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 Adeptekon wrote:
Here's what I got they could just change the lore little to read:

In the commotion and trusty Iron Hand brother scooped up Ferris's head like a loose ball for the touchdown before Chaos could hem them in.

Being one of the few survivors this trusty hand told only a hand full (no pun) of his bros and kept it a secret. When their bros started self-mutilating over the loss of dad, they said screw that! (no pun) and left the chapter while biding their time preserving his head when everyone else was claiming to have a piece of him.

They just needed the right connections with some powerful Technomancy to build him back better. Ferris awakens to hear the news about how his chapter went nuts and bolts over their humanity and he vows to restore faith in the flesh and purge their insanity.

Thus begins the return of Ferrus Manus and the Civil War of the Iron Hands successors.

Unfortunately, Ferrus' head ended up in Horus' possession, who used it like a ventriloquist puppet when he got more and more insane. It's also where Fabius got the tissue for his Ferrus-clones from... the Iron Hands just collected some random parts and tried to build a Ferrus-Zombie-Golem from it, with predictable results (it's baaaaad).

But we can't trust what they say.

 Adeptekon wrote:
But we can't trust what they say.

They should fully embrace all of this, and the LotD, and the Sapphire King stuff, and just have a very confused, frankenstein-like Possessed Robot Ghost of Ferrus' Clone Zombie ... of the Damned come back from the dead, seeking vengeance on the authors

Tsagualsa wrote:

 Adeptekon wrote:
But we can't trust what they say.

They should fully embrace all of this, and the LotD, and the Sapphire King stuff, and just have a very confused, frankenstein-like Possessed Robot Ghost of Ferrus' Clone Zombie ... of the Damned come back from the dead, seeking vengeance on the authors

Now you're talkin'!

I mean, there's room for interesting stuff there... I'd take it in the direction that due to being the first open, clear fratricide among Primarchs for traitorous reasons* Ferrus and all that relates to him has been messed up on a metaphysical level. That would provide a reason for the fact that several parties, more or less independent of each other, tried to reanimate, clone, summon or otherwise resurrect Ferrus - it's not something they do entirely out of their free will, but some sort of warp-related effect, of destiny/reality trying to fix itself after it has been broken by the actions of the Heretics. People get 'possessed' by the idea of resurrecting Ferrus just like they get snared up in Slaaneshi vices or Tzeentchian scheming, one moment you read a footnote in some apocryphal text about the Heresy and wonder if it is possible, the next you're standing knee-deep in clone vat juice, with the Inquisition pounding at your doors, wondering where it all went wrong...


* The missing Primarchs might have been killed by one of their brothers, but more out of necessity or as a mercy killing than for selfish reasons

 Arachnofiend wrote:
Does the Emperor have naturally conceived children? I kinda just assumed he was as sexless as Narcissus.

I don’t believe there are any in the cannon. There used to be a story about a secret order that were locating his offspring but after 10k years most of humanity would be related to him in the same way were all supposed to be related to Gengis khan (I don’t know how to spell it)

A good story would be that he kept killing his children because they would become too power and take him down or be corrupted by chaos etc

But are there any stories of perpetual having kids?

Another good fan theory about the missing primarchs is that one of them was getting busy building an army of offspring in secret. Primarchs grow very fast.

Tsagualsa wrote:I mean, there's room for interesting stuff there... I'd take it in the direction that due to being the first open, clear fratricide among Primarchs for traitorous reasons* Ferrus and all that relates to him has been messed up on a metaphysical level. That would provide a reason for the fact that several parties, more or less independent of each other, tried to reanimate, clone, summon or otherwise resurrect Ferrus - it's not something they do entirely out of their free will, but some sort of warp-related effect, of destiny/reality trying to fix itself after it has been broken by the actions of the Heretics. People get 'possessed' by the idea of resurrecting Ferrus just like they get snared up in Slaaneshi vices or Tzeentchian scheming, one moment you read a footnote in some apocryphal text about the Heresy and wonder if it is possible, the next you're standing knee-deep in clone vat juice, with the Inquisition pounding at your doors, wondering where it all went wrong...


* The missing Primarchs might have been killed by one of their brothers, but more out of necessity or as a mercy killing than for selfish reasons

That would be a twist alright. Who's starting the topic? I'll join it.

mrFickle wrote:

 Arachnofiend wrote:
Does the Emperor have naturally conceived children? I kinda just assumed he was as sexless as Narcissus.

I don’t believe there are any in the cannon. There used to be a story about a secret order that were locating his offspring but after 10k years most of humanity would be related to him in the same way were all supposed to be related to Gengis khan (I don’t know how to spell it)

A good story would be that he kept killing his children because they would become too power and take him down or be corrupted by chaos etc

But are there any stories of perpetual having kids?

Another good fan theory about the missing primarchs is that one of them was getting busy building an army of offspring in secret. Primarchs grow very fast.

Sounds like the Sensei, mentioned earlier may have been perpetual, if not powerful. Seems like they got swapped out for the primarch story.

I love all the Iron Hands thoughts here... heartily endorsed

We know the Big E was

Enoch, son of Awan
Alexander III
Arthur Pendragon
St. George

probably Sargon
most likely Ramses

maybe Jesus maybe Mohammad maybe Lincoln

ALL of whom (if picking and choosing your stories, tales, legends, and sources) have kids and grandkids, but nothing beyond that.. dead ends... might be why the above have all been alluded to (or directly mentioned)

 Lobukia wrote:
I love all the Iron Hands thoughts here... heartily endorsed

We know the Big E was

Enoch, son of Awan
Alexander III
Arthur Pendragon
St. George

probably Sargon
most likely Ramses

maybe Jesus maybe Mohammad maybe Lincoln

ALL of whom (if picking and choosing your stories, tales, legends, and sources) have kids and grandkids, but nothing beyond that.. dead ends... might be why the above have all been alluded to (or directly mentioned)

I don't think he was Jesus, his philosophy is far more OT than NT. Though he could be somehow connected, as that would explain the reemergence of Templar/Hospitaller iconography if Jesus had a secret bloodline, with the order resurged in secret, maybe E is the holy grail himself.

I think Mohammad is unlikely and instead would offer Khosrow I 531 to 579.

Other than that I would say some other good candidates would be Hammurabi and Cyrus the Great.

 Shadow Walker wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

I included the currently dead ones anyway because let's face it, if they want them to return a way will be found...

Unfortunately yes, they would find some absurd explanation to do this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbE8E1ez97M

We can't really conclude that the Emperor was Saint George. The account of his encounter with the Dragon is illogical and self-contradictory, is described by the person giving it as being unreliable, and multiple characters explain how similar tales are metaphorical and not literal...

 Adeptekon wrote:

Sounds like the Sensei, mentioned earlier may have been perpetual, if not powerful. Seems like they got swapped out for the primarch story.

There are hints in the more recent novels like in some of the more recent Dawn of Fire novels that the Sensei are still in the canon as an Inquisitor mentions that cult of theirs that was attacked and supposedly wiped out by another Inquisitor. He reveals that contrary to official reports they weren't all wiped out.

The Sensei are blood descendants of the Emperor but are not necessarily his direct children. Maybe it is like a recessive trait that gets passed down and only occasionally surfaces. The key thing about the Sensei is that they don't die of old age and stop aging biologically once they reach maturity. They are also immune to the emotional imbalances as epitomized by the Chaos gods, and due to being at one with the harmonious warp before it became turbulent, they are invisible to all forms of psychic scrying and perception, including that of the Emperor and Chaos gods.

The Sensei are not aware of their ancestry but at drawn instinctively to fight tyranny, injustice, and other forms of imbalance that would feed the Chaos gods. This means they often end up as opponents of the Imperium in the form of lone wandering outlaws, space pirates with hearts of gold etc...

The sensei are the holy grails, and must be found.