different weapons, but the Mortal Wounds for any and all of them are not resolved until you complete resolution of all weapon attacks and their non-Mortal Wounds.
   
Made in us
Deathwing Terminator with Assault Cannon






 alextroy wrote:
Warhammer 40,000 Core Rulebook FAQ wrote:Page 363 – Rare Rules
Add the following:
Multiple attacks that inflict mortal wounds
Some attacks can inflict mortal wounds either instead of, or in addition to, the normal damage. If, when a unit is selected to shoot or fight, more than one of its attacks that target an enemy unit have such a rule, all the normal damage inflicted by the attacking unit’s attacks are resolved against that target before any of the mortal wounds are inflicted on it.
IIRC the FAQ was addressed around the time when Tau codex was released - I'm probably wrong, but anyways.

The language of the FAQ seems to address weapons with multiple attacks that inflict mortal wounds, i.e. broadside heavy rail rifle with Heavy 2 profile, where it inflicts 1 MW for every successful wound rolls.
Assuming both of the attacks successfully wounds, it would imply that you don't get to issue the MW from the first successful wound roll from 1st shot of the HRR to kill off a model with 1 W remaining (after having resolved normal damage) so that the opponent is forced to allocate the second attack to another model in the target unit.

Core rules dictate that when shooing with multiple weapons, all attacks made with one weapon must be resolved before resolving attacks with another weapon.

So in the OP's case, the order of operation would be:
1. Resolve normal damage from weapon #1
2. Resolve MW from weapon #1
3. Resolve normal damage from weapon #2
4. Resolve MW from weapon #2

This message was edited 8 times. Last update was at 2022/09/27 15:08:55


 
   
Made in de
Nihilistic Necron Lord






Germany

The order is all normal damage from gun#1, then all normal damage from gun#2, then all MWs from both guns.
   
Made in us
Deathwing Terminator with Assault Cannon






 p5freak wrote:
The order is all normal damage from gun#1, then all normal damage from gun#2, then all MWs from both guns.
Which is demonstrably false as not resolving the ability of the weapon #1 prior to resolving the normal damage for weapon #2 violates the core rule. It's only when a given weapon has multiple attacks (i.e. heavy 2) the rare rules FAQ applies.
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






The FAQ says when a unit has multiple attacks, not when a weapon has multiple attacks.

I'm on a podcast about (video) game design:
https://makethatgame.com

And I also make tabletop wargaming videos!
https://www.youtube.com/@tableitgaming 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

 skchsan wrote:
 p5freak wrote:
The order is all normal damage from gun#1, then all normal damage from gun#2, then all MWs from both guns.
Which is demonstrably false as not resolving the ability of the weapon #1 prior to resolving the normal damage for weapon #2 violates the core rule. It's only when a given weapon has multiple attacks (i.e. heavy 2) the rare rules FAQ applies.
Incorrect. Read the Rare Rule again. It says unit, not model nor weapon.
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Cardiff

 alextroy wrote:
Read that FAQ quote again, JohnnyHell.


Turns out I’ve been playing it wrong! Interesting!

 Stormonu wrote:
For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 alextroy wrote:
 skchsan wrote:
 p5freak wrote:
The order is all normal damage from gun#1, then all normal damage from gun#2, then all MWs from both guns.
Which is demonstrably false as not resolving the ability of the weapon #1 prior to resolving the normal damage for weapon #2 violates the core rule. It's only when a given weapon has multiple attacks (i.e. heavy 2) the rare rules FAQ applies.
Incorrect. Read the Rare Rule again. It says unit, not model nor weapon.

As above. The rare rule states a unit making attacks. Not a model.
   
 
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