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 Kanluwen wrote:
I never want to see Arbites as a playable faction. Ever.

You want to play RT? Arbites? Go play Necromunda or Kill Team. They're not an army and should not have ever been given rules for 40k proper. Their inclusion was nothing but yet more dilution of roles for the Guard to have. The same thing goes with the Navy Breachers.

By that logic we should also drop all the flavors of Marines, mash all of chaos and demons back together, drop the Custodes entirely, drop Knights of all kinds entirely, the Tau, the Votann, Genestealers Cults and the Admech. None of them belong in 40k.

 Kanluwen wrote:
I never want to see Arbites as a playable faction. Ever.

You want to play RT? Arbites? Go play Necromunda or Kill Team. They're not an army and should not have ever been given rules for 40k proper. Their inclusion was nothing but yet more dilution of roles for the Guard to have. The same thing goes with the Navy Breachers.

We will have to agree to disagree.



Fluff-wise the Arbites are the last line of defense for a planet against rebellion or invasion. The Marines or the Guard ain't coming till the Arbites call for them. So an army of mobile, high-quality Arbites would make sense. Even if they were just a unit within Codex Inquisition or Imperial Agents.

I see the issue rules-wise, they're another human Imperial army, but that objection went out the window when Blue-Grey Space Marines got their own codex back in 1994. We now have what codexes for Blue, Black, Red, Green, Grey, Girl and Shiny marines, plus Black, Red, Green and Blue Chaos Marines. I think a few books of Humans would not be untoward.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Warptide wrote:
Renegade Guard maybe?

That would be the smart money for me.

Good of GW to outsource the models to WGA


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Brickfix wrote:
Isn't GW considering any release in February to be in winter still?

Maybe because it is?

#calendars

 Valkyrie wrote:
I can't see Agents being an entire faction on their own.

They're not a faction all their own, but they will take up a release slot.

Frankly, I don't think there is an issue with Arbites at 2000 or 3000pts either.

It was pretty easy to make a 2000pt mechanised Arbites force with their 3rd edition list and about 80 bodies in transports or on bikes. Overall essentially your classic carapace vet list, although a definite weakness against heavy armour with only combi-meltas, hunter killer missiles, and plasma pistols/combi-plasma going above S6.

The list had 5 units and 2 transports (3 with Forge World), and there are definitely more units mentioned in lore (cyber hounds, support weapon squads come to mind quickest, Leman Russ have also been in Arbites armouries). A full army is quite doable.

"You shouldn't get your pet unit because I don't get mine." Is such a weird way to approach this topic.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
I never want to see Arbites as a playable faction. Ever.

You want to play RT? Arbites? Go play Necromunda or Kill Team. They're not an army and should not have ever been given rules for 40k proper. Their inclusion was nothing but yet more dilution of roles for the Guard to have. The same thing goes with the Navy Breachers.

We will have to agree to disagree.



Fluff-wise the Arbites are the last line of defense for a planet against rebellion or invasion. The Marines or the Guard ain't coming till the Arbites call for them. So an army of mobile, high-quality Arbites would make sense. Even if they were just a unit within Codex Inquisition or Imperial Agents.

I see the issue rules-wise, they're another human Imperial army, but that objection went out the window when Blue-Grey Space Marines got their own codex back in 1994. We now have what codexes for Blue, Black, Red, Green, Grey, Girl and Shiny marines, plus Black, Red, Green and Blue Chaos Marines. I think a few books of Humans would not be untoward.

This army looks very cool! Unfortunately I can't see GW allowing an Arbites army using IG tanks, because cross games and cross faction compatible kits seem to be a big no no (my poor Horus heresy tanks, oh no servitors can be used in three factions in 40k alone let's not release a new kit and legend them instead)

About my comment on February still being considered winter by GW, I recall a lot of excitement over a release last year (or a year before?) and the following confusion because it was "two months late". People expected the release in March at the latest because "spring release" and it came at the end of May ...

I don’t think it’s traitor guard I think traitor guardsmen will be parts of a chaos cults codex. GW seem to prefer mutants and possessed to renegades

Brickfix wrote:


This army looks very cool! Unfortunately I can't see GW allowing an Arbites army using IG tanks, because cross games and cross faction compatible kits seem to be a big no no (my poor Horus heresy tanks, oh no servitors can be used in three factions in 40k alone let's not release a new kit and legend them instead)

Yeah for the moment they all count as multiple different IG units. With the move to 10th a good chunk of that army is illegal just like my Tallarn Vet army, and my Cadian drop army

Whatever you guys are expecting, you're going to be let down. This is GW. Lets tamper the expectations. It's going to be new Space Marine Chapter, loyalist.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

Brickfix wrote:


This army looks very cool! Unfortunately I can't see GW allowing an Arbites army using IG tanks, because cross games and cross faction compatible kits seem to be a big no no (my poor Horus heresy tanks, oh no servitors can be used in three factions in 40k alone let's not release a new kit and legend them instead)

Yeah for the moment they all count as multiple different IG units. With the move to 10th a good chunk of that army is illegal just like my Tallarn Vet army, and my Cadian drop army

Sadly GW do seem to be moving away from a more shared Imperial aesthetic with vehicles based on common STCs to bespoke vehicles for every faction.

It is weird to me, because surely they get more return on investment for a kit used in multiple armies, like priests, rhinos, or servitors. I don't think the "brands" of the factions are negatively "watered down" by this approach.

Brickfix wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
I never want to see Arbites as a playable faction. Ever.

You want to play RT? Arbites? Go play Necromunda or Kill Team. They're not an army and should not have ever been given rules for 40k proper. Their inclusion was nothing but yet more dilution of roles for the Guard to have. The same thing goes with the Navy Breachers.

We will have to agree to disagree.



Fluff-wise the Arbites are the last line of defense for a planet against rebellion or invasion. The Marines or the Guard ain't coming till the Arbites call for them. So an army of mobile, high-quality Arbites would make sense. Even if they were just a unit within Codex Inquisition or Imperial Agents.

I see the issue rules-wise, they're another human Imperial army, but that objection went out the window when Blue-Grey Space Marines got their own codex back in 1994. We now have what codexes for Blue, Black, Red, Green, Grey, Girl and Shiny marines, plus Black, Red, Green and Blue Chaos Marines. I think a few books of Humans would not be untoward.

This army looks very cool! Unfortunately I can't see GW allowing an Arbites army using IG tanks, because cross games and cross faction compatible kits seem to be a big no no (my poor Horus heresy tanks, oh no servitors can be used in three factions in 40k alone let's not release a new kit and legend them instead)

About my comment on February still being considered winter by GW, I recall a lot of excitement over a release last year (or a year before?) and the following confusion because it was "two months late". People expected the release in March at the latest because "spring release" and it came at the end of May ...

Its not unheard of. Custodes have Land Raiders and Rhinos. Sisters have Rhino Chassis variants. Grey Knights have the regular SM flyers and Land Raiders. With that said, I can totally see Arbites in Chimera, and Hellhounds. I'm not sure about Leman Russ/Rogal Dorn, and really not sure about the Super Heavies or "Artillery" like the Basilisks. I can see transport planes but not fighters and bombers.

Arbites have occasionally had access to small numbers of Leman Russ in the lore for when gak really hits the fan. Probably because you can leave a Leman Russ in storage for a few millennia and chances are it'll still turn on when you hit the rune of activation.

They are unlikely to have much if any artillery, although I could see them using Griffons for the smoke and ilum shells. Could also imagine an Arbites-specific tear gas shell that isn't very practical outside of riot control.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Whatever you guys are expecting, you're going to be let down. This is GW. Lets tamper the expectations. It's going to be new Space Marine Chapter, loyalist.

Before LoV I would have agreed but I think GW know there is a market for greater variety. Kroot are expanding, we’ve had Beastmen and traitor guard kill teams, new characters like vashtorr. I think it’s anyone’s guess.

Am not sure if the lore is sitll accurate, but in the Shira Calpurnia trilogy one of the three highest ranking officers of the arbites is responsible for stricktly mililtary scale operations. Stuff like ship boarding, siege craft of hive clusters and hive towers, he has access to fast moving in system ships which consist of engines, weapons pylons and space for boarding parties. A lot of the arbites or inquisitor stuff is hard to show in a large scale table top game though. The arbites have stuff like detectives, secret field operatives, their own branch of apothecaries/forensic team, who brench that is focused on laws and can arbitors can use them to go around or through red tape. etc

Custodes and GK are the same. On of the GK brotherhoods starts their interventions by teleporting 200 combat servitors high on frenzon in to combat, followed by mass terminator teleportation a few seconds later. No way to represent those in game. Custodes have "math" magicians and name an dream magic using "shamans", they have apothecaries and biologos, field agents consisting of both retired and not retired members of the brotherhood. And top of that if there is something that one could imagine that it existed in the times of retaking of Terra or even some golden age stuff, they probably have access to it. For example GK have their pokeball grenades, but those are designes given to them by Malcador and originaly used by the Custodes to capture really dangerous things.

mrFickle wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Whatever you guys are expecting, you're going to be let down. This is GW. Lets tamper the expectations. It's going to be new Space Marine Chapter, loyalist.

Before LoV I would have agreed but I think GW know there is a market for greater variety. Kroot are expanding, we’ve had Beastmen and traitor guard kill teams, new characters like vashtorr. I think it’s anyone’s guess.

I wouldn't be suprised by Emperor's Children. Yeah they normally release the new Primarch during the summer campaign, but I wouldn't be surprised if COVID created a logjam, which delayed the Lion and Angron, and thus Russ and Fulgrim were ready last summer but still delayed for the next one I would also absolutely not be surpised to see it be the Imperial Agents supplement and some sort of April Fools Joke with the Inquisition Redacting their Release date in a gigantic GW Dad Joke. .

If we assume the mystery faction is new(ish), I hope it's Emperor's Children. Getting all 4 of the god-specific Legions into their own books would probably help with balance in the CSM Codex as well as "completing" the various CSM armies. The various Inquisition Codices we've had in the past have always felt really undercooked and the sections of them that were more compelling as actual armies suitable for 40k games (Sisters, Grey Knights, Deathwatch) now have their own standalone Index armies. With how long it's going to take them to release all the 10th edition factions I think taking a break to release something completely new would be a bad move.

EC and Dark Mech do seem to be the two most likely candidates for an actually "new" force. EC because we know it really is only a matter of time for that to happen, and Dark Mech because the return of Vashtorr in the lore makes for a potentially perfect figurehead to do such a release around. There also is a chance that the "Redacted" codex will just be Imperial Agents though, especially with the recent rumors that they are getting a codex in the Summer.

I did wonder if adding more cultists to CSM and the Fellgor and traitor guard kill teams is a way of starting to fill out the codex ready for all 4 of the legions to leave it.


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But of course if the CSM codex comes out without noise marines in that gives the game away. So now I’m saying it’s not EC.

If the codex CSM doesn’t have noise marines then we are getting EC by the end of 10th but not the redacted one in the image.

So as it says redacted I’m going with codex inquisition

mrFickle wrote:
I did wonder if adding more cultists to CSM and the Fellgor and traitor guard kill teams is a way of starting to fill out the codex ready for all 4 of the legions to leave it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
But of course if the CSM codex comes out without noise marines in that gives the game away. So now I’m saying it’s not EC.

If the codex CSM doesn’t have noise marines then we are getting EC by the end of 10th but not the redacted one in the image.

So as it says redacted I’m going with codex inquisition

Plot-twist:
They put Rubric Marines, Plague Marines, and Khorne Berzerkers back into the main codex to throw everyone off.

 Kanluwen wrote:

mrFickle wrote:
I did wonder if adding more cultists to CSM and the Fellgor and traitor guard kill teams is a way of starting to fill out the codex ready for all 4 of the legions to leave it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
But of course if the CSM codex comes out without noise marines in that gives the game away. So now I’m saying it’s not EC.

If the codex CSM doesn’t have noise marines then we are getting EC by the end of 10th but not the redacted one in the image.

So as it says redacted I’m going with codex inquisition

Plot-twist:
They put Rubric Marines, Plague Marines, and Khorne Berzerkers back into the main codex to throw everyone off.

That would be cool, they are currently allowed as allies.

But now someone has said it I feel like the word redacted is a clue so it’s either a secret part of the imperium or something they want to keep secret.

A redacted space marine legion perhaps???

I don't want to be a party pooper, but why is "redacted" necessarily a new faction? I remember 9th edition we had a similar roadmap and the "redacted" codex in the image back then was simply Dark Eldar.

I see no reason to get riled up about the "Redacted" part.


^That's from 2020.

^2021.

I'm sure they've done more, but searching for it easily involves having to use Google/Bing/whatever...and BoLS has basically drowned out everything relevant.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Whatever you guys are expecting, you're going to be let down. This is GW. Lets tamper the expectations. It's going to be new Space Marine Chapter, loyalist.

I feel like the model releases have branched out quite a bit more recently.

They have lots of models that exist in some of the suggested factions that would be ready to go. I don't think it will be anything new though. They just put redacted to give themselves wiggle room at the end of that release schedule.

Yeah GW have shown they are more than happy to throw a surprise new faction out. It's one of the things I like about their current business model.

Slipspace wrote:
If we assume the mystery faction is new(ish), I hope it's Emperor's Children. Getting all 4 of the god-specific Legions into their own books would probably help with balance in the CSM Codex as well as "completing" the various CSM armies. The various Inquisition Codices we've had in the past have always felt really undercooked and the sections of them that were more compelling as actual armies suitable for 40k games (Sisters, Grey Knights, Deathwatch) now have their own standalone Index armies. With how long it's going to take them to release all the 10th edition factions I think taking a break to release something completely new would be a bad move.

The hard part about thinking its Emperor's Children is two fold. Bringing back another Primarch is a major event that can, will, and does sell an extra book. Which usually means Summer Campaign. Now April is probably close enough it could be that - with Emperor;s Children releasing and being the MacGuffin of the Summer Campaign which then puts the returning Loyalist Primarch (Probably Russ) in the Summer Campaign book to start - and its entirely posssible/plausible both release at once so EC players have an army to buy and everyone else has a Campaign book to buy. And I think its Russ because 40K is shaking up the traditional PREFERRED ENEMY results. Tyranids to Blood Angels instead of UM, WE/Khorne to Dark Angels, Magnus to Bobby G - so with the (assumed) Return of Russ they'll shake up those rivalries with the Brute Force of Russ with the Haughty Grace of Fulgrim.

The return of Russ would be good since then we'd have two loyal primarchs

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
The return of Russ would be good since then we'd have two loyal primarchs

I'm not sure how many they're going to bring back before chucking it all and Disappearing them all again, but this looks like their modus operandi going forward - release one of each at the same time to keep a relatively balanced primarch count. Hopefully they get them and/or "counts as" placeholders for the deaders back and keep them back. They're no brainers when it comes to Big Centerpiece Models.

I for one am not looking forward to the eventual gutted EC codex.


Only solace is possible.....DOOMRIDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am excited at the possibility of Darkmech tho

 Kanluwen wrote:
I see no reason to get riled up about the "Redacted" part.


^That's from 2020.

^2021.

I'm sure they've done more, but searching for it easily involves having to use Google/Bing/whatever...and BoLS has basically drowned out everything relevant.

yeah, when i saw the current roadmap, my thought was "oh that's something to be revealed later", not "new faction being added". frankly, i think they would be doing more if there was a new faction on the horizon in just a few months. Votann were announced like six months before their release, and World Eaters were foreshadowed by being removed from the CSM codex. we're probably going to be getting such foreshadowing soon, when CSM get their 10e codex, but i don't think they would do that again so immediately

if the rumor is true, it's agents, and i think that's likely. otherwise, i'm not really sure, but my armies are already getting codexes before this, so agents is the one thing i still have stakes in (i like using allies for my custodes army)— that is to say, if it's not agents, i don't really care

I really want it to be Agents of course.

Theads like this are dangerous, because they make me hope.