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I'm a long-time Imperial Fist player, and I heard in the rumor mill that after World Eaters there may possibly be a group of new codexes to replace the old 8e supplements for space marines that have yet to be replaced (Iron Hands, Imperial Fists, Salamanders, Raven Guard, Ultramarines). I have no information, this is just a thread about what I would personally like to see. In honor of the 7th Legion, here are my top 7 changes I want from the next Imperial Fist codex.



1. Chapter tactic loses the ignores light cover aspect. This is replaced by “Imperial Fist bolt weapons increase their AP value by 1 (-1 becomes -2 etc.).” Exploding 6s to hit is unchanged.

I don’t think ignoring light cover army wide is a good thing for the game. Right now there are very few complaints given the state of Imperial Fists, but ignoring light cover army-wide is no fun. It basically means that if a piece of terrain is not totally LOS blocking, it may as well not be there when you are facing Imperial Fists. This takes away a lot of the positioning aspect of the game. Increasing IF bolt weapon AP by 1 maintains a similar effect against for Imperial Fist signature weapons against targets in cover, and is a bit better against targets out of cover. Mostly this is to get rid of the “feels bad” of terrain feeling useless to your opponent.

2. Imperial Fist super doctrine needs a change. I’m fine with a total rework, but at bare minimum it needs to become: “Whilst the Devastator Doctrine is active, when resolving an attack made with a Heavy Weapon of strength 7 or higher against a Vehicle, Building, or Monster unit, add 1 to the damage characteristic of that attack.”

The fact that IF super doctrine doesn’t affect monsters, making it useless against entire armies is ridiculous.

3. Imperial Fists need to be able to choose when they want to use their doctrine.


There are many iterations of this but basically I’ve seen suggestions of you get 2 assault doctrines, 2 tactical doctrines, and 2 devastator doctrines per game, and you choose which one to use in your command phase. Currently even against armies with vehicles, all the opponent needs to do is hide their vehicles turn 1 and your doctrine buff is useless. It’s kind of absurd when you start to think that this is the equivalent Imperial Fist ability to Savage Echoes.

4. Imperial Fists need a unique unit.

I don’t much care what it is, so long as it’s pretty good. If you look at marine chapters that occasionally do well, they are all heavily reliant on their unique units. Imagine Blood Angels without Sanguinary Guard, Death Company, or Librarian Dreadnoughts. Imagine Dark Angels without any Deathwing or Ravenwing units. The lack of a unique unit for Fists makes it hard to adjust their balance without throwing off every space marine chapter.

5. Total reworks on just about all of their unique gear, warlord traits, secondary objectives, etc.

Eye of Hypnoth for example is the only relic worth looking at. Geokenesis discipline? Needs a total start-from scratch. There is nothing that is salvageable there.


6. Tank Hunters stratagem should cost 1 cp.

Other similar factions get a similar ability for 1 cp. 2 is too much.

7. Bolter Drill Stratagem should cost 0 CP.

This is the 6s to hit explode again with bolt weapons stratagem. That’s right. It should cost zero. 2 cp for this is outrageous, even 1 cp is too much. Just give it out as a free buff once per turn for a bolter unit. If you mathhammer this out the amount of extra damage you get from it is pathetic. You’re literally better off using 1 cp to command reroll a melta shot or something.




Do you agree or disagree? What changes would you like to see to the Imperial Fists in a future book?


Best of luck to all of you.

Disclaimer: I'm not an Imperial Fists player, so take all my thoughts with a grain of salt.

apogats wrote:

1. Chapter tactic loses the ignores light cover aspect. This is replaced by “Imperial Fist bolt weapons increase their AP value by 1 (-1 becomes -2 etc.).” Exploding 6s to hit is unchanged.

I don’t think ignoring light cover army wide is a good thing for the game. Right now there are very few complaints given the state of Imperial Fists, but ignoring light cover army-wide is no fun. It basically means that if a piece of terrain is not totally LOS blocking, it may as well not be there when you are facing Imperial Fists. This takes away a lot of the positioning aspect of the game. Increasing IF bolt weapon AP by 1 maintains a similar effect against for Imperial Fist signature weapons against targets in cover, and is a bit better against targets out of cover. Mostly this is to get rid of the “feels bad” of terrain feeling useless to your opponent.

You're correct that army-wide ignoring light cover is pretty lame. Giving all intercessors inferno bolt rounds as a chapter tactic both feels a bit much and also makes my Thousand Sons cranky. It also kind of feels like a reaction to Armor of Contempt? (Which is its own problem.) I don't see myself playing against an army of AP-2 bolt rifles (AP-3 for half the game if tactical doctrine goes unchanged) and finding the experience particularly enjoyable. Actually, good example: remember eldar hail of doom? That too-good trait that made the basic eldar guns have 1 better AP if you were close enough to your target? GW ended up nerfing it by making it your entire chapter tactic instead of one half of your chapter tactic. Giving bolt weapons an extra point of AP would be hail of doom, but without the range penalty or the nerf.

3. Imperial Fists need to be able to choose when they want to use their doctrine.

There are many iterations of this but basically I’ve seen suggestions of you get 2 assault doctrines, 2 tactical doctrines, and 2 devastator doctrines per game, and you choose which one to use in your command phase. Currently even against armies with vehicles, all the opponent needs to do is hide their vehicles turn 1 and your doctrine buff is useless. It’s kind of absurd when you start to think that this is the equivalent Imperial Fist ability to Savage Echoes.

Sincere question and not a jab at you: have you looked at the Deathwatch Rules. They have better bolters, and one of their gimmicks is being able to choose the order of your doctrines instead of following the usual order. I'm wondering if DW would provide what you're looking for.

But yeah, I mostly agree with you on this. Ideally, I'd rather get rid of doctrines entirely, but if we're going to have them, something like what you're pitching here seems reasonable.

4. Imperial Fists need a unique unit.

I don’t much care what it is, so long as it’s pretty good. If you look at marine chapters that occasionally do well, they are all heavily reliant on their unique units. Imagine Blood Angels without Sanguinary Guard, Death Company, or Librarian Dreadnoughts. Imagine Dark Angels without any Deathwing or Ravenwing units. The lack of a unique unit for Fists makes it hard to adjust their balance without throwing off every space marine chapter.

Marines already eat up too many slots in the release schedule. If you can't think of an iconic unit that IFs desperately need added to their range, they probably don't need said unit all that desperately. You also sort of have a unique unit in the form of Black Templar initiates or whatever they're called. Technically not IF, I know. But seriously, wanting to add more units to a codex that already struggles with niche protection and already eats up too many slots in the release schedule seems like a bad idea to me.

I can absolutely imagine a world where all the extra special chapter-specific units get rolled into more generic datasheets. I hope that GW eventually goes that route. Frankly, extra angry chainsword Blood Angels don't need their own datasheets. Chapters other than BA should be able to figure out how to put a lbirarian in a dreadnaught. Dark Angel bikers and terminators don't need extra special rules just because someone told them a secret.

7. Bolter Drill Stratagem should cost 0 CP.

This is the 6s to hit explode again with bolt weapons stratagem. That’s right. It should cost zero. 2 cp for this is outrageous, even 1 cp is too much. Just give it out as a free buff once per turn for a bolter unit. If you mathhammer this out the amount of extra damage you get from it is pathetic. You’re literally better off using 1 cp to command reroll a melta shot or something.

I'm cautiously open to more 0 CP strats being a thing. That said, I suspect giving a faction a free "kill more betterer" stratagem every turn would be sort of annoying for opponents. I'd probably rather just get rid of the strat entirely if it's that weak. Especially given that IFs already have rules to represent their affinity for bolters. But then, I'd get rid of pretty much all the kill more betterer strats in the game, so I'm biased.

Do you agree or disagree? What changes would you like to see to the Imperial Fists in a future book?

1. Remove doctrines and their equivalents from every faction in the game.
2. Get rid of every chapter tactic in the game that just makes you kill faster or die slower.
3. Get rid of Shock Assault and Bolter Discipline for marines (but hand out something like them to choice subfactions).
4. Imperial Fists get Bolter Discipline as part of their chapter tactic. It fits their "stand on a wall and whittle down the approaching army" thing.
5. When IFs are the Defender, they can place mine field tokens outside their deployment zone pregame. Minefield tokens cause the area within 3" of them to be treated as dangerous terrain. Maybe have the tokens go away after they inflict X wounds, maybe don't. When IFs are the Attacker, they can call down an Orbital Bombardment type rule (mortal wounds against everything within a certain area one turn after you put down a marker) on turn 1. This represents them coordinating with off-screen artillery to take down an entrenched position. It will also have the side-effect of encouraging your opponent to spread out and possibly abandon some cover, which seems thematically appropriate.
6. Let IF units that don't move perform an "Overwatch" action. Needs a different name to avoid confusion, but the idea is that units that perform the action get to shoot at the end of the enemy shooting phase if they don't shoot on your turn. Basically gives you a sort of army-wide Interceptor option/a chance to shoot the enemy as they come forward even if they start the game hiding behind terrain.

Not sure I'd do much else with IF to be honest. They're a pretty by-the-book chapter. Items 4-6 above let you play them in a more defensive fashion without just giving them a vertical boost to their offense or defense.

apogats wrote:
I'm a long-time Imperial Fist player, and I heard in the rumor mill that after World Eaters there may possibly be a group of new codexes to replace the old 8e supplements for space marines that have yet to be replaced (Iron Hands, Imperial Fists, Salamanders, Raven Guard, Ultramarines). I have no information, this is just a thread about what I would personally like to see. In honor of the 7th Legion, here are my top 7 changes I want from the next Imperial Fist codex.



1. Chapter tactic loses the ignores light cover aspect. This is replaced by “Imperial Fist bolt weapons increase their AP value by 1 (-1 becomes -2 etc.).” Exploding 6s to hit is unchanged.

I don’t think ignoring light cover army wide is a good thing for the game. Right now there are very few complaints given the state of Imperial Fists, but ignoring light cover army-wide is no fun. It basically means that if a piece of terrain is not totally LOS blocking, it may as well not be there when you are facing Imperial Fists. This takes away a lot of the positioning aspect of the game. Increasing IF bolt weapon AP by 1 maintains a similar effect against for Imperial Fist signature weapons against targets in cover, and is a bit better against targets out of cover. Mostly this is to get rid of the “feels bad” of terrain feeling useless to your opponent.

What's wrong with the ignoring cover aspect? Your bolt weapons are already getting extra AP through Doctrines, adding another point of AP for an arbitrary reason is just overkill.

2. Imperial Fist super doctrine needs a change. I’m fine with a total rework, but at bare minimum it needs to become: “Whilst the Devastator Doctrine is active, when resolving an attack made with a Heavy Weapon of strength 7 or higher against a Vehicle, Building, or Monster unit, add 1 to the damage characteristic of that attack.”

The fact that IF super doctrine doesn’t affect monsters, making it useless against entire armies is ridiculous.

And? Which armies besides all-monster Tyranids is this going to be useless against?

3. Imperial Fists need to be able to choose when they want to use their doctrine.


There are many iterations of this but basically I’ve seen suggestions of you get 2 assault doctrines, 2 tactical doctrines, and 2 devastator doctrines per game, and you choose which one to use in your command phase. Currently even against armies with vehicles, all the opponent needs to do is hide their vehicles turn 1 and your doctrine buff is useless. It’s kind of absurd when you start to think that this is the equivalent Imperial Fist ability to Savage Echoes.

No, they don't need this any more than any other Marine chapter. As said previously, Deathwatch get this by default so try playing them instead.

4. Imperial Fists need a unique unit.

I don’t much care what it is, so long as it’s pretty good. If you look at marine chapters that occasionally do well, they are all heavily reliant on their unique units. Imagine Blood Angels without Sanguinary Guard, Death Company, or Librarian Dreadnoughts. Imagine Dark Angels without any Deathwing or Ravenwing units. The lack of a unique unit for Fists makes it hard to adjust their balance without throwing off every space marine chapter.

A unique unit would be nice but I wouldn't make it a priority. I'd just do some special Terminator or Breacher Marine unit and leave it at that.

5. Total reworks on just about all of their unique gear, warlord traits, secondary objectives, etc.

Eye of Hypnoth for example is the only relic worth looking at. Geokenesis discipline? Needs a total start-from scratch. There is nothing that is salvageable there.

Well what are your ideas then?

6. Tank Hunters stratagem should cost 1 cp.

Other similar factions get a similar ability for 1 cp. 2 is too much.

Fair enough, although best to compare what units other armies get to use it on. If you're putting out more firepower then perhaps it should stay 2CP.

7. Bolter Drill Stratagem should cost 0 CP.

This is the 6s to hit explode again with bolt weapons stratagem. That’s right. It should cost zero. 2 cp for this is outrageous, even 1 cp is too much. Just give it out as a free buff once per turn for a bolter unit. If you mathhammer this out the amount of extra damage you get from it is pathetic. You’re literally better off using 1 cp to command reroll a melta shot or something.

Nah, not necessary to make it 0CP. Maybe 1, but definitely not 0CP.

 Valkyrie wrote:

What's wrong with the ignoring cover aspect? Your bolt weapons are already getting extra AP through Doctrines, adding another point of AP for an arbitrary reason is just overkill.

Devil's advocate: the issue with ignoring cover is that it makes light cover a non-consideration when you play against Fists. Many feel that cover in general is kind of underwhelming and want utilizing cover/terrain/maneuvering to be an important part of the game. Against most opponents, I might be presented with a choice between hugging light cover to stay alive or venturing out onto an objective or going out into the open so that I can line up better shots. It creates an interesting choice. Against Fists, that choice doesn't matter. In a game with limited tactical depth, ignoring light cover makes that tactical depth even more shallow.

But that said, I fully agree about an extra point of AP probably being a bad idea.

And? Which armies besides all-monster Tyranids is this going to be useless against?

I mean, even if it were just tyranids, it would still be a bit weird that the Fists don't benefit against them. The distinction between monsters and vehicles is pretty vague, especially this edition. But for the sake of discussion, you can pretty easily end up with daemon lists that have monsters but not vehicles. Craftworld wraith lists can have things like wraith lords and wraith seers but not necessarily vehicles. Necrons can potentially field a bunch of C'Tan and tomb stalkers without running vehicles as well.

 Wyldhunt wrote:

 Valkyrie wrote:

What's wrong with the ignoring cover aspect? Your bolt weapons are already getting extra AP through Doctrines, adding another point of AP for an arbitrary reason is just overkill.

Devil's advocate: the issue with ignoring cover is that it makes light cover a non-consideration when you play against Fists. Many feel that cover in general is kind of underwhelming and want utilizing cover/terrain/maneuvering to be an important part of the game. Against most opponents, I might be presented with a choice between hugging light cover to stay alive or venturing out onto an objective or going out into the open so that I can line up better shots. It creates an interesting choice. Against Fists, that choice doesn't matter. In a game with limited tactical depth, ignoring light cover makes that tactical depth even more shallow.

But that said, I fully agree about an extra point of AP probably being a bad idea.

And? Which armies besides all-monster Tyranids is this going to be useless against?

I mean, even if it were just tyranids, it would still be a bit weird that the Fists don't benefit against them. The distinction between monsters and vehicles is pretty vague, especially this edition. But for the sake of discussion, you can pretty easily end up with daemon lists that have monsters but not vehicles. Craftworld wraith lists can have things like wraith lords and wraith seers but not necessarily vehicles. Necrons can potentially field a bunch of C'Tan and tomb stalkers without running vehicles as well.

Light Cover is immensely valuable... If your save is already good.

An Intercessor in cover doubles their durability against AP0 or -1, if said cover is Light Cover.
A Guardsman in Light Cover increases their durability by 33%, against AP0.

Which is the opposite of what it should be, to me-a Marine shouldn't benefit from physical cover when dealing with lasguns.

 JNAProductions wrote:

Which is the opposite of what it should be, to me-a Marine shouldn't benefit from physical cover when dealing with lasguns.

I politely disagree. To me, it's not that the chest-high walls and rubble are cushioning the impact of the enemy's attacks; it's that they're obscuring big pieces of his silhouette. So a marine out in the open might suffer more lucky and/or repeated hits to servos (locking up his armor) or exposed cables or whatever. Each individual shot isn't doing much, but eventually they manage to damage sections of the armor. In contrast, taking out the guy behind a barricade has fewer exposed areas. If he's behind a chest-high wall, he doesn't have to worry about slow, steady damage to his legs and lower torso.

In other words, it's not that the cover is stopping that single lucky lasgun shot; it's instead negating X% of the shots that were eventually going to wear away at his armor until a weak point was created and exploited.

Plus, we had marines that didn't care about cover back in the day, and it just kind of made the game less interesting. See above about removing tactical depth from a game that already isn't very tactically deep.

I think that Dense cover should help Marines, 100%. Because that's making them harder to hit. But that's not what Light cover is-that's actually improving their odds of not taking damage from something that's already hit.

It also disproportionately helps good armor armies, which again, I feel is backwards.

Thanks for the ideas!

Regarding the Light Cover/AP change. So here is my reasoning: I talked about the current rules (army wide ignore cover) being a bit boring for your opponent to play against. If you're not on board with that much than agree to disagree I guess! But assuming that you are, the -1 AP on bolter weapons is to keep the Imperial Fist bolter on the same level against targets in cover. Otherwise, if you remove the ignores light cover, you make the bolter dramatically less effective against targets in cover. With the extra -1 ap, but no ignores cover, it will come out as a wash. Without an extra -1 AP, bolter shots are just worse. You dont want to make bolter shots worse on the bolter chapter. Incidentally, non-bolter weapons remain worse against targets in cover, as they will lose the IF army-wide ignores cover bonus, and will not have the extra -1 AP from being bolters. I felt this was more than a fair trade-off.

About Doctrines: Yes, I have looked at the Deathwatch rules. The thing is that since the Devastator Doctrine must chosen first, it basically means Imperial Fists lose all benefit from their super doctrine 50% of the time, assuming your opponent deploys at all reasonably. If you want to keep the rigid doctrine system as it is, then Fists need a different super doctrine. Probably something in Tactical Doctrine, because Devastator is a terrible super doctrine to have the way the game currently works.

Cant think of a unique fist unit? How about some sort of fortification? As long as it's placeable!

Wyldhunt I like your suggestions, but I feel a lot of them are more general changes to space marines, rather than to Imperial Fists. My idea was to assume that Space Marines as a whole have no changes, and only change the subfaction.

Don't know what I would specifically do about gear/warlord traits, etc. Like I said, they need a complete overhaul. That would have been a lot longer than 7 things =p.

Just to show what I mean about bolter drill stratagem: One of the best bolter dakka units you can get is a 6 inceptor unit with assault bolters. For 240 points; you get a total of 36 shots. Dropping the stratagem on them yields on average about 6 extra assault bolter hits. That's just not powerful enough to justify 2 cp. Even at 1 cp I feel its just not strong enough. You could remove the stratagem entirely and replace it with something else, at present it is one of the only stratagems that buff bolters though. Otherwise it needs to cost 0 IMO, or else it needs to have another effect besides the extra hit on 6s to justify it being 1 or 2 cp.

 JNAProductions wrote:
I think that Dense cover should help Marines, 100%. Because that's making them harder to hit. But that's not what Light cover is-that's actually improving their odds of not taking damage from something that's already hit.

It also disproportionately helps good armor armies, which again, I feel is backwards.

Why wouldn't some rocks help a Marine take less damage from lasguns?

You not liking it doesn't mean it doesn't make sense.

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
I think that Dense cover should help Marines, 100%. Because that's making them harder to hit. But that's not what Light cover is-that's actually improving their odds of not taking damage from something that's already hit.

It also disproportionately helps good armor armies, which again, I feel is backwards.

Why wouldn't some rocks help a Marine take less damage from lasguns?

You not liking it doesn't mean it doesn't make sense.

If the rocks obscure line of sight, then they can't be targeted. That helps.

But, which guy should be seeking cover more against (relatively) ordinary firearms?
The 7+ foot tall superhuman clad in power armor? Or Joe Schmoe with a flak vest?

 JNAProductions wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
I think that Dense cover should help Marines, 100%. Because that's making them harder to hit. But that's not what Light cover is-that's actually improving their odds of not taking damage from something that's already hit.

It also disproportionately helps good armor armies, which again, I feel is backwards.

Why wouldn't some rocks help a Marine take less damage from lasguns?

You not liking it doesn't mean it doesn't make sense.

If the rocks obscure line of sight, then they can't be targeted. That helps.

But, which guy should be seeking cover more against (relatively) ordinary firearms?
The 7+ foot tall superhuman clad in power armor? Or Joe Schmoe with a flak vest?

Guy in flak needing it more =/= Dude in Power Armor not using it either, though. So that's right down to your "I don't like it", even if it makes sense.

To be fair, there's definitely room for the cover rules to be improved. However, I feel like it might be better to continue that particular conversation in a different thread given that the topic tends to kind of sprawl.

apogats wrote:
Thanks for the ideas!
Regarding the Light Cover/AP change. So here is my reasoning: I talked about the current rules (army wide ignore cover) being a bit boring for your opponent to play against. If you're not on board with that much than agree to disagree I guess! But assuming that you are, the -1 AP on bolter weapons is to keep the Imperial Fist bolter on the same level against targets in cover. Otherwise, if you remove the ignores light cover, you make the bolter dramatically less effective against targets in cover. With the extra -1 ap, but no ignores cover, it will come out as a wash. Without an extra -1 AP, bolter shots are just worse. You dont want to make bolter shots worse on the bolter chapter. Incidentally, non-bolter weapons remain worse against targets in cover, as they will lose the IF army-wide ignores cover bonus, and will not have the extra -1 AP from being bolters. I felt this was more than a fair trade-off.

I see where you're coming from, and you're right about ignoring cover being a boring rule. The thing is, simply making bolters more powerful regardless of whether or not the target is in cover is also pretty bland and it feels like it's maybe a bit too powerful. You're talking about giving bolt rifles the same AP as a plasma gun for two turns of the game. And again, I feel like Hail of Doom is an apt rule to compare against. Shuriken weapons have the same strength and AP as a bolt rifle with comparable range and shots. If that rule was too powerful on a faction full of squishy elves, it's probably too powerful on a faction full of marines who theoretically die less quickly.

About Doctrines: Yes, I have looked at the Deathwatch rules. The thing is that since the Devastator Doctrine must chosen first, it basically means Imperial Fists lose all benefit from their super doctrine 50% of the time, assuming your opponent deploys at all reasonably. If you want to keep the rigid doctrine system as it is, then Fists need a different super doctrine. Probably something in Tactical Doctrine, because Devastator is a terrible super doctrine to have the way the game currently works.

Ah, but I don't want to keep the doctrine system. ;D

Cant think of a unique fist unit? How about some sort of fortification? As long as it's placeable!

What's your objective with the unique unit thing? It kind of feels you want a new unit just to have one. This is the proposed rules forum. If you have a cool idea, pitch it and we'll gladly give suggestions on how to tweak it for play. But build a new unit for the fun of it or because you have a cool idea; not just because fists get less unique toys than space puppies and vampire marines.

Wyldhunt I like your suggestions, but I feel a lot of them are more general changes to space marines, rather than to Imperial Fists. My idea was to assume that Space Marines as a whole have no changes, and only change the subfaction.

That's fair. I basically feel like 9th edition has given most factions a bunch of rules just for the heck of it that don't really help tell their factions' stories. So in general, my preference would be to toss out a lot of the bland buff rules and replace them with rules that help armies play differently. So my suggested rules above would help Fists feel like they're defending the wall or blasting through the enemy wall. I'd give Raven Guard GSC blip tokens and the option to give bolters a "sniper" profile when they hold still. I'd give White Scars rules to reflect the velocity of their vehicles. Etc. Rules that let you pilot an army in a different fashion rather than just making the enemy die faster.

Just to show what I mean about bolter drill stratagem: One of the best bolter dakka units you can get is a 6 inceptor unit with assault bolters. For 240 points; you get a total of 36 shots. Dropping the stratagem on them yields on average about 6 extra assault bolter hits. That's just not powerful enough to justify 2 cp. Even at 1 cp I feel its just not strong enough. You could remove the stratagem entirely and replace it with something else, at present it is one of the only stratagems that buff bolters though. Otherwise it needs to cost 0 IMO, or else it needs to have another effect besides the extra hit on 6s to justify it being 1 or 2 cp.

See, this strikes me as a prime example of a stratagem that just doesn't need to exist. It doesn't really create an interesting decision beyond, "Is this worth some CP?" If you make it 0CP, it just becomes an extra rule to keep track of that's unlikely to have much impact on the game. I feel like a more interesting version of something like this would be to let the unit fire an additional shot with their bolt weapons, but prevent them from shooting at all until the end of their next turn. The idea being that you're letting rip with your shots but emptying your clips all at once. (Basically ripping off the 4th edition version of the eldar Bladestorm rule.) The rule increases a unit's offense enough to be a big deal, but you actually end up firing fewer shots overall (ex: a bolter would fire 3 shots on a single turn instead of 4 shots over the course of 2 turns). It feels good to get that boost in offense, but deciding whether or not this is the right moment to use it is an interesting decision. And then you might find your unit doing unusual things like running for cover or even re-embarking on a transport the turn after they use this power which opens up a bunch of new gamestates in its own right.

I'm ranting a bit here, but I feel like the goal of stratagems, chapter tactics, etc. should be to make the army play differently, not to make it stronger.

Also for specialized Imperial Fist/Successor specialized units, I think a Centurion Honor Guard of some kind would be VERY in theme. I know someone had mentioned boarding shield Marines, but those should be available to everyone.

I'd get rid of Chapter Tactics, faction-Strats, Doctrines and Super Doctrines for next edition. For an immediate errata the only thing I'd change would be to buff their super doctrine to apply to weapons below S7 like in 8th.

Allowing people to choose their Doctrine when they want is a bad idea, that's the whole point of it and where all the narrative WIN is. It is supposed to represent the structure that the codex astartes places on the warfare doctrines the Space Marines use. Opening it up would be like having a Chaos Eye of the Gods table where you choose your result, when the whole point of Chaos Gods is that they are fickle and unfair.

I am not sure if I would want to keep Chapter Relics. I am currently trying to rewrite every relic in the game, using them to represent what Doctrines and Super Doctrines currently represent. At most you need 3 Relics in a game, usually only 1, so while I wouldn't mind each faction having 30 of them (because you'd only bring 3 into the game), I don't think it's necessary or that one faction having more than another is a problem.

I think balance is secondary when it comes to relics, they should be cool and fun. Who cares if Eye of Hypnoth is more effective than whatever other option you can take if both are awesome and fun to use and play against? Eye of Hypnoth is probably the biggest failure here since it has a re-roll aura and people dislike playing against those.

Another thing I think is important is making the Relics actually feel like they belong to their faction. Making several relics feel like they belong to Imperial Fists seems like a really hard design challenge, I chose to not even try to make a Relic that felt like it belonged uniquely to a Necron Dynasty. Eye of Hypnoth could belong to any sub-faction or faction in the game and nobody would flinch. Necrons probably aren't even the only faction in the game with a relic that adds 1 to Sv and a 6+ FNP and this is supposed to be the super unique thing that only Nihilakh gets? So I have given up on that and just focussed on making about a dozen Necron relics that you hopefully wouldn't confuse for belonging to anybody else.

I finished the ones for Thousand Sons as well but I am unsure whether Thousand Sons should be using Chaos Space Marines mechanics as well or whether they should just be doing their own thing. I think it might be kind of cool for Thousand Sons to use mechanics that identify them as being Chaos Space Marines, along with a bonus mechanic that makes them stand out. The mechanic I gave Thousand Sons is that each Relic gives a unique psychic power, which could be a Grey Knigths thing since they all have psychic powers but I am still pretty happy with how they turned out.

Coming back to Imperial Fists, the question I have whether Imperial Fists need their own Relics or whether players can just pick the Space Marines relic they think is coolest for their list, which may or may not have an Imperial Fists flavour, but will definitely have a Space Marines flavour.

I think your criticism of their geokinesis psychic discipline seems a little harsh, they might not be super powerful, but a few of them seem fair. Some of them are a little bland, but I don't think it's a "remove it from the game and redact all references to its existence" thing like with Gladius Strike Forces. Here are some quick thoughts, rocks (and Imperial Fists) are slow to get moving but they are also hard to stop. Instead of having Aspect of Stone grant the utterly generic temporary +2 S/T, it could grant a permanent +2 T -1 M, you could place that flavour as Nurgle though. Tectonic Purge just needs to do a mortal wound to every enemy unit within 12" when manifested. I'd probably make one or two of the powers have additional range if the psyker remained stationary to make them feel more like siege magics. There are only so much design space within psychic powers, I think this is where we should cut GW some slack, you also have another psychic discipline to use for Space Marines anyway.

 vict0988 wrote:
I'd get rid of Chapter Tactics, faction-Strats, Doctrines and Super Doctrines for next edition. For an immediate errata the only thing I'd change would be to buff their super doctrine to apply to weapons below S7 like in 8th.

I'd be kind of open to that. I still think it needs to apply to monsters as well as vehicle/building though. Good at killing big things is a decent enough ability. Honestly the str 7 thing doesnt bother me as much as the lack of super doctrine against tyranid, or other big models that you'd want to bring down that more or less take the place of vehicles (Tyranid monsters, Eldar wraith constructs, Canoptek Doomstalker, etc).

 vict0988 wrote:
Allowing people to choose their Doctrine when they want is a bad idea, that's the whole point of it and where all the narrative WIN is. It is supposed to represent the structure that the codex astartes places on the warfare doctrines the Space Marines use. Opening it up would be like having a Chaos Eye of the Gods table where you choose your result, when the whole point of Chaos Gods is that they are fickle and unfair.

Don't disagree here. But the fact that it is linked exclusively to turn 1 is a problem. I'd be fine with keeping the rigid doctrine system if our doctrine was Tactical. The ability to hide behind LOS and neutralize the super doctrine entirely *already* makes this a lot weaker than the rest of the other doctrines. Combine that with the fact that you can only Devestator doctrine for 1 turn (other doctrines are 2 or 3 turns of army-buff); is why the IF super doctrine is so bad. Ok well its also bad because +1 damage on heavy str7+ weapons is no where near the ability of like a savage echoes, or other super doctrine... but still.

 vict0988 wrote:
Eye of Hypnoth is probably the biggest failure here since it has a re-roll aura and people dislike playing against those.

Really? People dislike playing agaisnt a reroll 1s in shooting attacks 6" aura? It's a moderate relic that other armies have access to similar/identical abilities. And it's nothing compared to the feels bads of something like Reaper of Obliterax. I never had anyone ever complain about Eye of Hypnoth. Flavorless and boring? That I grant you. But not damaging to the enjoyment of the game.

 vict0988 wrote:
Coming back to Imperial Fists, the question I have whether Imperial Fists need their own Relics or whether players can just pick the Space Marines relic they think is coolest for their list, which may or may not have an Imperial Fists flavour, but will definitely have a Space Marines flavour.

Every other space marine subfaction has their own relics. Lore-wise, each chapter keeps and maintains its own relics. Why shouldn't IF have their own too ? I'm all in favor of upping the theming of some of the relics... but they definitely *do* need their own.

Iron Hands successors have done fine in 9th* as far as I know, although I cannot tell you why they have done fine, Devastator Super Doctrine do not seem to be a problem. Imperial Fists rules just aren't good enough. *Edit

A lot of IF players in 8th used the heavy guns for their Intercessors, that's a terrible option now as far as I know. I want them to have some of that power back. Adding Monsters is probably a great idea considering the meta.

We agree that Eye of Hypnoth is merely boring and flavourless, I wasn't trying to say anything else. Boring and flavourless being the default relic is a shame. Considering you are an Imperial Fists player I would really like to know what you think exciting and flavourful IF Relics would look like. I think having a shared mechanic for all IF Relics like I did for Necrons, Thousand Sons and AdMech would be a good idea and then an additional mechanic for Space Marines. I am currently planning on the Space Marines Relic mechanic would be inspired by Combat Doctrines since I'd like to get rid of those and I was thinking of somehow getting Super Doctrines involved.

Iron Hands did great in 8e... but so did Fists. In 9e, Iron Hands are probably one of the better chapters that don't have a 9e supplement... but it isn't because their super doctrine is any good. Their super doctrine is pretty bad too.... for the same reasons. It's just that their chapter tactic of an army wide 6+ fnp, and better vehicle brackets is probably stronger than the IF chapter tactic of exploding bolter 6s and ignores cover. Iron Father Feiros is pretty decent too.

The short answer is that Iron Hands are well suited to going into a mass dreadnaught style, which is itself one of the strongest army styles for space marines. Imperial Fists are not. Iron Hands happen to synergize well with the units that are some of the best units in the space marine codex. Fists simply don't, and that's why they havent seen as much success IMO.

Stalker bolt rifles are indeed a pretty poor option. Not totally useless... but pretty poor. I'm not sure giving them back the doctrine on T1 would save them. It wouldnt hurt, but I don't think it's probably enough of a boost for them to see prominence.

I don't really fancy myself much of a designer, but one thing that I think Fists are lacking is that they don't *feel* like masters of offensive and defensive siege style warfare. I'd like to inject some of that into the army. So, what would a relic look like that would do that?

Well... Fluff-wise, the Eye of Hypnoth maybe. A hyper advanced sensor array that can quickly uplink target information? I'm on board. Rather than a reroll 1s aura, I'd like this to be some sort of an orbital strike mechanic. The orbital strike stratagems in the book are absolutely garbage, but maybe the Eye of Hypnoth could be used to call in an artillery strike somehow. Perhaps something in the style of the new deathstrike missile. That would probably be too powerful for a relic, but a lesser version of that maybe.

Or maybe a relic cannon upgrade for a Vindicator. That is the siege-style tank of the space marines, but it lacks punch. It would be cool to have a super vindicator cannon and get these vehicles out on the tabletop.

Or something for the Whirlwind. Back in the day they used to be able to shoot out a field of mines. That would be cool to see again. You could even cut out the whirlwind entirely and have the relic simply be a small number of deployable mines that you get to place at the start of the battle. The player could detonate them if enemy units get within a certain amount of inches, like Tyranid spore mines.

Anything like that would be something I'd get behind for a more interesting Imperial Fist relic.

Ultramarines, Salamanders and Iron Hands topped 4 grand tournaments in 9th. Imperial Fists topped 1 in 9th. I think that helps indicate the truth of my notion that IF's Super Doctrine specifically rather than all Devastator Super Doctrine Chapters are too weak.

Buffing units that are overcosted for every chapter to be balanced for most chapters and a little undercosted for Imperial Fists could help bring IF to a healthier level.

I appreciate that you're not a designer, no judgement here I just want some inspiration and your expertise and knowledge of IF flavour is appreciated.

My thought on the Eye of Hypnoth would be remove cover from target unit once per turn and send a few mortal wounds at that enemy building or a unit within terrain T1. My whole relic rework might turn out to be a total flop, I am considering posting it before finishing it to find out if I'm going in a silly direction with it.

My thoughts on unique upgrades for non-Characters is that it might be best to just get rid of them. Things like Space Marines Special Issue Wargear and Thousand Sons Legion Command upgrades. But if it is part of the 1-3 Relics you get instead of in addition to then I suppose there is no harm in allowing it. I don't really think it's something Necrons, AdMech or Drukhari need. Now the question is whether Thousand Sons should have any.

Perhaps Iron Hands could have a Relic that turns a Dreadnought into a Character since I am planning on getting rid of faction Strats.

I'm VERY curious on your Relic rework, as you did earlier compliment the Geokinesis table. First time I've seen that since the supplement was released LOL

EviscerationPlague wrote:
I'm VERY curious on your Relic rework, as you did earlier compliment the Geokinesis table. First time I've seen that since the supplement was released LOL

What discipline or which powers do you consider the gold standard? Limiting offensive spells to causing MW really limits design options.

You tell me whether my disciplines are better designed than Geokinesis. https://docs.google.com/document/d/15quO21xeb8osvXmCiEFUD9viAf4HbDOs2LXl7wcfwiE/edit?usp=sharing

Quick glance over shows it's alright, but there's definitely some dud powers.

EviscerationPlague wrote:
Quick glance over shows it's alright, but there's definitely some dud powers.

Anybody can make powers that aren't duds, like a WC2 2+ FNP to every friendly unit within 99". As someone who is going to try to make more psychic disciplines in the next couple of years I really want to know all the ways people judge a power system. Does every power have to be equally viable and what should the target power level be? I'm glad you seem to like mine better than Geokinesis. Like the Craftworlds Runes of Fate discipline hasn't gotten tonnes of hate but Doom still seems like an auto-take. I just checked and apparently, there is amazing diversity in psychic powers for Craftworld GT top 4 lists. Is that the gold standard then?

How do people like the high roll bonus effects? That could be a way to boost Geokinesis powers.

1 TECTONIC PURGE (AURA)If the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, each enemy unit within 12" of this psyker suffers 2 mortal wounds.

2 WRACK AND RUINIf the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, increase the range to 24".

3 IRON INFERNOIf the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, each enemy unit within 6" of that point automatically suffers 1 mortal wound instead.

4 FORTIFYIf the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, select all friendly IMPERIAL FISTS INFANTRY or IMPERIAL FISTS BIKER models within 12" of the psyker; those models regain all lost wounds.

5 ASPECT OF STONEIf the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, reduce the psyker's Movement characteristic by 1 and all effects of the power remain in effect until the end of the game.

6 CHASMIf the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, if the target is not a CHARACTER it suffers 3 mortal wounds or 6 mortal wounds if the result equals or is greater than the lowest Move characteristic in the unit respectively.

Okay but I'd also literally would NEVER use a WC6 power to just lower a unit's LD by 1.

I think the overcast mechanic works in fantasy because you have some control over your magic phase. If I want to try to cast the overcast version of Comet of Cassandora, I can just decide to allocate more of my magic dice to casting it. Sure, I give up the chance to use them on something else, and I risk miscasting but those tradeoffs make it interesting.

In 40k this is literally just "well I hope I roll good" so I don't think that's much fun.

EviscerationPlague wrote:
Okay but I'd also literally would NEVER use a WC6 power to just lower a unit's LD by 1.

Are you talking about Astromsncy 1 Iceshard Blizzard? It does something else.

 vict0988 wrote:
As someone who is going to try to make more psychic disciplines in the next couple of years I really want to know all the ways people judge a power system. Does every power have to be equally viable and what should the target power level be?

Personally, I think the main things I look at are:
A.) Can I see myself using all/most of the powers. The powers don't necessarily have to be equally useful, but there should be a use case for each power. Preferably a use case that I don't have to bend over backwards to make work. Maybe a power set has some options for turning the caster into a beatstick. Even if those powers aren't as generally optimal as his support or blaster powers, maybe I want to enjoy throwing my beatstick psyker into the fray from time to time for the lulz. But if I find myself writing off half the powers as "never takes" after the first readthrough, then it feels like the nevertakes are "wasted content." Which leaves a bad taste in your mouth.
B.) Are the powers fun/interesting? I like powers that let me feel like I'm pulling off something whacky or adding something memorable to the game. Generic blaster powers or "reroll some of your dice" powers tend to be kind of bland. (With exceptions.) In that same vein, powers that feel fluffy or tell a story are more interesting to me than the aforementioned bland powers.
C.) Have I seen these powers before? Semi-distinct from B. A power might be useful and do something interesting, but if it feels like a rerun of two other factions' powers, then it makes me start thinking about how many special rules get copy+pasted between factions these days and how that, in turn, kind of makes some factions feel more cookie cutter, and... it's a bit of a downer.

How do people like the high roll bonus effects? That could be a way to boost Geokinesis powers.

Honestly? Not a huge fan. My craftworlders have plenty of these, and it's not usually very exciting. Apogats kind of nailed it. I don't have any control over the likelihood that I'll overcast, so it just makes the rule feel more fiddly/complicated rather than satisfying. It works reasonably well with smite because you're basically just "critting"; you're doing the same general thing you originally intended to (deal mortal wounds), but potentially moreso. I'll add more notes regarding this on each power. At the risk of getting off-topic, I generally find the idea of a psyker intentionally pushing himself and accepting guranteed consequences in exchange for potentially better results to be more interesting than just randomly critting ona power.

1 TECTONIC PURGE (AURA)

Spoiler:

Blessing: Tectonic Purge has a warp charge value of 6. If manifested, then until the start of your next Psychic phase, when a charge roll is made for an enemy unit within 12" of this psyker, subtract 2 from the result.

If the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, each enemy unit within 12" of this psyker suffers 2 mortal wounds.

I almost sort of like this one in that making charges more risky is more interesting than just dealing mortal wounds or granting rerolls or whatever. However, I think this one has enough mild downsides to make it sort of meh overall. Typically, enemy charges are going to be coming from the front. So that makes your psyker want to stand near the front of the army to be more likely to be in range to nerf enemy charges. But that in turn makes him more vulnerably to having his screens shot up and leaving him vulnerable to getting picked off by a lascannon. This power could work really well as a deepstriking charge deterrent, but then it sort of falls into the category of a special ability that lets you shut down special abilities and make semi-interesting strategies less viable. Possibly doing mortal wounds as part of the overcast feels like it would be annoying to be on the receiving end of because you're just randomly losing models because the dice say so; your opponent probably wasn't even actually trying to do damage.

I think there are a couple interesting directions to take this power (maybe just turn it into a charge debuff on a targeted friendly unit within X" or something), but I'm not sure I see myself choosing to take and cast this one very often.

2 WRACK AND RUIN

Spoiler:

Witchfire: Wrack and Ruin has a warp charge value of 6. If manifested, select one BUILDING unit, or one enemy unit that is wholly on or within an Area Terrain feature and is within 18" of and visible to this PSYKER. Roll nine D6, adding 1 to the result if the unit you selected was a BUILDING; for each roll of 5+ that unit suffers 1 mortal wound.

If the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, increase the range to 24".

This one I like. Making the opponent choose between the protection of cover and the risk of being hit by this power shakes things up a little. (Oh hey. A pun!) That said, it seems like it would be pretty easy to negate this power by just leaving a single model outside of the area terrain (and then just take your saves on the models *in* cover). Also, the range increase is unexciting here for the same reason it's unexciting when eldar do it. I'm not going to change where I move the psyker on the off chance my range increases, and it's going to be pretty rare that an extra 6" of range just so happens to open up a significantly better target for the power than I had before.

I'd probably just let the power hit a unit even if it's only partially on terrain. Alternatively, maybe shrink the range to 12" or even 9", and let it work against *all* units that *partially* on the terrain. You're basically using a mini-quake to bring a building down, right? Seems like a collapsing building would hurt anyone inside; not snipe at a single unit of your choice.

3 IRON INFERNO

Spoiler:

Witchfire: Iron Inferno has a warp charge value of 6. If manifested, select one point on the battlefield within 18" of and visible to this psyker. Roll one D6 for each enemy unit within 6" of that point; on a 4+ that unit suffers 1 mortal wound.

If the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, each enemy unit within 6" of that point automatically suffers 1 mortal wound instead.

This one's fine. Just kind of bland. One of many mortal wound powers out there. Maybe it would be more interesting to up the radius or the lethality but then add a delay to when the hit lands? Basically like an orbital strike style mechanic. It basically turns it into more of an area denial, but that seems like it would fit the "feel" of 'Fists pretty well. Want to charge straight at my closest frontline unit? Okay, but you'll have to walk right through my delayed psychic bombardment area!

4 FORTIFY

Spoiler:

Blessing: Fortify has a warp charge value of 4. If manifested, select one friendly IMPERIAL FISTS INFANTRY or IMPERIAL FISTS BIKER model within 12" of the psyker; that model regains up to D3 lost wounds.

If the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, select all friendly IMPERIAL FISTS INFANTRY or IMPERIAL FISTS BIKER models within 12" of the psyker; those models regain all lost wounds.

Again, this one is find but kind of bland. It also steps on the toes of your apothecary options a bit; you don't necessarily need two guys patching up marines when you can have a single guy do it and also blast the enemy with lightning. Then again, maybe there's a healing-heavy build I'm not considering. The overcast "crit heal" falls into that realm of feeling annoying when your opponent does it and just a nice (if "unearned") bonus when you do it.

5 ASPECT OF STONE

Spoiler:

Blessing: Aspect of Stone has a warp charge value of 5. If manifested, then until the start of your next Psychic phase, add 2 to this psyker’s Strength and Toughness characteristics.

If the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, reduce the psyker's Movement characteristic by 1 and all effects of the power remain in effect until the end of the game.

I like this one and actually like the overcast part of it quite a bit. This falls into that category of probably not being as generally useful as the other powers, but potentially running around with a super tough psyker statue by the end of the game could be interesting. I almost think I'd rather this just be a permanent -1" Movement, +1S, +1T power. Your opponent has to decide whether it's worth the risk to gun for your psyker in the early game to avoid dealing with a super-buffed monstrosity in the second half of the game. And conversely, you have to decide whether it's worth going for yet another use of the power even if it means reducing your speed yet again.

6 CHASM

Spoiler:

Witchfire: Chasm has a warp charge value of 6. If manifested, select one enemy unit that cannot FLY and is within 18" of and visible to this psyker. Roll 2D6: if the result is less than the lowest Move characteristic in that unit it suffers 1 mortal wound; if the result equals the lowest Move characteristic in that unit it suffers D3 mortal wounds; if the result is greater than the lowest Move characteristic in that unit it suffers 3 mortal wounds.

If the result of the Psychic test was 10 or more, if the target is not a CHARACTER it suffers 3 mortal wounds or 6 mortal wounds if the result equals or is greater than the lowest Move characteristic in the unit respectively.

This one is mostly fine but could stand to be simplified. This power potentially does one of five different things depending on the results of the 2d6 roll and the psychic test. Consider rolling the equals result and the greater than result together. And then maybe use the psychic test as the 2d6 roll instead of making player roll 2d6 an extra time. So something like:

* WC 3
* Roll a psychic test.
* If the result is greater than or equal to the target unit's lowest Movement stat, deal d3 mortals.
* If the result is 11 or higher, deal 3 mortals to the target regardless of what their Movement stat is.

I just added the high roll bonuses, the spoilered stuff is official. So either Wyldhunt agrees with me that Geokinesis isn't that bad or he is being overly polite.

I don't think it is possible to make 100 wacky and unique psychic powers. Like the WHFB disciplines I wrote are very generic, the only way to avoid disciplines being generic would be lore attributes so that every power in a discipline shares a quirk, but then you can forget about making 100 wacky powers because the power budget of psychic is small and the only way they can cause damage is mortal wounds.

The stats that can be changed are M WS BS S T W A Ld Sv D AP Type Range Invulnerable. The rolls are manifest, deny, hit, wound, Sv, advance, charge which can get +-1 or get re-rolls. Then a unit can be made to move, charge, shoot, fight, fall back, deepstrike, fight first/last. Units can gain or lose obsec or Fly. These changes can then be more or less conditional and possibly permanent.

I had a chat with a couple of buddies and one thought the most important thing was powers feeling like they belong to their discipline. Runes of Fate powers should feel fate-y, without necessarily having a lot of rules. Another thought each power having a use case was the most important. Neither thought that the Runes of Fate discipline couldn't share an identical power with the Tzeentch and Waaagh disciplines.

 vict0988 wrote:
I just added the high roll bonuses, the spoilered stuff is official. So either Wyldhunt agrees with me that Geokinesis isn't that bad or he is being overly polite.

Yeah, those powers don't seem too bad on the whole. A little blasty for my taste, and obviously I've called out things I'd like to see changed, but it seems useful enough. A librarian using that discipline could put out roughly as many mortal wounds as most blasters, or he could take Fortify to patch up high-wounds units like centurions/termies (pretty iconic 'Fists units if I'm not mistaken), or they could whip out aspect of stone and be an off-brand beatstick/tarpit when the enemy gets close. Less "cool" imho than something like the Raven Guard discipline, but probably roughly equally useful.

I had a chat with a couple of buddies and one thought the most important thing was powers feeling like they belong to their discipline. Runes of Fate powers should feel fate-y, without necessarily having a lot of rules. Another thought each power having a use case was the most important. Neither thought that the Runes of Fate discipline couldn't share an identical power with the Tzeentch and Waaagh disciplines.

That's fair. I can agree with most of that. Wanting powers to not seem repetitive is a me thing and really more of an issue with the repeated special rules seen across codices in general rather than within psychic powers specifically. And as you point out, having a 100+ whacky powers is probably an unreasonable ask.

I will somewhat disagree on the "Runes of Fate powers should feel fate-y," part though. Despite the name, Runes of Fate is really just the, "farseers do these things," discipline. There are some fate-y powers, sure, but you also have Mind War and Executioner in there, plus the telepathic(?) effects of Will of Asuryan. And historically, Eldritch Storm has been in the Farseer's bag of tricks too (despite now being a stratagem). I'm all for powers feeling fluffy and appropriate for their caster/discipline, but their first job is to represent the powers that should be available to the psykers that can take them. Not that those things are necessarily mutually exclusive. Runes of Fate is probably a rare example of a discipline with powers that don't fit the overall theme.

A few others chimed in and said that their most important factor was balance and inventiveness respectively.

How do Farseers use powers like Executioner, Mindwar and Eldritch Storm in the fluff? What I am thinking is that effects could play more into the Farseer predicting what the enemy is likely to do and punishing them for it. That would make the powers less repetitive and more inventive and feel more fate-y. While it might not make strict sense for a Farseer to not be able to freely choose how to use all his powers, the restrictions and triggers could be used to weave a narrative that is true to the fluff. There is also always Smite.

Is the two powers in one gimmick of Runes of Battle the right gimmick for Warlocks?

Could there be a right gimmick for Geomancy to set it apart? I am thinking of the defence of Terra or walking into the Iron Warriors' trap and being determined to beat the Iron Warriors' at their own game as possible inspirations for a gimmick.

Why don't you start another thread for your DIY psychic stuff? This thread was supposed to be about Imperial Fists.