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I've been looking at the marmachine website, had quick skim through some of the old books. My question is this. Can I build a all warjack army with no Infantry ? I was thinking of one led by either Karchev the Terrible or Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince. I was thinking a list simliliar to a 1650 - 2000 Points in warhammer 40k.

You can indeed. However, if you refuse to take anything but jacks I think you will find your army will run very dry and have very little punch. Jacks require Focus allocated from your main character called a warcaster and most of them have only 5-9 focus. Each jack usually needs 2+ focus to be very productive some less some more so you can really only ever run 2-4 jacks at full power with one war caster. So all in all yes you can. I wouldn't suggest it though, but of all the armies to get away with it Khador is the one to pick.

A Warmachine army at an equivalent point value to 1600-2000 would be around 50-100 points after 75 points you get to use a second warcaster which will make it easier to run more jacks.

I know jacks look awsume and are just cool in general, but let me tell you troops, mounted units and solos are the best things to combo with your jacks as they add unique synergy and buffs to them.

All-jack lists are more viable in MkII, but still with a number of caveats. They don't tend to suit Khador, although it's viable off Sorcha and Vlad. Although Karchev is the wonderful one-man jack, his low focus makes it impractical (even though you probably will run a couple of heavies with him, as Tow is more nails than ever). If you're intent on playing khador and like jack-y goodness, I'd use men-o-war; they're essentially khador's light jacks, which just happen to have a bloke inside. Also, IIRC there's a new plastic kit for them coming out. The Old Witch has her scrapjack too, though friendly advice of a pal who is far, far more experienced than I (top-tier tourney player) is she's just not worth using. Also, I'd suggest starting with 35pts max, just to get the feel of things. Just my 2 british pennies, though.

Maybe run jackheavy with Karchev and 3 heavys max, then add some support solo's like manhunters or something like that. should be fun to play and bring a severe beating. Just watch out for infantryswarm, as besides tramples there is not much to stop those in the list...

It is possible to play jacks without infantry, but you have to be really realistic about it. You'll be relying on spells that let you charge/boost for free (all factions have a jack caster with full throtle equivalent) and no other source of focus. It is a trade off of 1 jack with lots of focus will do more than an individual jack with full throtle, but you can run 5 jacks of full throtle if you really wanted to.

The other option is marshal a jack or two. Khador has Man O War Kovnik (so a solo that is pretty much a light jack) who can control a heavy for you. Koldun Lord can marshall too, and has powerbooster.

On the note of solos, you will want mechanics, especially Khador heavies are hard to kill in one round. You will probably find after a game or two that you are lacking the ability to deal with something (infantry or stealth or something) and you will have to add something to deal with it.

My advice is yeah, start off with karchev, and 2 or 3 jacks and play a couple games. Then go from there. If you are planning on buying it all at once, maybe proxy a game or 5, and make sure you buy the plastic kits so that you can change your mind if you want.

I think though it would be 1 dimensional, Karchev and as many berserkers as you can fit in is a potential all jack list. Karchev's feat works very well with them, and his spell gives them a boost without allocating focus, and they can run without focus anyway, and sometimes explode if you give them focus. I dunno, it seemed like it would work, in a ridiculous fashion, against some foes.

Karchev can run many jacks, just add a couple of support pirces and you are good to go. Greylords are very nice for their infantry clearing sprays, mechanics to help keep big K up and running and widowmakes to take out oposing infantry.

Thanks for the Feedback - I just like the look of Khador. What would your average points limit be for games of about a hour to hour and half ?

Also which list is better suited to all jacks ? Also does anybody have any experience with hoards - I like the idea behind the trolls but I can't seem to find a decent write up on how they play.

Grifthin wrote:What would your average points limit be for games of about a hour to hour and half ?

35 points is good fit to that game length.

I love my Trolls, I'll try to give you a short rundown later.


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I have 5 minutes.

Fury is a bit more forgiving (IMHO) then Focus and it is a lot more fun if you are running beast heavy.

You generate fury each time you would spend focus. At the start of the turn, the warlock pulls it off the beasts. Anything left on a beast might cause it to frenzy and try to rip apart the nearest thing. Because you can 'run hot' for a critical turn, it can be really fun. There are also more mechanics in Hordes to help control the fury.

Negative aspects, warlocks aren't as good as warcasters (in general) they have smaller spell lists and the can only 'force' a beast in their control range so they have to be closer to the fight. (A warjack could start in the control range and leave it without any lose of combat power, not true for beasts) Fury doesn't bump up armour, but does allow transfering damage to beasts.

As for trolls, they are fun. I play beast heavy and I'm working on improving my list. Things like eHoarluk, whelps are awesome, anyway, times up, maybe more later.


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k, I've got 10 minutes this time

Beasts aren't as dangerous as jacks (IMHO) The stats are comparable, but if you are to compare the heavy factions (Trolls vs Khador) you'll find higher armor and mat in the jacks over the beasts. I think Jacks have more boxes too.

Fury is not suited for attrition as the 'lock needs a beast to generate fury so that he can cast his spells. You will need 2 beasts, maybe 3 just to provide your fury everyturn. If you play beast heavy, you will have to play assassination most of the time.

Back on Trolls in general, all the beasts have regen (force for d3 healing) which makes them really dangerous (don't leave one 1/2 dead, cause he can be brought back to full combat efficiency with 1 focus) On top of that, the whelps can be eaten for health, or to avoid a frenzy check. With eDoomie and whelps, you could really lay the pain on someone for a turn or two. The light trolls are in 2 groups, the weapon groups, and the element groups. The weapon groups all have reach and something else (axer = thresher, impaler = crit slam, bouncer = chain + bodyguard) while the elements have 2 fists and some sort of spray/aoe/bonus damage.
the Dire Trolls all have 2 fists (Mulg has 1 + a reach weapon) and something else (Maulter = chain attack smash + grab, Blitzer = a gun + gunfighter + virtuoso, earthborn = that adaption thing) 2 Open fists is amazing, especially for getting that assassination off.

there are some 'staple' units, like the Krielstone Bearers, fell caller and Champions that may or may not interest you. The krielstone would bump the armor of most of your beasts from a respectable 18 to a heavy 20 (and the UA adds 1 STR)

Anyway, times up again.


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As for how they play, generally you are looking at SPD 5 (4 Mulg, 6 for some infantry) with low def (12) and decent arm (16-18) They are alright on their own but gain a lot from the synergies in the faction. Krielstone + ua gets you ARM, STR, Immune to continous stuff, the Fell Caller can cancel knockdown, increase melee, Axer Animi (a spell that a beast has and which the 'lock can cast too) Rush is amazing (+2" SPD + pathfinder) the DT Mauler animus (+3 STR) the elemental beasts animi (boosts of STR or adding elemental stuff) Grim Angus' Bait the line ability (+2" Charge for warbeasts against target damaged by gun)

I keep wanting to pull off a 16" threat of an Axer charging (5+3) with rush (+2) bait the line (+2) the Nyss Sorcerers mark (+2) and reach (+2) No one would expect a SPD 5 model to reach out and touch someone at 16"


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And tough, all infantry are tought.